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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2009.05.17 20:21:00 -
[61]
Yeah I know.
Your Crusader's ~200 overheated DPS against my unhardened shield had me worried... until I realised that my fifth volley would kill you.
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Bingowas hisnamo
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Posted - 2009.05.18 01:33:00 -
[62]
Originally by: edrenbaton2
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida AB + Scrambler beats MWD each and every time ... provided (ie The "IF") you can get that initial 10km range to kill his drive.
Most killboards you checked are probably for 0.0 entities and MWD is still considered a requirement 'out there' due to bubbles .. look at what is done in with AB fittings FW (low-sec) to get an idea of its power.
http://www.battleclinic.com/eve_online/pk/view/player-Hirana+Yoshida-kills.html
Theory warrior detected. Please continue. its so interesting. Ok where i can see low-sec killboard with afterburners?
Old dog unable to learn new tricks detected.
Granted, AB's arent for every ship, but anyone who doesn't see them in use in PVP at least occasionally regardless of low sec, empire, or 0.0 isn't looking very hard. MWD's are still absolutely necessary in a lot of situations... more than ABs, however there are a lot more uses for AB than there used to be.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.18 07:21:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Merdaneth
If you had only been a member of the Minmatar Militia, you surely wouldn't be laughing. I believe my setups have proven themselves in practice. If you fly them like MWD ships, yes, they don't work. But you need to fly them as AB ships.
this is too funny. i actually melted a couple of your minnie friends (who were flying AB frigates) in my mwd ishkur today. do you know why? well, it's simple. they couldnt catch me.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.18 07:25:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Merdaneth Yesterday I was fighting an MWD Crusader in my AB Crusader.
what would you do against an ishkur? 5 light drones on your ass, 24km point, going 2.6km/s without overheating. if you aggressed it, youre finished. you cannot be serious with that fit.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.18 07:38:00 -
[65]
Edited by: UMEE on 18/05/2009 07:43:26
Originally by: Anubis Xian
Alright, let's look as some numbers. AB frigs vs mwd cruisers. ... All of those cruisers only get slower, while those frigs only get faster.
sorry, my last reply for now.
youre missing the point bud. those frigates may be a little faster, 100-400m/s faster...but that is not enough in pvp. a cruiser pilot will easily control his ship away or toward you at the right moment, then web you. the little extra speed you've got won't be enough to change direction in time.
secondly, are you at all thinking about light drones? i dont think you are. even hob II's can go about 3.1km/s, and easily maintain orbit around you. mwd fits can maintain range on cruisers. a few inties can even outrun warrior II's. if you cant, then at least you can warp out.
finally, to all those drawing on their mad "pvp experience" to make these silly conclusions about AB's: if youre using an AB in pvp, you simply aren't good enough to compete with those who are experienced. this is why you don't understand why AB's suck. enough said.
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Merdaneth
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 08:51:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Merdaneth on 18/05/2009 08:52:22
Originally by: UMEE so i say, it is you who hasn't tested your AB fits in real pvp.
I do believe I have over 500 solo kills using AB ships. I have tested them plenty, have you? I guess not. Also, you might not realize, but we are fighting at the same side in FW. I don't have 'Minnie friends'
Originally by: UMEE what would you do against an ishkur? 5 light drones on your ass, 24km point, going 2.6km/s without overheating. if you aggressed it, youre finished. you cannot be serious with that fit.
I would do with I have done with all the Ishkur's I destroyed solo. Rely on the overconfidence of pilots like yourself, warp in, lock, point, shoot and watch stare when my Crusader engages them at point blank, then flail to lock me, panic to get their drones out and see watch their armor melt faster then had thought possible:
http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=25675 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=22076 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=21896 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=21121 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=17786
I'm not just serious with my fit, I'm *deadly* serious.
Originally by: UMEE even a ranis would destroy you with his 2 hobgoblins
As quote above, this fit is *deadly* serious, here a list of my solo Taranis kills in FW with my AB Crusader:
http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=50631 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=25556 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=25422 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=50632 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=25418 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=50633 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=19467 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=17249 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=15236
Before speed changes:
http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=11387 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=11259 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=11080 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=4303 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=2444 http://www.amarr-empire.net/killboard/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=988
My last solo loss to a Taranis is from before FW.
Can I see a list of your solo kills with you flying MWD ships against opponents in similar shiptypes? That way everyone can verify your "mad pvp experience"? ____
The Illusion of Freedom | The Truth about Slavery |
Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.18 09:18:00 -
[67]
Originally by: UMEE Edited by: UMEE on 18/05/2009 07:44:41
Originally by: Merdaneth Yesterday I was fighting an MWD Crusader in my AB Crusader.
what would you do against an ishkur? 5 light drones on your ass, 24km point, going 2.6km/s without overheating. if you aggressed it, youre finished. you cannot be serious with that fit. even a ranis would destroy you with his 2 hobgoblins
What did you plan to do after your drones were destroyed?
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 09:23:00 -
[68]
While Merdaneth is a little harsh, he's right. The AB Crusader does a lot better vs Ranises than the MWD Crusader due to the fact that Crusader is no longer a ship that can engage at 10-15k after the Locust + optimal nerf.
Although, to be fair, I'm fairly certain that a well-piloted MWD+AB Taranis would beat the Crusader in a 1on1 - MWD to get into range, turn on the AB the instant your MWD is offlined and simply keep at a close range (don't orbit to mess up your tracking). There are not a lot of well-piloted Ranises around though, seeing as a big majority of the people who fly them still think that a 500m orbit is somehow a good idea vs other Interceptors (see Disintregrator's movie where 90% of the Taranises he fights are orbiting and missing half their shots).
Some people are far too narrowminded on this forum. AB fits work in some instances. They are not the end be all of PvP though. I have multiple Crusaders lined up in my Hangar with both MWDs and ABs on 'em.
I lost my latest AB Crusader to a Rifter of all things. Funniest part is, I lost it after fighting this guy 1on1 once before, winning and telling him that "if he had a Neut he would have killed me" - which, when I returned a week or so later, he obviously did. Bad idea on my part to engage him, I knew his name looked familiar. ;) I capped out when he was just hitting hull - with a MWD I would have capped out way earlier. In hindsight, I should have stopped repairing earlier and simply gone for fullout damage and I may have been able to kill him before capping out. ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.18 09:29:00 -
[69]
Originally by: UMEE
secondly, are you at all thinking about light drones? i dont think you are. even hob II's can go about 3.1km/s, and easily maintain orbit around you. mwd fits can maintain range on cruisers. a few inties can even outrun warrior II's. if you cant, then at least you can warp out.
finally, to all those drawing on their mad "pvp experience" to make these silly conclusions about AB's: if youre using an AB in pvp, you simply aren't good enough to compete with those who are experienced. this is why you don't understand why AB's suck. enough said.
...
You are so clueless it hurts. I thought Gunship Diplomacy were a little smarter than this.
Is this your main? Because...wow, those are some pityful PvP stats. I think you may want to get a little more experience before you talk about these things.
ABs do not suck. They have a role just as every other module ingame has a role (save for some really terrible drones and whatnot). They are not the best for every role, infact they are usually not the best choice at all seeing as the frigates you wish to use them on are primarily tacklers in fleets. But that does not make them a bad choice for solo work.
I am absolutely amazed at the sheer amount of stupidity in this thread. Some of you should avoid commenting on topics that you do not have the slightest clue about. ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.18 09:29:00 -
[70]
Originally by: UMEE Edited by: UMEE on 18/05/2009 07:43:26
Originally by: Anubis Xian
Alright, let's look as some numbers. AB frigs vs mwd cruisers. ... All of those cruisers only get slower, while those frigs only get faster.
sorry, my last reply for now.
youre missing the point bud. those frigates may be a little faster, 100-400m/s faster...but that is not enough in pvp. a cruiser pilot will easily control his ship away or toward you at the right moment, then web you. the little extra speed you've got won't be enough to change direction in time.
You may not be aware of this, but MWDs add significant mass to ships that already maneuver much slower than frigates.
Another thing you may not be aware of is that while you have that AB frig webbed and 24km disrupted, he has your mwd completely disabled AND you webbed on top of that. The AB frig in this case has a much larger mobility advantage.
Quote: secondly, are you at all thinking about light drones? i dont think you are. even hob II's can go about 3.1km/s, and easily maintain orbit around you. mwd fits can maintain range on cruisers. a few inties can even outrun warrior II's. if you cant, then at least you can warp out.
As said before, light drones can explode.
Quote: finally, to all those drawing on their mad "pvp experience" to make these silly conclusions about AB's: if youre using an AB in pvp, you simply aren't good enough to compete with those who are experienced. this is why you don't understand why AB's suck. enough said.
You do realize the MWD is a crutch right? It gives even the worst players an edge. Frankly I'm still of the mind that CCP should never have caved to the playerbase, instead making them more into the module they were intended to be rather than into what they were not supposed to be.
Oh and in your silly tirade, you overlooked the fact I never said ABs were superior to MWDs. I am one of those weird people that can find a viable use for different fits and don't chase the FOTM. But keep this in mind: MWD ships only get slower, especially with plates. AB ships only get faster.
MWDs have their place and so do ABs.
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.19 00:40:00 -
[71]
Edited by: UMEE on 19/05/2009 00:46:27 Edited by: UMEE on 19/05/2009 00:43:41 fail, fail, fail. yes, gunship are an awesome bunch of people. and believe me, they dont fit AB's on their inties. rofl. mind you, an AB has some use on the rifter in 1v1 frig combat... but thats about it.
someone mentioned blowing the drones up, and what do i do then? 1. you wouldnt down the drones fast enough in a lol ab sader...theyd be on top of you so fast. 2. if you did, my rails would finish you.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.19 00:46:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Merdaneth
stuff
sorry you spent so much time finding those KM's. i didnt read a single one. i already told u man, u were fighting noobs. i dont care what u killed, and how many.
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Val Erian
Gallente Azure Horizon Federate Militia
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Posted - 2009.05.19 01:07:00 -
[73]
UMee, your ...I dont want to say...but lets say sadly ill informed.
Espcialy since pilots in your OWN CORP use the AB Crusader setup. To good effect I might add since one popped my MWD Sader using it.....
I would link his setup but since you dont bother looking at factual backup i wont.
AB are a perfectly viable option for frigs,dessies and some interceptors. They have limitations like everything .
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Noskill McCheese
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:25:00 -
[74]
I always thought G.DIP was pretty cool on top of being competent and respected opponents, but that was before they let umee join. It must have been an accident.
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UMEE
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.19 20:09:00 -
[75]
look, it's a game. im posting my opinions and not those of gdip. to me, arguing is fun sometimes and there was no ill intent behind my words. while my tone is argumentative, i dont feel it's particularly disrespectful. all im saying is that you may not have tested out your builds sufficiently against experienced opponents. im not putting down anyone's religion or mother. but i can see why it may come across as that over the internets, and with people taking games a little too seriously. getting convoed about this in game is really silly imho. take your AB's and leave me alone please . i dont wanna be a part of any politics...it's a little too hardcore for me. i was just trying to help the OP.
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Intigo
Amarr Endemic Aggression Exalted.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 20:58:00 -
[76]
Originally by: UMEE look, it's a game. im posting my opinions and not those of gdip. to me, arguing is fun sometimes and there was no ill intent behind my words. while my tone is argumentative, i dont feel it's particularly disrespectful. all im saying is that you may not have tested out your builds sufficiently against experienced opponents. im not putting down anyone's religion or mother. but i can see why it may come across as that over the internets, and with people taking games a little too seriously. getting convoed about this in game is really silly imho. take your AB's and leave me alone please . i dont wanna be a part of any politics...it's a little too hardcore for me. i was just trying to help the OP.
There's a difference between expressing a well thought out opinion and just being an argumentive, ill-informed ****.
You are the latter. The sooner you realize it, the sooner we won't have to endure your posts.
If UMEE really is your main no wonder you have no idea what you're talking about. ___________________
ENEMA, much love. <3 |
Iece Quaan
Caldari Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:15:00 -
[77]
Unfortunately for us, Merdaneth has the record to back up his claims. =P
When I was an interceptor ace years ago ( before my long break ) I flew similar fits to what he uses.. and they're deadly.
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:25:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Intigo If UMEE really is your main no wonder you have no idea what you're talking about.
doesn't and shouldn't matter. Everyone are entitled to their opinion. AB works for some and MWD for others, that is all there is to it really.
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Tesha Muron
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Posted - 2009.05.19 21:32:00 -
[79]
It is interesting how she was all serious about her space ships, and then when faced with an overwhelming body of evidence and opinion to the contrary decided to dismiss it out of hand. Then ask why everyone was so serious about the space ship game.
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.19 22:22:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Tesha Muron It is interesting how she was all serious about her space ships, and then when faced with an overwhelming body of evidence and opinion to the contrary decided to dismiss it out of hand. Then ask why everyone was so serious about the space ship game.
Ain't it just?
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Jodie Amille
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.20 03:32:00 -
[81]
I and several other in our corp have flown AB fit inties/frigs/cruisers to quite a high degree of success. You need to pick your targets but no moreso than with mwd variants. Particularly in lowsec they are a viable option. --------
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.20 04:00:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Jodie Amille I and several other in our corp have flown AB fit inties/frigs/cruisers to quite a high degree of success. You need to pick your targets but no moreso than with mwd variants. Particularly in lowsec they are a viable option.
Does UMEE participate?
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Jodie Amille
Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.20 06:38:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Anubis Xian
Originally by: Jodie Amille I and several other in our corp have flown AB fit inties/frigs/cruisers to quite a high degree of success. You need to pick your targets but no moreso than with mwd variants. Particularly in lowsec they are a viable option.
Does UMEE participate?
I posted here to put a stop to the trolling and let healthy discussion get back on track. Get over yourself.
I will also add that in gangs MWD is always the answer. For solo AB has it's uses for sure. --------
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Meridius Dex
Amarr Gunship Diplomacy
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Posted - 2009.05.20 06:52:00 -
[84]
And, yes, many of us do fly AB frigs (Ti and T2) with great success. In fact, as indicated earlier, we do indeed have one top gun who truly flies nothing BUT the AB sader.. and he kills damn near everything in sight with it.
Me, I see MWDs as a necessary evil: they suck cap, they suck grid, they suck agility -- basically, they just suck. But they are imperative on many ships, including most anything in the cruiser to battlecruiser hull range.
I have fits that absolutely rely on the speed provided by MWD and I have other fits that absolutely depend upon the AB for its reliability against scrams, as well for sig tanking. -- Meridius Dex Visit the Gunship Forums --
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Anubis Xian
Reavers
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Posted - 2009.05.20 07:34:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Jodie Amille
Originally by: Anubis Xian
Originally by: Jodie Amille I and several other in our corp have flown AB fit inties/frigs/cruisers to quite a high degree of success. You need to pick your targets but no moreso than with mwd variants. Particularly in lowsec they are a viable option.
Does UMEE participate?
I posted here to put a stop to the trolling and let healthy discussion get back on track. Get over yourself.
I will also add that in gangs MWD is always the answer. For solo AB has it's uses for sure.
A simple 'no' would have sufficed. Get over yourself.
Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
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Veshta Yoshida
Amarr PIE Inc.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 08:25:00 -
[86]
Let me quote a wise comment from earlier (back needs a pat once in a while)
Originally by: Veshta Yoshida AB works for some and MWD for others, that is all there is to it really.
A lot of the proponents of AB fittings are fighting in FW. The rules differ greatly out here as there are a lot of warp-to-zero bottlenecks so the starting range is less of a factor and drive type largely irrelevant.
I still use MWD for general hunting, but once an enemy is identified and located I have found the AB improves survivability .. at least against MWD ships. It is still situational so no clear cut rule, just my preference.
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