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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.04 11:31:00 -
[1]
Rare isolated incidents of ROE violation occur in every alliance. I can show you examples of ROE violations from virtually every single alliance in Providence, however, us more professional NRDS alliances take action swiftly when such an incident occurs.
Personal opinion, not necessarily the opinion of Ushra'Khan: If a pilot or organization isn't willing to negotiate standings, I will not shoot them outside of a free fire zone, but if they aren't willing to help us end slavery, then I feel that they have no business in our space.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.04 11:53:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Rodj Blake
Originally by: Kazzzi
if they aren't willing to help us end slavery, then I feel that they have no business in our space.
Does "helping you to end slavery" include the adoption of negative standings towards pro-slavery groups?
It would simply include having the intestinal fortitude to take a stand and show some form of dedication to the cause. Nothing more, nothing less. I personally would welcome refugee aid station volunteers just as much as black ops combat pilots. I have never seen U'K dictate the ROE of allies.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.05 02:21:00 -
[3]
*Kazzzi looks at a map
Why does everyone insist upon basically comparing U'K to the Providence block? We are 1/10 the size of Provi, if that. We are fighting a war against far superior numbers and live close to the front lines. Truly neutral parties don't have easy access to where our space is located deep in Catch, we don't have hisec entrances available to them. Only an idiot or a Modern Marvel propaganda bot would expect us to treat our space any differently than our current ROE dictates.
We just broke ground on our new space, northern Catch is still in enemy hands and there is a war ongoing. To claim our space is safe for outsiders would be premature. Once the Imperial sympathizers are defeated, slavery ended and the region is secure then maybe we can start to think about the neutrals.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.05 12:02:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Kazzzi on 05/11/2009 12:05:20
Originally by: Merdaneth
Your space is not safe for outsiders because you shoot at them. That has nothing to do with the Providence block. Basically, Ushra Khan has an NBSI policy in all the territories they frequent. Who really cares that Ushra Khan uses NRDS in the Drone Region or Delve? What people care most about is what policy an alliance uses in their own space and the space the visit frequently.
You really don't know what you are talking about. When we lived in the Curse region, we maintained NRDS in Curse. This made it difficult to operate due to the extreme hostile nature of the area, but we followed our ROE and focused our attention on slaver infested Catch and Providence.
Our ROE is well publicized and easy to understand. Feel free to interpret it however you wish in order to invent arguments to slander us, but we've already heard it all before. You may call us pirates or terrorists, but it doesn't change the fact that we come for our people.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.06 11:26:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Nur AlHuda
So in conclusion...
UK is NRDS in their space (but their allies are allowed to go NBSI in UK territory) and they are NRDS in empire.
Which makes the policy not red dont shoot a total joke. Its somethink in the line we will not stab you to the death but we will watch how someone will do it for us.
*Kazzzi chuckles as all the Imperialists keep trying to shove square pegs into round holes.
No, we're NBSI in our own space for the reasons which have already been elaborated upon several dozen times in many threads. I'm sorry if we're breaking the Providence paradigm which you have been brainwashed with.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.06 20:41:00 -
[6]
The two regions which are the exception, hmmm, I wonder why those would be the exception and I wonder why we would focus a bit of our time there? Maybe the reason has something to do with our sworn enemies living there? Of course most Provi sympathizers believe the universe revolves around Provi and therefore can't stand having their precious space regarded as some sort of "exception".
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.06 21:10:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Jakiin
Yes, we would. It would be very, very difficult. That's assuming of course that you spent about 1/65th of your time in each region, giving an even distribution. As it is you spend 80-90% or more of your time within, so we're arguing percentage rather than regions. Arguing regions would just be ignoring the facts.
The argument is that you are NRDS 10-20% of the time, and NBSI 80-90% of the time.
Why would we spend 1/65th of our time in every region? Why would that matter? We operate in Catch/Provi because the slavers live there. We are NBSI in Catch/Provi because the slavers live there. We fight for a purpose and don't simply rampage all across New Eden killing everyone we see just for sadistic pleasure.
((This thread has become nothing more than metagame bickering and should be locked))
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.06 21:43:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Jakiin
You're off the topic, I wasn't saying you should spend an equal amount of time all over New Eden. I'm simply saying that if you're NBSI in the regions you spend 80-90% of your time in, you have more of an NBSI policy than an NRDS policy.
No, I'm not off topic, I'm just not saying what you want to hear.
Slaver Sympathizers > You can't be NRDS in one place and NBSI in another
U'K > Yes we can
Slaver Sympathizers > Well, we don't agree
U'K > Dont care
Slaver Sympathizers > You need to admit you practice NBSI
U'K > We do admit it, NBSI in catch and provi, NRDS everywhere else
Slaver Sympathizers > Well, we don't like that
U'K > Dont care
Slaver Sympathizers > Thats not real NRDS
U'K > Yes it is
Slaver Sympathizers > No it isn't
U'K > Yes it is
Slaver Sympathizers > No it isn't
U'K > Says who?
Slaver Sympathizers > We do
U'K > Don't care what you say
Slaver Sympathizers > You're more NBSI than NRDS
U'K > Semantics and opinion, get over it
We done yet? Can we all get back to our pods now and do the slaver/freedom fighter thing?
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.06 23:20:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Kazzzi on 06/11/2009 23:20:37
Originally by: Jakiin
But your home space and the space you spend almost all of your time in you've declared NBSI.
Now, as a general rule, at any point in time any particular U'K member is probably going to be within the 'free fire zones'. So as a general rule, these pilots are operating under an NBSI policy. If we're looking at a time-based definition of policy, then the time spent outside of free fire zones could be seen as the actual exception. But that is, of course, silly.
*Kazzzi looks at his map again, notes the 2 small dots labeled NBSI. Kazzzi then checks his corp roster to see where everyone is.
Jakiin, you really don't know what you're talking about. We conduct business all over high and low security space and in several regions of nullsec. Plus I didn't know NRDS freespace ideals were based more on time of activity and less on area of coverage.
Personally, I feel our NBSI stance is more in line with the fact that any neutrals in the areas of Catch and Provi are by default red since they are supporting the slaver regime by paying taxes and docking fees to slavers. Therefore by this logic we're not actually NBSI at all since the neutrals are technically red for their support of the slaver regime. This has been elaborated before several times.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.07 00:42:00 -
[10]
Guys let's be patient with Jakiin here. He is after all just a freshman Hedion University student.
Originally by: Jakiin
Unfortunately, I seem to lack a database of where U'K membership is, which while good for a guerrilla group, does mean that I'm largely going to have to go off what I hear. And from what I hear you're pretty dedicated to your goal, which lies within the free-fire zones.
Exactly. You don't have enough information in the first place to make your claims. There is no scale to measure how NBSIy/NRDSy somebody is. You don't have a database and you don't know any specifics of how much time we spend conducting what you consider NBSI against the "neutrals" who I consider red. We can call it NBSI if you want, it doesn't really matter. For the sake of a simple explanation we openly admit that we conduct NBSI in Catch and Provi, but the meaning of our ROE is a bit more in depth which you cannot argue, and is one reason why I feel we aren't anywhere near being a true NBSI alliance.
Final point. In my opinion our ROE isn't really an ideal for our enemies to debate and approve of. It is a diplomatic policy of engagement for US to follow. I feel that we make it known public simply as a courtesy.
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.07 01:16:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Jakiin
Originally by: Kazzzi
Guys let's be patient with Jakiin here. He is after all just a freshman Hedion University student.
CONCORD technical issue, I've never spent a day in Hedion, I was taught in a Kingdom planet side university and received my pod training etc. with a Kingdom program. I appreciate the condescension, though, makes you look mature and knowledgeable.
Wasn't being condescending, I was defending you. Sometimes neocoms have a hard time expressing context.
Originally by: Jakiin
I simply would appreciate if you'd stop claiming to be NRDS.
We're not debating your ROE. You can have whatever ROE you want, we're not going to tell you how to run your show. At least, not those of us with common sense. We're debating whether or not your ROE make you NBSI or NRDS. Be careful not to confuse the two.
Ok, so you don't want us to believe our own ROE which states that we are NRDS with the exception of designated free-fire zones?
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.07 07:36:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Jakiin
Originally by: Kazzzi
Wasn't being condescending, I was defending you. Sometimes neocoms have a hard time expressing context.
I do not wish to be defended, particularly not in such a fashion.
Too bad.
Originally by: Jakiin
I don't even cross missiles with U'K
You don't cross missiles with anyone it seems. You have the ability to fly a capsuleer vessel yet feel no responsibility to serve. Many in your kingdom call this cowardice.
Originally by: Jakiin
Post of impotent desperation because I can't win an unwinnable argument
It's a shame, I'm sure your professors of the correspondence courses you take from Hedion University were hoping you were actually trying to discern some actual truth. I'm sure you wont mind their disappointment and failing grade they give you now since you obviously have no intention of graduating. At any rate, thank you for clarifying that you should not be taken seriously. You will now be ignored.
Fly Free
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Kazzzi
Amarr
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2009.11.07 07:59:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Merdaneth
Traitor Kazzzi: NRDS as opposed to NBSI in high-sec? How benevolent! I'd love to see an alliance who uses an NBSI policy in high security space.
I take it you haven't been to Niarja in awhile.
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