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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
   |
Posted - 2009.06.13 14:41:00 -
[151]
And the Fraction can be a very harsh environment for those wishing to promote change and reform and new ideas - not because its naturally conservative or respectful of any status quo, but simply because new ideas must be sold to the assembly of Free Captains and debated and defended. The Star Fraction cannot be dictated too - it can only be persuaded. And that was ultimately what Kuna failed to do.
We have many Free Captains who come from troubled backgrounds, who have seen the universe and grown unsettled with the status quo. We are a home to troublemakers and rogue personalities, to heretics and freedom fighters, to contrary libertarians and anti establishment bravos, anarchists, anarcho-capitalists, mad-scientists and eccentric innovators of every race and culture.
Do you really think it would be possible to persuade such a community of individuals to do anything without time and effort and good arguments?
It isn't of course. And even I (the mad matriarch, the insane CEO, the tyrant and dictator who rules by fiat and evil magnetism) need to present my plans to the Fraction, defend them in public debate, take questions, make changes, compromise, restate points and then ultimately put them to the floor for voting by the membership.
Is this inefficient and frustrating? Sometimes yes it is.
Do we make mistakes? Of course we do, nothing in life has any business being perfect.
Do we lose our tempers, snarl and sulk and gnash our teeth in rage? Of course speaking truthfully who doesn't? We are all human-beings, we all have individual ego and personal frustrations.
But the questions you (or Kuna rather) needs to consider are these:
Does any campaign decision get made in the Fraction that is not ultimately presented, debated, and voted on by the membership of the alliance?
Was Kuna driven to quit the Fraction by the lone enmity of an evil mad tyrant CEO clashing her teeth and persecuting him with vindictive rage?
Or was Kuna ultimately unable to convince the majority of the membership round to the validity of his arguments on their logic and appropriate utility to the interests of the Fraction itself?
Is Kuna's condemnation of Jade Constantine as an evil madwoman a truthful picture of the Fraction leadership or is it simply an expression of his frustration at being unable to convince the Free Captains and inability to persuade Jade Constantine to join his side in open and free debate?
Only you (or Kuna) can answer these points honestly for yourself.
But as for why so many ex-revolutionaries are bitter ideological outcasts on the "scrapheap" as you describe. I'd say the reason is not so very difficult to puzzle out. Going from the enlightened environment of individual sovereignty and voting rights, of the personal influence of the Free Captain and free association and innovation of the Fraction to almost any other entity in known space will be a shocking and almost degrading experience, that I can only imagine. One moment you are valued as an individual and listened too, debated with, persuaded and negotiated with. The next you are just a number in the great machine of somebody else's ambition.
Kuna went from Star Fraction to Triumvirate initially. One day he was a proud independent Free Captain with dreams and vision and hopes to persuade his peers. The next he was just a number in a large gang with no voice, no say, no political engagement, just another bandit in somebody else's bandit-army. Nobody asked Kuna what he thought. Nobody needed his vote. Nobody debated anything with him. It must have been a terrible experience for a man once believed in the revolution to be plunged to intellectual darkness and know the company of naught but killers and sullen stony-faced emotionally-dead authority-worshipers.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2009.06.13 14:45:00 -
[152]
But to summarise and bring this element of the discussion to a conclusion:
I do find this notion of Jade Constantine the mad-tyrant to be indicative of certain modes of thought recurring in some of the ex-revolutionaries of the Star Fraction, that is true.
But it really doesn't hold up to factual consideration of what generally occurred to trigger their absence.
In almost every case those making this accusation have played a part in Star Fraction internal decision-making, have made their arguments internally, have sought to change things to their preferences, have debated and persuaded and cajoled and harangued at turns. Certainly I have had my say internally in counterpoint - we all have. But it all comes down to the vote amongst the member base. And that's both the foundation of Star Fraction political continuity and my pride in the organization.
And its why we hear plenty of "Jade is a mad tyrant" "Jade is an insane dictator" as throwaway hominem attacks to muddy the waters. But we hear nothing of any substantive accusation of actual tyranny or madness.
Where are the tales of "Jade ignored the popular vote!" or "Jade executed the dissidents"" "Jade fired me for speaking my mind!" "Jade stole the corp wallet!" "Jade silenced me and instituted a CAOD ban!" "Jade warp scrambled my CNR and podded me when I left!"
Such anger and rage as is displayed in the words of Devilish Ledaux and Khanid Voltar, Jonny Damordred or Bacchanalian - such accusations of mad-insane-dictatordom. So many slurs and such invective but so few actual tales of wrongdoing and impropriety.
The reality Khanid Voltar is that I Jade Constantine am guilty in the eyes and heart of ex-revolutionaries of generally only one crime. (And can seem a terrible one I'll grant you at the personal level.)
That crime is not being persuaded by those individuals on issues of alliance direction in popular membership votes. I have always (rightly or wrongly) been perceived as having more influence than is "fair" in the Fraction by virtue of long membership and passionate oratory - but when matters come down to the vote I have just one vote like everyone else. If I am not persuaded by somebody I am not persuaded. It doesn't mean I hate them, just I'm not persuaded. In the anarchist community we have built there must be room for disagreement. Sometimes the disagreements are minor and association can remain. Sometimes they are more significant and individuals will seek their personal fortunes elsewhere.
In a hundred cases these partings are amicable and sovereign individuals continue to interact from afar with friendship and mutual respect. But (as with this thread) in every hundred there are a handful who are unhappy with their new circumstances, resentful of the manner of their leaving the Fraction - and sometimes wish to continue the arguments and discussions they lost in the popular vote of Free Captains many years after the tally was counted. Their discontent makes them vocal.
This is life. We are immortals after all. And Immortal troublemakers all, ex-anarchist revolutionaries are likely to be single most fractious and outspoken flammable firebrands in the Star Cluster. In really is no surprise that Star Fraction has more than its share of vocal detractors and absolutely no mystery why I have a continuing support-group of ex-members who consider me an "evil tyrant queen" to blame for whatever personal circumstances they are currently unsatisfied with.
After all, I did commit the cardinal sin of not agreeing with them. I am guilty. That is why their voices are raised in protest. I am to blame for that.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Aphoxakhan
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.13 21:39:00 -
[153]
I am bombarded with shrapnel of obliterated diplomacy, the stakes grow fat and I am the cavalier. Green Constantine is rigid with life and death rolled like cake. Explosions resound around my, I am aghast and unable to cope.
War or without, I fire the cannons, launching corpses.
---
[Don't Think Differently, Think Critically.] |
Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.14 07:15:00 -
[154]
 Originally by: Jade Constantine
Stuff
TL;DR.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.14 14:45:00 -
[155]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 14/06/2009 14:45:10
Ah dear Khanid Voltar, you came to the thread and asked for a response without ad hominem attacks and I gave you just that. A full and detailed response and analysis of the situation you'd detected. Now it appears that you didn't really want debate or discussion at all and just wanted to stick your own knife in quietly and escape without rebuttal. I guess that says it all really.
And for the record you are second man to type "TL:DR" in this thread whilst quite definitely reading the posts above. If you really didn't read them I suspect you wouldn't have felt the need to make a throwaway comment indicating your lack of interest. Still, thank you for the bump. If you ever feel the need to discuss the conclusions I've reached in relation to Kuna's situation (as described in the posts above) feel free to contact me by eve-mail or private chat and we can certainly address these points outside of public scrutiny.
Until then have a nice life, and I'll hope you find what you are looking for in Eve wherever you finally end up.
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Aphoxakhan
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.14 15:17:00 -
[156]
Venomous bite's the day in tailspin. Jade has struck and the emotion will elevate, I wait wide eye and close fisted.
What laser beam annihilation the mouth will raze is the lottery I gamble, Ten to one odds.
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Centra Spike
Reaper Industries
Eternal Rapture
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Posted - 2009.06.14 23:16:00 -
[157]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
And its why we hear plenty of "Jade is a mad tyrant" "Jade is an insane dictator" as throwaway hominem attacks to muddy the waters. But we hear nothing of any substantive accusation of actual tyranny or madness.
Where are the tales of "Jade ignored the popular vote!" or "Jade executed the dissidents" "Jade fired me for speaking my mind!"
The Gulag.
Emphasis mine.
------
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Heartstone
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 00:08:00 -
[158]
Originally by: Centra Spike
Originally by: Jade Constantine
And its why we hear plenty of "Jade is a mad tyrant" "Jade is an insane dictator" as throwaway hominem attacks to muddy the waters. But we hear nothing of any substantive accusation of actual tyranny or madness.
Where are the tales of "Jade ignored the popular vote!" or "Jade executed the dissidents" "Jade fired me for speaking my mind!"
The Gulag.
Emphasis mine.
Er what?
Who was fired for speaking their mind?
Who was executed for disagreeing with the majority?
Heartsonte - confused as all hell
---
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 07:33:00 -
[159]
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 07:35:41
reserved
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Tecam Hund
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 11:39:00 -
[160]
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 07:42:55
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 07:41:12
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 07:39:18
[EDIT] Forum malfunction; Jade do not fear I will respond and refute your points thoroughly later, more important things to do you see than talk to a mad woman.
I do know how you crave the front page, so consider this a mocking bump.
PS. H; Jade asked me to leave for speaking my mind, why do you think I reacted so badly when 2 days later SF decided to attack the militia I was forced out into. Over it now though :).
Kuna left once, came back, and left again three months later. Definitely on good terms the first time with everyone wishing him well, and on what seems to be good terms the second time as well. I think I have a good idea about what caused the second leave. At any rate there was no drama or animosity.
Yet, now, a year later Kuna sends you to pick a bone with Jade in public over how he was "forced" out of SF into a militia. 
I've only one thing to say. If people were forced out of Star Fraction for disagreeing with Jade, I would be nowhere near this alliance. |
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 12:02:00 -
[161]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 12:04:19
Well Khanid Voltar, while you formulate your rebuttal to the posts earlier lets deal with the inaccuracies in the current assertion shall we?
Skipping over the ad hominem attack (shocking that you would continue to use these after all the song and dance you made about the tactic earlier isn't it?)
(This is specific to the second exit of Kuna from SF by the way. Since I imagine we both know the first exit when he left for TRI was accompanied by a detailed leaving post explaining his reasons and respect for all of us and the alliance there.)
So this is about the Second Exit some months later -
Captain Kuna was not asked to leave Star Fraction for speaking his mind. He was asked to leave Star Fraction and drop roles because he had made up his mind to leave already (for the second time) and was using the alliance as a convenient "waiting-room" while applying to other corps and alliances and not aiding Star Fraction in any material way.
After seeing Kuna talking in Alliance chat of his resolution to depart as soon as he got a successful acceptance from Reikoku or Outbreak I opened a private conversation with him and suggested that if he was absolutely resolved to depart the alliance it would be polite to drop roles and actually leave rather than using us as temporary holding identity pending successful applications elsewhere.
The result of Kuna's applications to these illustrious external corporations are his own business. But by the same measure the Star Fraction's campaign decisions and objectives are ours. Not sure where Kuna ended up, but you Khanid Voltar were a 24th Crusader and our ideological foe by your own choice.
Star Fraction moved into a formal war of suppression against the State Protectorate some days later which we'd been planning for several weeks (including logistical moves, base relocation, planning and intel work) and regardless of Kuna's personal suspicions to the contrary this target selection had absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with his second exit from the Star Fraction.
I find it somewhat incredible that you (or Kuna) can appear to believe that an organization of a hundred Free Captains could spend several weeks preparation and billions of ISK in intel and combat expense to make war on a Militia entity purely to persecute a single wanderlust-prone ex member who had decided that regressive imperialist dogma was more to his taste than idealistic radical free-space idealism.
While I do remember Kuna's angry pro-state ranting on our alliance public forums - I would reiterate that the reasons for him being asked to leave the alliance was purely that he had already decided to leave and had posted publicly and privately about this intention and was doing nothing in alliance chat but talk about his prospective career-choices while we were attempting to run combat ops and continue our own operations.
I would think that most people reading this will understand why he was asked to leave. He was certainly not "forced" into any Militia. That was purely his own choice and required him to fly to the appropriate office and click "apply".
***
In conclusion I would ask you to ensure you speak a little more truthfully on these issues when you do get round to publishing your formal rebuttal to my earlier posts.
Ordinarily I don't like commenting on the circumstances of previous members departures - but I have at my disposal the posts, chatlogs, and physical records of what was said, when and why. I will not put this material into the public domain pre-emptively - but I will use this material to correct obvious lies and distortions of the truth on your part where appropriate.
Do consider just how much public exposure of these discussions you are prepared to withstand before making further false accusations against my actions. On review I am quite convinced that Kuna was treated fairly and with great patience on the part of SF alliance leadership and the leaving posts from the time bear this out.
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 17:32:00 -
[162]
I do regret making that post earlier, it has allowed Jade to do her usual and make a thread about something entirely different to what it was.
I left 3 times actually but who's counting. After the penultimate time a director gave me a exit interview where I explained my reasons for leaving and they suggested I tried to stay and help JF change. When I came back the third and final time it was to try and do what that Director had told me, to help JF evolve for the better.
Anyway, as I said this morning, I reacted badly on what happened after the last time, and for what its worth I do apologise; my behaviour was that of a petulant child and was nothing to be proud about.
However Jade, my opinions of you over the entire period have never changed one jot. Much as you scribble away inaccuracies desperate to turn the conversation away from my original point that you were insane, you simply prove that you are incapable of having a reasoned debate.
For what its worth I still haven't read your original rebuttal, although I have skimmed... you seem to lecture me at first on what an ad hominem is, and then spend the next few post denouncing my ability to have any sort of judgement on the matter (maybe you should check out what being ad hominem actually is?). I cannot say for certain what else was there as I know it infuriates you all the more that I cannot be bothered to read it properly and react to the various jibes put there to make me react to your advantage.
See that's you all over Jade. A dried up journo hack desperate for the front page again, willing to say or do anything that will arouse a negative reaction in your opponent. Very sad that you cannot reason without being inciteful. Seriously can you honestly say that you have done anything else in this thread?
Before you answer it is a rhetorical question. Your word is worth very little to me, especially when I can judge the answer by your previous responses in this thread.
Still, back to the point of me being here. I was content to mark JF's 6th birthday with a wave in the other channel, but when I saw Dev's post in here I simply had to express my support, not that it was asked for nor even wanted no doubt.
I saw an opportunity to stick the knife in (to Jade, not SF), and would happily take another opportunity to do so in the future.
I would offer you a chance to settle this in 1 to 1 combat, but as we both know you declined my last offer, and anyway, even if you lost you wouldnt change so whats the point.
What Dev said needed to be said, and he needed to be supported in that. What you should have done is taken it onboard and not react like you did.
One final thing... I thought you never got trolled?
I beg to differ. |
Centra Spike
Reaper Industries
Eternal Rapture
|
Posted - 2009.06.15 17:40:00 -
[163]
Originally by: Heartstone
Who was fired for speaking their mind?
If you can't remember, look through your director records.
Originally by: Heartstone
Who was executed for disagreeing with the majority?
No one was executed for disagreeing with the majority, as no majority decided on the Gulag campaign. When one 'dissident' presented an alternative plan he was blasted by certain members of the directorate. He was essentially told to put up and shut up or leave.
He left.
Seeing my fellow 'Free-Captain' have his idea shut down by my fellow directors shattered any illusion I had that Star Fraction was a democracy.
So I left.
I enjoyed my time with Star Fraction, enjoyed being a director and enjoyed flying with many of the pilots in this thread, including Jade. But to say that the ex-Star Fraction pilots are making baseless claims is untrue. |
Heartstone
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2009.06.15 17:55:00 -
[164]
Edited by: Heartstone on 15/06/2009 18:04:48
Edited by: Heartstone on 15/06/2009 17:55:48
Originally by: Centra Spike
Originally by: Heartstone
Who was fired for speaking their mind?
If you can't remember, look through your director records.
After you mentioned this I did look through the directors records for the time I have been with SF and I found only 1 person who has been fired and that was for something else entirely. I honestly don't know what you are referring to. Of course I won't post names and events here from our internal forums as it would be unfair to the person in question.
Originally by: Centra Spike
Originally by: Heartstone
Who was executed for disagreeing with the majority?
No one was executed for disagreeing with the majority, as no majority decided on the Gulag campaign. When one 'dissident' presented an alternative plan he was blasted by certain members of the directorate. He was essentially told to put up and shut up or leave.
He left.
Well if this is your recollection of the events then fair enough but I must say I disagree with them. Whilst I agree the campaign in question wasn't exactly the most popular idea we have had the majority went along with it and those that didn't want to were free to do other things as comments on the thread in question on the SF internal forums shows. For instance as the aim was to increase the Concord rated security level of our pilots a number of pilots tried ratting and others tried missioning instead.
Obviously much of this is a matter of perspective but I don't see it as you have. I still don't think that anyone has been mistreated in particular by the directors of Star Fraction. Sure some people have been treated harshly but I can't think of an instance where it was undeserved.
Anyway as you say it was fun flying with you and I still remember some of the engagements we flew together with as some of the best fun I've had. Especally that Freighter in KBP just after you bought your first Crow.
Fly well Centra.
---
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2009.06.15 17:57:00 -
[165]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 18:01:58
Originally by: Centra Spike
Originally by: Heartstone
Who was fired for speaking their mind?
If you can't remember, look through your director records.
Have to say you are going to have to do better than that Centra. I cannot recall ever firing a Jericho Fraction member in the whole of our history for "speaking their mind". Sorry but you are simply being untruthful here. I have fired Jericho Fraction members in the past - this is true. But I assure you that nobody has ever been kicked from this corporation for having outspoken views and no other fault.
The campaign in question was discussed and agreed by a majority of the alliance at a public meeting. It was discussed, critiqued and ultimately okayed by popular consent albeit with a vocal minority of members disagreeing - some of whom decided on making their protest clear in leaving the alliance. You are incorrect to allege that no majority supported this plan. I'm not going to comment on your "one member disssident" save that I know the case you are speaking of and I still believe matters could have been amicably resolved if people had drawn back from the emotions of the moment and spoken about the situation with the light of dawn the following day. This however was a reasonable outcome and didn't suit the designs of some unreasonable people with their own agendas at that time.
What you describe as a "shut down" was simply forum debate. Star Fraction has a rich and vigourous history of internal discussion and debate on our member forums and frankly one needs to a good sense of perspective and thick skin when things get heated.
Quote:
I enjoyed my time with Star Fraction, enjoyed being a director and enjoyed flying with many of the pilots in this thread, including Jade. But to say that the ex-Star Fraction pilots are making baseless claims is untrue.
Sadly Centra you are now making baseless claims on this thread.
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
|
Posted - 2009.06.15 18:26:00 -
[166]
Okay Khanid Voltar, reading your latest post lets summarise your position. Kuna joined and left JF 3 times? I think you must admit that means Kuna was never a terribly reliable pilot or a very good fit. Ultimately as I've said to you earlier in this thread Kuna - what tends to happen to some leavers is that they get a bee in their bonnet about the way the alliance is handling campaign decisions, try to persuade people, fail to get a majority behind their position then grow frustrated. In Kuna's case this kept happening.
I honestly lost count of the number of late night conversations I had with Kuna with him trying to convince me to back his plans and ideas for the alliance and use my own oratorical skills to drive them through and champion his cause in debate. Sure I refused, I wasn't convinced. I didn't think Kuna was right and I wasn't prepared to argue on his behalf. But that didn't mean debate was stifled - far from it. I actively encouraged Kuna to place his points on the member forum and support his argument. I actively encouraged Kuna to speak his peace and make his pitch at open meetings and he did. That he was unable to convince a majority of free captains is not evidence of my "mad-tyranny" so much as his failure to make and argue his case. No other conclusion is possible.
You admit your own behaviour was that of a petulant child. Good. Yet you continue to make ad hominem attacks by the by. Without a jot of evidence to support your charges you accuse me of insanity and claim it's impossible to have a reasoned debate. I think this very public debate we are having now would indicate otherwise.
You claim you haven't read my original posts I addressed to you? Then you try to critique those posts? It doesn't work Khanid Voltar. That position has already failed in this thread for Kostantin Mort. Either you have read the posts or you haven't. Either you have read them in which case you haven't "skimmed" anything. Or you haven't and you don't get to critique the content.
You describe me as infuriated? Hardly. I find you a slightly pitiable sight its true and having nailed your colours to the mast of Devilish Ledeux the "great dissident free-captain" you might profitably spend two minutes on your neocom terminal and discover exactly what he's doing right now. I assure you it has nothing to do with furthering the interests of freespace.
You saw an opportunity to put the knife in? You have been misled by a liar and a fraud and have slipped on your own blood and stabbed yourself in the foot. What Devilish said was utter nonsense. Unsupported by anyone with a mind and decried and foresworn by those with honour in his own late alliance.
The fact he has now quit that cause like so many others before and is currently crawling on his knees begging the approval of the cluster's most regressive pigdog imperialists even as we speak - well, what does that say of your good assessment of character I wonder? Devilish is a puling half-man waste-of-skin unworthy of breath. I spit on him.
If you wish single combat I accept. Terms are battleships of choice, no fitting restrictions. We'll can-flag in Kamela, join the same fleet, then fight at a safe spot. Last one to explode or remain on the field is the victor.
Contact me by neocom to signal the days and times you are available.
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Saul Dhampir
Caldari
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 19:06:00 -
[167]
Edited by: Saul Dhampir on 15/06/2009 19:07:49
Originally by: Tatsue Nuko
I consider myself to have proceeded beyond where I was when I was a Star Fraction director.
IÆm really didnÆt want to get involved with all this chest beating and self ************ but I really find this comment interesting.
You say you have proceeded beyond where you were, but I wonder where that is exactly? At first one might assume it was some great new undiscovered country. A new clear vision of Freespace. Yet, if I understand correctly, you abandoned NRDS in favour of NBSI. In simple terms, NRDS is the fundamental foundation and guiding principal on Freespace. Everything else is window dressing. Giving yourself the free reign to shoot at any one at anytime might seem like the ultimate freedom. But what has that got to do with Freespace?
IÆm left thinking that what you have proceeded onto is in fact base piracy.
ItÆs nothing new. And it was discovered a good few millennia ago. Of course IÆm exaggerating. I dare say your not after money at all. You just want to blow things up and have found the NRDS rules get in your way. Coming from some of the former Fraction members who went with you that would be no surprise. But you and some others, like Atan, Bach and Sac I respect tremendously. Why then donÆt you just state the facts:
These days you like to blow stuff up.
Why bother to claim you have anything to do with Freespace anymore?
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slugdo masada
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Posted - 2009.06.15 19:20:00 -
[168]
One small ray of joy for me, amongst all the bitterness and angst from pilots I have flown with and greatly respected over the years, is that the Revolution still has such momentum, and is fought by pilots of such drive, that passions are so clearly enflamed over who is fighting it the hardest. Arguing over who is following the true path to freedom. Reviling former comrades and friends in the name of that which we all fight for.
Like the parents of a child arguing over who loves that child the most, one thing is certain ; that child is loved, and so this revolution will continue. Tremble pigdogs. We'll get to you all eventually.
If you are thinking then you are winning!
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 19:44:00 -
[169]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 18:37:21
If you wish single combat I accept.
Terms are battleships of choice, no fitting restrictions. We'll can-flag in Kamela, join the same fleet, then fight at a safe spot. Last one to explode or remain on the field is the victor.
LOL. I thought you might accept if the gauntlet was laid down in public, pity your actions did not speak for your brovado last year when I gave you the chance to silence me.
Yet you declined a year ago and think I would jump at the chance now. You think way way too much of yourself my dear lassie.
I will get a Jade Constantine killmail and a matching corpse to abuse. I have little need to do so at your terms. Personally I rather hope it will be on the same day your titan goes down.... that killmail will be a keeper for certain.
Is it me or has noone besides jericho posted here arguing in your favor?
Pretty weak...
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 20:11:00 -
[170]
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 20:13:12
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
LOL. I thought you might accept if the gauntlet was laid down in public, pity your actions did not speak for your brovado last year when I gave you the chance to silence me. Yet you declined a year ago and think I would jump at the chance now. You think way way too much of yourself my dear lassie.
You offered a duel with frigates. I told you to come back when you could fly a Battleship. Seems you haven't learned yet.
Quote:
Is it me or has noone besides jericho posted here arguing in your favor?
Since you've been posting on matters of internal Jericho Fraction member relations its hardly surprising is it? Bitter ex-members with axes to grind have been tempted out from under their stones like the human slugs they are. Still they weren't good enough for the Fraction back then and they still aren't good enough for the Fraction now. Some things never change.
For our part the revolution goes on. Our wars are fresh and vital and the cause is just and passionate.
Perhaps that memory haunts you as you sit alone in your monastic cell blaming others for your misadventures and isolation?
I'll remember you slightly as I continue taking the shot at the divine and laughing in the face of tyranny. Its more than you deserve.
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 20:31:00 -
[171]
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 20:36:24
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 20:34:48
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 20:13:12
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
LOL. I thought you might accept if the gauntlet was laid down in public, pity your actions did not speak for your brovado last year when I gave you the chance to silence me. Yet you declined a year ago and think I would jump at the chance now. You think way way too much of yourself my dear lassie.
You offered a duel with frigates. I told you to come back when you could fly a Battleship. Seems you haven't learned yet.
Again your lies are so transparent they could only be the result of selective memory. Search your memory my dear girl. What ship did Kuna fly above all else?
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 20:13:12Since you've been posting on matters of internal Jericho Fraction member relations its hardly surprising is it? Bitter ex-members with axes to grind have been tempted out from under their stones like the human slugs they are. Still they weren't good enough for the Fraction back then and they still aren't good enough for the Fraction now. Some things never change.
For our part the revolution goes on. Our wars are fresh and vital and the cause is just and passionate.
Perhaps that memory haunts you as you sit alone in your monastic cell blaming others for your misadventures and isolation?
I'll remember you slightly as I continue taking the shot at the divine and laughing in the face of tyranny. Its more than you deserve.
Funny how all the best pilots end up as 'not good enough'. How many of these pilots still sit in your killboard top 20? More than half?
Any current Fraction pilot remember these words should you finally see Jade for the braggart she is.
In your own words... it's only once you have lost everything, that you are free to do anything.
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 20:44:00 -
[172]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Edited by: Jade Constantine on 15/06/2009 20:13:12Our wars are fresh and vital
Just caught that... dont you listen to a WORD anyone says?
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 22:32:00 -
[173]
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
Funny how all the best pilots end up as 'not good enough'. How many of these pilots still sit in your killboard top 20? More than half?
Surprise surprise. We're not an alliance where the killboard is the god. We have lots of absolutely terrible ex-pilots who are high on the killboard but didn't understand the alliance, didn't partake in the campaigns and didn't understand the political ideals for which we fight. By the same count we have truly excellent pilots who are not highly placed on the kill rankings - but are imaginative, innovative, creative thinkers with the staying power to remain committed to a cause rather than getting bored like hyperactive mayflies the moment the obvious targets dry up.
We aren't a regressive NBSI adrenalyn junky corp that needs kills to stave off our ennui. Any pilots that feel that drive end up leaving and joining the ranks of psychotic nobody outfits that will go unremarked into the long night of eve.
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Our wars are fresh and vital
Just caught that... dont you listen to a WORD anyone says?
I don't listen to a WORD that dogs say. Their opinions mean nothing. If they had the courage of their convictions they'd doubtless do something about it - but like you are too cowardly to back up their animosity in space. Seriously let me make this plain. I don't care what failed revolutionaries think. Not even a little bit.
I have enough committed and capable comrades-at-arms to actually care about. People who have my back when the fighting is hardest and are prepared to sacrifice and strive for the cause.
Why would I give a moment's thought to failures, turncoats and burnouts?
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 22:54:00 -
[174]
What a bunch of rhetorical doggerel. Sums you up that statement eh?
Mind you if I were you that's how I would respond as well. The alternative would be quite alarming :).
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.15 22:59:00 -
[175]
Well since you have no answer. No purpose. No guts to fight nor further arguments to make I guess thats it for you. Kuna is mindwiped, you're pointless, good night 
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Khanid Voltar
Zarathustra's Dionysian Modernists
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Posted - 2009.06.15 23:04:00 -
[176]
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Well since you have no answer. No purpose. No guts to fight nor further arguments to make I guess thats it for you. Kuna is mindwiped, you're pointless, good night
More rhetorical doggerel. Someone should change your job title, all you are capable of is ranting on the forums these days, and at that, poorly.
Until we meet in space.
Kuna |
u2 bono
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Posted - 2009.06.15 23:38:00 -
[177]
Edited by: u2 bono on 15/06/2009 23:41:56
Originally by: Jade Constantine
Sadly Centra you are now making baseless claims on this thread.
Happily pointing out the error in grammar.
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
Personally I rather hope it will be on the same day your titan goes down.... that killmail will be a keeper for certain.
You'll have to provide the titan.
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Vardemis
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.16 08:00:00 -
[178]
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
Edited by: Khanid Voltar on 15/06/2009 20:38:39
[...] Originally by: Jade Constantine
[...]Bitter ex-members with axes to grind have been tempted out from under their stones like the human slugs they are. Still they weren't good enough for the Fraction back then and they still aren't good enough for the Fraction now.[...]
[...]Any current Fraction pilot remember the bolded words should you finally see Jade for the braggart she is.[...]
Well you should bold the sentence before as well, since only bitter ex-members might come to that conclusion.
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
[...]Funny how all the best pilots end up as 'not good enough'. How many of these pilots still sit in your killboard top 20? More than half?[...]
There are many ways to fight for the ideals of The Star Fraction, shooting down hostile ships is just one of them, the others are just not as easily noticed.
Just as there are multiple reasons for people to actually try to get on top of the killboard, and not a whole lot fit well with our ideology.
Originally by: Khanid Voltar
[...]Thank You Jade, this is meant from the bottom of my heart, for freeing me of the tyranny that is Star Fraction.
Well, that is certainly an interesting closing statement. If you are glad about leaving, why bother with all the posting in this thread if you can just sum it up in a single sentence? |
Aphoxakhan
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.16 15:31:00 -
[179]
I am hysterical with heretical glee, Green Rocky Well-Wishings is inspiring with doubt and I jump on the hull of superiority.
I stretch my arms across the cluster to give all of The Lovely Anarchists a hug.
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Jade Constantine
Gallente
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2009.06.16 15:40:00 -
[180]
Well having disposed of the last elements of the off-topic derail perhaps its time to turn back to the subject of the thread? It certainly seems that the Amarrian side of the debate has gone very quiet of late - perhaps they have admitted that their rhetorical talents have failed when confronted by the truth of the matters on the world of Paradise?
In any event it would be good to return to matters of philosophical and ideological - and I trust that even through the last four pages of rigourous anarchist schismogenesis with side-helpings of post-idealist fanatical mewling from some quarters have been entertaining and enlightening in its own right, time has come to return to topic.
So. Any Questions?
ISSUE - Bring Space Bushido to CAOD |
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