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Bestofworst
Gallente
Double Eagle Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.05.19 10:40:00 -
[61]
It is perfectly reasonable for someone high up in the fleet to Broadcast targets along with primary calls, or before hand explain a signal for warp out and rally.
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<Insert Wit> |
Neamus
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Posted - 2009.05.19 10:56:00 -
[62]
 Originally by: Rakshasa Taisab
Originally by: Neamus
Your last FC is an idiot. Its easily possible to acomodate deaf players using in fleet commands. Warp here, align there, enemy spotted etc etc. Its then just a case of keeping an eye on your screen for the visual indicators.
A good FC should be able to handle this without issue. Just delegate out to a couple of fleet members, one handles fleet commands while the another (preferably a touch typist) types anything that is outside of the commands scope. I dont know for sure but usually our fleets make regular use of the fleet commands, so its quite possible that we have deaf people in fleet.
An FC's job is hard enough as it is, you do not want to overload him more than he already is. If you don't already know this, either you've got a naive view of what being an FC really entails, or you've never been in any decent sized fleets.
Yes I agree an FC's job can be quite hectic, especially in large fleet battles. But as I clearly stated in my post, a good FC would delegate out to a couple of fleet members. Its not difficult and there is no extra work involved for the FC.
My experience or lack thereof is laregly irrelevent, I dont need to proove anything to you. Using the in game tools to assist in coordinating your fleet is simple common sence.
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Lexa Hellfury
SPORADIC MOVEMENT
Cult of War
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Posted - 2009.05.19 11:46:00 -
[63]
Originally by: David Caldera
Originally by: Colonel Cornbread
Originally by: Opis
Would be pretty awesome if you set up a corp for deaf players. Not that they can't be just as effective as anyone else with a good FC and someone relaying orders, but a corp centered around deaf players would help those to get into pvp who may not be as confident as you.
Note also I said centered around deaf players, dosen't have to be exclusive. Must be a ton of partial hearing or deaf players in eve that never get to fleet fights cause of bad experience, or just think they won't be accepted.
I really want to do this. I do plan on doing it if my current corporation doesn't go well with me.
Why not? Make the corporation and advertise it. It's a great idea in my opinion.
Whatever you do, I personally wish you the best of luck. =)
This tbqh. We do have one deaf guy in SPORE, but I can't for the life of me remember who it is at this particular moment 
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sxndy
Gallente
Snuff inc
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Posted - 2009.05.19 12:34:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Colonel Cornbread
Edited by: Colonel Cornbread on 18/05/2009 16:31:55
I'm curious how you got by while fleeting up with people, finding good corps, and the like.
Here's what the last FC I was with said two weeks ago.
[ 2009.05.09 07:30:00 ] <censored> > if you can't use vent, you can't be effective in our fleets, and when i'm FC'ing, i have easily over a billion isk worth of ships that i'm responsible for. and i don't remember promising you anything. i might have...
I can understand how the FC feels, but I hope you find the right people and a way to overcome this. I'm sure you are a credit to any fleet. Good luck dude! and fly safe.
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Blane Xero
Amarr
The Firestorm Cartel
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Posted - 2009.05.19 12:42:00 -
[65]
People really need to learn to use the Broadcasting system. Of course, it could do with a facelift possibly, but otherwise it helps accommodate people hard of hearing.
There will always be situations of Awkwardness where you might be slightly out of the loop in what to do, I.E if everyone is ordered to scramble, or panic sets in and people stop informing you. But as you said, nothing is wrong with your perception of the situation. Even you can tell when everyone is busy GTFOing and if you need to follow suit.
___________________________________________
Haruhiist since December 2008
^Third Times a Charm^ |
Roc Wieler
Freeform Industries
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Posted - 2009.05.19 13:17:00 -
[66]
Minmatar brother, if you continue to have issues, please look me up in Heimatar Region. Every fleet I FC makes uses of the broadcast commands and I have a repeater. I also warp the fleet as a single unit while travelling, helping to keep everyone together.
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Professor Perplex
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Posted - 2009.05.19 13:22:00 -
[67]
depending on the size of the fleet he is leading i totally understand that FC.
you should probably get one person to relate the commands to you in pvt chat.
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Raekone
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Posted - 2009.05.19 13:27:00 -
[68]
If you're in a fleet you're doing it wrong 
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barvo
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:16:00 -
[69]
Edited by: barvo on 19/05/2009 16:22:54
Originally by: WhiteGhostBear
It would be really cool if CCP would give us macro text with simple text substitution. This could all be done client side, and would facilitate giving more verbose textual commands.
Did anyone here ever play Netrek back in the day? That had macros - you could put your mouse over one of the players and hit your macro key and it would say "Attack [that persons name]" or "Player [name] carrying armies in [shiptype]". Really useful.
Back to topic, not sure how useful that would be over and above the current fleet commands.
WRT forming a corp centered around those who are hard of hearing I think it would be pretty successful, no TS/Vent spies anyway 
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Jita Security
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:20:00 -
[70]
I've heard of quite a few deaf corps in EVE. There are all types that cater to all different people, though I've yet to see a corp for the blind.
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barvo
Corp 1 Allstars
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:23:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Jita Security
I've heard of quite a few deaf corps in EVE. There are all types that cater to all different people, though I've yet to see a corp for the blind.
Thats because eve's sound sucks
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Bayushi Kitsuke
Gallente
Sigillum Militum Xpisti
Novus Ordo Mundi
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:34:00 -
[72]
Edited by: Bayushi Kitsuke on 19/05/2009 16:35:18
I'm actually hearing impaired, but I do fine in fleet ops. I used to be in UND and we fleet up a lot with UNL (Russian speakers). This made it really hard when the Russian FC would issue an order and half of the UND players couldn't understand through the accent. This was easily resolved by having a couple of players who could understand him actually simplify and type out his orders in fleet chat. The same system can be used with deaf players, you just need a fast and accurate typer to relay the important orders in chat.
IN FACT - I highly suggest all fleets do this since voice coms are not always clear and some FCs needs their voice checked.
A good FC uses the broadcast commands, have his assistant type his orders and take in account that there's the handful that can't use voice chat (IE deaf player).
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zacuis
Great Big Research
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:35:00 -
[73]
Edited by: zacuis on 19/05/2009 16:37:41
frankly any decent sized fleet should be relaying all target calling and important orders in chat anyway. i personally hate it when they only call primarys over voice coms. its confusing especially when the primary had an odd spelt name. a good fc would have a dedicated member of the fleet relaying the important stuff in chat anyway. so im glad u left your allience they probably werent very good anyway.
i remember back when i was in d2 this system was almost an necessity as we had a multi laugauage allience. its not only the deaf that it applys to.
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Michelle Vega
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:40:00 -
[74]
Sounds like your FC was just a little stressed. Sadly some people don't take into consideration people who can't hear, see properly, have red hair or even talk. It isn't a perfect world but there are good corps that will have no issues with being deaf. As someone posted about having someone in corp private chat (if you need to keep fleet channel empty) and that is about the best advice (as well as using in game functions).
Fly safe :)
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Sol'Kanar
SRIUS BISNIS
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:45:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Colonel Cornbread
Edited by: Colonel Cornbread on 18/05/2009 16:31:55
I'm curious how you got by while fleeting up with people, finding good corps, and the like.
Here's what the last FC I was with said two weeks ago.
[ 2009.05.09 07:30:00 ] <censored> > if you can't use vent, you can't be effective in our fleets, and when i'm FC'ing, i have easily over a billion isk worth of ships that i'm responsible for. and i don't remember promising you anything. i might have...
Maybe you should just type louder. Try using all caps.
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John Bishop
Caldari
Capital Ships Inc.
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2009.05.19 16:52:00 -
[76]
to the OP
Having been in the military i can say that your FC is a ******. although comms are used extinsively there are many operations carried out with no talking at all with surgical precision, often an order given with a visual que or hand signal. even todays super carriers still have means of visual communication with other ships. so for the FC saying that since you are unable to use vent or teamspeak or the ingame audio comms is a determent to his fleet is absurd.
id gladly fly with you. your disability with hearing im sure gives you an edge every other way in what you can see. id imagine your attention to detail is astounding.
i applaud you for overcoming your limitations and im sure that if you stick with it you will find people to fly with and show these idiots how wrong they are.
_______________________________________________
Originally by: Rodj Blake
Large Beam Spec 5 is a really good skill to have, because it almost puts you on a par with people using T1 projectiles. [:lol: |
GoGo Rens
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:09:00 -
[77]
What???
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Mikal Drey
Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2009.05.19 17:39:00 -
[78]
hey hey
we have a deaf guy in prio and fleet orders are simply relayed in corp chan.
tbh its minimal hassle and we have had little to no trouble. when the **** hits the fan its even better as we have good comms dicipline. when its all relaxed and everyone is mulling about then it can be worse purely because noones listening anyway and we are all joking around :)
Shattered Crystal - 60 day GTC
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Jimer Lins
Gallente
Noir.
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Posted - 2009.05.19 18:28:00 -
[79]
Originally by: barvo
Edited by: barvo on 19/05/2009 16:22:54
Originally by: WhiteGhostBear
It would be really cool if CCP would give us macro text with simple text substitution. This could all be done client side, and would facilitate giving more verbose textual commands.
Did anyone here ever play Netrek back in the day? That had macros - you could put your mouse over one of the players and hit your macro key and it would say "Attack [that persons name]" or "Player [name] carrying armies in [shiptype]". Really useful.
Back to topic, not sure how useful that would be over and above the current fleet commands.
WRT forming a corp centered around those who are hard of hearing I think it would be pretty successful, no TS/Vent spies anyway
barvo is free beer!
(God, I loved that game)
Corp killboard-How to Kill Logoffskis |
Chris Liath
Gallente
Nex Exercitus
Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2009.05.19 19:40:00 -
[80]
Well, EVE hasn't got any sound, so that's fine.
"Oh dear," says God, "I hadn't thought of that," and promptly vanishes in a puff of logic. |
Colonel Cornbread
Minmatar
Subnet Syndicate
Binary Brotherhood
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Posted - 2009.05.20 01:32:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Chris Liath
Well, EVE hasn't got any sound, so that's fine.
That's not the problem here...
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TraininVain
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Posted - 2009.05.20 01:44:00 -
[82]
Edited by: TraininVain on 20/05/2009 01:45:33
Originally by: zacuis
Edited by: zacuis on 19/05/2009 16:37:41
frankly any decent sized fleet should be relaying all target calling and important orders in chat anyway. i personally hate it when they only call primarys over voice coms. its confusing especially when the primary had an odd spelt name. a good fc would have a dedicated member of the fleet relaying the important stuff in chat anyway. so im glad u left your allience they probably werent very good anyway.
i remember back when i was in d2 this system was almost an necessity as we had a multi laugauage allience. its not only the deaf that it applys to.
This tbh.
It's something we often do in FW because EVE voice drops people all the time.
And as you say, spoken commands aren't necessarily 100% clear what with pronunciation and funny system names.
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F'nog
Amarr
Celestial Horizon Corp.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 02:01:00 -
[83]
Edited by: F''nog on 20/05/2009 02:07:43
Frankly I'm surprised any corp worth its salt with stick with only voice chat. There's just too many idiots talking about the latest something or other in most corps during a fleet op that nothing could get done without using chat. Add to that the accents one can find in Eve, and the poor quality of voice chat, that I'm surprised anyone except for language-specific corps can get anything done using voice only. And dog help you if you're in an English only corp, unless they all speak with BBC English - sadly we have no equivalent over here in the US, but we can all understand the BBC (funny that).
So, yeah, if you don't use chat, you're probably screwed. So that FC is just an idiot.
Edit - by English only I mean only using native English speakers. It's hard enough understanding the various dialects in the US. Including those in the UK makes it even more mind-boggling since they've got more dialects per square kilometer than the whole of the US (exaggerated of course).
Originally by: Kazuma Saruwatari
F'nog for Amarr Emperor. Nuff said
Originally by: Chribba
Go F'nog! You're a hero! Not a Zero!  /me bows
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Altair Mogwa
Amok.
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Posted - 2009.05.20 05:45:00 -
[84]
Our alliance has a corp in it with a deaf member, he flys capitals as well as conventional and has no issue. There are always more than a couple people willing to help him out, and I myself have relayed for him.
Some things I use to make it easy.
Private convo of course
I get a squad for the deaf member and place myself a leader, this allows me to use broadcasts for align, warp, jump, and travel to, as well as targets, it eliminates about 98% of any typing.
I have the deaf member put me on their watch list depending on gang comp and if we are in same ships. For example if we are in snipers hacs, all he/she has to due is click and 'approach' or keep at, that way if we change alignment, or FC says '1/4' speed, i don't have to broadcast or type anything, they'll just tail me.
I'll fleet warp him/her while jockeying around in system (safe bouncing for example) so no 'Warp to XXX' is needed at all. Make sure to check for drones in first of course :).
It's really like being your own little FC, and really should not hinder any competent player.
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Agent Known
Apotheosis of Virtue
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Posted - 2009.05.20 05:54:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Agent Known on 20/05/2009 05:56:06
Our FC always has someone relay the commands to our Fleet chat to make sure everyone gets it. Some people have issues using the voice chat, so we accommodate for them. I also like seeing the commands in the channel in case I miss it on voice.
It's stupid that some FCs require voice to function. People can read, and if another person relays commands it's not much of a problem. In a combat situation on-screen cues eliminate most voice chatter anyway.
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