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I spit on my Panther

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Trappist Monk Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 17	Posted - 2012.06.15 20:20:00 - [31] - Quote Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: I re-considered my toughts and now believe that to balance Black Ops to the almighty Covert Ops Titans they should be able to warp cloaked too. Also, I will stop playing EvE and try this new WoW thing. we're all happy to hear you're leaving.
Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 6	Posted - 2012.06.15 20:33:00 - [32] - Quote Trappist Monk wrote: Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: I re-considered my toughts and now believe that to balance Black Ops to the almighty Covert Ops Titans they should be able to warp cloaked too. Also, I will stop playing EvE and try this new WoW thing. we're all happy to hear you're leaving. And I am sad for your sarcasm recognition skills.
Shade Millith The Maverick Navy Against ALL Authorities 39	Posted - 2012.06.15 23:02:00 - [33] - Quote Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: Cutout Man wrote: Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: Cov Ops Cloaking Device in a battleship sized hull is weird, overpowered and just plain dumb. Overpowered? Did you know that titans can fit covops cloaks? Please explain to me how a BO with cov ops so that it can warp cloaked is more overpowered than a titan with a covops. That one is new to me. Now develop your argument. From what I've heard, some titans, with CPU rigs and implants, get enough CPU to stick a DD, Covertops Cloak, and a little tank on.
Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 6	Posted - 2012.06.15 23:51:00 - [34] - Quote That's a troll argument. We're discussing ship classes. Even if that was possible it would be an aberration amongst Titan fits. Since it does not have any bonus all the ship CPU would go to the cov ops module. I doubt its possible to fit any tank with that. And it's a game breaker. Not to mention it's weird. Think of cov ops cloak on anything bigger than a cruiser as trying to camouflage an elephant while it walks down the highway.
Shade Millith The Maverick Navy Against ALL Authorities 39	Posted - 2012.06.16 00:07:00 - [35] - Quote Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: That's a troll argument. We're discussing ship classes. Even if that was possible it would be an aberration amongst Titan fits. Since it does not have any bonus all the ship CPU would go to the cov ops module. I doubt its possible to fit any tank with that. And it's a game breaker. Not to mention it's weird. Think of cov ops cloak on anything bigger than a cruiser as trying to camouflage an elephant while it walks down the highway. Wasn't saying it was a GOOD argument, just clarifying what he's talking about. It's a new thing that's probably going to be patched out.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 8011	Posted - 2012.06.16 00:53:00 - [36] - Quote Why does it need a covops cloak? What need do you have that is enabled by giving it one? GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
Ignatious Mei Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 1	Posted - 2012.06.16 03:44:00 - [37] - Quote Fronkfurter McSheebleton wrote: It's useless because it doesn't have a covops cloak? Nevermind the fact that it can jump itself and a small fleet into a system nearly invisibly, and move as fast as a battlecruiser while cloaked... As long as no one is looking at local...
Aaron Greil None Of You Can Compare 3	Posted - 2012.06.16 06:27:00 - [38] - Quote I am hearing a lot about theoretical speeds with the cloak and a micro. Something about 4 km/s? I call bull. The cycle time on 100mn micros and the inertia of the blackops prevent you from ever getting close to your max speed while cloaked, even if you started at overloaded micro speed. On top of that, you can't cloaked while targeted. In a fight you would never get your cloaked speed bonus. You can't run the cloak and a prop mod, so they don't move anywhere close to battlecruisers. Sounds more like people eft warrioring who haven't ever flown the things. Also those "two neuts" are for your cloak and jump portal generator. Even with a panther, you still have only one utility high. I see a lot of fail speculation. I'm guessing that these "stats" come from a panther, but on a proper double plated redeemer, or armor sin, you aren't dealing with battlecruiser agility. Some other things: Cyno 5 is a 20 day skill train. Thats a long time to ask a corp mate to sacrifice for you if you don't have an alt. An the whole "who plays on that level without an alt" crap is the point of why I say its greedy. You are paying for two accounts if you want to do upper level stuff in eve. Covert Cynos are restricted to the most paper ship classes in the game. You cannot effectively hotdrop with covert cynos without losing your scout. With regular cynos its not a problem. Tech 1 frigs are easy to replace. Try doing it with covert ops frigs or a force recons. You can't jump if you are disrupted, or have less than 75% cap. Neither of these circumstances exist in real pvp. Now about covert ops cloaks: The only real argument against them is "they're overpowered." This is pure speculation. Lets look at covert ops ships in their traditional use. What makes force recons powerful? Its not the covert ops cloak, its the EWAR capabilities. How about a bomber? Even without a covert ops cloak, a bomber is a formidable opponent if flown by a skilled pilot. So what, precisely, is the combat function of a covert ops cloak? Once targeted, a ship can't cloak regardless, so once the fight is started, the cloak is useless. Its functionality above a regular cloak lies solely with movement. Specifically, escaping gate camps or hunting targets. Now because of the jump drive, escaping gate camps is irrelevant. This only leaves the target hunting aspect left. This pretty much boils the covert ops cloak functionality down to target selection. The covert ops cloak would only add the ability to sneak up on unsuspecting opponents. Blackops are not battlecruisers, despite what others have said. Once uncloaked, the fight is committed. Blackops will be (and are) outmaneuvered by smaller ship classes, unlike other cloaky ships. The only true benefit of the covert ops cloak on blackops is being able to sneak onto the battlefield. In their current state, as soon as the blackops enters warp, any stealth tactics are out the window, and bridged gang-mates are given away as well. Of course I recognize that there are viable blackops strategies currently, I use them. But they don't have the necessary tools to perform their role adequately.
Shade Millith Fortis Defensor. 40	Posted - 2012.06.16 11:15:00 - [39] - Quote Aaron Greil wrote: I am hearing a lot about theoretical speeds with the cloak and a micro. Something about 4 km/s? I call bull. The cycle time on 100mn micros and the inertia of the blackops prevent you from ever getting close to your max speed while cloaked, even if you started at overloaded micro speed. On top of that, you can't cloaked while targeted. In a fight you would never get your cloaked speed bonus. You can't run the cloak and a prop mod, so they don't move anywhere close to battlecruisers. Uncloaked Panther - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,543 m/s, 9 second align. 2,180 m/s Overloaded Hurricane - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,552 m/s, 8.8 second align. 2,205 m/s Overloaded Harbinger - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,346 m/s, 9.3 second align. 1,908 m/s Overloaded Difference - Cane is 9 m/s faster, and .2 seconds faster align. Harb is 197 m/s slower, and .3 seconds slower align Quote: Sounds more like people eft warrioring who haven't ever flown the things. Also those "two neuts" are for your cloak and jump portal generator. Because you'd use a jump portal generator if you're not intending to portal people. That's the best way to fly a ship. The ship has 8 high slots. 5 turrets, 1 cloak, 2 neuts. Quote: I'm guessing that these "stats" come from a panther, but on a proper double plated redeemer, or armor sin, you aren't dealing with battlecruiser agility. That's why I'm talking about a Panther, not a Redeemer. A Sin is actually freaking agile. Quote: Some other things: Cyno 5 is a 20 day skill train. Thats a long time to ask a corp mate to sacrifice for you if you don't have an alt. An the whole "who plays on that level without an alt" crap is the point of why I say its greedy. You are paying for two accounts if you want to do upper level stuff in eve. Really? You've only just realized this? It's the same damn thing if you have ANY capital outside of a corp. Maybe those ships are greedy too... And as for training time? You've just trained BS V to get the ship. Quote: Covert Cynos are restricted to the most paper ship classes in the game. You cannot effectively hotdrop with covert cynos without losing your scout. With regular cynos its not a problem. Tech 1 frigs are easy to replace. Try doing it with covert ops frigs or a force recons. Many times I've seen rapiers/falcons being the cyno's for capital hotdrops. Reason being, they're not paper thin. You can get over 63k EHP on a falcon, still having a MWD and point. 57k on a rapier.
Darek Castigatus Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel 91	Posted - 2012.06.16 14:18:00 - [40] - Quote Shade Millith wrote: Aaron Greil wrote: I am hearing a lot about theoretical speeds with the cloak and a micro. Something about 4 km/s? I call bull. The cycle time on 100mn micros and the inertia of the blackops prevent you from ever getting close to your max speed while cloaked, even if you started at overloaded micro speed. On top of that, you can't cloaked while targeted. In a fight you would never get your cloaked speed bonus. You can't run the cloak and a prop mod, so they don't move anywhere close to battlecruisers. Uncloaked Panther - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,543 m/s, 9 second align. 2,180 m/s Overloaded Hurricane - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,552 m/s, 8.8 second align. 2,205 m/s Overloaded Harbinger - 2 Nanofibers, MWD 1,346 m/s, 9.3 second align. 1,908 m/s Overloaded Difference - Cane is 9 m/s faster, and .2 seconds faster align. Harb is 197 m/s slower, and .3 seconds slower align Quote: Sounds more like people eft warrioring who haven't ever flown the things. Also those "two neuts" are for your cloak and jump portal generator. Because you'd use a jump portal generator if you're not intending to portal people. That's the best way to fly a ship. The ship has 8 high slots. 5 turrets, 1 cloak, 2 neuts. Quote: I'm guessing that these "stats" come from a panther, but on a proper double plated redeemer, or armor sin, you aren't dealing with battlecruiser agility. That's why I'm talking about a Panther, not a Redeemer. A Sin is actually freaking agile. Quote: Covert Cynos are restricted to the most paper ship classes in the game. You cannot effectively hotdrop with covert cynos without losing your scout. With regular cynos its not a problem. Tech 1 frigs are easy to replace. Try doing it with covert ops frigs or a force recons. Many times I've seen rapiers/falcons being the cyno's for capital hotdrops. Reason being, they're not paper thin. You can get over 63k EHP on a falcon, still having a MWD and point. 57k on a rapier. Just as an aside one use we found for the sin was as a remote repper, similar kind of fit to the RR dominix. As long as you use an armour tanked cyno boat, Rapier is the obvious one here but ive seen Falcons and Arazu used too, its pretty damn good at keeping the cyno alive. Provides some useful RR to an armour fit recon gang too.

Red Teufel Blackened Skies THE UNTHINKABLES 55	Posted - 2012.06.16 22:45:00 - [41] - Quote Black Ops read the fine print.... " may require intelligence to use "
Euripedies nul-li-fy RED.OverLord 2	Posted - 2012.06.16 23:13:00 - [42] - Quote Quote: Black Ops battleships are designed for infiltration and espionage behind enemy lines. With the use of a short-range jump drive and a portal generator, they are capable of making a special type of jump portal usable only by covert ops vessels. This enables them to stealthily plant reconnaissance and espionage forces in enemy territory. For the final word in clandestine maneuvers, look no further.
Euripedies nul-li-fy RED.OverLord 2	Posted - 2012.06.16 23:14:00 - [43] - Quote For the final word in clandestine maneuvers, look no further. HA!
Hemmo Paskiainen Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities 331	Posted - 2012.06.17 00:03:00 - [44] - Quote it works exellent as a smartbombing bubble camper... just put some stabs, cap rech mods, ecm burst and 7 large faction smartbombs on and your good to go... you can kill most small stuff upto destroyers. Assault frigs are not duable. Lots of fun and the best part is that you dont even have to decloak those pesky cov ips to kill them CCP FIX BLACK OPS FFS
Hatsumi Kobayashi Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 82	Posted - 2012.06.17 18:32:00 - [45] - Quote If you think the Panther is terrible you should learn to use it. CAUTION SNIGGS
Viecat Badger Badger Badger 0	Posted - 2012.06.17 18:55:00 - [46] - Quote Welp, reconsidering training for the Widow.
Alexa Coates The Scope Gallente Federation 142	Posted - 2012.06.17 19:49:00 - [47] - Quote WHAAA MY INCREDIBLY VALUABLE SHIP DOESN'T DO EVERYTHING EVER EVEN THOUGH ITS ROLE IS SPECIFICALLY POINTED OUT IN THE SHIP DESCRIPTION WHAAAAAAAAAA Love my Gallente Federation Navy ships!
Euripedies nul-li-fy RED.OverLord 3	Posted - 2012.06.17 20:17:00 - [48] - Quote Alexa Coates wrote: WHAAA MY INCREDIBLY VALUABLE SHIP DOESN'T DO EVERYTHING EVER EVEN THOUGH ITS ROLE IS SPECIFICALLY POINTED OUT IN THE SHIP DESCRIPTION WHAAAAAAAAAA sums it nicely
TomyLobo Posthuman Society Elysian Empire 18	Posted - 2012.06.17 22:52:00 - [49] - Quote I think it needs an extra turret hardpoint.
Sean McIlhenny University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2012.06.18 15:52:00 - [50] - Quote Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: Trappist Monk wrote: Opodiphthera Eucalypti Lepdoptera wrote: I re-considered my toughts and now believe that to balance Black Ops to the almighty Covert Ops Titans they should be able to warp cloaked too. Also, I will stop playing EvE and try this new WoW thing. we're all happy to hear you're leaving. And I am sad about your sarcasm recognition skills. a trait the two of you share

Sean McIlhenny University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2012.06.18 15:54:00 - [51] - Quote Shade Millith wrote: Quote: Covert Cynos are restricted to the most paper ship classes in the game. You cannot effectively hotdrop with covert cynos without losing your scout. With regular cynos its not a problem. Tech 1 frigs are easy to replace. Try doing it with covert ops frigs or a force recons. Many times I've seen rapiers/falcons being the cyno's for capital hotdrops. Reason being, they're not paper thin. You can get over 63k EHP on a falcon, still having a MWD and point. 57k on a rapier. Titans are not paper thin. Not even a little bit.
Tandin The Collective Northern Associates. 7	Posted - 2012.06.18 21:16:00 - [52] - Quote This entire topic amuses me.. many moons ago the black ops sucked worse than they do now before they boosted the cov cloaky ships and gave BO's fuel bays.. that was back before the stealth bombers had cov cloaks. If you know how to use a black ops, they're very very dangerous. The key is knowing your ship and its abilities.
Lin-Young Borovskova Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 253	Posted - 2012.06.19 05:13:00 - [53] - Quote Tandin wrote: This entire topic amuses me.. many moons ago the black ops sucked worse than they do now before they boosted the cov cloaky ships and gave BO's fuel bays.. that was back before the stealth bombers had cov cloaks. If you know how to use a black ops, they're very very dangerous. The key is knowing your ship and its abilities. Confirming there's nothing more dangerous than that random dude/s you engage and suddenly get hotdrop by a swarm of those...thing is that you never know unless known cyno beatches of course. But it's a fair game, they can be countered by counter hotdrop that delivers tasty km's and tears brb
Seishi Maru doMAL S.A. 23	Posted - 2012.06.19 12:50:00 - [54] - Quote Give us Local chat with 2 minutes delay and suddenly Black ops usability issues vanish.
Renier Gaden Exanimo Inc Hedonistic Imperative 8	Posted - 2012.06.19 14:21:00 - [55] - Quote How about letting Black Ops ships equip Covert Ops cloaks, but change the Covert Ops cloaks so that any warship over cruiser size gives off too strong a signature to fully mask while in warp, so that ships withing 100 km can detect them. Thus to approach a hostile fleet without blowing your cover you would need to warp to another fleet member (presumably in a Covert Ops ship) or to a bookmark so you land over 100 km away. Then manoeuver in at normal speed to get into position. This would allow Black Ops ships to get into position without blowing their cover, but require some time and effort for them to do so. Would that be too OP? I donGÇÖt fly Black Ops, so I am not sure. I sort of see them as being like the U-Boats in WWII.
ovenproofjet The Illuminatii Mildly Intoxicated 51	Posted - 2012.06.19 15:02:00 - [56] - Quote Confirming I have at least 3 separate uses for my Redeemer.
Soldarius TreadStone Standard The 99 Percent 246	Posted - 2012.06.20 04:00:00 - [57] - Quote Who needs tank when you've got ECM and full-speed align while cloaked? Widow is pretty decent if you know how to use it. Just the other day I helped some bros bypass an RA gate camp and ninja their recently cleansed neo moon. "How do you kill that which has no life?"


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