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Trvaeler
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Posted - 2009.09.30 21:34:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Trvaeler on 30/09/2009 21:35:08 Here is a proposed strategy:
2 chars, but only one can fly an Orca/Hulk.
Char 1 warps to belt with Orca and Hulk in ship bay Char 2 warps to belt in a Dominix with 6 miner IIs and some mining upgrade modules in the lows
Char 2 targets Orca from his Dominix and sets "keep range 500m", with an afterburner perma running and 5 hammerhead IIs out set to agressive for the rats
Char 1 launched Hulk and boards it. Targets Orca and sets "keep range 500m".
Char 2 in Dominix targets Hulk.
Char 1 and Char 2 target roids and start mining into Orca. Char 1 periodically boards Orca to move ore from corp hanger to ore hanger/cargo bay until full.
What are thoughts/experiences from peeps here about the relative 'safety' of this. Planning on doing this in a 0.6 or 0.7 system with no starbase (thus lots of roids left in belts) and average of 5-10 pilots in local.
Also fitting a warp disruptor and some 5 ogre IIs in the dominix in case someone manages to steal anything, I'll just blow it up, but hoping it doesn't get to that.
What are the chances someone can nudge the dominix AND the hulk outside of targeting range or target disrupt both ships in the 5 seconds or so it would take me to board the Orca and scoop up the hulk?
(PS I know it's not the most efficient setup, just interested in seeing how workable it is for kicks)
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente Federal Defense Operations
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Posted - 2009.09.30 21:56:00 -
[2]
1) Unless you are at war with someone, the "warp disruptor... blow it up" is irrelevant. If they don't manage to break both target locks and board the ship before Concord pops them, they're out a ship. I'm pretty sure however, if they do manage to board in time, then Concord will pop your Orca instead.
2) I'm also puzzled by your "keep at 500m" part. Domi's base targeting range is 70km, but the Hulk's is 22km. So unless they manage to bump them both out past that distance, the Domi will stay locked longer, and prevent them from boarding.
3) Your emergency plan to "board the Orca and scoop up the Hulk" will run into a snag if you don't time it just right. If your Strips are running when you board the Orca, you'll wind up with a load of rock in the hold. And the Orca can not store the Hulk if there is rock inside. So you have to quickly; cut the lasers, shift over the rock, jump to Orca, then scoop Hulk. You're almost better off jumping to Orca and considering yourself lucky if they only make off with a free Hulk.
Those points aside, it's a perfectly doable setup. In fact, with as few people in Local as you claim, I doubt you'll run into any trouble. Just don't advertise where you intend on doing this, and you should be fine. |
OwlManAtt
Gallente Yasashii Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2009.09.30 22:42:00 -
[3]
I'm told the locking trick hasn't worked in a long while. --- Owl |
Marcus Gideon
Gallente Federal Defense Operations
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Posted - 2009.09.30 23:03:00 -
[4]
Originally by: OwlManAtt I'm told the locking trick hasn't worked in a long while.
Unless a "long while" is a few weeks... then I can assure you it still works.
We've tested it so far as to see if a CEO can't board one of their corpies ships while locked, and found they can not.
So long as a single ship has the Orca (or whatever ship in question) targeted, it can not be boarded except by the original pilot.
This also means if a gang attacks you, and one of them attempts to board, the rest of the gang has to drop targeting as well. Otherwise his buddies are preventing him too. |
OwlManAtt
Gallente Yasashii Heavy Industries
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Posted - 2009.10.01 00:25:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Marcus Gideon Unless a "long while" is a few weeks... then I can assure you it still works.
I stand corrected, then. There was a thread about this about two months ago where somebody said that wouldn't work anymore.
Quote: So long as a single ship has the Orca (or whatever ship in question) targeted, it can not be boarded except by the original pilot.
Or if they bring a Blackbird. It only takes one jam cycle to lose your Orca. --- Owl |
Trvaeler
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Posted - 2009.10.01 00:57:00 -
[6]
Originally by: OwlManAtt
Originally by: Marcus Gideon Unless a "long while" is a few weeks... then I can assure you it still works.
I stand corrected, then. There was a thread about this about two months ago where somebody said that wouldn't work anymore.
Quote: So long as a single ship has the Orca (or whatever ship in question) targeted, it can not be boarded except by the original pilot.
Or if they bring a Blackbird. It only takes one jam cycle to lose your Orca.
Thanks for the replies folks...So a couple ECCMs for the Dominix then |
McFly
C0LDFIRE
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Posted - 2009.10.01 08:47:00 -
[7]
train the other character to fly one of the two ships, although with a single hulk, it's fairly pointless to be using the orca anyway,
- No character running the mining links, - inconvenient as hell to shift everytime the corp hangar fills up - domi pilot in an itty would work just as well, since the shifting from ship to ship time would negate the domi's mining anyway since the hulk is no longer operating.
Just train the domi pilot to fly the orca, if you really want to be using the orca, tho without 3 hulks at a minimum the orca isn't really justified except as a more convenient hauler.
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Baka Lakadaka
Gallente Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
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Posted - 2009.10.01 09:23:00 -
[8]
"That is the stupidest plan since 'How to Read French' was translated into French". -Edmund Blackadder
Sorry - I just like that quote and I've been waiting to use it.......well it's not a smart move to leave a half billion isk ship floating in space without a pilot.
A dedicated pair of bumpers could have the Domi and the Hulk out of range quick smart and if you get out into your pod to try to fly back to the Orca, you'll be podded rather quickly. Sure Concord could come and pop a T1 ship or maybe even 2, but the new Orca pilot would be on scene quick smart to board (possibly already sitting there in a CovOps). He then scoops his own ship to the bay and flies off home in his shiny 2nd hand Orca.
______________________ Isn't it time you learned to fight back? Agony Unleashed Home of the PvP University.
Recruitment Re-opening Soon. |
Sader Rykane
Amarr Midnight Sentinels Midnight Space Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.10.01 09:28:00 -
[9]
I can't understand anyone who would willing leave an or ca unpiloted and delude themselves into thinking that this is somehow a good idea under any circumstances.
Sig Gallery is currently down: Contact me ingame for prices.
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Signore Kaeota
Caldari Caelum Incognitum
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Posted - 2009.10.01 10:19:00 -
[10]
Congratz to the OP, you missed 70% of the point of an orca. It's a gang ship. I even stressed which part you fail at, in case that sentence wasn't obvious enough. With the ore loss of the domi, just have a second hulk and fly back and forth.
Let me make it clear, in case you didn't get my point still:
THE ORCA IS NOT A MASSIVE GSC! -_-_-_-
I, Signore Kaeota, hereby apologise for any and all offence caused by the contents of this above post, and all others that I have written, or otherwise been responsible for.
-_-_-_ |
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SpankSkank
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Posted - 2009.10.01 13:18:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Signore Kaeota Congratz to the OP, you missed 70% of the point of an orca. It's a gang ship. I even stressed which part you fail at, in case that sentence wasn't obvious enough. With the ore loss of the domi, just have a second hulk and fly back and forth.
Let me make it clear, in case you didn't get my point still:
THE ORCA IS NOT A MASSIVE GSC!
Congrats to you on missing 100% of the point of the OP's question. He didn't ask if he was using the Orca the way it was intended, he asked if by targeting the Orca while he wasn't in it would keep someone from stealing it and about the possibility of being bumped far enough way. He even said he KNOWS it's not the most efficient use of ships.
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2009.10.01 14:22:00 -
[12]
One bump from a MWD-equipped Typhoon and that Orca will be out of range of the Hulk pilot. The 'phoon will just keep bumping until the Orca's out of targeting range of the Domi. Then the other guy boards the Orca and scarpers, or gets his friend to WTZ to board the Orca.
Your "park the Orca in the belt" idea will end in tears, guaranteed.
[Aussie players: join channel ANZAC] |
Protagonist Prospect
Gallente Quantum Theory.
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Posted - 2009.10.01 14:53:00 -
[13]
What system is this?
We are the Warrior Nation, representing 2000 members over 60 online games. We recruit people not characters.
Wnx Protagonist Warrior Nation Judge Advocate Colonel |
foobarx
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Posted - 2009.10.01 14:58:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Mara Rinn One bump from a MWD-equipped Typhoon and that Orca will be out of range of the Hulk pilot. The 'phoon will just keep bumping until the Orca's out of targeting range of the Domi. Then the other guy boards the Orca and scarpers, or gets his friend to WTZ to board the Orca.
Your "park the Orca in the belt" idea will end in tears, guaranteed.
Has anyone ever heard of this actually happening? Sure, it's possible, but the Typhoon pilot is going to have to warp to the belt and then get up to speed before the Hulk pilot notices him and boards the Orca. I don't see it unless the Hulk/Orca pilot is AFK.
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Signore Kaeota
Caldari Caelum Incognitum
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Posted - 2009.10.01 15:12:00 -
[15]
Originally by: SpankSkank
Originally by: Signore Kaeota Congratz to the OP, you missed 70% of the point of an orca. It's a gang ship. I even stressed which part you fail at, in case that sentence wasn't obvious enough. With the ore loss of the domi, just have a second hulk and fly back and forth.
Let me make it clear, in case you didn't get my point still:
THE ORCA IS NOT A MASSIVE GSC!
Congrats to you on missing 100% of the point of the OP's question. He didn't ask if he was using the Orca the way it was intended, he asked if by targeting the Orca while he wasn't in it would keep someone from stealing it and about the possibility of being bumped far enough way. He even said he KNOWS it's not the most efficient use of ships.
actually, after rereading the OP, you 100% correct I read it yesterday, came back today, read the replies and got the totally wrong idea.
That said, I still don't see why you would use them that way... but yes, it should work. Apologies for my stupidity. -_-_-_-
I, Signore Kaeota, hereby apologise for any and all offence caused by the contents of this above post, and all others that I have written, or otherwise been responsible for.
-_-_-_ |
Callista Omenswarm
Astronautical Engineering
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Posted - 2009.10.01 15:25:00 -
[16]
I don't see why you don't just jet can. Using the orca as a jet can, you're not getting the bonuses, having to switch ships every so often to move ore around and having to run for the orca anytime someone appears in local or pops up on d-scan heading to the belt.
Orca can hold what, maybe 20mil of ore. Seems to me to be a FAR more sensible idea to have 20mil of ore floating out there than some 'fool proof' plan to risk a half bil ship. Less effort too as you don't have to keep switching ships. Astronautical Engineering - T1 BPC Store - Now recruiting |
Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.01 15:57:00 -
[17]
Originally by: foobarx Has anyone ever heard of this actually happening? Sure, it's possible, but the Typhoon pilot is going to have to warp to the belt and then get up to speed before the Hulk pilot notices him and boards the Orca. I don't see it unless the Hulk/Orca pilot is AFK.
There are several threads in Crime and Punishment about stolen Orcas.
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
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Posted - 2009.10.01 16:12:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Protagonist Prospect What system is this?
Consult your nearest locator agent --- 34.4:1 mineral compression ISRC Racing, Season 7 - schedule |
Agent Unknown
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.01 17:06:00 -
[19]
I thought you could password-protect orcas....or was this a long time ago? (Either that or I'm just going insane )
Originally by: CCP Fallout
And yelling is bad. It makes the baby Jesus cry and when the baby Jesus cries I'm forced to lock threads |
Signore Kaeota
Caldari Caelum Incognitum
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Posted - 2009.10.01 17:30:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Agent Unknown I thought you could password-protect orcas....or was this a long time ago? (Either that or I'm just going insane )
no, that's POSs... what are you smoking hehe -_-_-_-
I, Signore Kaeota, hereby apologise for any and all offence caused by the contents of this above post, and all others that I have written, or otherwise been responsible for.
-_-_-_ |
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Agent Unknown
Caldari
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Posted - 2009.10.01 18:16:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Signore Kaeota
Originally by: Agent Unknown I thought you could password-protect orcas....or was this a long time ago? (Either that or I'm just going insane )
no, that's POSs... what are you smoking hehe
WTS Quafe Special Edition
Originally by: CCP Fallout
And yelling is bad. It makes the baby Jesus cry and when the baby Jesus cries I'm forced to lock threads |
AusTerror
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Posted - 2009.10.02 04:13:00 -
[22]
If you really want to mine with your Orca use drones.
I know its not efficient. But you can target 5 roids, assign each drone to 1 roid, then go vac****or do the washing.
a 0.9 or 1.0 sec system does not have any rats.
Or mine with drones stay at keyboard, and your other mining ship will get gang bonuses.
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Signore Kaeota
Caldari Caelum Incognitum
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Posted - 2009.10.02 06:41:00 -
[23]
Originally by: AusTerror If you really want to mine with your Orca use drones.
I know its not efficient. But you can target 5 roids, assign each drone to 1 roid, then go vac****or do the washing.
a 0.9 or 1.0 sec system does not have any rats.
Or mine with drones stay at keyboard, and your other mining ship will get gang bonuses.
Dude, highsec rats wouldn't even dent an orcas passive regen :P -_-_-_-
I, Signore Kaeota, hereby apologise for any and all offence caused by the contents of this above post, and all others that I have written, or otherwise been responsible for.
-_-_-_ |
ForgeMarket Alt
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Posted - 2009.10.02 07:45:00 -
[24]
But they will kill mining drones easily :)
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Signore Kaeota
Caldari Caelum Incognitum
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Posted - 2009.10.02 08:14:00 -
[25]
not if the orca jumps in first, waits to be targeted then releases them -_-_-_-
I, Signore Kaeota, hereby apologise for any and all offence caused by the contents of this above post, and all others that I have written, or otherwise been responsible for.
-_-_-_ |
Sulg
Quicksilver Industries Amici Noctis
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Posted - 2009.10.02 11:26:00 -
[26]
Just thought I would throw this up to make the point that if you are in fact going to attempt something like this, be careful. :)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Warp speed is not fast enough. We must go straight to...ludicrous speed! |
Natalie Mia
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Posted - 2009.10.05 15:40:00 -
[27]
I aquired a brand new Orca the other day from some one doing just what you are describing. I was able to scoop my frigate I was in as well and I made off with a ship and the targeting thing didnt work It still let me board the ship. Too bad for him good for me.
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente Federal Defense Operations
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Posted - 2009.10.05 16:45:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Sulg Just thought I would throw this up to make the point that if you are in fact going to attempt something like this, be careful. :)
Noobminer was a noob. The Hulk was WAY too far away from the Orca, and most likely was actually beyond targeting distance... if he'd thought to target to begin with.
The point of this trick, is to park the Hulk directly on top of the Orca. Then there is no delay between "Oh ****" and reboarding.
Originally by: Natalie Mia I aquired a brand new Orca the other day from some one doing just what you are describing. I was able to scoop my frigate I was in as well and I made off with a ship and the targeting thing didnt work It still let me board the ship. Too bad for him good for me.
Since this seems to be such a large debate... I will go home tonight and test it again, just to make sure.
Unless they have altered the wardec mechanic to prevent this, then it will still work.
Currently, you can not board a targeted ship, because it would change the ownership. And a ship targeted, and receiving fire... which now belongs to a neutral party, will result in Concordoken.
I'd wager Ms Natalie's opponent was not locked onto their Orca. And her own target lock against the Orca would have dropped immediately when she started to board. |
HarukoYsera
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Posted - 2009.10.05 18:08:00 -
[29]
Edited by: HarukoYsera on 05/10/2009 18:13:28 Sounds pretty awesome actually.
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McFly
C0LDFIRE
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Posted - 2009.10.06 01:16:00 -
[30]
Poasting to confirm the third orca I've stolen from people trying this, suicide blackbird alt is all that it takes.
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