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The lowly Breacher? Cheap as chips.

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Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2009.07.23 00:21:00 - [31] Originally by: Nullshadow The numbers work out well for hitting cruisers, so a gang of hunter-killer Breachers would have a better time of hunting larger prey. Not to say rockets don't need some love vs frigates but isn't that what a frigate gangs natural prey is supposed to be? Larger ships?
Nullshadow Minmatar Aperture Harmonics	Posted - 2009.07.23 16:41:00 - [32] Originally by: Zeba Not to say rockets don't need some love vs frigates but isn't that what a frigate gangs natural prey is supposed to be? Larger ships? Well, yes, but "supposed to be" does not always mean "is in actuality". For instance rockets are a frigate-sized weapon and thus are supposed to be useful against frigates, yet they all but fail at the task. I mentioned the larger ship thing because I wanted to point out that rockets were not so broken that they are useless in every situation. AFAIK it is only in frigate vs frigate battles where rockets function poorly.
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.24 15:48:00 - [33] For a new fit I was thinking of something like this for PvP. What do you guys think? Oh and the assumption is with the future rig changes. [Breacher, Max?] High 3x Standard Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Piranha Light Missile 1x 150mm Light AutoCannon II, EMP S Medium 1x Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters 1x Small Shield Extender II Low 1x Reactor Control Unit II 1x Ballistic Control System II Rigs 1x Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I 1x Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I 1x Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Kashre Minmatar Battlegroup Obsidian	Posted - 2009.07.24 16:45:00 - [34] I'm not sure why anyone would want to use one of these for pvp, other than to say you did... but, if you gotta... a pvp frigate should have a MWD and a scram, imo. I was surprised to find that it's actually cap stable. 3x std missile II 125mm Autocannon II Catalyzed Cold-Gas MWD Warp Scram II Micro Aux Power Core 200mm Tungsten plate +++ "Etiquette is for the Dojo. In war there is only victory or death." - Eiji Yoshikawa
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.24 16:59:00 - [35] Originally by: Kashre I'm not sure why anyone would want to use one of these for pvp, other than to say you did... but, if you gotta... a pvp frigate should have a MWD and a scram, imo. I was surprised to find that it's actually cap stable. 3x std missile II 125mm Autocannon II Catalyzed Cold-Gas MWD Warp Scram II Micro Aux Power Core 200mm Tungsten plate Nice fit, but did you notice the range at max skill this ship has? 40Km targeting range and a 42Km range with the missiles. Just let someone else dot them, keep at range and no normal frig will get close.
Kashre Minmatar Battlegroup Obsidian	Posted - 2009.07.24 17:19:00 - [36] well thats true I guess, but I think it depends on what kind of pvp you're expecting. I was thinking more along the lines of a typical gang where the frigs are going to be for tackle/anti-tackle and the people in the real ships will be for DPS. :) Scram makes it more flexible since you can still stand off, but you have options. :) +++ "Etiquette is for the Dojo. In war there is only victory or death." - Eiji Yoshikawa
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.24 17:28:00 - [37] Originally by: Kashre well thats true I guess, but I think it depends on what kind of pvp you're expecting. I was thinking more along the lines of a typical gang where the frigs are going to be for tackle/anti-tackle and the people in the real ships will be for DPS. :) Scram makes it more flexible since you can still stand off, but you have options. :) Thats would be true if you only used frigs for tackle, but for an all frig pack, a heavy tackler like a jaguar is all you need, then the rest can bombard at range. Even a vagabond can't hit effectively at 40km
Fiben Bolger Gallente	Posted - 2009.07.25 04:03:00 - [38] The posts on these forums regarding rockets and the missile damage formula are funny. It's hard to believe that the multiplication of fractions can give so many people so much trouble. Rockets will outdamage light missiles. I've done a lot of experimenting with the Breacher and other missile boats. In brief, the key is to compare the ratio of the missiles explosion velocity/explosion radius. The result of that operation is multiplied by the outcome of the ratio of ship radius/ship velocity. You DO NOT compare the explosion velocity to the ship's velocity. Rockets have a puny explosion radius, and the ratio of explosion velocity/explosion radius is very much in the rocket's favor. The truth is, all missiles have trouble with fast moving frigates. As someone said, though, rockets force you to get in range of a web, and as speed is your friend you would rather not do that. On the other hand I have found nothing eats high sec Angel rats faster than a rocket Breacher. Three seconds per NPC frigate, tops. You can clear a belt in Nakugard in less than 30 seconds, much of the time. It is a nice noob ship. A gang of rocket breachers would be funny. If someone sees a bunch of breachers headed toward them they may just stare in bafflement. Until it is too late.
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.07.25 12:11:00 - [39] Originally by: Fiben Bolger The posts on these forums regarding rockets and the missile damage formula are funny. It's hard to believe that the multiplication of fractions can give so many people so much trouble. Rockets will outdamage light missiles. Stop making sense, those are not the right forums for it. -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.25 14:02:00 - [40] Edited by: Nian Banks on 25/07/2009 14:02:30 Ok so were using rockets, how about this then? [Breacher, Rocket] Ballistic Control System II 200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Warp Scrambler II Rocket Launcher II, Phalanx Rocket Rocket Launcher II, Phalanx Rocket Rocket Launcher II, Phalanx Rocket 125mm Gatling AutoCannon II, EMP S Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I Warhead Flare Catalyst I Trimark Armor Pump I
Baron Primus	Posted - 2009.07.25 14:33:00 - [41] Originally by: Ghoest Originally by: Nian Banks Why fly a breacher? Its hella cheap. Why does cost matter? Because its so cheap I don't care about loosing it. Yes losing a rifter is painful on the wallet. My sig sucks.
Dhaaka Vincatar	Posted - 2009.07.25 15:39:00 - [42] Edited by: Dhaaka Vincatar on 25/07/2009 15:40:14 Originally by: Baron Primus Originally by: Ghoest Originally by: Nian Banks Why fly a breacher? Its hella cheap. Why does cost matter? Because its so cheap I don't care about loosing it. Yes losing a rifter is painful on the wallet. We are all aware that the Rifter is the 'best' T1 frigate out there, and that there is no real reason to fly another. The only reason people fly Incursi, Punishers and Kestrels is that they don't have Minmatar frigate III. It should not be this way, but it currently is. You shouldn't be persecuting people for trying to fly the other ships in the game. If you go by the fluff Minmatar should be flying fleets of Slashers and taking out Armageddons, look how far away we are from THAT fantasy?
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.25 20:45:00 - [43] Originally by: Dhaaka Vincatar We are all aware that the Rifter is the 'best' T1 frigate out there, and that there is no real reason to fly another. The only reason people fly Incursi, Punishers and Kestrels is that they don't have Minmatar frigate III. It should not be this way, but it currently is. You shouldn't be persecuting people for trying to fly the other ships in the game. If you go by the fluff Minmatar should be flying fleets of Slashers and taking out Armageddons, look how far away we are from THAT fantasy. The problem is that doing something different, outside the box of thought others have is to them unthinkable and absurd. To the truthful, I am starting to thing the breacher with the rig changes will be an extremely viable ship and I wish CCP made one of the Assault Frigates from one back when they were created. Ah well. its a nice ship and I want to try some active duty with it soon.
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2009.07.26 16:20:00 - [44] Still looking for peoples fits for the Breacher, pvp, pve... What ever intended role you can think of. Post it as this ship is interesting.
Hiroshima Jita	Posted - 2009.07.26 21:02:00 - [45] Lol Dhaaka. People suggest using the rifter because its better. Not because they dislike people who use crappier ships. I personally am much happier when I run into someone flying a crud ship. It means I have a better chance of getting a killmail without dying myself. You should pick a role you want to preform. Then you should pick a ship to do it in. If you want to kill people on a frigate level you start with that and pick the best tool avaliable to you for the job. If the breacher is an option the rifter is a better one. You will kill more people and live longer. If you want to have fun and **** around as your primary concern then the breacher might be better. The problem is the teiring system. Breacher is low teir, rifter is higher. Rifter is better. Alot of ships that fill interesting roles suffer from this, especially amongst t1. Their higher teir big brother simply outpreforms them at all things. That leaves alot of ships that more or less belong in the garbage bin. Cyclone, prophecy, stabber, omen, breacher...
Joanna RB	Posted - 2009.07.26 22:29:00 - [46] Originally by: Nian Banks If and when Rockets get a remake, j may considder a Rocket Breacher. As it stands now however, the range of standard missile far outweigh the rockets in functionality. I admit that a 4:2:2 slot layout doesn't lend the breacher to any great tank and truth be told if I had the CPU and grid, I may considder a mwd, 9k scram, plate and bcu with a mix of armor rigs that would maximize it's ehp. That could work. a point on a level 1 mission ship?
Anyura	Posted - 2009.07.26 23:33:00 - [47] I'm not a huge fan of Minmatar ships - would always fly a Punisher over Rifter for personal preference. I do like the OP's view on trying out unusual ship fits. I've recently trained up rockets for a Vengeance in the hope that they may one day be a little more effective but in keeping with the spirit of this thread, I give you: [Inquisitor, lolwut] 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher 'Malkuth' Rocket Launcher 200mm Small Autocannon 1MN MWD Small Shield Extender II Overdrive Injector I Ballistic Control Unit I Ballistic Control Unit I ...gives you a modest amount of damage for a T1 frig (about 60 DPS - whoo), an optimal of 4km, 12 minutes at 2.4km/s and given the T1 stuff, fairly cheap to fit. Of course, this is with my fairly low skills, could be better with higher SP.
Duke Starbuckington	Posted - 2009.07.26 23:46:00 - [48] Originally by: Hiroshima Jita That leaves alot of ships that more or less belong in the garbage bin. Cyclone, prophecy, stabber, omen, breacher... Stabber's a good ship, it just has a role.
Dhaaka Vincatar	Posted - 2009.07.27 21:20:00 - [49] Edited by: Dhaaka Vincatar on 27/07/2009 21:20:55 Originally by: Hiroshima Jita Lol Dhaaka. People suggest using the rifter because its better. Not because they dislike people who use crappier ships. [...] The problem is the teiring system. Breacher is low teir, rifter is higher. Rifter is better. Alot of ships that fill interesting roles suffer from this, especially amongst t1. Their higher teir big brother simply outpreforms them at all things. That leaves alot of ships that more or less belong in the garbage bin. Cyclone, prophecy, stabber, omen, breacher... I couldn't agree with you more. I could see Breacher being better at 20km range with standard missiles but even then the Rifter may be better with artys....

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