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Thenoran
Caldari
Tranquility Industries
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Posted - 2009.05.17 17:53:00 -
[61]
I trained all my basics ones and Learning to V, the advanced ones to IV.
Doubt I'll ever train the Advanced ones to V, would take too long to get any benefit out of it.
I'd recommend getting the basics to V (especially those for your playstyle) and getting +3 or +4 implants after a while.
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Low-sec is like sailing along the coast of Somalia...
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Ttochpej
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Posted - 2009.05.18 07:54:00 -
[62]
I have all learning maxed out, partly because I want to try and beat my bother with skill points and he started a while before I started eve, I haven't spent the money to get +5 implants yet
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Tremitry Darkstar
Caldari
Rule of Five
The Junta
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Posted - 2009.05.18 19:29:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Tremitry Darkstar on 18/05/2009 19:32:00
Edited by: Tremitry Darkstar on 18/05/2009 19:30:20
Gaius,
Pottsey actually makes a decent point even if (s)he doesn't explain it very well. The point Pottsey is making is that training the advanced learning skills to 5 now allows your character to quickly adapt to new changes in the game faster. When looking at it from this perspective, it's not so much about how many SP's you need before it becomes beneficial, but has to do more with the changes that CCP makes to the game.
If you're looking at the total benefit from a brand new character's perspective, then yes, it will take a few years before the benefits of training the advanced skills to 5 are seen. No one in this thread is disputing that. However, as CCP tweaks skills and ships, or even adds new skills and ships to the game, then the character that spent the time to train up their advanced learning skills to 5 will naturally train these new skills much more quickly.
If your goal today is to create a new toon and fly battleships really well, then it would not be in your interest to train the advanced learning skills to 5. However, if your goals are continually changing (due to CCP tweaks/additions, new corp roles you have to fit, or just on a whim), then getting the advanced skills to 5 (along with Cybernetics 5) will be in your best interest. You'll no longer be looking at your skill training from character creation to 4+ years out. You'll be looking at your skill training at a more flexible viewpoint.
If you want to be using T4, T5, or Tn ships, or any other new/changed ships as soon as they come out, then training your advanced learning skills to 5 is worth it since you don't know what the your skill plan is going to be yet.
TLDR:
Static goals: don't bother training advanced learning skills to max.
Variable goals: maxing out your stats is a good idea as you will be able to train faster when your training goals change for whatever reasons (nerfs, buffs, or new skills/ships/modules).
-Tremitry Darkstar |
Bladen Kerst
Caldari
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2009.05.18 21:02:00 -
[64]
The advantage you get in that case scenario is negligible  These days every new feature CCP releases comes prenerfed and chances are you will have to wait another half a year after you have trained skills to benefit from it, like with Black Ops lol
Anyway you don't cease to amaze me people.. you worry about 4% tactical advantage in skill training speed for new features, yet you don't care about disadvantage of spending 2 months out of your first half year for nothing.
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Chathe
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.05.18 21:33:00 -
[65]
best case you save 21.47 day of training in a year , worst case you save 13.52 days of training in a year.
you get a much larger quantity of skillpoints over the year by having a decent skill plan ~ 10 million skill point difference in a year.
it takes 323 days to pay off a single advanced 5. 861 to pay off all but cha ( who does cha ? )
( my opinion ) A new player should not do the advanced 5's until they're at a point with there character that they want to train a skill with more than a 3x multiplier. At that point they should take a serious look ( my opinion )
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Lagruna Zegata
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Posted - 2009.05.19 07:27:00 -
[66]
But the problem is if you wait too long to train the adv V's you will gain less potential benefit from it. The earlier they are trained, the better....but admittedly the boredom factor can be immense.
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Pottsey
Enheduanni Foundation
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Posted - 2009.05.19 08:39:00 -
[67]
Chathe said "it takes 323 days to pay off a single advanced 5. 861 to pay off all but cha ( who does cha ? )"
I did and benefited a lot from it. adv5 cha saved me a lot of time on my skill plans. But new players most likely shouldn't get it unless they expect CCP to bring out a lot of cha skills which they might for WiS which looks to be highly based around Cha and trading.
It's a bit of a gamble but there looks to be a lot of trade skills and skills to hire people who work for you in shops. I would guess the speaking to people, hiring people, new types of trading are all Cha based. So if people think they might get into WiS they might benfit from adv5 cha.
______
How to Passive Shield Tank T2
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Eireen Harvenheit
Amarr
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Posted - 2009.05.19 09:01:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Eireen Harvenheit on 19/05/2009 09:02:26
I'm still fairly new character i'd say (only about 8 months). And yes i trained all learnings to lvl5. Eve is not like i missed something out. Yes my friends are dealing more dmg and are able to tank more. So yes, i knew payback is in terms of years. But learning is like the most important skill section imo. It allows you to train faster. That is most essential in eve.
So to hint new characters whether to take adv learning to 5. My asnwer is : if you are ok with fact you will have to play very long to get payback and if you can bear 2 and half months for all of them to get them from lvl4 to lvl5, then go for it. I've been there and tried. Training them to lvl5 is suffering when you see everyone around flying new and new things and do better and better but you're training something with "no effect". It is discouraging. Brace yourself if you go down that road.
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KiwiMatt
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Posted - 2009.05.22 04:37:00 -
[69]
When all is said and done, there are 2 main times when you might like to train all adv learning to lvl5.
1. Where you KNOW you are in it for the long term and will be playing for at least 4-5 years
2. Where your RL limits the time you can play online, work trips, holidays etc - so setting adv's from 4-5 won't annoy you too much.
MY situation is a mix of both - the day adv skills came out I trained nothing but them until they were done, then carried on with eve, knowing I had fallen behind a bit, but not really caring. I was only managing to get on for 20 mins or so at a time, so not needing to fly around in a new shiny spaceship as fast as possible at that point.
Now so many years later, by ANY payoff time calculation imagineable, I am ahead and always will be, and have been for a while... about 2 years and yes, it is nice to know that with the +5's in my head I will always be accumulating sp's at a high rate. At those "measly" 1.6sp's a minute extra I am now passed the point of breaking even and surpassed it by about 1.5M sp's - and growing every minute...
So regardless of weather you use Pottesys convoluted scenarios's which work for him, or purely mathmatical calc's of others - there IS a payoff point at some stage and if it floats your boat.. then go for it.
my 2 isk worth 
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.05.22 08:05:00 -
[70]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 22/05/2009 08:07:41
<Deleted again. Dang this is an old Lazarus thread that I've already replied to twice.>
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