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OMGNOTANOTHERALT
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Posted - 2009.05.13 05:31:00 -
[1]
I've been using a CNR with a faction fitting for some time now to run missions, and whilst it is an undeniably efficient mission running ship, I'm starting to tire of its unpleasant looks and its 'sit still, lock, fire, repeat' mentality.
So I'm asking for opinions on what other ships offer similar efficiency/effectiveness whilst being in general more pleasant to look at and fly... something that doesn't use missiles would be a good start :)
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Merin Ryskin
Peregrine Industries
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Posted - 2009.05.13 05:46:00 -
[2]
There is none. The Paladin/Nightmare can match the CNR if you only fight NPCs with an EM weakness, but for anything else, the only ship that can even come close to challenging the CNR is the Golem.
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Xapharia
WOLIMAZO INC
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Posted - 2009.05.13 05:48:00 -
[3]
You might want to take the step into marauders. Golem is the best all-round marauder, but if you only do missions against certain types of enemies the Paladin and Kronos are better. I've heard mixed arguments about the Vargur, so I cannot be sure how that one would play out for you.
_________________________
 Originally by: CCP Whisper
Boo hoo. Cry some more.
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Arkeladin
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Posted - 2009.05.13 05:52:00 -
[4]
Originally by: OMGNOTANOTHERALT
I've been using a CNR with a faction fitting for some time now to run missions, and whilst it is an undeniably efficient mission running ship, I'm starting to tire of its unpleasant looks and its 'sit still, lock, fire, repeat' mentality.
So I'm asking for opinions on what other ships offer similar efficiency/effectiveness whilst being in general more pleasant to look at and fly... something that doesn't use missiles would be a good start :)
If you're in Amarr space and have the skills, Armageddon/Abbadon. Lasers have a more difficult time of if in other race's space, and you need good cap/armor tanking skills,
With good drone skills, a Dominix is just as versatile as a CNR, but drones can be muy expensive to replace. Megathron can be good too.
Staying Caldari a Rokh can be good as a blasterboat - tank is nice (same resistance bonus a Drake gets) and a 55KM range with faction Antimatter does good damage - not high by PvPer standards, but decent enough for all that, especially with t2 guns.
Can't speak for Minmatar, no experience with their BS :)
Marauders are the ultimate missionrunners, taking them into lowsec is begging to be ganked - and so, depending on fit, is using them in highsec.
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Pretty H4X
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Posted - 2009.05.13 05:55:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Pretty H4X on 13/05/2009 05:55:45
Marauders are certainly something I'm aiming towards, mainly because the prerequisites are handy in general (except perhaps EGU V), however certainly the Golem would not resolve my issue. I suppose I could have a Paladin for running Blood/Sansha missions (I'm using an Amarr agent currently) and just use the CNR for other damage types... It's such a pain that only missiles have such damage versatility.
Edit - posted on my alt before.
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Pretty H4X
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Posted - 2009.05.13 06:12:00 -
[6]
Having poked around on EFT the Paladin looks pretty sweet - 770 damage with T2 pulses and Scorch at 45+10km range. I guess that would make a good - albeit expensive - complement to the CNR.
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Leiara Knight
Gallente
The Oblivion Guard
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Posted - 2009.05.13 06:29:00 -
[7]
If you're not dead from the waist down, I would heartily suggest the Hyperion or the mighty Tempest.
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Research Shizzle
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Posted - 2009.05.13 06:41:00 -
[8]
Don't listen to the people that say a Paladin is *only* good for Sansha/Blood missions. The Paladin burns through ALL rat types extremely fast. Yes, it burns through sansha/blood quicker than other rat types, but it still burns through those other rat types extremely fast. Don't let people tell you you need 2 different ships to do Lvl 4s (Unless you're an extremely anal min/max'er). At this level of higher quality ships, missioning time differences are extremely minimal between the 2.
Originally by: Pretty H4X
Edited by: Pretty H4X on 13/05/2009 05:55:45
Marauders are certainly something I'm aiming towards, mainly because the prerequisites are handy in general (except perhaps EGU V), however certainly the Golem would not resolve my issue. I suppose I could have a Paladin for running Blood/Sansha missions (I'm using an Amarr agent currently) and just use the CNR for other damage types... It's such a pain that only missiles have such damage versatility.
Edit - posted on my alt before.
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.13 07:17:00 -
[9]
The duh answer is 2 CNRs.
Originally by: CCP Oveur
The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Zen Mehari
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Posted - 2009.05.13 07:43:00 -
[10]
Kronos or Paladin are both enjoyable to fly.
Kronos has the added benefit of hybrids which are useful for your native Caldari...then again lasers are just plain sexy (although only 4 on a Paladin so no disco  ).
If I was in your shoes I'd train up for a Golem...then gradually work your way to a Kronos, with a stopover in the Hyperion to get a feel for a railgun platform and use a Golem when you really need EM/Exp damage.
If lasers take your fancy then train up for a apoc/geddon and gradually work your way to a Paladin.
Either choice will take a while to get there so I suggest flying one of the lower-tiered ships to add some spice and get a feel for the Marauder equivalent.
Marauder V is a pain but oh-so-sweet for the mission grinder.
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Pretty H4X
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Posted - 2009.05.13 07:52:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Pretty H4X on 13/05/2009 07:54:59
Edited by: Pretty H4X on 13/05/2009 07:54:27
Some very helpful suggestions here. I think the last poster and the pro-paladin guy (forgot names sorry, why it only shows the OP on the new post page is beyond me) has summed up my intentions here, after some more poking around, combined with the undeniable sexiness of Amarr ships in general, I think that marauders followed by Amarr cross training is the way I'll go (since I don't have many hybrid skills anyway).
Thanks for all the replies :)
Edit - Zen Mehari and Research ****zle :)
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Leiara Knight
Gallente
The Oblivion Guard
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Posted - 2009.05.13 07:57:00 -
[12]
You are most welcome.
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comrade captain
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:09:00 -
[13]
The nightmare is the best imo, the only downside is the lack of 40km tractor beams, the tracking is superb with tachyons.
However you can make a paladin as good as a nightmare 4 tech 2 tachs amarr navy crystals- 2 tech 2 or faction tracking comps if isk allows in med slots with tracking scripts, voila a paladin that tracks as well if not better than a nightmare with 40km tractor beams 
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Pretty H4X
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:18:00 -
[14]
Hrmm, since I plan to use pulses on my fits I don't think a Nightmare would really be a worthwhile investment... although admittedly the pimp-factor would about make up for it :)
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Zaqar
Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:20:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Zaqar on 13/05/2009 08:21:10
Forget pulses - total waste of time on ships that can fit tachs so easily. You'll be spending half your time waiting to get into range.
(assuming it's for missions)
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comrade captain
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:22:00 -
[16]
Pulses fire a bit faster and track better but they dont have the instapop factor on cruisers and the 2-3 volleys max to pop bses that tachs do. I think tachs are a lot more fun, just swap out to pulse for missions where all the npcs are close eg damsel in distress.
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Pretty H4X
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:31:00 -
[17]
A compelling argument :) Just looked at it again and 6k alpha and 900 DPS certainly makes a good point, and it saves burning through T2 crystals. It would also validate the expenditure on a Nightmare, which I'm a lot closer to skill-wise.
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Psi Draconis
Caldari
Pirate Shop
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:33:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Anubis Xian
The duh answer is 2 CNRs.
This, both running their own missions 
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comrade captain
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:33:00 -
[19]
i use tech 2 pulse and tachs, with tachs i dont think ive burnt out a single amarr navy crystal yet in months of level 4s. However ive gone through quite a few scorch crystals while using pulse. Ammo is pretty much free for a very long time in a tach nm or pally.
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Khornne
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:44:00 -
[20]
Thanks for creating topic #3249002 on that topic.
Answer still is: Golem.
--
Khornne's Teamspeak Server Service
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Tarantoga
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Posted - 2009.05.13 08:48:00 -
[21]
Go for Paladin with Techs. Onehitting Sansha BCs with 6500 dam is teh sex.
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Ebru Shally
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Posted - 2009.05.13 09:52:00 -
[22]
i must say that my maelstorm with 3xGyros and 8x1200mm scout projectile turrets do missions as fat as my T2 Cruise Launcher CNR. also tank a lot more than it. and also its 1/3 price with a bigger drone bay and its really hard to tank a projectile ammo. maybe thats because of my skills and also i am doing missions in minmatar space. here are my damage dealing skills for battleships:
For CNR:
Cruise missile spacialization 3
Cruise missiles 5
Caldari Battleship 4
Warhead Upgrades 4
for MAEL:
Large Projectile Turrets 5
Minmatar Battleship 5
Surgical Strike 3
dunno but i prefer to use mael most of the time. i am training for caldari bs5, maybe then it will be a better choice for me.
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Talio ZomB
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Posted - 2009.05.13 10:04:00 -
[23]
I used a CNR for 2 1/2 years
but now a golem
my fit achieves
353m/s
2 40km tractors
1 salvager
approx raw dps and approx range, going from memory
1152 to 38km
900+ to 58km
Painter 49.5% (still got signal focusing or whatever to max out)
cargo bay is much larger than CNR
a very lovely boost bonus
7 mids
I have found the effective DPS of the Golem much better using 1 painter.
the 100% damage bonus helps justify using CN and t2 ammo,
I hit for 1997.4 per torp raw, even if smaller targets negate half of that due to size velocity or other factors I am still hitting hard.
Seasoned mission runners will know how to priortise their targets, I will very often hit cruisers for near full damage minus resistence of course.
the ranges of the torps are rarely a problem.
WC room 1
Vengence room 3
and even at that thats not a big problem.
Granted a CNR with AB 2 painter and some seriously expensive shield gear could maybe match my golem fit and 1 more rig slot will let it shoot farther but thats very expensive fit and the ammo expense I cant justify either.
I have 16mil sp missles, and marauder 5 so I probably wont recommend my fit to newer players.
BLEH!!!!
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Sir Ibex
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Posted - 2009.05.16 17:18:00 -
[24]
Hey guys, what's better for a CNR and Golem? Torpedoes or Cruise Missiles? Right now, I'm well specced for cruises, but I have absolutely no skills for torps. How much skill training do you need to be truly efficient with torpedoes? Are there any tertiary skills that need to be maxed for torpedoes? How do you check the damage your torpedo will do to a cruiser for example? I don't see such an option in EFT...
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Gavin DeVries
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Posted - 2009.05.16 17:39:00 -
[25]
There are two big problems with torpedoes: the explosion radius is huge (450m), and the range is horrible. Fixing the first can really only be accomplished with target painters, since Rigor rigs and Guided Missile Precision skill only apply to guided missiles (cruises in the battleship class weapons). The second can be mitigated in several ways:
1) Tech 2 launchers allows the use of tech 2 ammo. Javelin torps have longer range.
2) The skills Missile Bombardment and Missile Projection increase speed and flight time, both increasing range.
3) If you're flying a Raven derivative, the skill Caldari Battleship gives you a 5% increase per level in missile velocity, also increasing range.
4) Hydraulic Bay Thrusters and Rocket Fuel Cache Partition rigs increase missile speed and flight time, also increasing range.
Generally speaking, I think you need to be able to get some torps out to a true range of about 50-55 km to be able to hit any foe in a mission. You can do a mix of regular/faction torps for close range foes and the longer ranged but somewhat less damaging javelin torps for the extreme range foes. If you can't get these ranges, you're probably better off using cruise missiles except on a very few missions where (almost) all of the foes get up in your face.
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Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? |
Waagaa Ktlehr
Amarr
Evolution
KenZoku
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Posted - 2009.05.16 17:43:00 -
[26]
To answer your question, I need to ask you a question first. Are you interested in just LP or ISK?
If your only interested in grinding LP, then only killing speed is a factor. If you're also interested in optimal ISK making, then you have to worry about salvaging & looting as well.
If your only interest is in LP grinding, go for a CNR or Nightmare.
In other cases Paladin or Torp Golem will suit you fine. Paladin vs anything that's not angel or guristas.
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Traderboz
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Posted - 2009.05.16 18:16:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Waagaa Ktlehr
To answer your question, I need to ask you a question first. Are you interested in just LP or ISK?
If your only interested in grinding LP, then only killing speed is a factor. If you're also interested in optimal ISK making, then you have to worry about salvaging & looting as well.
If your only interest is in LP grinding, go for a CNR or Nightmare.
In other cases Paladin or Torp Golem will suit you fine. Paladin vs anything that's not angel or guristas.
That's spot on I think. If you like to clean up everything in a mission and gather loot/salvage, then a marauder is the best bet. I personally find it's easier to just grind LP, as I make most of my ISK from LP's, not to mention it's more tolerable since I'm not a fan of looting/salvaging/dealing with the pile of loot afterwards.
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Ghoest
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Posted - 2009.05.16 18:35:00 -
[28]
An expensively fit Phoon should match the CNR if you have awesome skills and want to work harder.
Wherever you went - Here you are.
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Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2009.05.17 01:48:00 -
[29]
Nightmare/Paladin > CNR/Golem. No reload, instahit, with one shot killing pretty much everything at range thats smaller than a battleship regardless of npc race Lazorz of Doom ftw. Figure that into your min/max formula. 
Originally by: Fifinella
As to trying to scare me with 0.0/lowsec, well,..... I've been there, and wasn't very scared at all. Only a little.
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Chomapuraku
Caldari
Templar Republic
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Posted - 2009.05.17 02:06:00 -
[30]
golem!! if i didn't have to keep selling mine to pay for a GTC, i'd be rollin in mine with 20-inch rims that keep spinnin every time i stop.
tractor bonus + utility slots + fantastic permatank + big volleys + painter bonus + huge cargo + half ammo usage = YAY
but if you don't want a missile boat, then i don't have anything to say :P
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