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Ambo EMMA Test Corp	Posted - 2009.06.18 07:26:00 - [1] As many of you know, Maestro is unable to continue looking after EMMA due to RL problems. Mme Pinkerton has stepped into the breach temporarily but does not have the ability to issue license keys (I think?) or software updates. He also does not have the time to do so. Personally, I'm also unable to login on a regular basis to check on things. As I see it there are two possible ways forward: 1) Find another person to take over the project. 2) Do away with the 100 mil fee and just let go of EMMA. After trying to hand it over to another player once already, I'd favour option 2. However, those who have already purchased a license will undoubtedly feel somewhat cheated. This would also leave a question mark over what to do with all the isk that has been accumulated in 'EMMA Test Corp'. I'd like to hear thoughts from the community as to which option would be best or other possible solutions that I havn't considered. If you are currently waiting for a license then I will send you the details ASAP. My PSU blew yesterday when I turned my PC on but I'll have a replacement by this evening. -------------------------------------- Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Dark-Rising	Posted - 2009.06.18 07:52:00 - [2] Those who sent you 100M, did it because that was the license fee. They were not cheated, they could use the features. If you make EMMA free, the new users won't be cheated by an assistance that cannot be provided any longer, the older players are not losing anything, they paid 100M to take advantage over others without EMMA NOW, while the others will get it free but delayed by months and thus are potentially behind.
Salvo Brunel Clown Punchers Syndicate	Posted - 2009.06.18 08:33:00 - [3] Edited by: Salvo Brunel on 18/06/2009 08:33:42 I'm a license holder and I have no objection to option 2. I paid the money becuase I was happy with the product. My suggestion for the EMMA Test Corp isk is to try to offer it to people who want to develop new tools, but that might be a pain.
Lost Hamster Serenity and Unicum Hungarian Corp	Posted - 2009.06.18 08:38:00 - [4] Originally by: Salvo Brunel I'm a license holder and I have no objection to option 2. I paid the money becuase I was happy with the product. My suggestion for the EMMA Test Corp isk is to try to offer it to people who want to develop new tools, but that might be a pain. I'm a license holder, and I agree with the poster as well. I could use the product without a key as I found a way to do that, but still I paid it. So use the money to get some reward to the developers.
Romanov DeBeers Gallente Small Gods	Posted - 2009.06.18 08:46:00 - [5] Option 2 is fine, I paid a licence to pay Ambo for his work. If Ambo now wants to make it free then I'm fine with that option.
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.06.18 08:51:00 - [6] option 2 is fine. though i recomend you pay back for unused licenses then.. i still have about 8 licence keys unused....
Lady Charnoob	Posted - 2009.06.18 08:54:00 - [7] We payed the fee to get what other users couldn't have. Now that advantage there will be no more, so nothing to pay for. The 100M fee shouldn't be a problem: the ones who haven't been able to multiply their profit using EMMA have other kind of problems :D
Adrian Idaho Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2009.06.18 09:08:00 - [8] I'm working on an EMMA port for Linux, i.e. porting EMMA to Mono and PostgreSQL. However, real life occupation and strange bugs in the Mono runtime and compiler result in slow progress. Personally I'd favour option 2, especially if you would re-release the newest SVN version (with removed licence-check) under the GPL. Then I could create a fork of EMMA as a project hosted on SF.net. Mono as well as PostgreSQL run on Windows, too, so my port should also run on Windows and thus be usable by everyone. Under these circumstances I'd be willing to take over the project. However, I can and will not work on the .NET/MS SQL Server version, since I only have a Virtualbox Vista environment - this can be a PITA with only 4 GiB RAM So, if anyone is interested in giving me a hand porting EMMA to Mono/PostgreSQL, please let me know in this thread or in-game.
Lady Charnoob	Posted - 2009.06.18 09:13:00 - [9] Thinking to a Plone-powered solution, offered as service on the web, no installation needed.
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 09:31:00 - [10] Edited by: Kouryusei on 18/06/2009 09:33:36 I'd be willing to take over the project if the license fee was removed, and the project was shifted to an entirely open source model (I would continue to use the Eclipse Public License). I would be happy to continue bug fixes and feature updates (along with monitoring project commits from other developers). ----- eveHOSTED - Hosting you can afford. eveTALK - Ventrilo / Teamspeak at affordable prices. intraPAY - A market tool of some kind... >_>.
Adrian Idaho Sankkasen Mining Conglomerate Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:13:00 - [11] Originally by: Kouryusei Edited by: Kouryusei on 18/06/2009 09:33:36 I'd be willing to take over the project if the license fee was removed, and the project was shifted to an entirely open source model (I would continue to use the Eclipse Public License). I would be happy to continue bug fixes and feature updates (along with monitoring project commits from other developers). Please don't get me wrong, I appreciate you wanting to help EMMA users. But we're still waiting for your own software to be released - not even your beta testers received it. On top of that you have to take care of your newborn son (congratulations, by the way ). That's why I think you should give him priority, and if your free time allows it, work on intraPAY. Blatantly Obvious Features that need to be implemented, stat!
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:14:00 - [12] Originally by: Kouryusei Edited by: Kouryusei on 18/06/2009 09:33:36 I'd be willing to take over the project if the license fee was removed, and the project was shifted to an entirely open source model (I would continue to use the Eclipse Public License). I would be happy to continue bug fixes and feature updates (along with monitoring project commits from other developers). Let me guess, you're about to launch an expansion for your current market activities, right? Black Sun Empire
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:32:00 - [13] Originally by: Adrian Idaho Originally by: Kouryusei Edited by: Kouryusei on 18/06/2009 09:33:36 I'd be willing to take over the project if the license fee was removed, and the project was shifted to an entirely open source model (I would continue to use the Eclipse Public License). I would be happy to continue bug fixes and feature updates (along with monitoring project commits from other developers). Please don't get me wrong, I appreciate you wanting to help EMMA users. But we're still waiting for your own software to be released - not even your beta testers received it. On top of that you have to take care of your newborn son (congratulations, by the way ). That's why I think you should give him priority, and if your free time allows it, work on intraPAY. The amount of work that EMMA would need is minimal at best, hence my offering to help. My software is not related to this in the least. :)
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:32:00 - [14] Originally by: YouGotRipped Originally by: Kouryusei Edited by: Kouryusei on 18/06/2009 09:33:36 I'd be willing to take over the project if the license fee was removed, and the project was shifted to an entirely open source model (I would continue to use the Eclipse Public License). I would be happy to continue bug fixes and feature updates (along with monitoring project commits from other developers). Let me guess, you're about to launch an expansion for your current market activities, right? Nope, nor do I intend to ever to. All future expansions will be entirely privately funded. :) Now, shouldn't you go back to scamming people?
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:37:00 - [15] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 18/06/2009 10:45:37 Originally by: Kouryusei Nope, nor do I intend to ever to. All future expansions will be entirely privately funded. :) Now, shouldn't you go back to scamming people? Is it morning yet? No? Then I'm probably busy shooting down my competition.
Ambo EMMA Test Corp	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:40:00 - [16] Well thanks for the understanding everyone. Ji Sama - I will indeed refund any unused licenses from the emma corp cash. The license fee will be removed. The project is already entirely open source so anyone who wants to contribute is free to do so through the google code project. I'll also add instructions on how to issue software updates. Any payments sent after 1200 eve-time on 18th June (i.e. midday today) will be refunded. The remaining cash in the EMMA wallet will be distributed between those who have helped with the project.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Dark-Rising	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:53:00 - [17] Quote: The amount of work that EMMA would need is minimal at best, hence my offering to help. My software is not related to this in the least. :) Have you even looked at the source? EMMA needs a refactor in several features (an opinion shared by the person currently upkeeping EMMA btw) and you find to dedicate minimal effort at best? Ok, this is "just" an internet spaceships game (btw imho this is false, EvE shows the real people behind these ships better than any other MMO) but this does not mean someone would downplay the efforts to put in game's derivative works. If you were to launch a bond I'd take this over-simplicistic attitude as a red flag. The business sentiment raised, moreover, as YGR keenly sniffed, is to cash in popularity off multiple unfinished activities to spend it on something "more".
Ji Sama Caldari Tash-Murkon Prime Industries Sex Drugs And Rock'N'Roll	Posted - 2009.06.18 10:54:00 - [18] rgr ambo, thanks.. be sure to let us know if there is anything we can do. its a shame to see emma fall like this.
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:01:00 - [19] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Quote: The amount of work that EMMA would need is minimal at best, hence my offering to help. My software is not related to this in the least. :) Have you even looked at the source? EMMA needs a refactor in several features (an opinion shared by the person currently upkeeping EMMA btw) and you find to dedicate minimal effort at best? Ok, this is "just" an internet spaceships game (btw imho this is false, EvE shows the real people behind these ships better than any other MMO) but this does not mean someone would downplay the efforts to put in game's derivative works. If you were to launch a bond I'd take this over-simplicistic attitude as a red flag. The business sentiment raised, moreover, as YGR keenly sniffed, is to cash in popularity off multiple unfinished activities to spend it on something "more". I stated the amount of work is minimal, because the code behind EMMA is not a complex as some people might think - it is pretty simplistic. Any serious .NET developers on this forum would not find it a problem in the least. I did not say I would dedicate minimal effort, I was stating it would require minimal effort (in comparison to the development projects I am normally involved with. ----- eveHOSTED - Hosting you can afford. eveTALK - Ventrilo / Teamspeak at affordable prices. intraPAY - A market tool of some kind... >_>.
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:02:00 - [20] Originally by: Ambo Well thanks for the understanding everyone. Ji Sama - I will indeed refund any unused licenses from the emma corp cash. The license fee will be removed. The project is already entirely open source so anyone who wants to contribute is free to do so through the google code project. I'll also add instructions on how to issue software updates. Any payments sent after 1200 eve-time on 18th June (i.e. midday today) will be refunded. The remaining cash in the EMMA wallet will be distributed between those who have helped with the project. Even though the license allows for it, I thought I'd ask just to be clear. Do you mind me forking the current code base to fix a number of outstanding problems? :) ----- eveHOSTED - Hosting you can afford. eveTALK - Ventrilo / Teamspeak at affordable prices. intraPAY - A market tool of some kind... >_>.
Krathos Morpheus Gallente Legion Infernal Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:15:00 - [21] Originally by: Kouryusei Originally by: Ambo Well thanks for the understanding everyone. Ji Sama - I will indeed refund any unused licenses from the emma corp cash. The license fee will be removed. The project is already entirely open source so anyone who wants to contribute is free to do so through the google code project. I'll also add instructions on how to issue software updates. Any payments sent after 1200 eve-time on 18th June (i.e. midday today) will be refunded. The remaining cash in the EMMA wallet will be distributed between those who have helped with the project. Even though the license allows for it, I thought I'd ask just to be clear. Do you mind me forking the current code base to fix a number of outstanding problems? :) Look at the underlined part -.- EVE Knowledge
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:18:00 - [22] Originally by: Krathos Morpheus Originally by: Kouryusei Originally by: Ambo Well thanks for the understanding everyone. Ji Sama - I will indeed refund any unused licenses from the emma corp cash. The license fee will be removed. The project is already entirely open source so anyone who wants to contribute is free to do so through the google code project. I'll also add instructions on how to issue software updates. Any payments sent after 1200 eve-time on 18th June (i.e. midday today) will be refunded. The remaining cash in the EMMA wallet will be distributed between those who have helped with the project. Even though the license allows for it, I thought I'd ask just to be clear. Do you mind me forking the current code base to fix a number of outstanding problems? :) Look at the underlined part -.- Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. ----- eveHOSTED - Hosting you can afford. eveTALK - Ventrilo / Teamspeak at affordable prices. intraPAY - A market tool of some kind... >_>.
Ambo EMMA Test Corp	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:23:00 - [23] Well... if you feel the need to do so then that's fine with me. Would it not make more sense to just keep one, centralised source repository though? i.e. create a branch in the google code project, make your changes and then re-integrate them into the main codebase. If you make a totally separate version with your own modifications then not only do others not get the benefit of those changes but if/when an update is released from google code, your version will not be able to integrate the changes without more work on your part. -------------------------------------- Trader? Investor? Just want to track your finances? Check out EMMA
Krathos Morpheus Gallente Legion Infernal Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:26:00 - [24] Originally by: Kouryusei Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. Sorry, english is not my first language and I readed that as fixing. EVE Knowledge
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:28:00 - [25] Originally by: Kouryusei Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. It's quite idiotic to ask for allowance to fork an open source project.
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:30:00 - [26] Originally by: YouGotRipped Originally by: Kouryusei Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. It's quite idiotic to ask for allowance to fork an open source project. It's called politeness. :) Originally by: Ambo Well... if you feel the need to do so then that's fine with me. Would it not make more sense to just keep one, centralised source repository though? i.e. create a branch in the google code project, make your changes and then re-integrate them into the main codebase. If you make a totally separate version with your own modifications then not only do others not get the benefit of those changes but if/when an update is released from google code, your version will not be able to integrate the changes without more work on your part. Without there being project oversight by a competent developer on the Google Code repository; it could lead to a literal cluster**** of coding. If you end up appointing someone, then I'll look into doing that instead. :)
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:33:00 - [27] Edited by: YouGotRipped on 18/06/2009 11:33:29 Originally by: Kouryusei Originally by: YouGotRipped Originally by: Kouryusei Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. It's quite idiotic to ask for allowance to fork an open source project. It's called politeness. :) No ****? I bet you asked for permission too before posting this? You might want to take a better look at post 22.
Kouryusei Caldari The Bitter Sea Trading Company	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:34:00 - [28] Originally by: YouGotRipped Edited by: YouGotRipped on 18/06/2009 11:33:29 Originally by: Kouryusei Originally by: YouGotRipped Originally by: Kouryusei Try reading again, I asked to fork the current code base; not contribute to the existing project hosted on Google Code. It's quite idiotic to ask for allowance to fork an open source project. It's called politeness. :) No ****? I bet you asked for permission too before posting this? You might want to take a better look at post 22. I've learned to ignore con artists like yourself, for the most part. :)
YouGotRipped Ewigkeit	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:44:00 - [29] Originally by: Kouryusei I've learned to ignore con artists like yourself, for the most part. :) Have fun living in your own world. If the community cannot see you for what you are, then I won't waste more of my time. Black Sun Empire
Snasty Caldari The Hippies House of Mercury	Posted - 2009.06.18 11:54:00 - [30] I'm a license holder and I have no objection to option 2 I dont care what happens to the cash in Emma corp, I also dont really care who or how the application develops. When it comes to the little trist going on in the posts above me I have no view either way either. For me, as a simple trader making a living in Eve, Emma is a nice app that I would like to see live on and get better, thats all. So, whoever ends up doing what with it, you can generally expect to see my support, be that ISK or just thinking nice thoughts in your direction. --------------------------------------- -=Snasty, short for Shagnasty ever since the GM's in SWG made me change it...!=-

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