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Thanks for Falcon change

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Naomi Wildfire Amarr Stardust Heavy Industries Majesta Empire	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:04:00 - [61] Originally by: Mystafyre Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: TimMc This. Most recons only fit 2-3 ewar modules, not 6 like the ECM boats. The other ewar modules work 100% of the time. QFT The others cant use it at 200km and you got a positive side effect from the Counter Modules. ECCM has no positive site effect. I highly welcome this change. Start to fit a Tank! Wildfire - New Horizons
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:15:00 - [62] Originally by: Naomi Wildfire The others cant use it at 200km The others are not used in gang v gang combat because of that fact.. Originally by: Naomi Wildfire you got a positive side effect from the Counter Modules. Then boosting a few of the other recons effects and giving eccm a secondary effect is a much better solution
Borat Sangdiev	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:31:00 - [63] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Malcanis We even have a solopwnmobile Combat Recon on a par with the Curse now. I haven't seen them in action yet, but purely based on some preliminary number crunching, I'm expecting some pretty loud OMGZNERFROOK!!1 threads within less than a weekà Very much so. It can stand off at 120Km, jam AND apply as much DPS as a cerberus with any damage type bar kinetic, or get in close and scram, jam and do even more DPS with a rack of Hobgoblins. I might almost feel a little guilty at using such an evil ship had it not been for the months of mendacious whines that led to it's creation from the very people who will whine about it now. No whining from me now, Falcon pilots will need more balls to engage now instead of being nearly invulnerable at 200km plus. This does make Falcons more vulnerable in small gang warfare.
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:33:00 - [64] Originally by: lecrotta Edited by: lecrotta on 17/04/2009 15:26:27 Originally by: LiNuXb0y What was it that all the falcon alts posted when they nerfed speed, damps, webs???? Something like 'adapt or..............'cant think of the last word, anyone care to help me out? Actually they said "this sucks boost other things nerfing is a crap way to do things", pvpers never want nerfs because they ARE the ones that adapt its the clueless muppets that constantly cry for the nerfs as they need something to blame for their incompetance. Actually no, people who have falcon alts were and always were just pussies. Nano was fun as hell to fly.
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:33:00 - [65] Originally by: Borat Sangdiev No whining from me now, Falcon pilots will need more balls to engage now instead of being nearly invulnerable at 200km plus. This does make Falcons more vulnerable in small gang warfare. They're just going to fit heavy tanks. I think falcon in its new role would be fine to be honest if it had gained a little more shields and a 25m3 drone bay. Rook should have a 40m3 drone bay and a bit more grid.
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:36:00 - [66] Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Originally by: Borat Sangdiev No whining from me now, Falcon pilots will need more balls to engage now instead of being nearly invulnerable at 200km plus. This does make Falcons more vulnerable in small gang warfare. They're just going to fit heavy tanks. I think falcon in its new role would be fine to be honest if it had gained a little more shields and a 25m3 drone bay. Rook should have a 40m3 drone bay and a bit more grid. A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank?
Tippia Raddick Explorations BlackWater.	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:39:00 - [67] Edited by: Tippia on 17/04/2009 16:39:56 Originally by: Dizeezer Velar A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? It's what the other recons have to play with, and it works for them… The only reason ignorant falcon pilots think their ship can't tank is because they're obsessed with needlessly fitting every last slot with ewar modules. ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:41:00 - [68] Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 17/04/2009 16:39:56 Originally by: Dizeezer Velar A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? It's what the other recons have to play with, and it works for themà The only reason ignorant falcon pilots think their ship can't tank is because they're obsessed with needlessly fitting every last slot with ewar modules. A Pilgrim's tank is much better than anything a Falcon could field, I've never flown an Arazu or Rapier though so I won't comment on them.
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:43:00 - [69] Originally by: Dizeezer Velar Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Originally by: Borat Sangdiev No whining from me now, Falcon pilots will need more balls to engage now instead of being nearly invulnerable at 200km plus. This does make Falcons more vulnerable in small gang warfare. They're just going to fit heavy tanks. I think falcon in its new role would be fine to be honest if it had gained a little more shields and a 25m3 drone bay. Rook should have a 40m3 drone bay and a bit more grid. A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? You can fit a 60k EHP tank on a rook rather easily with a MWD and two slots for multi's (which is fine for small gang fights). Against their resists its more like 80-90k EHP with a passive tank of like 250 dps. The problem comes to when you start filling up the highs with launchers you run out of grid. You need to stop thinking of rooks and falcons as "fit 6 ECM mods and jam 3-4 ships" and start thinking of it as "fit a tank and permajam one ship". And for that they aren't totally useless, they just could use the mods I mentioned (more drones, more grid). The fix that CCP did was a "quick and dirty" not based on any logic - 2 light drones aren't going to do crap.
Lilith Velkor Minmatar OVERLOAD. Dead Terrorists	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:47:00 - [70] Originally by: n0thing Oh riiight, so because of one recon a gnag leader should waste a tackler/cov ops? Too much dont you think? Thats not a CS or BS or Capital my dear. Lol, thats an unqualified statement right there. My probe-equipped Rapier is in no way a waste (if anything, a cov ops frigate is a waste to have imo since I can do the job much better), I can still fulfill my tackler role while providing cover and instant warpins against snipers or do the scouting, experienced FCs appreciate it being around my dear.

Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.04.17 16:58:00 - [71] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Dizeezer Velar A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? It's what the other recons have to play with, and it works for themà Heres the thing, nobody flies the other recons in gang v gang combat........so NO it does NOT work for them in fact it is one of the main contributing factors (along with their operational range) to why they are hardly used in anything and never used in gang v gang fighting.
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:01:00 - [72] Edited by: Dasalt Istgut on 17/04/2009 17:02:33 Originally by: Murina Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Dizeezer Velar A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? It's what the other recons have to play with, and it works for themà Heres the thing, nobody flies the other recons in gang v gang combat........so NO it does NOT work for them in fact it is one of the main contributing factors (along with their operational range) to why they are hardly used in anything and never used in gang v gang fighting. Uh, curses, pilgrims, rapiers, huginns and arazu's/lachy's never show up in gang vs gang fighting? Wtf are you smoking? Every gang vs gang fight I go into has some of the ships above and they're quite a great addition to HAC gangs.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:04:00 - [73] Edited by: Murina on 17/04/2009 17:06:01 Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Originally by: Murina Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Dizeezer Velar A Falcon can't really fit a heavy tank if it wants to jam. You consider a half assed shield tank or a few armor plates in the lows a heavy tank? It's what the other recons have to play with, and it works for themà Heres the thing, nobody flies the other recons in gang v gang combat........so NO it does NOT work for them in fact it is one of the main contributing factors (along with their operational range) to why they are hardly used in anything and never used in gang v gang fighting. Uh, curses, pilgrims, rapiers, huginns and arazu's/lachy's never show up in gang vs gang fighting? Wtf are you smoking? Nope, im not saying that a few of these ships now and again go roaming and get a few ganks ect, but to claim they are a regular make up of gang v gang combat is foolish and its you who are smoking summat if you say otherwise. In fact if it was so why are so many ppl claiming that all we see are falcons flown by alts.................make up your mind what story you prefer and stick to it at least......
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:05:00 - [74] Originally by: Murina Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Uh, curses, pilgrims, rapiers, huginns and arazu's/lachy's never show up in gang vs gang fighting? Wtf are you smoking? Nope, im not saying that a few of these ships now and again go roaming and get a few ganks ect, but to claim they are a regular make up of gang v gang combat is foolish and its you who are smoking summat if you say otherwise. They're support ships. They routinely show up to uh, support gangs. Recon only gangs aren't exactly uncommon either.
Murina Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:08:00 - [75] Edited by: Murina on 17/04/2009 17:09:02 Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Originally by: Murina Originally by: Dasalt Istgut Uh, curses, pilgrims, rapiers, huginns and arazu's/lachy's never show up in gang vs gang fighting? Wtf are you smoking? Nope, im not saying that a few of these ships now and again go roaming and get a few ganks ect, but to claim they are a regular make up of gang v gang combat is foolish and its you who are smoking summat if you say otherwise. They're support ships. They routinely show up to uh, support gangs. Recon only gangs aren't exactly uncommon either. Im not saying that a few of these ships now and again go roaming and get a few ganks ect, but to claim they are a regular make up of gang v gang combat is foolish and its you who are smoking summat if you say otherwise. Recon only gangs look for ganks, they rarely get into gang v gang fights because of how thin they are and the range they work at. In fact if it was so why are so many ppl claiming that all we see are falcons flown by alts in gang combat?.................make up your mind what story you prefer and stick to it at least......
Dasalt Istgut	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:11:00 - [76] Originally by: Murina In fact if it was so why are so many ppl claiming that all we see are falcons flown by alts in gang combat?.................make up your mind what story you prefer and stick to it at least...... I never said that at all. The only time I see falcon alts is when pirates are 'soloing' or random other 'solo' PVP'ers or incredibly small gang (like 2-3 person war dec griefer corps). I think claims of falcon alts are overblown to say the least.
Carmine Cerise	Posted - 2009.04.17 17:39:00 - [77] Originally by: Omara Otawan Originally by: Jared D'Uroth Wait, so they bring the Falcon INLINE with the other Recons, and you are complaining. I hope you're trolling when you ADMIT that gangs without Falcons always lost. No ship should ALWAYS be needed to win. They didnt bring it inline, or it would have a tank, its ewar would work 100% of the time and it would be able to deal damage. Jesus, everyone pisºing and moaning about "Not 100% of the time, waaaah." Suck it up. You want to whine about 100% effective, what about the rest of the EWar modules? Not a single one of them completely shuts down a ships's PvP abilities (aside from neuting but that's a detriment to the aggressor as well). So, chance based / 100% shutdown = 100% chance / partial shutdown. As for the other ships fitting 6 EW modules, they don't need to. They aren't all effective against every race and type of ship. IE Nos/Neut only effects Amarr/Gallente (as far as guns go), TDs don't effect Caldari at all, and Target Painting is just a waste of time, as is damping. Have you guys completely forgotten about all the pisºing and moaning that went on about damps working 100% of the time at full strength? Everyone hated it but everyone used it. Those of you begging and pleading for 100% ECM effectiveness: CCP already had that at one time, with the damps. IT DOESN'T WORK.


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