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We don't want the graphics to be increased again in Winter 2009 !

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Cadde Gallente FireworX	Posted - 2009.10.06 00:08:00 - [31] The question now is, when will CCP take the step into the future and discontinue SM2 because lets face it. If 40% of eve's playerbase are running on SM2 hardware and cannot be arsed to find the cheapest solution to THEIR problem running on hardware that belongs in a cave ... while another 40% are ok with the current game but have upgraded to GeForce 9x series and above or the ATI equivalent and would at some time in the near future demand better visuals or leave for another game... What would be the best path for CCP to take here? Remain "loyal" to the fellas that sit on their yabbadabbadoo laptops and SM2 PC's or should they invest in the future? So, i am fine with waiting another 6 months after dominion for more graphic detail and fidelity but after that i cannot tell you how I'll feel. All i know is i was really looking forward to dynamic HARDWARE accelerated particle physics as shown in Fanfest 2008. After all, i bought a GeForce 260GTX and now i wanna see it being utilized by all games i invest my time in. Mind you, I am not a wealthy man... But I'd rather live a non glamorous life for the sake of pushing gaming forwards into more stunning graphics, physics and gameplay options. One could say i ... live through my gaming. But at least it's cheaper than going to the pub every weekend, destroying your body and soul. IMHO. My opinions belong to me, you can't have them!
Trioxi	Posted - 2009.10.06 02:13:00 - [32] Originally by: DJ Shuffle Maybe CCP could still support Shader Model 2 and have an optional upgrade or feature built in for people who want to use Shader Model 3. All problems solved. Or you should buy a half decent computer, sorry but you cannot expect EVE to sit back with outdated graphics.
illford baker Pilots of Damnation death from above..	Posted - 2009.10.06 02:18:00 - [33] Edited by: illford baker on 06/10/2009 02:18:48 i know we gotta move forward, and i want new graphics. i also now it is a bad move for business if you just cut em off with little warning. CCP, tell em now that they will lose eve if they don't upgrade by the next expansion(after winter). to give them a fair bit of warning. perhaps even throw in some surveys to make sure everyone is ready, who doesn't like a good surveys?
DJ Shuffle Eve Radio Corporation	Posted - 2009.10.09 01:34:00 - [34] Originally by: CCP Explorer Graphics requirements in 2009 (red text at top) and general system requirements 2009. Thank you CCP Explorer in showing us CCP's latest decision to continue support for Shader Model 2 as a minimum requirement for the Eve Client. Also thank you for all the players who also showed us similar proof. Will the next expansion pack, Dominion, also have Shader Model 2 as a minimum requirement? From the post you showed us I'm assuming yes but I want to ask just for clarification purposes. As of this point forward it has been stated, with proof, that the Eve client will still support Shader Model 2 as a minimum requirement throughout Winter 2009. As far as the people who have been posting "just buy a new computer" I want to say that most people just don't buy new computers at a random moment in time, unless 1) your rich or 2) you save up for a new computer; especially a laptop. I would upgrade my laptop if everything wasn't integrated. Now that I know, at some point other than Winter 2009, the Eve client will eventually discontinue support for Shader Model 2 we all can start saving up money for a new computer/laptop. As you all know laptops are generally more expensive than desktops especially laptops designed for gaming. I am for sure going to save up to replace both computers. At this point this thread has helped CCP to still support Shader Model 2 and made all of us aware of thier decision and status on the graphical requirments on the Eve client; past, present, and future. I would like to continue this discussion to all those who would like to comment about what you think the direction of the graphics should take in Eve. I have to admit that graphics are a small important aspect about a game, in my opinion. I've played for about 4 years and I've never had any complaints about the graphics in Eve, especially since the Apocrypha patch.
DJ Shuffle Eve Radio Corporation	Posted - 2009.10.09 01:39:00 - [35] Originally by: illford baker Edited by: illford baker on 06/10/2009 02:18:48 i know we gotta move forward, and i want new graphics. i also now it is a bad move for business if you just cut em off with little warning. CCP, tell em now that they will lose eve if they don't upgrade by the next expansion(after winter). to give them a fair bit of warning. perhaps even throw in some surveys to make sure everyone is ready, who doesn't like a good surveys? I agree, surveys would be a great idea for getting viable information about when people are ready to make the big leap forward in requiring Shader Model 3. In my opinion the most important factor for business is to take care of your customers. If a lot of people are cut off of being able to play Eve, for any reason, there is a chance to lose money/profits. I think this thread has helped shaped Eve, even just a little bit, and more importantly have made us aware of the graphical changes that will/may happen in the future. At least for now we can rest assured that these changes will not take place Winter 2009. Woot!
Sleepkevert Amarr Rionnag Alba Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2009.10.09 08:05:00 - [36] Originally by: DJ Shuffle Originally by: illford baker Edited by: illford baker on 06/10/2009 02:18:48 i know we gotta move forward, and i want new graphics. i also now it is a bad move for business if you just cut em off with little warning. CCP, tell em now that they will lose eve if they don't upgrade by the next expansion(after winter). to give them a fair bit of warning. perhaps even throw in some surveys to make sure everyone is ready, who doesn't like a good surveys? I agree, surveys would be a great idea for getting viable information about when people are ready to make the big leap forward in requiring Shader Model 3. In my opinion the most important factor for business is to take care of your customers. If a lot of people are cut off of being able to play Eve, for any reason, there is a chance to lose money/profits. Even better, just have the client report the graphic capabilitys of a system, much like steam does nowadays. That way you have a decent report of what EVE's main stream pc's look like. _ Add your own line!
DJ Shuffle Eve Radio Corporation	Posted - 2009.10.11 02:39:00 - [37] Originally by: Sleepkevert Even better, just have the client report the graphic capabilitys of a system, much like steam does nowadays. That way you have a decent report of what EVE's main stream pc's look like. I would also be in favor of the client reporting functionality in the Eve Client (as described above) as long as it didn't sacrifice performance or security.
Lork Niffle Gallente External Hard Drive	Posted - 2009.10.11 10:09:00 - [38] Originally by: Sleepkevert ]Even better, just have the client report the graphic capabilitys of a system, much like steam does nowadays. That way you have a decent report of what EVE's main stream pc's look like. It does. They found SM1 to SM2 capabilities i.e being only able to support 1.0/1.1 to be in the minor percentages so they were able to make a business move to stop supporting it. The SM2 to SM3 capabilities on the other hand is still very high so they decided against it. It was the same with supporting a linux based client. They found not only thenumber of people using Linux on EVE being very low 0.1% but of those people actually using the Linux client instead of Wine being a small percentage of that so they discontinued it. Illford, Crysis =/= Good graphics, Crysis is unoptimized to hell and no where matches STALKER and most people wouldn't be able to play that. What can you really offer seriously in a Space game? Kinda hard to put all the effects in in Space. They are alreay redesigning the planets and nebulae, and it looks good in SM2. SM3 and 4 don't really offer much more to the table along with DX10/11 ------------------------------------- Don't click the links or even the forum topics.
Charcul	Posted - 2009.10.13 00:38:00 - [39] Edited by: Charcul on 13/10/2009 00:38:45 Originally by: DJ Shuffle I plan to buy a new desktop and laptop but don't have the money right now due to the economy. I love that, lol. Dude, just be honest and say you got sacked. we're adults here..... I for one am completely in favour of bigger and better graphics, with more shiny bits. Its a minority that can't run shader model 3.0 and the rest of use could be seeing better graphics. Really, a system to run shader model 3 will set you back what, 300 euro? just stop smoking for a month and hey presto!
Charcul	Posted - 2009.10.13 00:47:00 - [40] Originally by: DJ Shuffle Originally by: illford baker i give up, if you cant see the difference then you just have a bad eye for graphics. eve need better graphics, the end. illford baker, why does Eve need better graphics? Are you willing to sacrifice performance just to have better graphics? I'm not. Also, I don't see what's wrong with the current graphics, it looks amazing. Does anyone that have all thier display/graphic settings set to max disagree? Please continue to be respectful and mature in this thread. i would dissagree. The planets and moons are decidedly plain, as are the ship models. sure, they have pretty lights and such, but the engine plumes, the weapons, the well everything really on the ships look pretty basic. if max settings still looks basic compared to the rest of the games coming out these days then its time for a major upgrade.

Tranka Verrane Angelic Industries	Posted - 2009.10.13 11:59:00 - [41] Dude, they aren't. Why is this non-issue thread still going? Player Since 2005 Over 4000 hours logged
DJ Shuffle Eve Radio Corporation	Posted - 2009.10.21 04:48:00 - [42] Originally by: Tranka Verrane Dude, they aren't. Why is this non-issue thread still going? People are just responding with thier views and ideas. We have already established that Shader Model 3.0 isn't going to be required this Winter. Check previous posts in this thread. If you have any questions please ask and if we can answer it we will. My opinion, I really do want to upgrade my computer and right now I can't. Sure you can get a cheap computer for around $500 USD, as I'm in USA, but it will be laggy and poor performance with Eve. That's just the way it is. So for a decent setup on a laptop especially you are looking to spend at least $1,000 USD. A desktop would be a different story, estimating around $800 USD + monitor-- that includes the operating system. If you can find a laptop build equally as good for less than $1,000 USD please let me know. And please link it. Feel free to link UK computer setups but as for me ordering a computer from UK or anywhere else than USA is impratical for me and I'm sure for other USA-based players. Please don't respond with "just upgrade your computer, doesn't cost that much" anymore please. As that is an opinion and not a fact since all of us don't have as much money as you.
Tranka Verrane Angelic Industries	Posted - 2009.10.21 08:38:00 - [43] Originally by: DJ Shuffle Originally by: Tranka Verrane Dude, they aren't. Why is this non-issue thread still going? People are just responding with thier views and ideas. We have already established that Shader Model 3.0 isn't going to be required this Winter. Check previous posts in this thread. If you have any questions please ask and if we can answer it we will. My opinion, I really do want to upgrade my computer and right now I can't. Sure you can get a cheap computer for around $500 USD, as I'm in USA, but it will be laggy and poor performance with Eve. That's just the way it is. So for a decent setup on a laptop especially you are looking to spend at least $1,000 USD. A desktop would be a different story, estimating around $800 USD + monitor-- that includes the operating system. If you can find a laptop build equally as good for less than $1,000 USD please let me know. And please link it. Feel free to link UK computer setups but as for me ordering a computer from UK or anywhere else than USA is impratical for me and I'm sure for other USA-based players. Please don't respond with "just upgrade your computer, doesn't cost that much" anymore please. As that is an opinion and not a fact since all of us don't have as much money as you. Yes but they, as you, are responding and arguing over things that are completely irrelevant. Shader 3.0 isn't coming in this winter. If it ever does become required we'll be given a great deal of advance notice, we always are. By the time it is required getting a new pc may well be a requirement for you for other reasons anyway. Enough people are 'only just' running shader 2.0 that there is no immediate threat. For 3.0 to be truly required the majority of us would have to be smoothly running 2.0 at maximum and champing at the bit for better. This is clearly not yet the case. When we get to the point when 3.0 is looming we'll have this discussion again, legitimately. In the meantime, wtf, leave it alone. Player Since 2005 Over 4000 hours logged
DJ Shuffle Eve Radio Corporation	Posted - 2009.11.01 10:06:00 - [44] Originally by: Tranka Verrane Enough people are 'only just' running shader 2.0 that there is no immediate threat. For 3.0 to be truly required the majority of us would have to be smoothly running 2.0 at maximum and champing at the bit for better. This is clearly not yet the case. When we get to the point when 3.0 is looming we'll have this discussion again, legitimately. In the meantime, wtf, leave it alone. Nicely summarized and full of LOL's because this is pretty much exactly what I wanted to see happen. This should be the last post on this thread but wanted to say a big "thank you" for closing this thread with an undoubtly explanation that cannot be countered. FTW!!
Kelly Luzita Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2009.11.01 15:21:00 - [45] I just wanted to add that the newest agp cards 4650 and the 4670 support SM 4.1. I too don't have the money to upgrade right now to a new PC. But picking up a new agp card for 85$ to 124$ is probably with in most peoples budget. Even the 2600 cards suport Shader Model 4.0 if you can find one that old. For a lap top you could look at this. How ever it is 300$ with a card and 199 with out. http://www.villagetronic.com/vidock2/index.html The nice thing is it takes desk top PCIe 2.0 cards.You do need a ExpressCard 2.0 slot on the lap top.
Mkiaki Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2009.11.01 17:06:00 - [46] Yup this is why you should all be upgrading, and why EVE should be DX10 already
illford baker Pilots of Damnation death from above..	Posted - 2009.11.02 00:18:00 - [47] Edited by: illford baker on 02/11/2009 00:20:45 people wont upgrade if they don't see a reason why. introduce a 2nd DX11 client(lets face it, DX11 can run on DX10 card and vista/7, it would be a waste to use DX10). once they see how good it looks they will be more insensitive to upgrade. DX11 is the future, it will happen and IS GOING TO HAPPEN. so start collecting money in your piggy bank and upgrade, you wont look back, you wont regret it. just pop over to newegg.com and shop(best buy is a rip off). you can find video cards for $60 windows 7 OEM for $99, single core CPUs for $40, 2 core for $50 and quad core for $100.
Dealer bob Gallente The Industrialist's Trade Society	Posted - 2009.11.02 02:08:00 - [48] +1 for dx11 eve spaceships . screw these guys
Talon Aidian Interstella Fleet	Posted - 2009.11.07 04:44:00 - [49] Several things to keep in mind. 1) The Devs promised 'Premium-Lite' which was supposed to help those players with lower-end systems continue to play the game, and to release this alternative client simutanously with the retirement of the 'Classic' client and the upgrade in graphics. They upgraded the graphics and retired the Classic client....and never released 'Premium-Lite'. Don't believe everything they say. 2) The attitude of some players that those with technical difficulties with continuing increases in system requirements to benefit those players who have state-of-the-art systems and replace their system every year should also replace their own system or quit the game is also the demonstrated attitude of the game developers. My own system worked well with the Classic client, and has been borderline since the graphics changeover. The end result of a series of troubleshooting sessions was just that.."Get a new system, or leave the game." 3) This is the way EVE will continue to go. The graphics will continue to expand in requirements to pander to those players who cannot tolerate a system more than a year old, and leave the players who can't keep purchasing new systems with nothing more than fond memories of when the gameplay mattered more than the eyecandy. Sad, but proven true by the actions of the Devs.
Ilyashen Caldari Teamsters Union	Posted - 2009.11.07 19:06:00 - [50] I am all for moving on in graphics quality. EVE has pushed the graphics with every generation of their engine. I see no reason to move on to DX11. That is, of course if they find a way to still accommodate players with lower end systems. Engines can scale to the hardware. Let's look at Half Life: 2. It supported DX7 (and DX6 kinda), through DX9, and partially DX10. That is a broad range. DX11 can offer these features to EVE: Tessellation - Much more detail to ships, stations, everything. Planets can have visible height on continents and much, much, more can be enhanced with it. But remember, it's only a map, so if you can't support it it's fine. Unified Pipeline - Better performance for everyone that has support for the hardware. DX11 I believe has a mandatory 4x AA, and we all know that EVE can really use some official Anti-Aliasing. There is much to be gained from upgrading the engine, but we do not need to leave the lower end players behind.

Sharthe	Posted - 2009.11.09 22:52:00 - [51] no increased min req's - signed.
Koyama Ise Caldari Equestrian Knight Order of Lolicon	Posted - 2009.11.10 00:27:00 - [52] Originally by: Talon Aidian The Devs promised 'Premium-Lite' which was supposed to help those players with lower-end systems continue to play the game, and to release this alternative client simutanously with the retirement of the 'Classic' client and the upgrade in graphics. They upgraded the graphics and retired the Classic client....and never released 'Premium-Lite'. Don't believe everything they say. You've been misinformed. The "Premium-Lite Client" was really a misnomer. Premium-Lite was never intended to be a separate client, It's just someone in their great wisdom decided to call it that. "Premium-Lite" was really just the scalability of the graphics. Before they removed classic there were a few settings in the ôPremium-Clientö namely; HDR, Shadows and Bloom. There werenÆt any Shader settings or Texture settings, these two limited the Premium-Client to Shader Model 3.0 cards. Premium-Lite expanded the Premium-Client to Shader Model 2.0 by allow the Shader settings to be turned down. However, since a large number of Shader Model 2.0 cards are old they also had to allow the reduction of the texture quality to keep performance. Releasing a separate ôPremium-Liteö client would have been redundant, as the purpose for removing the Classic-Client was to reduce the work load of maintaining not only two different engines but also creating duplicates of every Art Asset added to the game so there was one for the Premium-Client and the Classic-Client. Finally Originally by: Talon Aidian This is the way EVE will continue to go. The graphics will continue to expand in requirements to pander to those players who cannot tolerate a system more than a year old, and leave the players who can't keep purchasing new systems with nothing more than fond memories of when the gameplay mattered more than the eyecandy. Yes I like eye candy, but no my system is a few years old now. Assuming the graphics card didnÆt die in my other system my almost eight year old system could play on the ôPremium-Clientö though the graphics card was updated to one from around August 2004. Which by the way is five years old, not one year old. ______________________________ I may not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it.
Crommi Gallente	Posted - 2009.12.01 17:27:00 - [53] Originally by: Ilyashen Tessellation - Much more detail to ships, stations, everything. Planets can have visible height on continents and much, much, more can be enhanced with it. But remember, it's only a map, so if you can't support it it's fine. To actually see terrain elevation changes from space, you'd have to have friggin' huge mountains. Tesselation itself does not add details in any way, it just subdivides the mesh into far higher polycount. Visually,only differences would be increased surface smoothness and much more round silhuettes. Also, it is not a texture map or anything like that. More than new fancy DX versions, I'd love to see scaleable UI. It would be nice to use higher resolutions without having to invest into binoculars to read mission texts.
InViz0 Caldari Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2009.12.01 21:30:00 - [54] Edited by: InViz0 on 01/12/2009 21:34:15 Here is a mature reply for you: Facts: 1.) Several NEW MMOs with cutting-edge technology are coming out (Star Trek, The Old Republic). 2.) These MMOs appeal to the same player-base that EVE has. 3.) These MMOs are going to be superior on the graphical side when they release. 4.) It has been proven that 40% of a game's entertainment for most people comes from VISUAL stimulation. Suggestions: 1.) Push the envelope on the graphic department to attract new players. 2.) The amount of player-base you gain from having a technologically-proficient game is going to heavily outweigh the player-base that cannot afford to upgrade their computers. In conclusion you guys have to realize that gaming is a luxury not a necessity, and like all luxuries they don't come cheap, their should be no reason you have not upgraded your pc for even the last 3-4 years in my opinion. Every year i spend about $150-$200 and that alone keeps my computer top notch. This is coming from a 20 year old college student that has (with a high school diploma) put himself through a UC and dormed completely independent. All it took were a few stock market trades and a high-tech internship. And the standard computer for everyone right now should be: GeForce 8800GT Dual core or better CPU 2.5ghz+ 4GB DDR2 RAM The Ram i think is like $40 lol, the cpu and mobo can cost as low as $150, and that video card is $150 or less right now.


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