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LNX Flocki
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Posted - 2004.09.20 12:11:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Arud I think it would be a waste of time.
1. Linux users are usualy not big gamers since very few games work for them. Also Linux users have the knowledge of having dual boot so if they are big gamers they have a windows installation for gaming.
I don't believe that's true. Most if not all Linux users I know (and that are quite a few) love games and play a lot. This also means that Linux users are usually more loyal to the few games they can actually run (for obvious reasons).
Originally by: Arud
2. The Mac crowd is very small and is also not very big on gaming for the same reason as the linux users.
Probably true, although I don't know many Mac users so this is just a guess. One thing is for sure, Mac users tend to be non-technical people and it seems that those people tend to play less computer games.
Originally by: Arud
3. Best way would be to ask those who make the emulators for linux to make them support Eve.
I'd love to see a native linux eve client, but only if this does not affect the development of the game itself (content & feature wise). Otherwise I totally agree with you.
Originally by: Arud
... the only thing needing to be ported are maybe the server cluster, go from windows to something less power hungry
The most insightfull comment in this thread so far - I hope the guy responsible for chosing windows to run the server part on has been thoroughly spanked by the Devs.
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LNX Flocki
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Posted - 2004.09.20 12:11:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Arud I think it would be a waste of time.
1. Linux users are usualy not big gamers since very few games work for them. Also Linux users have the knowledge of having dual boot so if they are big gamers they have a windows installation for gaming.
I don't believe that's true. Most if not all Linux users I know (and that are quite a few) love games and play a lot. This also means that Linux users are usually more loyal to the few games they can actually run (for obvious reasons).
Originally by: Arud
2. The Mac crowd is very small and is also not very big on gaming for the same reason as the linux users.
Probably true, although I don't know many Mac users so this is just a guess. One thing is for sure, Mac users tend to be non-technical people and it seems that those people tend to play less computer games.
Originally by: Arud
3. Best way would be to ask those who make the emulators for linux to make them support Eve.
I'd love to see a native linux eve client, but only if this does not affect the development of the game itself (content & feature wise). Otherwise I totally agree with you.
Originally by: Arud
... the only thing needing to be ported are maybe the server cluster, go from windows to something less power hungry
The most insightfull comment in this thread so far - I hope the guy responsible for chosing windows to run the server part on has been thoroughly spanked by the Devs.
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Daddl
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Posted - 2004.09.20 15:38:00 -
[33]
Just saw this. A Linux client would be great indeed. Finally I'd be able to play a bit EVE while doing boring work! :)
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Daddl
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Posted - 2004.09.20 15:38:00 -
[34]
Just saw this. A Linux client would be great indeed. Finally I'd be able to play a bit EVE while doing boring work! :)
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Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.09.20 15:41:00 -
[35]
changing eve to opengl would be cool and would end most of the gfx lag. :P
and while we are at it, get a new "forum" server...
"We brake for nobody"
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Admiral IceBlock
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Posted - 2004.09.20 15:41:00 -
[36]
changing eve to opengl would be cool and would end most of the gfx lag. :P
and while we are at it, get a new "forum" server...
"We brake for nobody"
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kieron
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:15:00 -
[37]
When the Devs port EVE over for my C-64.....
On a more serious note, it is good to see discussion on this progressing. Keep it flowing and who knows what may result.
kieron Community Manager, EVE Online
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kieron
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:15:00 -
[38]
When the Devs port EVE over for my C-64.....
On a more serious note, it is good to see discussion on this progressing. Keep it flowing and who knows what may result.
kieron Community Manager, EVE Online
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MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:27:00 -
[39]
Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 20/09/2004 16:29:27 We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Mai's Idealog |
MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:27:00 -
[40]
Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 20/09/2004 16:29:27 We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Mai's Idealog |
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Swedish Bob
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:39:00 -
[41]
I agree with people here that a linux or mac port is not going to really add anything. If CCP really wants to port it, focus on a console port. I don't see any good coming from having multiple clients though. It means that valuable time will be spent tracking down bugs that don't effect the main PC players. Maybe after Brahma consider it again.
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Swedish Bob
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Posted - 2004.09.20 16:39:00 -
[42]
I agree with people here that a linux or mac port is not going to really add anything. If CCP really wants to port it, focus on a console port. I don't see any good coming from having multiple clients though. It means that valuable time will be spent tracking down bugs that don't effect the main PC players. Maybe after Brahma consider it again.
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Thraxll
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Posted - 2004.09.20 17:08:00 -
[43]
I think a linux port is a great idea. I know I would use it, and I wouldn't be surprised if it drew in some more users.
That said, I'd really like to hear that projectile turrets are being worked on/have been fixed before you guys go thinking up more projects to invest your time and energy on
Let's fix what's currently broken (and aggravating players) first, and then work on new stuff
"The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama
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Thraxll
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Posted - 2004.09.20 17:08:00 -
[44]
I think a linux port is a great idea. I know I would use it, and I wouldn't be surprised if it drew in some more users.
That said, I'd really like to hear that projectile turrets are being worked on/have been fixed before you guys go thinking up more projects to invest your time and energy on
Let's fix what's currently broken (and aggravating players) first, and then work on new stuff
"The long and short of it is that this game, or any game, is either going to be a kindergarten where it's safe and cuddly and secure and you can play with plush tigers, or it will be a harsh place, harsh but interesting and interesting because harsh, where you must take risks to succeed and so must everyone, since victory is tasteless without danger." - Raivn Akhama
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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2004.09.20 19:37:00 -
[45]
Considering that porting and testing would take many months, I think dev time would be better spent on improving the game
if the game is more fun, more people join, less people leave. These people may outway the linux gamers, plus the overall customer satisfaction increases when game is improved
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Ephemeron
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Posted - 2004.09.20 19:37:00 -
[46]
Considering that porting and testing would take many months, I think dev time would be better spent on improving the game
if the game is more fun, more people join, less people leave. These people may outway the linux gamers, plus the overall customer satisfaction increases when game is improved
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 20:55:00 -
[47]
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud I think it would be a waste of time.
1. Linux users are usualy not big gamers since very few games work for them. Also Linux users have the knowledge of having dual boot so if they are big gamers they have a windows installation for gaming.
I don't believe that's true. Most if not all Linux users I know (and that are quite a few) love games and play a lot. This also means that Linux users are usually more loyal to the few games they can actually run (for obvious reasons).
Sorry Arud, but I have to side with LNX Flocki on this one. Anyone serious enough to use Linux is going to be a gamer. Why else would there be so many games that come with the standard Linux distribution? A good deal more than I see coming with Windows.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
2. The Mac crowd is very small and is also not very big on gaming for the same reason as the linux users.
Probably true, although I don't know many Mac users so this is just a guess. One thing is for sure, Mac users tend to be non-technical people and it seems that those people tend to play less computer games.
Sorry I'd have to diagree with both of you on this one. Many Mac users I've known are quite technical and the majority are gamers as well. Games like Marathon and a myriad of other Bungie games come to mind.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
3. Best way would be to ask those who make the emulators for linux to make them support Eve.
I'd love to see a native linux eve client, but only if this does not affect the development of the game itself (content & feature wise). Otherwise I totally agree with you.
I'd rather they spent time and money on making a version for Linux and Mac. Supporting the emulation does not encourage other developers to support the systems. You also do not have any guarantee of future changes being supported in a timely manner to keep the EVE community happy.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
... the only thing needing to be ported are maybe the server cluster, go from windows to something less power hungry
The most insightfull comment in this thread so far - I hope the guy responsible for chosing windows to run the server part on has been thoroughly spanked by the Devs.
I'll assume you meant power hungry, as in resources. Personally, I see nothing wrong with having them run the server on Wintel, but I do think that some maintenance would be eliminated with a switch. At the very least you may see an increase in the performance of the current hardware.
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 20:55:00 -
[48]
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud I think it would be a waste of time.
1. Linux users are usualy not big gamers since very few games work for them. Also Linux users have the knowledge of having dual boot so if they are big gamers they have a windows installation for gaming.
I don't believe that's true. Most if not all Linux users I know (and that are quite a few) love games and play a lot. This also means that Linux users are usually more loyal to the few games they can actually run (for obvious reasons).
Sorry Arud, but I have to side with LNX Flocki on this one. Anyone serious enough to use Linux is going to be a gamer. Why else would there be so many games that come with the standard Linux distribution? A good deal more than I see coming with Windows.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
2. The Mac crowd is very small and is also not very big on gaming for the same reason as the linux users.
Probably true, although I don't know many Mac users so this is just a guess. One thing is for sure, Mac users tend to be non-technical people and it seems that those people tend to play less computer games.
Sorry I'd have to diagree with both of you on this one. Many Mac users I've known are quite technical and the majority are gamers as well. Games like Marathon and a myriad of other Bungie games come to mind.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
3. Best way would be to ask those who make the emulators for linux to make them support Eve.
I'd love to see a native linux eve client, but only if this does not affect the development of the game itself (content & feature wise). Otherwise I totally agree with you.
I'd rather they spent time and money on making a version for Linux and Mac. Supporting the emulation does not encourage other developers to support the systems. You also do not have any guarantee of future changes being supported in a timely manner to keep the EVE community happy.
Originally by: LNX Flocki
Originally by: Arud
... the only thing needing to be ported are maybe the server cluster, go from windows to something less power hungry
The most insightfull comment in this thread so far - I hope the guy responsible for chosing windows to run the server part on has been thoroughly spanked by the Devs.
I'll assume you meant power hungry, as in resources. Personally, I see nothing wrong with having them run the server on Wintel, but I do think that some maintenance would be eliminated with a switch. At the very least you may see an increase in the performance of the current hardware.
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 21:23:00 -
[49]
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 20/09/2004 16:29:27 We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Wow can you say childish and ill conceived? Why don't we break down the problems in a point-by-point analysis.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
While you are quite correct that the time involved in setting up Windows XP is minimal, it is far from free. The Linux users know what free is and to say that Linux is difficult to setup is pure foolishness. Linux has come a long way in its short life span and in some respects can be easier to setup than Windows. Also, unless you're going to be pirating, a license of Windows XP Professional, Home is worthless, will set you back at least $200 US.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
First, Linux users may only be a tiny fraction because they choose not to use Windows at all; thusly they cannot run EVE. Regardless this is ridiculous logic. Say you purchase a new top-of-the-line graphics card, but upon installing it EVE won't work. Now since you're one of few people that may even be using this card, why should EVE bother to try and support it? I mean it's not economically worth it.
Second, development time is something better left in CCP's very capable hands.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Well that's just plain childish; so I won't bother analyzing it.
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 21:23:00 -
[50]
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 20/09/2004 16:29:27 We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Wow can you say childish and ill conceived? Why don't we break down the problems in a point-by-point analysis.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar We do not need Linux/Mac OS clients. Even if you... whoever you are... think we need them -> we don't.
Installing Windows XP + drivers + Eve on a standard machine takes 2 to 3 hours at no cost if you have the equipment.
While you are quite correct that the time involved in setting up Windows XP is minimal, it is far from free. The Linux users know what free is and to say that Linux is difficult to setup is pure foolishness. Linux has come a long way in its short life span and in some respects can be easier to setup than Windows. Also, unless you're going to be pirating, a license of Windows XP Professional, Home is worthless, will set you back at least $200 US.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Porting the client for Linux/Mac users (an absolute minority!) would cost valuable development time, slowing down the progress of the game and delaying the implementation of content which this game badly needs, just to do a tiny fraction of Eve's playerbase a favor. From an economical point of view this makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!
First, Linux users may only be a tiny fraction because they choose not to use Windows at all; thusly they cannot run EVE. Regardless this is ridiculous logic. Say you purchase a new top-of-the-line graphics card, but upon installing it EVE won't work. Now since you're one of few people that may even be using this card, why should EVE bother to try and support it? I mean it's not economically worth it.
Second, development time is something better left in CCP's very capable hands.
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Tbh... if it wasn't for all the die hard Linux freaks this discussion would've never came up
Seriously you devs have better stuff to do than waste your time thinking about Linux and even Mac! Mac = Antichrist!!11oneoneeleven!!
Well that's just plain childish; so I won't bother analyzing it.
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 21:36:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Cardassius It's a pain in the arse to get linux -> mssql working properly btw ;) (At least i had some trouble)
Well I know for a fact that there are plenty of database alternatives. Many of these alternatives run quite well on Linux, including Oracle and PostgreSQL. Oracle has gone so far as to convert their infrastructure entirely to Linux, because of the performance gain.
Originally by: Lao Tzu
Originally by: Laughter Sorry Samoht, I think (hope? :-) ) they don't have any intention of changing the server side of things to Linux, just the client side.
OMG! running a cluster on an OS that has real support for clusters, the horror!
TBH, Linux wouldn't be such a good idea for servers like this (betters that windows though), a comercial *nix would work well, but'll never happen.
Why the disdain for Linux on the server side? I currently only use Linux for servers and it has yet to fail me. Either way I merely suggested it as a possible way to gain a great deal of insight into its inner workings.
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Samoht Werdna
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Posted - 2004.09.20 21:36:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Cardassius It's a pain in the arse to get linux -> mssql working properly btw ;) (At least i had some trouble)
Well I know for a fact that there are plenty of database alternatives. Many of these alternatives run quite well on Linux, including Oracle and PostgreSQL. Oracle has gone so far as to convert their infrastructure entirely to Linux, because of the performance gain.
Originally by: Lao Tzu
Originally by: Laughter Sorry Samoht, I think (hope? :-) ) they don't have any intention of changing the server side of things to Linux, just the client side.
OMG! running a cluster on an OS that has real support for clusters, the horror!
TBH, Linux wouldn't be such a good idea for servers like this (betters that windows though), a comercial *nix would work well, but'll never happen.
Why the disdain for Linux on the server side? I currently only use Linux for servers and it has yet to fail me. Either way I merely suggested it as a possible way to gain a great deal of insight into its inner workings.
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Par'Gellen
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Posted - 2004.09.20 22:55:00 -
[53]
Wasting time to port EVE Online to Mac OS or Linux is the worst idea I have ever witnessed in print. Personally I see it as a slap in the face and a total disregard for what is a good use of developer time. I find it literally offensive.
Let's get a poll going for players that DON'T want the devs' time wasted on something like this.
--------------------------------- "Guardian Of The Cheese" |
Par'Gellen
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Posted - 2004.09.20 22:55:00 -
[54]
Wasting time to port EVE Online to Mac OS or Linux is the worst idea I have ever witnessed in print. Personally I see it as a slap in the face and a total disregard for what is a good use of developer time. I find it literally offensive.
Let's get a poll going for players that DON'T want the devs' time wasted on something like this.
--------------------------------- "Guardian Of The Cheese" |
S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.20 23:14:00 -
[55]
As a developer that has to support multiple operating systems, it a hassal.
Unless the game was designed from the get go to simultaniously support both or all three platforms with your own interface layer then there's no point to spend time an redesign.
The number of people you could gain as customers on linux and Mac operating systems would not justify the development, testing, and maintanance costs.
Trust me.
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S'Daria
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Posted - 2004.09.20 23:14:00 -
[56]
As a developer that has to support multiple operating systems, it a hassal.
Unless the game was designed from the get go to simultaniously support both or all three platforms with your own interface layer then there's no point to spend time an redesign.
The number of people you could gain as customers on linux and Mac operating systems would not justify the development, testing, and maintanance costs.
Trust me.
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MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2004.09.21 01:23:00 -
[57]
Originally by: S'Daria As a developer that has to support multiple operating systems, it a hassal.
Unless the game was designed from the get go to simultaniously support both or all three platforms with your own interface layer then there's no point to spend time an redesign.
The number of people you could gain as customers on linux and Mac operating systems would not justify the development, testing, and maintanance costs.
Trust me.
There ya go Samoht I'll take the "childish" part as a compliment, well knowing that we still don't need Linux clients... no matter how much you love Linux or whatever OS rocks your boat
Mai's Idealog |
MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2004.09.21 01:23:00 -
[58]
Originally by: S'Daria As a developer that has to support multiple operating systems, it a hassal.
Unless the game was designed from the get go to simultaniously support both or all three platforms with your own interface layer then there's no point to spend time an redesign.
The number of people you could gain as customers on linux and Mac operating systems would not justify the development, testing, and maintanance costs.
Trust me.
There ya go Samoht I'll take the "childish" part as a compliment, well knowing that we still don't need Linux clients... no matter how much you love Linux or whatever OS rocks your boat
Mai's Idealog |
Nac MacFeegle
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Posted - 2004.09.21 03:45:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Par'Gellen Wasting time to port EVE Online to Mac OS or Linux is the worst idea I have ever witnessed in print. Personally I see it as a slap in the face and a total disregard for what is a good use of developer time. I find it literally offensive.
Let's get a poll going for players that DON'T want the devs' time wasted on something like this.
And I see your comments as a slap in the face and offensive to anyone who would rather not play on Windows.
Is it possible that we all could be any more childish about this?
Why do people make it sound like a porting project would involve the entire development team? Hell, one or two people and some outside contractors would get the job done and leave the rest of CCP to work on the server-side of things and continue tweaking the PC client.
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Nac MacFeegle
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Posted - 2004.09.21 03:45:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Par'Gellen Wasting time to port EVE Online to Mac OS or Linux is the worst idea I have ever witnessed in print. Personally I see it as a slap in the face and a total disregard for what is a good use of developer time. I find it literally offensive.
Let's get a poll going for players that DON'T want the devs' time wasted on something like this.
And I see your comments as a slap in the face and offensive to anyone who would rather not play on Windows.
Is it possible that we all could be any more childish about this?
Why do people make it sound like a porting project would involve the entire development team? Hell, one or two people and some outside contractors would get the job done and leave the rest of CCP to work on the server-side of things and continue tweaking the PC client.
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