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Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.05 19:49:00 - [31] Originally by: Kyguard Now let me point it out for you, "want to burn fat and build mussle" A second time so we can say you are an idiot if you disagree after this, "want to burn fat and build mussle" Burn fat and build muscle. ... I have a secret and I will share it with you. Read closely. I first read the OP's comment, then I read the thread and only when I feel that I need to add to what has already been written do I write a comment. So why write about burning fat, when several people before me have given an advise on how to burn fat? Sit-ups and crunches! They rule. Take it from me. -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Cpt Gobla The Dark Space Initiative	Posted - 2009.06.05 19:49:00 - [32] Swimming is a good start Sit-ups and crunches are downright stupid to start with. Your body has various energy systems. At first your body will start burning local energy reserves in the muscles. These allow for short bursts of energy and don't require oxygen. In under a minute of exercise there are burned away. This energy system can handle a huge intensity such as lifting very heavy weights or sprinting. This is why in those sports you don't feel you're getting tired for the first bit and after that suddenly it starts kicking in. ( Technically this part is broken down in 2 stages but those stages are practically the same. They just differ in exactly what local energy store is burned. ) After that you will start burning glucose present in your blood stream. This lasts for about 2 to 4 minutes and requires a low amount of oxygen. Meaning you start panting a little bit. This system can handle quite heavy intensity such as carrying heavy stuff or pull-ups. In does unfortunately cause the release lactic acid to be released in your muscles causing that burning sensation I'm sure everyone knows. At this point you're done with your sit-ups and crunches and you'll have burned your local energy stores and glucose present in your blood stream. Congratulations, you've burned no fat whatsoever and you're probably getting hungry again soon because your body wants to replenish the reserves you just burned. These are replenished using the carbohydrates that you eat. So the remaining fat in your food will not be used for anything useful except for adding to your already existing fat stores. If however you're a smart guy and have not listened to the sit-ups and crunches advise and went running, cycling or swimming you'll now be entering a new stage of your body's energy systems. In this stage we're going to be burning carbohydrates from your food and ( surprise! ) the fat from your fat reserves! This requires a high amount of oxygen so by now you'll be panting heavily. That's a good sign! Fat requires lots of oxygen to be burned by your body so panting is good! This energy system can last for hours on end for well-trained sportsmen. It however can't handle heavy intensities. It's only good for low intensity long duration things like jogging, cycling etc. tl;dr; version: Short term heavy intensity exercises burn no fat and only make you hungry causing you to gain fat. long term low intensity exercises burn lots of fat and are very good for you!
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:10:00 - [33] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto lol. that is not going to make one bit of difference. As you sort of menetioned, it is IMPOSSIBLE to spot reduce fat unless you get liposuction. The area in which you lose fat at what time is determined by genetics. I take that as an agreement to what I have said. The only direct approach is to suck out the fat. It is the last thing I would suggest. I would rather drink more beer instead. Quote: If you really work your deep abdominals, that will help pull in your gut in very slightly. But situps/crunches aren't going to do that. That will work the rectus abdominus which is pretty **ing useless as a muscle. You need to work your external and internal obliques and other deep abdominal muscles. Not quite true. Those who already have a decent shape will not gain much from it in terms of shape, but then you do not see them often asking for advise on how to burn fat and build muscles. They are rather the ones who can tell you about how to do it. Sit-ups and crunches are then a simple exercises that can be done by everyone and almost everywhere. It is great for starters. Quote:** If you are in amazing shape you would be doing squats or something to work your core muscles(a term which usually is meant to include the deep abdominals). If not, you would be doing simpler exercises that focus on breathing technique and posture. Even still, these exercises are not going to change the appearance of your gut very much. I do not think we are talking about someone who is in an amazing shape.
Slade Trillgon Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:30:00 - [34] Originally by: Ja'kar I want to burn fat and build mussle I just want to know what is good for burning fat off of my belly Thanks Originally by: Whitehound Sit-ups and crunches. You cannot directly control at which areas of your body your fat will burn up, but when you want your belly to be in a better shape then you need to train the muscles of your belly of course. This may be the hardest part for you to do if your belly has the shape of a pregnant whale and you have never trained these muscles before. Swimming is a good start. No matter how you word what you say after the bolded part, you were giving improper advice for how the question was asked. Your answer would be for someone asking how do I get my abdominals into better looking shape and your answer would still lack luster for that question. Also, you can directly control which areas your body will burn fat. The myth of spot reduction is not really a myth. But doing crunches and sit ups to loose many inches of fat around the belly (which you did not directly say)is a a "myth". It is a myth because you can not do enough, at a high enough intensity, for a long enough period of time, to significantly burn off the inches. On the other hand if you climb stairs your legs are for sure not going to go to the arms or the belly to get fat if there is fat surrounding those leg muscles and vice verse. If you add extreme abdominal movement to cardiovascular training then when those abdominals are activated they will utilize fat in the direct vicinity not the arms or the legs. Your original comment was misleading and improperly worded like every infomercial I have ever seen for exercise equipment. Slade
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:36:00 - [35] Originally by: Cpt Gobla Swimming is a good start Sit-ups and crunches are downright stupid to start with. .. Tell the military. Sit-ups and crunches.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:43:00 - [36] Originally by: Slade Trillgon Your original comment was misleading and improperly worded like every infomercial I have ever seen for exercise equipment. And you never wondered if it is just you who is reading them wrong? -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Slade Trillgon Masuat'aa Matari Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:50:00 - [37] Originally by: Whitehound And you never wondered if it is just you who is reading them wrong? Never crossed my mind, and now that you mention it; no. Slade
Kyguard Amok. Minor Threat.	Posted - 2009.06.05 20:52:00 - [38] Originally by: Whitehound Originally by: Cpt Gobla Swimming is a good start Sit-ups and crunches are downright stupid to start with. .. Tell the military. Sit-ups and crunches. You're mixing scenarios. In the military, aside from the exercises mentioned in the link, their whole training each day burns a ridiculous amount of calories ie. cardio/endurance activities which when combined with sit-ups and crunches/push ups and other muscle building exercises will work wonders. If this were any other body part, weightlifting and body exercises will actually be the first thing to do to burn fat as it advances your metabolism. However, abdominals are in a class of their own and need to be treated differently. This is why you don't see everyone walking around with steel-hard six packs. Originally by: Whitehound And you never wondered if it is just you who is reading them wrong? The world doesn't revolve around you. You gave bad advice and we got you by the tail.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.05 21:19:00 - [39] Edited by: Whitehound on 05/06/2009 21:28:13 Originally by: Kyguard You're mixing scenarios. There is no scenario. The OP will decide what the scenario will be. If he likes to burn fat fast then he is likely going to do it wrong, because the gain often does not last long. The simpler the exercise the more often one can do them and the less of a problem is it going to be. You cannot go on a bike everyday unless you have a home trainer, nor can you go swimming on a daily basis. If he goes swimming once in a while, goes running, rides the bike and adds some basic exercises to it then that is all he needs. I take him as a regular guy who is concerned about his belly - not as a big fat blob. Quote: The world doesn't revolve around you. You gave bad advice and we got you by the tail. If you think you got me by the tail then bite me. Sit-ups and crunches ftw. And swimming is a good start. -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Cpt Gobla The Dark Space Initiative	Posted - 2009.06.05 22:57:00 - [40] Edited by: Cpt Gobla on 05/06/2009 22:57:18 Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 05/06/2009 21:28:13 Originally by: Kyguard You're mixing scenarios. There is no scenario. The OP will decide what the scenario will be. If he likes to burn fat fast then he is likely going to do it wrong, because the gain often does not last long. The simpler the exercise the more often one can do them and the less of a problem is it going to be. You cannot go on a bike everyday unless you have a home trainer, nor can you go swimming on a daily basis. If he goes swimming once in a while, goes running, rides the bike and adds some basic exercises to it then that is all he needs. I take him as a regular guy who is concerned about his belly - not as a big fat blob. Quote: The world doesn't revolve around you. You gave bad advice and we got you by the tail. If you think you got me by the tail then bite me. Sit-ups and crunches ftw. And swimming is a good start. Whitehound why do I see you quoting every single post out there except for mine which actually contain facts, unlike yours. If sit-ups and crunches are so great then please explain to me where exactly I'm wrong when looking at the body's energy systems. An untrained man can no way do sit-ups/crunches for over 5 minutes straight. Which is the time it takes for your body to switch to the fat burning system. Next to that sit-ups/crunches are, for an untrained man, high intensity exercises. High intensity exercises require the burning of local energy stores present in your muscles ( thus actually causing your muscles to look smaller ) or glucose in your blood ( that's sugar, and we all know how eating sugar helps in losing weight... ) Unless you can do sit-ups/crunches for over an hour easily then you will NOT lose weight by doing them. The only minor effect that they have is that they cause you to burn the glucose in your blood possibly preventing you from gaining extra weight. They will however not burn any fat reserves you already have. Now by all means, if you can supply some actual physiological evidence as to why crunches/sit-ups ( a relatively short duration, relatively high intensity exercise ) burn fat better then running/swimming/cycling then please by all means reply. If however your next argument is going to be "ftw" again. Then please, do the world a favour and plug out your network cable. Thanks in advance.
Krystal Vernet Minmatar Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2009.06.05 23:38:00 - [41] Originally by: Cpt Gobla Whitehound why do I see you quoting every single post out there except for mine which actually contain facts, unlike yours. Because he's trolling, and apparently, doing so quite successfully.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.06 00:01:00 - [42] Originally by: Cpt Gobla Whitehound why do I see you quoting every single post out there except for mine which actually contain facts, unlike yours. Because it is not the facts that will make the OP lose fat, but his will to do some exercises. You only want to push the OP into a full and hard program where he is at risk of burning out and getting deeply depressed. When this happens will you lose him to the "Dark Side". He might never try it again. Sit-ups and crunches are simple and if they only get him to start burning fat then that is already enough to make him lose weight. Whatever he does afterwards, and as long as it is not eating, will it not get him out of the burning. Instead, he will get used to a life where he learns that everything he does can be done not only on a full stomach but when his body is burning energy, too. All your logic and arguments simply ignore the psychology of a person. There is an entire discipline called sport psychology, which deals with the side effects. Even world class athletes with many years of experience in training can fall into deep depressions due to a wrong training. -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.06 00:02:00 - [43] Originally by: Krystal Vernet Because he's trolling, and apparently, doing so quite successfully. You only wish you had my class. -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Dr Slaughter Minmatar Rabies Inc.	Posted - 2009.06.06 18:44:00 - [44] Originally by: Whitehound And swimming is a good start. Yes I think I suggested that on page 1.... ~~~~ There is no parody in this thread. Honest.
Maisha Libo Caldari Stupid Piwats	Posted - 2009.06.06 22:27:00 - [45] silly me, I've always been under the impression that playing EVE gave beer bellies, because we're all always drunk when we do fleet ops.
ReaperOfSly Gallente Zetsubou Corp	Posted - 2009.06.06 22:37:00 - [46] Originally by: Maisha Libo silly me, I've always been under the impression that playing EVE gave beer bellies, because we're all always drunk when we do fleet ops. It's funny because it's true.
mama guru Gallente Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:05:00 - [47] Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 05/06/2009 10:29:24 For every stupid too dumb to read, do I repeat: Sit-ups and crunches. If it is his belly he is most concerned about, then these exercises will help him to define the shape of the belly area. And swimming is a good start. Spot reduction is a myth. Situps will only slightly increase the muscle mass on his abdomen, but he gotta get rid of the fat around there first to make it visible. For the OP: Dieting Disasters Read that before you try anything.
mama guru Gallente Thundercats RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:06:00 - [48] Originally by: Whitehound Originally by: Cpt Gobla Swimming is a good start Sit-ups and crunches are downright stupid to start with. .. Tell the military. Sit-ups and crunches. The us military also thinks crossfit is awesome. Shut up.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.07 12:17:00 - [49] Originally by: mama guru Shut up. Go and read the entire thread. With some luck will it shut you up.
Kyguard Amok. Minor Threat.	Posted - 2009.06.07 17:49:00 - [50] Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 07/06/2009 13:33:38 Originally by: mama guru Shut up. Go and read the entire thread. With some luck will it shut you up. And what does crossfit have to do with loosing a little weight? Every dumbass in the 70's made a video on how to lose weight, in the 80's and 90's everyone designed their machines to lose weight, and now we have threads with the same kind of people who tell the world what is best. This is getting sad. You're one of those dumbasses. Indeed, you are sad. -
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.07 18:21:00 - [51] Edited by: Whitehound on 07/06/2009 18:27:52 Originally by: Kyguard You're one of those dumbasses. Indeed, you are sad. You were a bunch of happy but fat kids, then you tortured yourself all the kilos of your body when one day you had success. But that was not enough. You finally could overcome all the superficialness that comes with being overweight and now you want more. It has made you righteous, arrogant and overconfident, but it has not made you smart and you have forgotten what it is like to be happy. Just like there is nice person inside someone who is overweight, can one now see the dumbass that you have become. You stopped eating all, which makes you fat, but have turned to eating your heart out.
Jin Nib	Posted - 2009.06.07 19:04:00 - [52] Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 07/06/2009 18:41:15 Originally by: Kyguard You're one of those dumbasses. Indeed, you are sad. You were a bunch of happy but fat kids, then you tortured yourself all the kilos of your body when one day you had success. But that was not enough. You finally could overcome all the superficialness and the social pressure that comes with being overweight and now you want more. It has made you self-righteous, arrogant and overconfident, but it has not made you smart and you have forgotten what it is like to be happy. Just like there is a nice person inside someone who is overweight, can one now see the dumbass that you have become. You have stopped eating all, which makes you fat, but have turned to eating your heart out. ^This is why you shouldn't post while high.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.07 19:10:00 - [53] Originally by: Jin Nib ^This is why you shouldn't post while high. Is it? Well then, perhaps tell me why I should attack you for your comments? I am at the end of my wisdom.
Jin Nib	Posted - 2009.06.07 19:46:00 - [54] Originally by: Whitehound Originally by: Jin Nib ^This is why you shouldn't post while high. Is it? Well then, perhaps tell me why I should attack you for your comments? I am at the end of my wisdom. I have no idea why you should attack me. It seems a bit extreme to attack people who disagree with you. You might, for instance, construct a reasonable argument and debate the matter for instance.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.07 20:12:00 - [55] Originally by: Jin Nib It seems a bit extreme to attack people who disagree with you. You might, for instance, construct a reasonable argument and debate the matter for instance. It is a bit extreme when you wish for a debate but do not bring any new arguments. Why do you not pick up at my last argument when I say that all your high-calorie burning programs lead to a mental burn out, because they ignore the psychology of a person?
Jin Nib	Posted - 2009.06.07 20:43:00 - [56] Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 07/06/2009 20:30:20 Originally by: Jin Nib It seems a bit extreme to attack people who disagree with you. You might, for instance, construct a reasonable argument and debate the matter for instance. It seems? It is a bit extreme when you wish for a debate but do not bring any new arguments. I know why you say "reasonable" argument. You want to read an argument you already know. Pick up at my last argument where I say that it ignores the psychology of a person. Not really. As you may have noticed I'm not committed to either side, but frankly you haven't defended your point well, if at all. Further there have been many well constructed posts by knowledgeable people that you have simply ignored rather then respond to in any meaningful way. Posting things that say essentially "No, ur wrong. Go away." Isn't convincing anyone. When I say reasonable argument what I mean is an intellectually honest one. However arguing with people who have a partisan point of view from which they wont sway for any reason (either because of ego or whatever) is pointless because they are not willing to learn from the argument. In other words, an unreasonable argument is one in which a person has their particular view, and no matter how much better or logical the other sides points are they stick to this view, despite being unable to defend it to the other side, or even an impartial observer.
Whitehound	Posted - 2009.06.07 21:15:00 - [57] Originally by: Jin Nib Not really. Then why do you come back? You are taking the thread off topic by making me the centre of it. Quote: When I say reasonable argument what I mean is an intellectually honest one. No. You confuse opinion with argument. When I say people are dumbasses then that is an opinion. It is not an argument. An argument serves to give you a better understanding. An opinion is used for finding an agreement. -- If there is anything in your life you fear of losing, then keep your mouth shut once in a while.
Jin Nib	Posted - 2009.06.07 21:17:00 - [58] Thanks for proving my point. I appreciate that.
Kyguard Amok. Minor Threat.	Posted - 2009.06.07 23:55:00 - [59] Originally by: Whitehound Edited by: Whitehound on 07/06/2009 21:40:23 Originally by: Kyguard You're one of those dumbasses. Indeed, you are sad. You were a bunch of happy but fat kids, then you tortured yourself to get all those kilos of your body when one day you had success. But that was not enough. You finally could overcome all the superficialness and the social pressure that comes with being overweight and now you want more. It has made you self-righteous, arrogant and overconfident, but it has not made you smart and you have forgotten what it is like to be happy. Just like there is a nice person inside someone who is overweight, can one now see the dumbass that you have become. You have stopped eating all, which makes you fat, but have turned to eating your heart out. You're one of those individuals that was abused and picked on for being overweight as a child. I recommend you seek immediate counseling and psychiatric help since you appear to have brought that suffering on to your adult life. Seek help and counseling. And stopping posting is a good start. -
Bad Harlequin Minmatar	Posted - 2009.06.08 00:29:00 - [60] Troll, troll, troll your post - Thread has gone to hell; OP's given up by now... Eye Bee Tee and Ell!

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