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HAM drake for C1?

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BoobsALOTT Spirits of Fire 0	Posted - 2012.05.21 04:55:00 - [1] - Quote Like the title says. It's mostly frigates, so would a HAM drake work?
Sum Olgy Future Corps Sleeper Social Club 5	Posted - 2012.05.21 07:04:00 - [2] - Quote No. You will kill stuff but not very quickly. Which will mean you're much more likely to get ganked. The important thing for C1's in a Drake is to not be over tanked - you want just enough tank to cope and put everything else into gank modules so it goes quickly. The cookie cutter Lvl4 Drake fit is way way way over tanked.... Are you salvaging as you go or do you have another salvage ship/alt/buddy to do that?
Sp0ki3 renditions of madness B A C K B 0 N E 2	Posted - 2012.05.21 08:18:00 - [3] - Quote In my experience heavy missles with caldari navy missles for cruisers and frigs and fury for the bses works much better than hams. Might look like higher dps on the hams in eft but they suck vs small targets and c1 has alot of small targets so the actual dps is better with heavys. Also you have enough range to engage everything right from the start with heavys.
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 7	Posted - 2012.05.21 12:50:00 - [4] - Quote For a c1 I'm not even sure you need tank on a drake - probably something like this would work fine: [Drake, C1 Drake] Beta Reactor Control: Shield Power Relay I Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Large Shield Extender II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II EM Ward Amplifier II Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile [empty high slot] Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Medium Core Defense Field Extender I Aslong as you've got reasonable skills you should be killing them long before you run out of buffer and theres not really much in the way of scrams to worry about. EDIT: And if you've got a spare ganglink char chuck in the interdiction manouvers, electronic superiority and shield harmonising links for more efficent running.
Derath Ellecon Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal 203	Posted - 2012.05.21 15:43:00 - [5] - Quote C1 sites are all Frigs and cruisers. You can actually run them faster in a turret ship that can pop frigs than a Drake. I ran C1 sites in a drake like this: [Drake, C1] Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile [Empty High slot] Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Stasis Webifier II Parallel Weapon Navigation Transmitter Parallel Weapon Navigation Transmitter Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Shield Power Relay II Medium Core Defense Field Purger I Medium Core Defense Field Purger I Medium Core Defense Field Purger I
BoobsALOTT Spirits of Fire 0	Posted - 2012.05.21 17:30:00 - [6] - Quote Thanks for the feedback guys! I can also fly a cerberus and tengu. Any of t he above better for ac1
Derath Ellecon Washburne Holdings 203	Posted - 2012.05.21 17:34:00 - [7] - Quote BoobsALOTT wrote: Thanks for the feedback guys! I can also fly a cerberus and tengu. Any of t he above better for ac1 Tengu in a C1 is a pretty bad isk risk/reward ratio given the average c1 site payout. No idea on a Cerb vs drake. I'd imagine its also going to be more isk for not that much gain.
Leetha Layne 24	Posted - 2012.05.21 18:28:00 - [8] - Quote You COULD do it but why?
notha atfast Jabba Industries INC. Punkz 'n Monkeys 5	Posted - 2012.05.21 19:55:00 - [9] - Quote Tengu's for C1 NPC's is probably a bad idea. I speak from experience when a cloaky Prot had me scrammed and webbed. Then called his pals waiting at the internal and then they went on to do very unpleasant things to my ship....many are undescribable and give me the shakes. Reavers come to mind. It helps to think that someone is always watching and waiting to get you. If the reward is a juicy Tengu everyone wants in...Drakes...Meh...not so much. Not to mention you can buy many drakes to that 1 tengu. WH killers all want to shoot Shiny stuffs! So drake is the best for the Risk of Loss vs your ISK making potential...in a C1.
Ryday Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic 4	Posted - 2012.05.22 19:24:00 - [10] - Quote You might give a blaster fit Ferox a try.
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 125	Posted - 2012.05.22 23:57:00 - [11] - Quote in my experience, a passive shield mwd AC cane actually beats a drake in C1 anoms. if that is not an option, at least use rigor rigs and a web. ~150 omnitank is about as much as you need to chill in a C1, rest should go into dps.
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Exhale. 265	Posted - 2012.05.23 02:17:00 - [12] - Quote HMLs much better
Hoshimura Makina X-Zest Voyage 0	Posted - 2012.05.24 08:45:00 - [13] - Quote Rroff wrote: For a c1 I'm not even sure you need tank on a drake - probably something like this would work fine: [Drake, C1 Drake] ... Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile [empty high slot] ... Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I ... Precision + Flare or Fury + Rigor
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 9	Posted - 2012.05.24 14:12:00 - [14] - Quote Hoshimura Makina wrote: Rroff wrote: For a c1 I'm not even sure you need tank on a drake - probably something like this would work fine: [Drake, C1 Drake] ... Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Precision Heavy Missile [empty high slot] ... Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I ... Precision + Flare or Fury + Rigor I had a play in EFT and across the vast majority of scenarios those rigs + precisions produced the best results overall against sleepless frigs and cruisers - check for yourself :P (regardless of what the conventional wisdom may or may not be regarding missiles/rigs).
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 133	Posted - 2012.05.24 14:30:00 - [15] - Quote precision is indeed a waste of money. use faction or if you are poor standard missiles.
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 9	Posted - 2012.05.24 14:35:00 - [16] - Quote I can rarely be bothered to change to precisions anyhow heh tho it is more efficent timewise to use them from my experience and in a C1 you'd have less need for high damage ammo - no idea on the cost effectiveness of it over other ammo types.
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 133	Posted - 2012.05.24 14:56:00 - [17] - Quote Rroff wrote: I can rarely be bothered to change to precisions anyhow heh tho it is more efficent timewise to use them from my experience and in a C1 you'd have less need for high damage ammo - no idea on the cost effectiveness of it over other ammo types. last time i checked precisions did LESS damage than regular scourge against a 40m sig orbiting at 250m/s, at least with my skills and rigs. feel free to EFT for yourself and report the results though.
Derath Ellecon Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal 205	Posted - 2012.05.24 15:08:00 - [18] - Quote I ran in a C1 for about 6 months. I ended up just using standard scourge for everything. For a C1 no other ammo seemed to do enough better to justify the higher cost.
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 9	Posted - 2012.05.24 15:48:00 - [19] - Quote Daniel Plain wrote: Rroff wrote: I can rarely be bothered to change to precisions anyhow heh tho it is more efficent timewise to use them from my experience and in a C1 you'd have less need for high damage ammo - no idea on the cost effectiveness of it over other ammo types. last time i checked precisions did LESS damage than regular scourge against a 40m sig orbiting at 250m/s, at least with my skills and rigs. feel free to EFT for yourself and report the results though. According to EFT - 224dps with rigors + precisions, 218 with flare + precisions, 209 with flare + regular scourge, 215 with rigors + regular scourge, T2 scourge is less than regular with either rigs. Given the relative cost of precisions v t1 scourge and the fairly slim dps difference it probably doesn't make huge odds looking at those numbers which you use aslong as you don't use T2 high damage scourge as that drops the dps off by about 20% compared to any other setup. These figures go up by almost 50% when a frig is in web-range so some long range web assistance would not go amiss.
Hoshimura Makina ATOMIX Inc. 0	Posted - 2012.05.25 09:23:00 - [20] - Quote and ~250 w rigor + fury
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 9	Posted - 2012.05.26 15:04:00 - [21] - Quote http://aten-hosted.com/_/c1drake.jpg Sorry doesn't hold up atleast in EFT simulation (which while not always 100% accurate is usually a good guide). Seems good old t1 scourge + rigors gives the best overall results (first bit of the graph is in web-range+TP range, 2nd bit in TP range only). Probably get a bit better results with faction scourge but probably very little noticeable results in decreased time and a worse ISK efficency.
Hathrul DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD Exhale. 90	Posted - 2012.05.26 15:07:00 - [22] - Quote Derath Ellecon wrote: I ran in a C1 for about 6 months. I ended up just using standard scourge for everything. For a C1 no other ammo seemed to do enough better to justify the higher cost. this is best i think switching ammo and stuff is boring. regular t1 missiles are cheap and work just fine. hams are a bad idea simply because they lack range.
Rroff The Xenodus Initiative. 9	Posted - 2012.05.26 15:23:00 - [23] - Quote Hathrul wrote: Derath Ellecon wrote: I ran in a C1 for about 6 months. I ended up just using standard scourge for everything. For a C1 no other ammo seemed to do enough better to justify the higher cost. this is best i think switching ammo and stuff is boring. regular t1 missiles are cheap and work just fine. hams are a bad idea simply because they lack range. My graph above seems to bear that out. Range is probably less of an issue in a C1 compared to other classes as the sleeper types tend to have <16km orbit and close fairly fast - but from my experience HAMs struggle to put down damage on small cruisers and lower without significant webbing. You also have to bear in mind that if a sleeper is moving fast HAMs may take longer to reach them and while they might only be say 8km away as the crow flies the actual missile path could be getting close to double that maybe even enough that they never reach the sleeper.

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