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The Vagabond - A sad excuse for a HAC

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sushistrip	Posted - 2009.06.01 23:44:00 - [1] I've tried and tried....and tried some more.....and cannot for the life of me figure out how the vagabond fits the role of a heavy assault ship. Put this ship up against any other HAC, it will lose. Sure, maybe if you have all level 5 skills and fit it properly it might have a chance, but a slim one at that. It is either going to die, or have to warp off because it can't hit anything. First off: The bonuses combined with the slots This ships bonuses make absolutely no sense. How are you going to give a turret ship a bonus to speed and no bonus to tracking? And the bonus to falloff is just a slap in the face considering your transversal goes down the farther out you are, allowing other turret ships to hit you. Added to the fact that this ship gets no bonus to cap, making it just as hard to get the MWD to perma run as any other HAC. On top of all that, it gets 5 low slots.... and 4 mids?....wtf?... Of all things this ship is a tackler, therefore two of the mid slots are automatically mwd/point. On top of that, its a HAC.....you want good damage don't you?...well there goes two of your low slots for damage mods. Ok now by default the vaga goes faster than any other nanoed cruiser in the game (besides the stabber) even without speed mods....but your gona want to perma run it right?.....well there goes at least one more low and one more mid. Now, any self respectable vaga pilot knows you have to have good tracking if you want to hit your target. Well there goes the rest of your lows/mids and your rig slots. Yaaaaay now I'm ready to kill people right?.....wrong. Believe it or not you can't hit jack squat with medium guns orbiting someone at 2.9km/s, and that's the lowest speed a vaga should go.....On top of that, most turret ships (minus battleships of course) can still hit you at that speed. In conclusion to this bit, if you fit a vaga to play towards it's bonuses your going to be sorely disappointed. Now, (I could tell this was gona be a bit long so I'll shorten this up a bit) if you buffer/gank fit a vaga you can do fairly well, however any other hac is STILL going to kill you....they can fit their ships to play towards their bonuses, what do you get?....a bonus to speed?....that really helps when your sittin face to face with a deimos..... In total conclusion, you can't fly vagabond the way it was meant to be. It's a continuous circle of, "Well if I do this then that won't work." The vagabond needs something, another low/midslot perhaps, a bonus to play towards it's strength as a projectile/speedy ship, something to level the playing field.
Stuart Price Caldari The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2009.06.01 23:48:00 - [2] 3/10 Putting the 'irate' into 'Pirate'
Smirna Auff	Posted - 2009.06.01 23:50:00 - [3] 2/10 I was almost willing to give you the benefit of the doubt until you said this: Originally by: sushistrip ....they can fit their ships to play towards their bonuses, what do you get?....a bonus to speed?....that really helps when your sittin face to face with a deimos.....
Gin G Halls Of Valhalla	Posted - 2009.06.01 23:51:00 - [4] try the eagle instead then come back
Fuazzole	Posted - 2009.06.02 00:09:00 - [5] Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back
Tzar'rim	Posted - 2009.06.02 00:15:00 - [6] Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back You say that but you've never seen so much killmail w***ing in sniperfleets as eagles. Apart from that OP fails, hard. Self-proclaimed idiot
4THELULZ	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:02:00 - [7] Edited by: 4THELULZ on 02/06/2009 01:03:46 Quote: The Vagabond - A sad excuse for a HAC Ha... ha... haaahahahahahahahahahahahahaha Oh wow. I didn't even bother reading the rest after that. Learn to play or obvious troll - it gets harder to tell by the day here.
Poses	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:06:00 - [8] try running away in a SAC lets see how far that gets you... the point of the vaga is that it takes serious effort to lose one. Also: try killing a vaga with an ishtar 'ooh your heavy drones cannot catch up to me.... that's too bad :(((((((' this isn't 100% true as all ishtars also carry light and medium drones but ti takes them **ing ages to burn through the 9k+ shields on a standard vaga setup. So i guess what I'm trying to say is... suck **s and actually use ships before you devide how good/bad they are.
AstroPhobic Minmatar	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:09:00 - [9] Originally by: Fuazzole Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back 0/10 Try the muninn instead then come back
Grez Core Contingency Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:20:00 - [10] Poor troll. --- Grez: I shot the sheriff Kalazar: But I could not lock the Deputy BECAUSE OF FALCON
UMEE Gunship Diplomacy	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:39:00 - [11] vaga sux. im not even trolling.
Raven Foxfire	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:40:00 - [12] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Fuazzole Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back 0/10 Try the muninn instead then come back
Xzar Fyrarr Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2009.06.02 01:46:00 - [13] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Fuazzole Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back 0/10 Try the muninn instead then come back
Terianna Eri Amarr Scrutari	Posted - 2009.06.02 02:38:00 - [14] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Fuazzole Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back 0/10 Try the muninn instead then come back -1/10 Try the... oh wait, never mind __________________________________ Originally by: CCP Whisper Boo hoo. Cry some more.
Larkonis TrassIer Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2009.06.02 04:09:00 - [15] Terrible troll... Vagabond is still the king of Hacs
Lysander Kaldenn Viper Intel Squad Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.06.02 05:16:00 - [16] This is the stupidest topic on the forums. And thats saying a lot. The vaga is hands down my favorite HAC, and I can and have flown every other one except the cerb and the eagle. It moves quick and packs a hell of a punch. To argue that it is broken would be funny if you were joking or trolling or something, but unfortunatly I think you are all too serious. Maybe time to go back to that mission-machine raven/drake.
sushistrip	Posted - 2009.06.02 05:57:00 - [17] vaga vs deimos = can't break its tank, vaga vs ishtar = can't break its tank, vaga vs zealot = zealot can track you, vaga vs sacrilege = sac will wtfpwn you, vaga vs eagle (not too sure havent play with the eagle much), vaga vs cerb = will wtfpwn you, and in all cases you do jack for damage because you can't track them well
foobarx	Posted - 2009.06.02 06:27:00 - [18] Originally by: Poses the point of the vaga is that it takes serious effort to lose one. It may take serious effort to lose one, but it's mostly a mildly irritating mosquito to anything bigger than a cruiser. Unless you slow down enough to do full damage, at which point you will lose it.
sushistrip	Posted - 2009.06.02 06:39:00 - [19] Originally by: foobarx Originally by: Poses the point of the vaga is that it takes serious effort to lose one. Unless you slow down enough to do full damage, at which point you will lose it. Theres my point.....EFT may say im doing 450 dps but when I use it's bonus (speed) to my advantage the dps goes down to about 150.....
Harris Damage over Time	Posted - 2009.06.02 07:13:00 - [20] Originally by: sushistrip vaga vs deimos = can't break its tank..... You met someone who tanks a deimos
devilator	Posted - 2009.06.02 07:27:00 - [21] Correct me if I am wrong..but if you are perma running MWD on the vaga your sig is so big a One eyed dread pilot could track you and your going to fast for you guns to track anything, hence the low dps. The speed boost is there for you to dictate range and GTFO of dodge when needed, Not to orbit at 2.9kms with a huge sig radius. The ship is meant to speed / sig tank and u cant do that perma running the mwd. This is a setup in the mids I use, it take a bit of micro managing but boy it catch folks by surpise. 10mwd T2 and and 10abt2 warp disruptor and shield extender. i close with the mwd and then switch to the afterburner to orbit doing 900 - 1200 kms (overheating 1500 kms ) with a very tiny siq radius. with a shield extender rig and a damage control u have a nice buffer tank and can wreak hell on BS and like with the orbit speed plus the small siq. IF things go bad you disengage switch to the mwd straighten out and burn away at 3kms. Try it out you might like it. Oh yea it also give those frigate the oh shi!!! factor when they close on you and web scram you and your still faster than them. Belive me your with motion prediction V and a rack of dual 180s T2s you will be hurting and out running alot of stuff!
Andrest Disch Amarr Debitum Naturae	Posted - 2009.06.02 07:36:00 - [22] Originally by: sushistrip Yes thats just personal experience but fighting 1v1 for each of those on the test server That's your problem right there. The vaga isn't meant to go one vs one with any other HAC, it's meant to zoom in, get the easy kills and then run away before anything to big comes along to kill it. You can't simulate proper Vaga battles on sisi imo.
kyrv	Posted - 2009.06.02 07:46:00 - [23] Edited by: kyrv on 02/06/2009 07:47:10 They made a fast hac it has speed if it were good it'l get nerfed.. it did anyway. What troubles me- Minmatar are so easily categorised that they are the speed bandits lol That amarr get exotic imba like curse or sac, resists or a neut the range of a hugin webber? Debate. Edit- and 90% explosive resists over minmatar >.>
Mystafyre Caldari Dark Materials Heretic Nation	Posted - 2009.06.02 08:09:00 - [24] Originally by: sushistrip I've tried and tried....and tried some more.....and cannot for the life of me figure out how the vagabond fits the role of a heavy assault ship. Put this ship up against any other HAC, it will lose. Sure, maybe if you have all level 5 skills and fit it properly it might have a chance, but a slim one at that. It is either going to die, or have to warp off because it can't hit anything. First off: The bonuses combined with the slots This ships bonuses make absolutely no sense. How are you going to give a turret ship a bonus to speed and no bonus to tracking? And the bonus to falloff is just a slap in the face considering your transversal goes down the farther out you are, allowing other turret ships to hit you. Added to the fact that this ship gets no bonus to cap, making it just as hard to get the MWD to perma run as any other HAC. On top of all that, it gets 5 low slots.... and 4 mids?....wtf?... Of all things this ship is a tackler, therefore two of the mid slots are automatically mwd/point. On top of that, its a HAC.....you want good damage don't you?...well there goes two of your low slots for damage mods. Ok now by default the vaga goes faster than any other nanoed cruiser in the game (besides the stabber) even without speed mods....but your gona want to perma run it right?.....well there goes at least one more low and one more mid. Now, any self respectable vaga pilot knows you have to have good tracking if you want to hit your target. Well there goes the rest of your lows/mids and your rig slots. Yaaaaay now I'm ready to kill people right?.....wrong. Believe it or not you can't hit jack squat with medium guns orbiting someone at 2.9km/s, and that's the lowest speed a vaga should go.....On top of that, most turret ships (minus battleships of course) can still hit you at that speed. In conclusion to this bit, if you fit a vaga to play towards it's bonuses your going to be sorely disappointed. Now, (I could tell this was gona be a bit long so I'll shorten this up a bit) if you buffer/gank fit a vaga you can do fairly well, however any other hac is STILL going to kill you....they can fit their ships to play towards their bonuses, what do you get?....a bonus to speed?....that really helps when your sittin face to face with a deimos..... In total conclusion, you can't fly vagabond the way it was meant to be. It's a continuous circle of, "Well if I do this then that won't work." The vagabond needs something, another low/midslot perhaps, a bonus to play towards it's strength as a projectile/speedy ship, something to level the playing field. You simply just fail. Vagabond is absolutely A W E S O M E ship for scouting, solo pirating, heavy tackling and typical fleets. You fly it like a Crow, it has paper tank but you need to stay away from webbing range and with your T2 warriors you make sure that hostile drones are staying dead
OZEPATHAN Gallente Sharks With Frickin' Laser Beams	Posted - 2009.06.02 08:49:00 - [25] OP you fail. 1: You're setting up 1v1 hac fights on sisi. Under optimal conditions your opponents will be fitting their hacs to tank your vaga. This is not the case when you catch people by surprise on the live server. 2: Simply flaming on a ship which has won over so many people and has such a huge following in this game is silly. Instead of looking at the ship as a problem look at yourself as one. 3: Vaga is not a DPS machine, it's a solo wtf pwn mobile. Not by with it's DPS but with it's ability to control range and GTFO when needed. Ohh yeah, -10/10 Please resize signature to the maximum allowed size of 400 x 120 pixels. Navigator
Giannamichaels	Posted - 2009.06.02 09:07:00 - [26] Treat the vagabond like a cowardly bully is what ive heard, pick on stuff smaller than you and run when its a fair fight lol. i cant fly one yet but look forward to it.
Holy Lowlander Lone Star Joint Venture Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.06.02 10:53:00 - [27] Originally by: AstroPhobic Originally by: Fuazzole Originally by: Gin G try the eagle instead then come back 1/10 Try the diemost instead then come back 0/10 Try the muninn instead then come back -1/10 try the zealot instead then come back _______________
Andrest Disch Amarr Debitum Naturae	Posted - 2009.06.02 11:11:00 - [28] Originally by: kyrv Edit- and 90% explosive resists over minmatar >.> Yeah, god damn that imba EM damage against t2 Minmat- Oh, wait..
Enden Assulu Caldari Blood Money Inc.	Posted - 2009.06.02 11:34:00 - [29] Evacuate the thread before we reach page 2! Click the image!
Vir Hellnamin Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.06.02 11:34:00 - [30] l2fly -- "Entering MH means instant death. It's worse than 0.0. Even the asteroids shoot back." - Alex Harumichi [GRD]

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