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cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
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Posted - 2012.05.07 21:18:00 -
[61] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Nothing in the text warns about any possible scam genius or that orders will be cancelled. It's very poorly explained and therefore not documented.
Logic try it.
interestingly the "give isk" function doesn't contain a long list of ways you might not want to use that option either guess all scams that involve you giving isk are also "not documented"
the troll bus is calling for you to board. |
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
103
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:20:00 -
[62] - Quote
if only there was some sort of way to put an item up on the market for a price higher than the current buy offer, and ask people to pay you that price when they need the product |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:21:00 -
[63] - Quote
Lauren Hellfury wrote:So you were docked in an empty station and you think that there is no way for anyone else to have sold items at that station without being there....... You really, *really* *REALLY* need to brush up on trading. I'd suggest starting with reading the descriptions of the skills in the trade section of the skill market.
Clearly market trading is not my main activity in eve online as you can tell by my lack of experience with trading. However a BUY and SELL order were pretty clear up until recently. Now I don't understand what a BUY order actually represents or how it even exists when they can be funded with NO funds.
I wish plex could be funded this way as well. Eve would finally be a game you can play for free and everyone would just train margin trading to 5. Fun! |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:22:00 -
[64] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote:Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Nothing in the text warns about any possible scam genius or that orders will be cancelled. It's very poorly explained and therefore not documented.
Logic try it.
interestingly the "give isk" function doesn't contain a long list of ways you might not want to use that option either guess all scams that involve you giving isk are also "not documented" the troll bus is calling for you to board.
seems like a valid point to me.
you know, the "undock" function dosn't contain a long list of reasons why you might not want to use it, come to think of it. food for thought! |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3072
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:22:00 -
[65] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote: Clearly market trading is not my main activity in eve online as you can tell by my lack of experience with trading. However a BUY and SELL order were pretty clear up until recently. Now I don't understand what a BUY order actually represents or how it even exists when they can be funded with NO funds.
I wish plex could be funded this way as well. Eve would finally be a game you can play for free and everyone would just train margin trading to 5. Fun!
they can
you just funded Turizmo's
he's very appreciative |
Darth Tickles
Dark Sun Consortium
318
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:23:00 -
[66] - Quote
I'm going to make exorbitant profit in this area of the game I obviously know nothing about!
I got scammed!
WAAAAAHN CCP!
You will not be missed. |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:25:00 -
[67] - Quote
corestwo wrote:cyndrogen wrote:Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Nothing in the text warns about any possible scam genius or that orders will be cancelled. It's very poorly explained and therefore not documented.
Logic try it.
interestingly the "give isk" function doesn't contain a long list of ways you might not want to use that option either guess all scams that involve you giving isk are also "not documented" the troll bus is calling for you to board. seems like a valid point to me. you know, the "undock" function dosn't contain a long list of reasons why you might not want to use it, come to think of it. food for thought!
BUY orders bought through MARGIN trading should CLEARLY state MARGIN and NOT BUY.
I don't see why this is such a bad idea. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:26:00 -
[68] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote:corestwo wrote:cyndrogen wrote:Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Nothing in the text warns about any possible scam genius or that orders will be cancelled. It's very poorly explained and therefore not documented.
Logic try it.
interestingly the "give isk" function doesn't contain a long list of ways you might not want to use that option either guess all scams that involve you giving isk are also "not documented" the troll bus is calling for you to board. seems like a valid point to me. you know, the "undock" function dosn't contain a long list of reasons why you might not want to use it, come to think of it. food for thought! BUY orders bought through MARGIN trading should CLEARLY state MARGIN and NOT BUY. I don't see why this is such a bad idea.
you'd still have lost all your money because by that point, you'd have already bought his order. so not only are you gullible, but you're bad at game design too! |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:27:00 -
[69] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Clearly market trading is not my main activity in eve online as you can tell by my lack of experience with trading. However a BUY and SELL order were pretty clear up until recently. Now I don't understand what a BUY order actually represents or how it even exists when they can be funded with NO funds.
I wish plex could be funded this way as well. Eve would finally be a game you can play for free and everyone would just train margin trading to 5. Fun!
they can you just funded Turizmo's he's very appreciative
Exactly, he will get to play for two months using my ISK that I earned via missions. All it took was ONE skill to train vs 2 years of training for all the different skills I had to train. Man am I a sucker for training all that useless junk when I could be playing for free!
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Darth Tickles
Dark Sun Consortium
318
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:29:00 -
[70] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote:Exactly, he will get to play for two months using my ISK that I earned via missions. All it took was ONE skill to train vs 2 years of training for all the different skills I had to train. Man am I a sucker for training all that useless junk when I could be playing for free!
Exactly. |
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Lauren Hellfury
Full Pocket Aggro
332
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:31:00 -
[71] - Quote
I bet that makes cyn mad too Help rid New Eden of T2 BPOs:-áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=62797 The Full Pocket Aggro blog:-á http://fullpocketaggro.blogspot.com/ Now showing: The incursion situation |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3073
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:31:00 -
[72] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote: Exactly, he will get to play for two months using my ISK that I earned via missions. All it took was ONE skill to train vs 2 years of training for all the different skills I had to train. Man am I a sucker for training all that useless junk when I could be playing for free!
that's the great part of this game, having a brain matters more than skillpoints
you may wish to try a game where this is not the case given your particular aptitudes |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:31:00 -
[73] - Quote
two years of mission running and you only have a billion isk?
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Traumatica
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
2
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Posted - 2012.05.07 21:31:00 -
[74] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote:Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Clearly market trading is not my main activity in eve online as you can tell by my lack of experience with trading. However a BUY and SELL order were pretty clear up until recently. Now I don't understand what a BUY order actually represents or how it even exists when they can be funded with NO funds.
I wish plex could be funded this way as well. Eve would finally be a game you can play for free and everyone would just train margin trading to 5. Fun!
they can you just funded Turizmo's he's very appreciative Exactly, he will get to play for two months using my ISK that I earned via missions. All it took was ONE skill to train vs 2 years of training for all the different skills I had to train. Man am I a sucker for training all that useless junk when I could be playing for free!
Well now you have all that extra time to eat crayons |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:32:00 -
[75] - Quote
Why would I buy something if it was clearly market as a margin trade and not a buy order?
a BUY order would cover the funds, a margin order may or may not have the funds.
If you are still stupid enough to go ahead and attempt a margin trade, fine you deserve to be scammed.
The issue right now is that there is no way to tell if the BUY order is backed by any funds before you decide to make the trade.
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cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:33:00 -
[76] - Quote
Traumatica wrote:cyndrogen wrote:Weaselior wrote:cyndrogen wrote: Clearly market trading is not my main activity in eve online as you can tell by my lack of experience with trading. However a BUY and SELL order were pretty clear up until recently. Now I don't understand what a BUY order actually represents or how it even exists when they can be funded with NO funds.
I wish plex could be funded this way as well. Eve would finally be a game you can play for free and everyone would just train margin trading to 5. Fun!
they can you just funded Turizmo's he's very appreciative Exactly, he will get to play for two months using my ISK that I earned via missions. All it took was ONE skill to train vs 2 years of training for all the different skills I had to train. Man am I a sucker for training all that useless junk when I could be playing for free! Well now you have all that extra time to eat crayons
LOL, unlike you I will not be sitting inside a POD in my own goo. Enjoy your slime. |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:34:00 -
[77] - Quote
okay we'll spell this one out for you
if orders that were created with margin trading were marked somehow - decorated with skull & crossbones and radiation symbols, perhaps, just to make it really really clear for people like you - then the entire buy side of the market would look like chernobyl. the reason for this is that the vast majority of its usage is completely legitimate and above the table and there is no way to turn the skill off once you've trained it, nor is there ever much of a reason to.
did I make that clear enough, or should I use smaller words for you? |
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
103
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:36:00 -
[78] - Quote
honestly i wasn't aware that you could even make a buy order unless you had trained margin trading
it's just that good |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:37:00 -
[79] - Quote
Lauren Hellfury wrote:I bet that makes cyn mad too
Bro I'm not mad I just can't afford to waste another two weeks grinding missions when all it takes is a margin trade to play for free.
I'm soooo far from mad I'm actually glad it happened because he deserves my isk, and the two months on plex it will buy.
He can have the ISK, I'm just warning those like me who have little trading experience.
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Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3074
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:38:00 -
[80] - Quote
there's a thread "warning" about this literally once a week or more |
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Darth Tickles
Dark Sun Consortium
318
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:41:00 -
[81] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:there's a thread "warning" about this literally once a week or more
Definitely not always as hilarious though.
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cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:43:00 -
[82] - Quote
corestwo wrote:okay we'll spell this one out for you
if orders that were created with margin trading were marked somehow - decorated with skull & crossbones and radiation symbols, perhaps, just to make it really really clear for people like you - then the entire buy side of the market would look like chernobyl. the reason for this is that the vast majority of its usage is completely legitimate and above the table and there is no way to turn the skill off once you've trained it, nor is there ever much of a reason to.
did I make that clear enough, or should I use smaller words for you?
and this is bad how? I like the skull and crossbones idea. Very appropriate. |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:44:00 -
[83] - Quote
corestwo wrote:two years of mission running and you only have a billion isk?
I lose a lot of ships too. I never said I was good at eve. Eve is easy when you have no job. |
Promiscuous Female
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
104
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:44:00 -
[84] - Quote
cyndrogen wrote:corestwo wrote:okay we'll spell this one out for you
if orders that were created with margin trading were marked somehow - decorated with skull & crossbones and radiation symbols, perhaps, just to make it really really clear for people like you - then the entire buy side of the market would look like chernobyl. the reason for this is that the vast majority of its usage is completely legitimate and above the table and there is no way to turn the skill off once you've trained it, nor is there ever much of a reason to.
did I make that clear enough, or should I use smaller words for you? and this is bad how? let's say I sell a product that can detect if a person has aids
except it shows everyone as having aids
margin trading is like aids -- everyone has it so detecting if they have aids is useless |
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:47:00 -
[85] - Quote
apparently I didn't make it clear enough, which means his metaphor will probably escape you too.
if every warning is lit up like fukushima to warn you that it was created with margin trading and might be a scam, they might as well not be lit up at all |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:48:00 -
[86] - Quote
Promiscuous Female wrote:cyndrogen wrote:corestwo wrote:okay we'll spell this one out for you
if orders that were created with margin trading were marked somehow - decorated with skull & crossbones and radiation symbols, perhaps, just to make it really really clear for people like you - then the entire buy side of the market would look like chernobyl. the reason for this is that the vast majority of its usage is completely legitimate and above the table and there is no way to turn the skill off once you've trained it, nor is there ever much of a reason to.
did I make that clear enough, or should I use smaller words for you? and this is bad how? let's say I sell a product that can detect if a person has aids except it shows everyone as having aids margin trading is like aids -- everyone has it so detecting if they have aids is useless
Well, if I knew what to look for maybe I could have avoided the scam, the problem is I did not understand how margin trading worked since there are no tutorials so yeah, I screwed up, I admit that but that still doesn't change the fact that buy orders are ficticious and unless you understand what a margin trade is there is no way for someone to tell if they are being scammed or not. It looks like a legitimate buy order. |
Weaselior
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
3074
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:49:00 -
[87] - Quote
the man has a point the game should require you to pass such advanced tests as 2+2= ??? and "the sky is blue y/n" before allowing you to do something as dangerous as buy something off the market |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:51:00 -
[88] - Quote
Weaselior wrote:the man has a point the game should require you to pass such advanced tests as 2+2= ??? and "the sky is blue y/n" before allowing you to do something as dangerous as buy something off the market
I love how all the goons support margin trading as a legitimate game mechanic. Are you too afraid that CCP might actually fix it? |
cyndrogen
Occultum Scientia
62
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:54:00 -
[89] - Quote
corestwo wrote:Tell you the truth, I've never scammed in my life. I have all of three suicide ganks to my name, ever. All of my beating up on carebears is done out in 0.0, where they're implicitly consent to PvP, whether they think they have or not.
I still hold that eve should be the way it is, that things like this scam, and thievery in general, and suicide ganking, and so on, should be possible. If you want a game where that kinda stuff isn't allowed, go find one. This one isn't it.
e: Lets be clear here, you're saying that the game, which CCP has designed from day one to allow for the unwary player to lose everything, should not be a game in which you can lose everything. So uh, yeah.
Dude where did you read in my post that I said this should NOT be allowed? I said people should be AWARE not, kill this game mechanic.
Gank, loot, steal, whatever have fun hopefully while doing it, I'm just not sure how you read this as STOP MARGIN TRADING.
I never said that.
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corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
296
|
Posted - 2012.05.07 21:56:00 -
[90] - Quote
I've never used margin trading in a scammy way in the entirety of my eve career.
I did use it to trade 50m isk into 18b isk over the course of about six months which was possible because having the skill maxed out meant I was able to effectively "trade" with what was effectively four times the amount of isk that I had in my wallet at a minimum at any given time, though, and as I've been tutoring several newbie goons in the ins & outs of the market, including how to leverage margin trading in the same way, yes, I do worry sometimes that they'll cave to whiners like you and remove it. |
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