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Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:12:00 - [1] Thought about this long and hard and based on experience it has to be: The Drake Now let me tell you why: 1. it is cheap. 2. It can put out alot of dps with HAM II's, 3. It has a beast of a tank. 4. That tank can be a tuff nut to crack. 5. it has room for tackle. 6. It can be semi mobile. Everytime I come across these things I cringe. I can't solo it with my curse but it can't kill me either. This is definetly the best solo ship ingame and can handle multiple situationss more effectivley then what is currently out in the game today. Thoughts?
Marko Riva Adamant Inc.	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:20:00 - [2] People who know what they're talking about have said this many times, people who just yap a lot and go "caldari=crap + missiles=crap thus drake is lalal carebearboat fail to understand this. ----------- I think, therefore I'm single. Alliance creation service, also corp updates
5pinDizzy Amarr State Protectorate	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:34:00 - [3] I have to agree, it is very boring ship to keep flying but it is a ridiculously solid and diverse platform for someone with an imagination.
Brent riper Caldari Night Wolves Deprived of Existence by Mercenaries of the Night	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:37:00 - [4] i agree, most people will limit the drakes abilities by doing a full passive recharge which works for pve or being a juicy target, but i have seen multiple buffer and active drakes that can face roll multiple types and variants of ships with full capabilities to fight multiple different instances the drake has my vote, the 2nd best or also first id have to say would be the ishtar (drones ftw)it doesn't even need hi slots to pwn. AND further more, Carthage must be destroyed!!
King Rothgar Death of Virtue MeatSausage EXPRESS	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:38:00 - [5] That can be said for pretty much any tier 2 BC. All of them are very capable pvp boats in the right hands. -----------------------------------------------------
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:39:00 - [6] none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility.
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:53:00 - [7] While the Drake may be a capable boat I wouldn't dare try to say its one of the best solo pvp ships. It has 0 ability to selectively engage. --
Kazang Gallente Wrecking Shots	Posted - 2009.11.17 15:55:00 - [8] Drake is overpowered. Buff the myrmidon! I don't think its the best solo ship as its a bit slow and fat to run gate camps etc, but it is one of the best ships in the game without a doubt. Possibly the best the t1 solo ship. Kazang
Brent riper Caldari Night Wolves Deprived of Existence by Mercenaries of the Night	Posted - 2009.11.17 16:02:00 - [9] drake: out of versatility the platform is highly efficient at multi tasking, that said the myrm hurricane and harby are also very power full and can be configured to many different tasks aswell but the drake does it with ease. but it is not so much as being superior to the other BC's they all do or can do the same DPS or more and tank roughly the same jst in different ways. it doesn't have the downfall's that guns do such as tracking and range. it will always hit. might not be for much but it will hit, unless ur ofc 100+km away and then thats a completely different ball game. AND further more, Carthage must be destroyed!!
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.17 16:25:00 - [10] Edited by: Neuronai on 17/11/2009 16:26:31 Originally by: Torothin Edited by: Torothin on 17/11/2009 15:20:02 Thought about this long and hard and based on experience it has to be: The Drake Now let me tell you why: 1. it is cheap. 2. It can put out alot of dps with HAM II's, 3. It has a beast of a tank. 4. That tank can be a tuff nut to crack. 5. it has room for tackle. 6. It can be semi mobile. 7. It can down almost any other t2 cruiser ingame with ease. Everytime I come across these things I cringe. I can't solo it with my curse but it can't kill me either. This is definetly the best solo ship ingame and can handle multiple situationss more effectivley then what is currently out in the game today. Thoughts? The Drake is in my opinion the easiest ship to solo PvP with. You don't have to manage a tank, you don't have to manage your cap. Its DPS with HAMS is very nice, and the EHP too is nice. That said, I prefer the Myrmidon. Why? 1. It too is cheap. 2. 75mb of drones and 6 turret slots. Nuff said about DPS. 3. Triple rep Myrm overloaded and Exile boosted is a mother **ing beast tank. Capable of tanking many ships at once until it runs out of cap boosters (which takes a considerably long time in an average solo/small gang engagement) 4. Myrm not only has room for tackle, but also for Ewar if you go double rep. 5. If there's a T2 cruiser in scram range, the Myrm will kill it. The only HAC i've had trouble with at said range is a dual rep Sac. 6. You jammed? No matter, drones are still DPSing. 7. Neuted? Room for a cap booster or 2. The obvious major downside to the Myrm is that it can be slow when rigged. If you get kited, you're pretty much **ed. Applying DPS past scram range is trouble for the Myrm...It's a bit of a gamble in that way. Get your target scrammed and webbed, you will do well. If not, you will not do so well. But, each to their own I guess.
Anubis Xian Reavers	Posted - 2009.11.17 16:59:00 - [11] Vagabond Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:04:00 - [12] Vaga is limited these days. Ask yourself if a Vaga can kill a curse 1 on 1 and live. Then ask if a drake can kill a curse.
sukmanobov Minmatar Interstellar Brotherhood of Gravediggers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Torothin 7. It can down almost any other t2 cruiser ingame with ease. It can't touch my vaga as i can speed tank thoes missiles, HAM drake can;t reach my muninn. But as far as BC's go it is one of the best tank/gank boats. I have a Hard time taking on a drake in a cane (have know im gonna fight one to fit a drake buster). --------------------------------
Allahs Warrior Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:19:00 - [14] wait, are drakes catching anything solo? Since they're so slow dont they have to get in scram range? Also best solo boat is erebus just fyi But wait, how can you take a drake over a domi?
demonfurbie Minmatar Covert-Nexus	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:21:00 - [15] curse
TimMc Gallente Brutal Deliverance Extreme Prejudice.	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:44:00 - [16] Originally by: demonfurbie curse [Curse, **** off local] Damage Control II 1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Warp Disruptor II Stasis Webifier II ECCM - Radar II ECCM - Radar II ECCM - Radar II Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I Small Energy Neutralizer II Small Nosferatu II Small Nosferatu II Trimark Armor Pump I Trimark Armor Pump I Hammerhead II x5
Brent riper Caldari Night Wolves Deprived of Existence by Mercenaries of the Night	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:51:00 - [17] ROOK: simply untouchable :P AND further more, Carthage must be destroyed!!
Walker Bulldog Minmatar VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:54:00 - [18] Originally by: TimMc ECCM - Radar II ECCM - Radar II ECCM - Radar II I see what you did there...
tomokazu	Posted - 2009.11.17 17:58:00 - [19] I saw this thread and smiled. I've pretty much flown the Drake since I started playing this game and I remmember all the comments about how much it sucked at PVP. I've used it for everything, missions, ratting and pew pew palooza. For a PVP pilot living in 0.0, it's the best all-rounder in the game IMO.
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2009.11.17 18:14:00 - [20] Originally by: tomokazu I saw this thread and smiled. I've pretty much flown the Drake since I started playing this game and I remmember all the comments about how much it sucked at PVP. I've used it for everything, missions, ratting and pew pew palooza. For a PVP pilot living in 0.0, it's the best all-rounder in the game IMO. Because it did until nano nerf. --
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.11.17 18:14:00 - [21] A big part of the "best" tag is the ease of getting fights when flying it - which is possibly the greatest flaw of the Curse and Rook. Scan has an annoying tendency of emptying around you as other people look for targets they think that can actually kill...
Psiri	Posted - 2009.11.17 18:20:00 - [22] Problem with the Drake for solo is that it's relatively slow an not very agile. Missiles are not without their downsides either.
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2009.11.17 18:29:00 - [23] Originally by: Psiri Problem with the Drake for solo is that it's relatively slow an not very agile. Missiles are not without their downsides either. Thankfully it is a "lol-Drake" and everyone dives right into scramble/web range. Speed is irrelevant when the opponents come to you Whether it is the best solo ship is debatable. I personally prefer the Hurricane as turrets simply have more utility in combat and tank is about the same.
kessah Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.11.17 19:36:00 - [24] Dominix. Cheap and with MWD + Cloak can be quite mobile. Play defensive pvp with it though.
Footoo Rama Gallente Caldari Illuminati	Posted - 2009.11.17 19:49:00 - [25] Originally by: kessah Dominix. Cheap and with MWD + Cloak can be quite mobile. Play defensive pvp with it though. Or fit for drone or sentry, or blasters, or sniping... or nuet... ------- "Because the Dominix is the Chuck Norris of Eve!"
Xandi Crews	Posted - 2009.11.17 19:53:00 - [26] Originally by: Torothin Vaga is limited these days. Ask yourself if a Vaga can kill a curse 1 on 1 and live. Then ask if a drake can kill a curse. A drake can't kill a curse any more than a vaga can kill a curse. It should be self-evident as to why.
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.17 19:57:00 - [27] but if a Vaga engages a curse it dies. Same can't be said for a drake
Rhak Amharr Minmatar Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2009.11.17 20:02:00 - [28] Originally by: Torothin but if a Vaga engages a curse it dies. Same can't be said for a drake That wasn't your question though.
Mordred McKenna Silver Snake Enterprise	Posted - 2009.11.17 20:16:00 - [29] Maelstrom is probably the best solo pvp battleship in game. The shield boost bonus is great, coupled with the 750 odd dps+ it can push (before overloading) and the range it can get with Barrage, it's a great BS to play with. Crystal set + blue pill only makes it an even better tank, and a faction or deadspace x-l booster will knock you out. The other two battleships suck though, typhoon requires too much of a skill investment for a tier 1 bs and tempest is. tempest
Rose Artemis	Posted - 2009.11.17 20:16:00 - [30] Originally by: sukmanobov Originally by: Torothin It can't touch my vaga as i can speed tank thoes missiles, HAM drake can;t reach my muninn. LOL cant speed tank when you get scrammed and web. yes there are 2 drakes, but the second didn't change the outcome/was there to fend off any friends who may have been around
Xachin	Posted - 2009.11.17 21:14:00 - [31] Ahh, the mythical versatile HAM drake. Did you bother to fit a full rack of HAM II on a drake? Let me relieve you of the bother you cant fit a full rack with typical pvp mods (MWD,cap booster,web,scram). Even with all level V. How many of us have all lvl V anyway. So, according to your post (boast), "1. it is cheap. 2. It can put out alot of dps with HAM II's, 3. It has a beast of a tank. 4. That tank can be a tuff nut to crack. 5. it has room for tackle. 6. It can be semi mobile. 7. It can down almost any other t2 cruiser ingame with ease." When one of the above is true all others tend to be false. ie : if you tank you dont have room for tackle, if you fit HAM II you dont have the grid for tank, if you try to be mobile you cant fit triple bcu so you dont have alot of dps. If you want to accomplish more than one its not cheap anymore. Thats the extent of drake's versatility in my opinion.
Anubis Xian Reavers	Posted - 2009.11.17 21:23:00 - [32] The Vaga still rates higher than the Drake for the most important thing any solo pilot has to keep in mind: The ability to leave a fight that took a turn for the worse aka survival. If a Drake gets in over its head, its bye bye HMS Drake. If the Vaga gets in over its head, it can cut and run, resetting the engagement. This thread isn't about how many targets you can match against up solo, it is about what the best solo ship is. In strict terms, the Drake is a poor solo ship, it doesn't have the speed to control the engagement. Will solo Drakes score a lot of kills? Certainly. Does that make them the best? No. Can a Drake solo fly in enemy infested 0.0 space? Lol. Can a Vagabond? More often than not. Nobody is disputing the Drake as a strong ship, but is it the best solo pvp ship? Definitely not. Originally by: CCP Oveur The client handles no logic, it is simply a dumb terminal.
Psiri	Posted - 2009.11.17 21:43:00 - [33] Originally by: Mordred McKenna Maelstrom is probably the best solo pvp battleship in game. The shield boost bonus is great, coupled with the 750 odd dps+ it can push (before overloading) and the range it can get with Barrage, it's a great BS to play with. Crystal set + blue pill only makes it an even better tank, and a faction or deadspace x-l booster will knock you out. The other two battleships suck though, typhoon requires too much of a skill investment for a tier 1 bs and tempest is. tempest The Typhoon doesn't suck because it's skillpoint intensive, it sucks that it's skillpoint intensive. Fortunately however that'll probably change a little with the proposed Dominion changes. I'd rate both the Dominix and Armageddon to be better soloships than the Meal though. The Mealstorm is cool but it's slow, is lacking in the gank-department and has the price related to a tier 3 BS.
Rose Artemis	Posted - 2009.11.17 22:20:00 - [34] Originally by: Xachin Ahh, the mythical versatile HAM drake. [Drake, Hams pvp] Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Power Diagnostic System II Damage Control II Warp Disruptor II 10MN MicroWarpdrive I Large Shield Extender II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Stasis Webifier II Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Terror Assault Missile [empty high slot] Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Warrior II x5 it fits. you just need proper skills. cap booster? nope. I have been neuted a couple times on a gate and have been able to escape in structure without any cap. would a cap booster help? nope. BECAUSE OF FALCON! (and kitsune)
Meeko Atari	Posted - 2009.11.17 22:55:00 - [35] Originally by: Xachin Ahh, the mythical versatile HAM drake. Did you bother to fit a full rack of HAM II on a drake? Let me relieve you of the bother you cant fit a full rack with typical pvp mods (MWD,cap booster,web,scram). Even with all level V. How many of us have all lvl V anyway. So, according to your post (boast), "1. it is cheap. 2. It can put out alot of dps with HAM II's, 3. It has a beast of a tank. 4. That tank can be a tuff nut to crack. 5. it has room for tackle. 6. It can be semi mobile. 7. It can down almost any other t2 cruiser ingame with ease." When one of the above is true all others tend to be false. ie : if you tank you dont have room for tackle, if you fit HAM II you dont have the grid for tank, if you try to be mobile you cant fit triple bcu so you dont have alot of dps. If you want to accomplish more than one its not cheap anymore. Thats the extent of drake's versatility in my opinion. I believe the cookie cutter HAM drake needs a 3% power grid implant to fit, but there are variations on that set up that work just as good. The drake is a great ship, if fitted and flown properly.
Jatchin	Posted - 2009.11.17 23:15:00 - [36] I believe the cookie cutter HAM drake needs a 3% power grid implant to fit, but there are variations on that set up that work just as good. The drake is a great ship, if fitted and flown properly. Meaning it wont fit even with all lvl V, and the above fit will move like a brick without any agility mods on lows. Im not saying it can't be fitted well, but its tank isnt that beastly when you try to squeeze in the HAMs and good luck hitting anything fast with hams without a TP. I'm trying to point out that its not an easy ship as implied by the OP and many others before him. It can be fitted for many things so do other ships.
SwineFlu H1N1	Posted - 2009.11.17 23:21:00 - [37] Originally by: Jatchin ...and good luck hitting anything fast with hams without a TP. I guess you dont realize that most HAM drakes fit scram and web...
Jatchin	Posted - 2009.11.17 23:32:00 - [38] Edited by: Jatchin on 17/11/2009 23:32:31 Originally by: SwineFlu H1N1 Originally by: Jatchin ...and good luck hitting anything fast with hams without a TP. I guess you dont realize that most HAM drakes fit scram and web... Yes and we are talking about the slowest BC in the game. No one will be in web range unless they really want to.
Arec Bardwin	Posted - 2009.11.17 23:37:00 - [39] Ferox is the best - everyone and their mother will want to fight you
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 00:02:00 - [40] While the Drake is fantastic, I really prefer the Cyclone (I'm a sucker, what can I say?) and Hurricane (who can turn down flying an Imperial Star Destroyer?!?). Also, you seem to have missed out that the most important feature of "solo PVP" is "running away to fight another day". Also, to the person suggesting the triple rep exile Myrm: meet my dual neut Hurricane. Or meet "sentry guns", which single handedly **** over both your DPS and eat a significant portion of your tank. I dunno, I long ago recognized that Drake >> Myrm, even back when the Myrm fielded 5 heavies. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Zerode	Posted - 2009.11.18 01:33:00 - [41] I'd say my favorites are the HAM Drake and the quad nute Domi for solo work. Pilgrim is nice too but then you have to pick targets more
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.18 02:22:00 - [42] Originally by: Liang Nuren While the Drake is fantastic, I really prefer the Cyclone (I'm a sucker, what can I say?) and Hurricane (who can turn down flying an Imperial Star Destroyer?!?). Also, you seem to have missed out that the most important feature of "solo PVP" is "running away to fight another day". Also, to the person suggesting the triple rep exile Myrm: meet my dual neut Hurricane. Or meet "sentry guns", which single handedly **** over both your DPS and eat a significant portion of your tank. I dunno, I long ago recognized that Drake >> Myrm, even back when the Myrm fielded 5 heavies. -Liang Yeah sentry guns are a *****, but seriously, I rarely find medium neuts a problem since the two cap boosters replenish about 70% of my cap in a go anyway.
Apathetic Brent Every Villian is Lemons	Posted - 2009.11.18 03:37:00 - [43] Edited by: Apathetic Brent on 18/11/2009 03:37:30 Originally by: Xachin Ahh, the mythical versatile HAM drake. Did you bother to fit a full rack of HAM II on a drake? Let me relieve you of the bother you cant fit a full rack with typical pvp mods (MWD,cap booster,web,scram). Even with all level V. How many of us have all lvl V anyway. So, according to your post (boast), "1. it is cheap. 2. It can put out alot of dps with HAM II's, 3. It has a beast of a tank. 4. That tank can be a tuff nut to crack. 5. it has room for tackle. 6. It can be semi mobile. 7. It can down almost any other t2 cruiser ingame with ease." When one of the above is true all others tend to be false. ie : if you tank you dont have room for tackle, if you fit HAM II you dont have the grid for tank, if you try to be mobile you cant fit triple bcu so you dont have alot of dps. If you want to accomplish more than one its not cheap anymore. Thats the extent of drake's versatility in my opinion. Hmmmm..... 2 Core defnece field extenders 1 acr 3 bcu ii 1 dc ii 1 web 1 point 1 mwd 2 invul 1 lse 7 ham ii has room for tackle....has a tank...still has a mwd...has 600 dps with my skills and hammerhead ii's dont see how your opinion holds water... EDIT: AWU V allows for the acr to be dropped for another CDE
Leina Kubyeshev Vengeance Imperium Financial Federal Republic	Posted - 2009.11.18 08:28:00 - [44] Dominix, hands down.
Shade Millith Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2009.11.18 11:41:00 - [45] Love my Drake. Nuff said --------------------------------------------
AZN Steve Amarr	Posted - 2009.11.18 13:21:00 - [46] Originally by: Apathetic Brent Hmmmm..... 2 Core defnece field extenders 1 acr 3 bcu ii 1 dc ii 1 web 1 point 1 mwd 2 invul 1 lse 7 ham ii has room for tackle....has a tank...still has a mwd...has 600 dps with my skills and hammerhead ii's dont see how your opinion holds water... EDIT: AWU V allows for the acr to be dropped for another CDE Hammerheads on a drake , really ?
Neesa Corrinne Stimulus Rote Kapelle	Posted - 2009.11.18 13:46:00 - [47] Originally by: Torothin none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility. Two evenly skilled pilots one in a Hurricane and one in a Drake and I'll bet on the Hurricane every time. A smart Myrmidon pilot running Lasers will shove a Drake's wimpy EM tank in his hairy armpits while laughing maniacally. If the Drake isn't running a mission or ratting, then it belongs in a hangar, not on a battlefield. If you want to fly solo, then go with a Blaster Falcon or a Curse or if you want to stay on the insured side of the game, then go with a Laser Myrmidon or Hurricane. ---------------------------------
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.11.18 13:59:00 - [48] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 18/11/2009 13:59:03 Originally by: Neesa Corrinne Originally by: Torothin none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility. Two evenly skilled pilots one in a Hurricane and one in a Drake and I'll bet on the Hurricane every time. A smart Myrmidon pilot running Lasers will shove a Drake's wimpy EM tank in his hairy armpits while laughing maniacally. If the Drake isn't running a mission or ratting, then it belongs in a hangar, not on a battlefield. If you want to fly solo, then go with a Blaster Falcon or a Curse or if you want to stay on the insured side of the game, then go with a Laser Myrmidon or Hurricane. The Drake is the only really worrying BC when you're flying around in a Hurricane. You just bet that it's a failfit or pilot makes mistakes, which holds true 95% of the time. However, the Drake still boasts about 81K EHP vs a Harbinger's damage profile and 77K vs EM only. 1600mm RT Harbinger with dual EANMs and trimarks (which means you're fitting FMPs and only two HS) has 69K EHP vs the Drake's damage profile while doing less DPS. It's also significantly more agile and actually faster then the Harbinger. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Lubomir Penev Dark Nexxus	Posted - 2009.11.18 14:18:00 - [49] Originally by: Xachin Ahh, the mythical versatile HAM drake. Did you bother to fit a full rack of HAM II on a drake? Let me relieve you of the bother you cant fit a full rack with typical pvp mods (MWD,cap booster,web,scram). Even with all level V. WTF do you need the cap booster for? And yes many people have "Fitting skills relevant to the ship they are flying" to all 5. And fitting implants are cheap. -- 081014 : emoragequit, char transfered to a friend, 090317 : back to original owner blog
Darcon Kylote Terminal Impact	Posted - 2009.11.18 14:36:00 - [50] Originally by: Gypsio III A big part of the "best" tag is the ease of getting fights when flying it - which is possibly the greatest flaw of the Curse and Rook. Scan has an annoying tendency of emptying around you as other people look for targets they think that can actually kill... Yeah, absolutely. Love the rook but everyone runs from it, just like a curse. Anyone will shoot a drake because there is a huge chance that it's just some random noob wandering around in a loldps passive fit. -- Terminal Impact is recruiting PVPers for fun ops in lowsec/0.0/wormhole space. Visit our website or join ingame channel "the tict pub".
Neesa Corrinne Stimulus Rote Kapelle	Posted - 2009.11.18 14:47:00 - [51] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 18/11/2009 13:59:03 Originally by: Neesa Corrinne Originally by: Torothin none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility. Two evenly skilled pilots one in a Hurricane and one in a Drake and I'll bet on the Hurricane every time. A smart Myrmidon pilot running Lasers will shove a Drake's wimpy EM tank in his hairy armpits while laughing maniacally. If the Drake isn't running a mission or ratting, then it belongs in a hangar, not on a battlefield. If you want to fly solo, then go with a Blaster Falcon or a Curse or if you want to stay on the insured side of the game, then go with a Laser Myrmidon or Hurricane. The Drake is the only really worrying BC when you're flying around in a Hurricane. You just bet that it's a failfit or pilot makes mistakes, which holds true 95% of the time. However, the Drake still boasts about 81K EHP vs a Harbinger's damage profile and 77K vs EM only. 1600mm RT Harbinger with dual EANMs and trimarks (which means you're fitting FMPs and only two HS) has 69K EHP vs the Drake's damage profile while doing less DPS. It's also significantly more agile and actually faster then the Harbinger. While I don't dispute your claims concerning the Harbinger, I never actually mentioned it. I've never flown a Harbinger so I'm not sure what the capabilities and limits of the hull are. As far as the Drake being the only ship worrying to a Hurricane when flying solo, I would have to disagree wholeheartedly. I will engage a Drake immediately, if I catch one flying around alone, without hesitation. The only other BC that I won't immediately tag with a disruptor is a Harbinger, but that's mostly because the Hurricane fit I typically use is "weak" against EM. If I've checked his age, and he's a newbie then I'll tag him, but if he's an EVE Geezer, then I'll move along. Maybe I've just run across every bad Drake pilot in the game, but so far I'm not impressed whatsoever. ---------------------------------
Brent riper Caldari Night Wolves Deprived of Existence by Mercenaries of the Night	Posted - 2009.11.18 14:47:00 - [52] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 18/11/2009 13:59:03 Originally by: Neesa Corrinne Originally by: Torothin none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility. Two evenly skilled pilots one in a Hurricane and one in a Drake and I'll bet on the Hurricane every time. A smart Myrmidon pilot running Lasers will shove a Drake's wimpy EM tank in his hairy armpits while laughing maniacally. If the Drake isn't running a mission or ratting, then it belongs in a hangar, not on a battlefield. If you want to fly solo, then go with a Blaster Falcon or a Curse or if you want to stay on the insured side of the game, then go with a Laser Myrmidon or Hurricane. The Drake is the only really worrying BC when you're flying around in a Hurricane. You just bet that it's a failfit or pilot makes mistakes, which holds true 95% of the time. However, the Drake still boasts about 81K EHP vs a Harbinger's damage profile and 77K vs EM only. 1600mm RT Harbinger with dual EANMs and trimarks (which means you're fitting FMPs and only two HS) has 69K EHP vs the Drake's damage profile while doing less DPS. It's also significantly more agile and actually faster then the Harbinger. shhh if we keep talking about how great it is then ccp will nerf it to hell when the whinies with their whaambulances cry about it shhhh I THINK IT BLOWS . /me gets topic away from thinking they are great so they dont get nerfed AND further more, Carthage must be destroyed!!
Thargorr Brutor tribe	Posted - 2009.11.18 15:01:00 - [53] Originally by: Liang Nuren Also, to the person suggesting the triple rep exile Myrm: meet my dual neut Hurricane. Neuts don't really do much to a well flown Tri-rep Myrmi. With dual cap boosters and a micromanaged tank you always use the cap immediately after injecting.
Endless Subversion The Accursed	Posted - 2009.11.18 15:02:00 - [54] Best three solo low sec ships in no order imo: Drake Cyclone Myrm Dirt cheap, quick enough to re-approach versus anything but the really big low sec camps. Have the hitting power, tank and mobility to win fights but the ship size, lack of scanner presence and reputation to actually GET fights. If eve-files would stop failing 2/3 of the way through my upload I'd have my next video to offer up as video evidence :)
Thargorr Brutor tribe	Posted - 2009.11.18 15:08:00 - [55] Edited by: Thargorr on 18/11/2009 15:09:18 Originally by: Jatchin Edited by: Jatchin on 17/11/2009 23:32:31 Originally by: SwineFlu H1N1 Originally by: Jatchin ...and good luck hitting anything fast with hams without a TP. I guess you dont realize that most HAM drakes fit scram and web... Yes and we are talking about the slowest BC in the game. No one will be in web range unless they really want to. That would be true...before all the other armor tanking BCs strap on a couple 1600mm plates and armor rigs. Now if you wanna point out the massive sig radius on the drake however...
Elora Danzik Caldari Idiots In Spaceships Psychotic Tendencies.	Posted - 2009.11.18 15:36:00 - [56] The drake is a good ship. You can take the standard PVP HAM drake change a few mods and go right into some missions. So Versatile. The biggest drawback is the sig radius which just becomes a giant bullseye when the MWD is on. The plus is it has a huge tank. So it is balanced. BS gun will hit the drake for full damage, while other BC don't get the sig rad penatly for shield tanking, so they have a possibilty to survive better, Again Balanced. (geerunonsentancemuch) Choices and trade off. Its what eve is all about.
Cpt Branko The Scope	Posted - 2009.11.18 16:30:00 - [57] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 18/11/2009 16:32:56 Originally by: Neesa Corrinne As far as the Drake being the only ship worrying to a Hurricane when flying solo, I would have to disagree wholeheartedly. I will engage a Drake immediately, if I catch one flying around alone, without hesitation. The only other BC that I won't immediately tag with a disruptor is a Harbinger, but that's mostly because the Hurricane fit I typically use is "weak" against EM. If I've checked his age, and he's a newbie then I'll tag him, but if he's an EVE Geezer, then I'll move along. Maybe I've just run across every bad Drake pilot in the game, but so far I'm not impressed whatsoever. Well, the thing with Drake vs nanocane fight: (a) you're not really tackling a nanocane unless he makes a mistake (b) you must know when it's a good time to load javelins and have the skills to use Javelins, since w/out Javelins you just die Interestingly enough, I have - in no fit I've flown, including both plated fits and nano fits - ever actually lost to a Drake. I have disengaged a few times in nano fits, but I have likewise killed a HAM Drake with a nanofit, because he took his sweet time to reload to Javelin HAMs - and I probably did have better skills - so when he finally got around to using Javelins I just zoomed up close and finished the job point blank with low armour left when he exploded. It seems that, eg. 8 out of 10 Drakes I encounter are various failfits and remaining two aren't optimal fits either but are on the right track - but are either underskilled (eg, named HAMs, obvious lack of fitting/etc skills) or make mistakes or both. It's strange to run into so many fail Drakes. Comparatively, let's say every third Hurricane I run into is a proper PVP fit - generally with some variance in exact modules, but unlike the Drake the ship does not have a "one true fit which goes exactly like this". I don't have a explanation for that part, basically. However, it's really only a matter of time until I get my ass kicked by a Drake. Well, until Dominion hits anyway. Ofc, once Dominion hits, the Drake will have lots to fear from a Hurricane (since plated fits will just win DPS/EHP race with only LG slaves up close, and nano fits will have very very good chances of actually killing even well-flown and skilled Drake pilots if the fight starts at range). But on TQ, already, I would rate the Hurricane as a excellent solo ship, and would rather fly that then Drake for anything beyond BC on BC slugging. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 16:41:00 - [58] Originally by: Cpt Branko Interestingly enough, I have - in no fit I've flown, including both plated fits and nano fits - ever actually lost to a Drake. The corollary to this is that I have - in no fit I've ever flown, including both HAM and HML fits, ever actually lost to a Hurricane or Harbinger. And I've actually engaged Hurricanes+Myrms at odds >= 3v1 and won handily. I do tend to be skittish around Harbingers, but for some reason engaging abso + abaddon + astarte seems like a good idea (yes, I got my abso kill without losing the Drake too). -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Kaileen Starsong Amarr Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2009.11.18 17:09:00 - [59] Only came close twice vs Drakes in Hurricane, but got away both times. Same true for me being in Drake vs Hurricanes/Harbs, though I agree on Cyclown, Myrm and the likes, you can get engagement in one of them, instead of stuff just docking on sight. Although being in NPC-Corp certainly helps, as does putting "CHARACTER SOLD" in your bio
Meeko Atari	Posted - 2009.11.18 17:37:00 - [60] Originally by: Jatchin I believe the cookie cutter HAM drake needs a 3% power grid implant to fit, but there are variations on that set up that work just as good. The drake is a great ship, if fitted and flown properly. Meaning it wont fit even with all lvl V, and the above fit will move like a brick without any agility mods on lows. Im not saying it can't be fitted well, but its tank isnt that beastly when you try to squeeze in the HAMs and good luck hitting anything fast with hams without a TP. I'm trying to point out that its not an easy ship as implied by the OP and many others before him. It can be fitted for many things so do other ships. You are right, I was spewing utter nonsense. The Drake is a terrible ship and should never be used outside of missions, In fact...It deserves a massive buff to be put in-line with the other Battle Cruisers that clearly out perform it in every possible way!
snake133	Posted - 2009.11.18 18:10:00 - [61] best ship ever: avatar post dominion jk naa id have to go with rook but nobody wants to fight them they ave the same effect a curse does the "run away run away"(montypythons) :( but as far as effective
kessah Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.11.18 18:20:00 - [62] Originally by: Mordred McKenna Maelstrom is probably the best solo pvp battleship in game. The shield boost bonus is great, coupled with the 750 odd dps+ it can push (before overloading) and the range it can get with Barrage, it's a great BS to play with. Crystal set + blue pill only makes it an even better tank, and a faction or deadspace x-l booster will knock you out. The other two battleships suck though, typhoon requires too much of a skill investment for a tier 1 bs and tempest is. tempest Not sure if i agree with that, Maelstrom is a good ship, but not that good solo. Even with the 3bil of implants and gear id still take the Typhoon. Probably the Tempest aswell for solo work. Each to their own i guess.
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 19:05:00 - [63] Originally by: kessah Not sure if i agree with that, Maelstrom is a good ship, but not that good solo. Even with the 3bil of implants and gear id still take the Typhoon. Probably the Tempest aswell for solo work. Each to their own i guess. Yeah, I'd probably take a Phoon or Tempest too. The Tempest's redeeming feature is being able to fit tackle + 2 ECCM/SeBo. I mean, sure, your tank is crap but them's the breaks. Treat it like an oversize BC and you'll come out ok. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
AnKahn Caldari The Giant Squid Corp. Maru Ka'ge	Posted - 2009.11.18 20:35:00 - [64] Most ships should be able to either get away from a Drake OR be able to tank a Drake. This is not the discription of the best solo ship in the game. I think it depends on what you are hunting. For example if it's frigs you are hunting I would vote for the Vaga.
SwineFlu H1N1	Posted - 2009.11.18 20:49:00 - [65] Originally by: AnKahn Most ships should be able to either get away from a Drake OR be able to tank a Drake. This is not the discription of the best solo ship in the game. So you are saying you find it easy to tank 600+ dps in cruiser or BC sized ships?(i assume you mean these are the ones that cant "get away")
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.18 21:05:00 - [66] Originally by: SwineFlu H1N1 Originally by: AnKahn Most ships should be able to either get away from a Drake OR be able to tank a Drake. This is not the discription of the best solo ship in the game. So you are saying you find it easy to tank 600+ dps in cruiser or BC sized ships?(i assume you mean these are the ones that cant "get away") It's easy in a Myrm.
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 21:10:00 - [67] Edited by: Liang Nuren on 18/11/2009 21:10:20 Originally by: Neuronai It's easy in a Myrm. This is the point that the Drake pilot kills your drones (extremely easy to do) and orbits you at 15km. It takes 0 DPS, and you run out of cap boosters. -Liang Ed: The Myrm is a passable ship - but in most situations its completely crap. Get a better ship. -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
NxN	Posted - 2009.11.18 22:44:00 - [68] Edited by: NxN on 18/11/2009 22:47:09 Edited by: NxN on 18/11/2009 22:45:14 What if said Myrm pilot fly in something like that? [Myrmidon, Would Liang Approve] Damage Control II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Reactor Control Unit II Reactor Control Unit II 10MN MicroWarpdrive I Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 400 Warp Disruptor II Stasis Webifier II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 400 Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Hobgoblin II x5 Hammerhead II x5 Ogre II x3 Now, Myrm can Orbit drake at, say 18km even without drones and still do dps, where HAMs Drake would be doing 0 dps. But then again, there are many ships which could kill Drake when staying out of HAMs range... /NxN goes back to his corner ùùù ≡v≡
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 22:48:00 - [69] Edited by: Liang Nuren on 18/11/2009 22:48:16 Originally by: NxN What if said Myrm pilot fly in something like that? [Myrmidon, Would Liang Approve] Liang would not approve. Quote: Now, Myrm can Orbit drake at, say 18km even without drones and still do dps, where HAM Drake would be doing 0 dps. /ducks /introduces NxN to Javs and the penalties of fitting armor rigs -Liang Ed: Gah you edited it. I'll have to reread it now. -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.18 23:12:00 - [70] Originally by: Liang Nuren Edited by: Liang Nuren on 18/11/2009 21:10:20 Originally by: Neuronai It's easy in a Myrm. This is the point that the Drake pilot kills your drones (extremely easy to do) and orbits you at 15km. It takes 0 DPS, and you run out of cap boosters. -Liang Ed: The Myrm is a passable ship - but in most situations its completely crap. Get a better ship. Please don't assume things such as "orbits you at 15km" when arguing your case. Neither of us know whether or not the Drake will get a chance to do such a thing. But if we're playing the old circumstancial fight game then...As a blaster boat, I overload my MWD and bust nuts getting my target into scram range. At this point, there is no chance of the Drake kiting me, I will tank its DPS, either kill the Hobs (or return/deploy my drones everytime they get start taking damage) and kill his buffer before I run out of cap boosters. You are right about it being crap in more than a few situations (fleet combat), however, in solo/small gang fights the Myrm is a beast and my *preference* over a Drake for such situations.
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.18 23:20:00 - [71] Originally by: Neuronai You are right about it being crap in more than a few situations (fleet combat), however, in solo/small gang fights the Myrm is a beast and my *preference* over a Drake for such situations. Most of your post isn't worth responding to. Anything ridiculous like "I overload my MWD and catch him good!" implies that he isn't also able to do that. Except he is. And he's faster to start with. And you won't be able to keep your drones alive (you can't pull them fast enough). And and and and. All things considered, your *preference* is for a bad ship. I'm not hating - my *preference* is for the Cyclone... but I'm not going to go around claiming the Cyclone is going to solo pwn Drakes! Will the Myrm do well in situations where it's under low sustained fire? Sure... but outside of gate camping under sentries, that situation is vanishingly rare - and in that situation it loses a huge chunk of its DPS -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.19 00:13:00 - [72] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Neuronai You are right about it being crap in more than a few situations (fleet combat), however, in solo/small gang fights the Myrm is a beast and my *preference* over a Drake for such situations. Most of your post isn't worth responding to. Anything ridiculous like "I overload my MWD and catch him good!" implies that he isn't also able to do that. Except he is. And he's faster to start with. And you won't be able to keep your drones alive (you can't pull them fast enough). And and and and. All things considered, your *preference* is for a bad ship. I'm not hating - my *preference* is for the Cyclone... but I'm not going to go around claiming the Cyclone is going to solo pwn Drakes! Will the Myrm do well in situations where it's under low sustained fire? Sure... but outside of gate camping under sentries, that situation is vanishingly rare - and in that situation it loses a huge chunk of its DPS -Liang Hmm sorry I should have specified that my thoughts were in reference to the standard HAM Drake fit...The one that lacks the CPU for a disruptor? Obviously its not the only fit out there, but if we consider all fits it'll be almost impossible to discern the "better" ship. Anyway, bringing the whole kiting thing into it is still circumstancial. We could sit here all day and say "what if...". All that should matter is personal experience. Arguing ship statistics is so futile because it doesn't always reflect real PvP situations. It just gets people into arguments like these. And in my experience, I would take a Myrm over a Drake when soloing any day. For whatever reason that is, it's my opinion and I stand by it. You can call it a bad ship, but I'll call it a good ship... There's not much we can do now except perhaps fight it out on SiSi? I don't suppose you're up for that?
kessah Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2009.11.19 04:40:00 - [73] Triple Rep Myr r teh w1n
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.19 05:23:00 - [74] Originally by: Neuronai There's not much we can do now except perhaps fight it out on SiSi? I don't suppose you're up for that? Comments: - Arranged 1v1s are probably not going to be useful for answering the question at hand. - Sisi is particularly poor for settling arguments like this, because of the absolute commonality of T2 rigs, pirate sets, the lack of easily available faction ammo, etc. Basically, Sisi PVP is very very very different from TQ PVP. Hell, they don't even run the same code atm. :\| - I would normally not be unwilling to duel someone (TQ or sisi), but I have always drawn a hard and fast rule of not revealing alts. Even when it would have been so much easier to have done so. Liang can't fly the Drake (well, she could move one if I needed her to, but that's about it!). So, since the duel would require me outing an alt.... no. Sorry. :-/ - Active tanks are at their best in a 1v1 situation. I don't consider "solo PVP" to imply in any way, shape, form, or fashion "1v1". It normally implies "1v5" to me. Does that mean I think a Myrm would win a 1v1 vs a Drake? Probably not. But 2v2 and beyond and Drakes easily win. Active tanking is just pretty fail. :-/ -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Shosoru Gallente	Posted - 2009.11.19 06:04:00 - [75] Best solo pvp ship, the Drake haha haha haha ha 1. it is cheap - its quite expensive. If you want to have real funn you need something you can loos once a day or two, if you fit your Drake to be used as something that can tank a bit , it will cost you 30mill+ a loss 2. bla bla HAM yes a ham drake is a good drake but point3 3. If HAM then tackle and tackle is opposite to tank for shield tank 4 if tank then IRRELEVANT a ship like a sitting duck that cant move and cant do damage and sits there to a- w8 till the evil man gos away or b evil mans friends **** you 5 of course, its a caldari ship, if you throw out the nber tank, you have room for tackle, the tipical ham drake is an ok ship but you have to many points on that list if your talking about a ham drake 6 it can CAN ! but on expense of that sooo cool tank 7 mr t2 cruzer pleas do not move as i cant catch you. The Ultimate and True best Solo pvp ship in game clearly is a Badger Mark II there is no questioning this.
Scarlett Sky	Posted - 2009.11.19 06:15:00 - [76] Originally by: Shosoru phail poast I nominate you for the most fail post of the year.
Darthewok Blue Republic	Posted - 2009.11.19 13:51:00 - [77] Out of curiousity, is there any HAC/Recon that can defeat a Drake one on one?
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.19 14:54:00 - [78] Edited by: Torothin on 19/11/2009 14:54:24 on gate to gate PvP there is no Hac/Recon that can kill a well skilled and well fitted Drake 1 on 1. Now you can say but if I catch a Drake in a belt with my Vaga he is screwed. I can say if I have my alt in a Rapier cloaked beside me you are screwed.
Brent riper Caldari Night Wolves Deprived of Existence by Mercenaries of the Night	Posted - 2009.11.19 14:55:00 - [79] Originally by: Liang Nuren Edited by: Liang Nuren on 18/11/2009 21:10:20 Originally by: Neuronai It's easy in a Myrm. This is the point that the Drake pilot kills your drones (extremely easy to do) and orbits you at 15km. It takes 0 DPS, and you run out of cap boosters. -Liang Ed: The Myrm is a passable ship - but in most situations its completely crap. Get a better ship. harby can do it so can a cane, cyclone does it with easy as well with an xlarge booster. it can be done quite easily actually.. drake is jst easy mode that's all. the other races jst take a lil finesse and skill. but it can be done and i believe the omen can tank quite a bit for a lil cruiser with 6 lows ( i think its the omen at least, at work so cant check) not hard to do though drake inst as leetsauce as its made out to be although granted it is effective and can a complish its goals easily due to HAM II AND further more, Carthage must be destroyed!!
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.19 14:59:00 - [80] The point is a Myrm can be owned 1 on 1 by a Curse. The Drake cannot. This makes the Myrm limited as a PvP ship. Its a good pvp ship but does not have the flexibility in combat that the Drake does. Same can be said for all other gunships. Don't bother posting "I'll just passive fit my Myrm" Good luck with that.
Berendas Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:03:00 - [81] All I'm getting from this thread is that the Drake is in desperate need of a nerf. Nothing should ever be best in EVE. People are going to be all; "It's not overpowered, its just a good ship when you use it right." Thats utter crap, the Drake is far too easy to use and you get far too much out of it (apparently best solo PVP ship and we already know its the best PVE ship next to the Raven variants).
rubico1337 Caldari Mnemonic Enterprises	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:07:00 - [82] Originally by: Darthewok Out of curiousity, is there any HAC/Recon that can defeat a Drake one on one? nano istar maybe?
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:15:00 - [83] drones will die before the Drakes tank cracks.
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.11.19 15:39:00 - [84] Originally by: Darthewok Out of curiousity, is there any HAC/Recon that can defeat a Drake one on one? Zealot, nfp. http://www.youtube.com/user/DizeezerV#p/a/u/0/ubCn-AbA-IE
fac3hunter	Posted - 2009.11.19 16:19:00 - [85] best solo ship for an arranged 1on1 where each use setups to counters the other, tempest is hands down the best solo ship in game sucks at everything else but for an arranged fight its slot layout is just evul.
MADDOGzors Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2009.11.19 16:43:00 - [86] Rokh hands down beats any other bs 1v1. That includes solo roaming on TQ and when people are gay and use sisi fits.
Tau Dades Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:19:00 - [87] Originally by: Berendas All I'm getting from this thread is that the Drake is in desperate need of a nerf. Nothing should ever be best in EVE. I, too, believe Caldari have no business in PVP and should be forced only to run missions for CN.
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:23:00 - [88] Originally by: MADDOGzors Rokh hands down beats any other bs 1v1. That includes solo roaming on TQ and when people are gay and use sisi fits. Eeeeuuuurrrmmmmm.... can you justify this statement? I'm assuming you're talking crystals and blue pill and a cap booster or something? I truthfully doubt you'd kill a standard Tempest with it.... and the Tempest isn't exactly the greatest ship out there. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Berendas Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:24:00 - [89] Originally by: Tau Dades Originally by: Berendas All I'm getting from this thread is that the Drake is in desperate need of a nerf. Nothing should ever be best in EVE. I, too, believe Caldari have no business in PVP and should be forced only to run missions for CN. No but I think when somebody asks on this forum; "I need a ship to do X and/or Y because of Z" and half the responses they get are "Drake" then that's reason enough that a ship is imbalanced.
Tau Dades Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:29:00 - [90] yeah, because basing nerfing decisions on internet forumz is always a sound decision. drake does not need a nerf.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:32:00 - [91] Clearly the Drake's tank is too good. We should therefore remove the resist bonus. And replace it with, erm, a ROF bonus! Gogo 900 DPS Drake!
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.19 17:56:00 - [92] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Neuronai There's not much we can do now except perhaps fight it out on SiSi? I don't suppose you're up for that? Comments: - Arranged 1v1s are probably not going to be useful for answering the question at hand. - Sisi is particularly poor for settling arguments like this, because of the absolute commonality of T2 rigs, pirate sets, the lack of easily available faction ammo, etc. Basically, Sisi PVP is very very very different from TQ PVP. Hell, they don't even run the same code atm. :\| - I would normally not be unwilling to duel someone (TQ or sisi), but I have always drawn a hard and fast rule of not revealing alts. Even when it would have been so much easier to have done so. Liang can't fly the Drake (well, she could move one if I needed her to, but that's about it!). So, since the duel would require me outing an alt.... no. Sorry. :-/ - Active tanks are at their best in a 1v1 situation. I don't consider "solo PVP" to imply in any way, shape, form, or fashion "1v1". It normally implies "1v5" to me. Does that mean I think a Myrm would win a 1v1 vs a Drake? Probably not. But 2v2 and beyond and Drakes easily win. Active tanking is just pretty fail. :-/ -Liang Don't get me wrong, I realise SiSi is totally different from TQ. But it beats arguing stats from EFT and arguing with personal experience.
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:04:00 - [93] Originally by: Torothin The point is a Myrm can be owned 1 on 1 by a Curse. The Drake cannot. This makes the Myrm limited as a PvP ship. Its a good pvp ship but does not have the flexibility in combat that the Drake does. Same can be said for all other gunships. Don't bother posting "I'll just passive fit my Myrm" Good luck with that. Uh, sorry how did you deduce that the Myrm is "limited" because it doesn't fair well against a Curse? Referencing a ship's ability to PvP against a single ship isn't the most logical move imo. About the shield Myrm, don't need good luck...The fit I posted is a bit of a beast, though the buffer admittedly ain't as good as a Drake's.
Liang Nuren No Salvation War.Pigs.	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:05:00 - [94] Originally by: Tau Dades yeah, because basing nerfing decisions on internet forumz is always a sound decision. drake does not need a nerf. Eh, the Drake really doesn't need a nerf right now. I'd adopt a wait and see attitude to see how projectiles affect the Cyclone/Hurricane and TC/TEs affect the other turret BCs. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire www.kwikdeath.org
Torothin Foundation Sons of Tangra	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:10:00 - [95] Originally by: Neuronai Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Neuronai There's not much we can do now except perhaps fight it out on SiSi? I don't suppose you're up for that? Comments: - Arranged 1v1s are probably not going to be useful for answering the question at hand. - Sisi is particularly poor for settling arguments like this, because of the absolute commonality of T2 rigs, pirate sets, the lack of easily available faction ammo, etc. Basically, Sisi PVP is very very very different from TQ PVP. Hell, they don't even run the same code atm. :\| - I would normally not be unwilling to duel someone (TQ or sisi), but I have always drawn a hard and fast rule of not revealing alts. Even when it would have been so much easier to have done so. Liang can't fly the Drake (well, she could move one if I needed her to, but that's about it!). So, since the duel would require me outing an alt.... no. Sorry. :-/ - Active tanks are at their best in a 1v1 situation. I don't consider "solo PVP" to imply in any way, shape, form, or fashion "1v1". It normally implies "1v5" to me. Does that mean I think a Myrm would win a 1v1 vs a Drake? Probably not. But 2v2 and beyond and Drakes easily win. Active tanking is just pretty fail. :-/ -Liang Don't get me wrong, I realise SiSi is totally different from TQ. But it beats arguing stats from EFT and arguing with personal experience. Neur, That was the deciding fatcor on which ship to take. The only thing that makes the Drake a tad better than the Myrm is the Myrm's inability to deal with curses or pilgrims efficiently. Eever seen what happens when a pilgrim tackles a drake? It gets face ****d. The myrm is good. But still based on overall effectiveness on every ship out there the Drake wins. Hands down.
Neuronai	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:18:00 - [96] Yeah I agree with that, the Drake is very versatile. Like others have said its PvP on easy mode. FYI a Myrm would also face ** a Pilgrim that came into scram range...For that matter it face **s most things its size or lower (barring active tanked CSs) that get into scramble range. The problem of getting into scramble range is why most people deem it limited at PvP which is a certainly acceptable argument and one that I agree with.
Susy Assulu Caldari Atomic Mexicans	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:18:00 - [97] Why would a myrm pilot get caught by a curse? Why would he stay in system with a curse on scan? Also the taranis can't take on a curse does this make it terribad? Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. StevieSG
Meeko Atari	Posted - 2009.11.19 18:20:00 - [98] I am going to take the same stand as all the Ammar Whiners when anyone mentions Nerfing Lasers. "The Drake does not need to be Nerfed, it's the Other Battle Cruisers that need to be brought up to the drakes level" People are just now starting to figure out how to fit and fly them, so a nerf is called for? ...Classic Don't adapt or use teamwork, Ask CCP to do it. hey!! maybe we can ask CCP to PvP for us too!!! Everyone gets 1 Dev hotdrop per hour !!!
MADDOGzors Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2009.11.19 19:26:00 - [99] Edited by: MADDOGzors on 19/11/2009 19:29:37 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: MADDOGzors Rokh hands down beats any other bs 1v1. That includes solo roaming on TQ and when people are gay and use sisi fits. Eeeeuuuurrrmmmmm.... can you justify this statement? I'm assuming you're talking crystals and blue pill and a cap booster or something? I truthfully doubt you'd kill a standard Tempest with it.... and the Tempest isn't exactly the greatest ship out there. -Liang There's 2 ways to see for yourself. Watch the rokh movies that have been made and fight a good rokh pilot. Btw the tempest is horrible. Only ship that has a chance vs the rokh is a mael pilot of equal skill and the winner will be in structure, out of cap charges hanging on by a thread. Anything I say is from experience. I don't eft pvp.
Berendas Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate	Posted - 2009.11.19 19:32:00 - [100] Edited by: Berendas on 19/11/2009 19:35:17 Originally by: MADDOGzors Edited by: MADDOGzors on 19/11/2009 19:29:37 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: MADDOGzors Rokh hands down beats any other bs 1v1. That includes solo roaming on TQ and when people are gay and use sisi fits. Eeeeuuuurrrmmmmm.... can you justify this statement? I'm assuming you're talking crystals and blue pill and a cap booster or something? I truthfully doubt you'd kill a standard Tempest with it.... and the Tempest isn't exactly the greatest ship out there. -Liang There's 2 ways to see for yourself. Watch the rokh movies that have been made and fight a good rokh pilot. Btw the tempest is horrible. Only ship that has a chance vs the rokh is a mael pilot of equal skill and the winner will be in structure, out of cap charges hanging on by a thread. Anything I say is from experience. I don't eft pvp. I have to agree with Maddog. The Rokh is a 1v1 beast, only other BS that I think could match it is the Abaddon.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.11.19 20:14:00 - [101] In an arranged 1v1, where you know that your opponent will be flying a turret BS, you can do some truly hilarious things with a triple-TD armour-tanking Raven. Mega or Rokh - cripple optimal and stay at range. Laser BS - hit tracking speed and orbit close. Try not to remember that the Domi or Typhoon exist as you do this, though.
MADDOGzors Total Mayhem. Cry Havoc.	Posted - 2009.11.19 20:38:00 - [102] Originally by: Gypsio III In an arranged 1v1, where you know that your opponent will be flying a turret BS, you can do some truly hilarious things with a triple-TD armour-tanking Raven. Mega or Rokh - cripple optimal and stay at range. Laser BS - hit tracking speed and orbit close. Try not to remember that the Domi or Typhoon exist as you do this, though. You are the reason a lot of people don't do 1v1's. It's pretty sad when you feel the need to setup for someone. 1v1's are a test of skill not who can bring the gayest sisi fit.
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.11.19 20:40:00 - [103] Edited by: Dizeezer Velar on 19/11/2009 20:45:49 Lol serious? Am I alone in thinking a Drake is one of my fave targets to see ratting in belts while i'm pirating or roaming solo in 0.0? Its too slow to hold anything, its got big em/therm holes, dps sucks and you can signature tank it along with the usual resist/rep tanking. If its fit for tackling with a speed mod, it's tank buckles really, really fast.
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2009.11.19 20:41:00 - [104] Originally by: Meeko Atari I am going to take the same stand as all the Ammar Whiners when anyone mentions Nerfing Lasers. "The Drake does not need to be Nerfed, it's the Other Battle Cruisers that need to be brought up to the drakes level" People are just now starting to figure out how to fit and fly them, so a nerf is called for? ...Classic Don't adapt or use teamwork, Ask CCP to do it. hey!! maybe we can ask CCP to PvP for us too!!! Everyone gets 1 Dev hotdrop per hour !!! "Just now"? People have been saying the drake is a good PvP ship for a year now.
Shosoru Gallente	Posted - 2009.11.19 20:47:00 - [105] Dam Torothin, is the Drake some sort of fetish of yours(no offense) or why are you coming up with such arguments. Quote: on gate to gate PvP there is no Hac/Recon that can kill a well skilled and well fitted Drake 1 on 1. Now you can say but if I catch a Drake in a belt with my Vaga he is screwed. I can say if I have my alt in a Rapier cloaked beside me you are screwed. what the hell.... let me rephrase that for you "My Drake will own your hac if you are under sentry fire haha" "My Drake might die but not with my stealth alt haha 2 vs 1 haha see the drake is the BEST SOLO ship cos i have a cloaked backup haha haha" Quote: The point is a Myrm can be owned 1 on 1 by a Curse. The Drake cannot. This makes the Myrm limited as a PvP ship. Its a good pvp ship but does not have the FLEXIBILITY in combat that the Drake does. Is this a parody? Pleas Post the Exact fitting you are talking about, as you say "HAM douse damage", "MegaPassivTank is so unbeatable","Can fit tackle (ab/mwd web scram) without any problem" and then you say "the drake that has all this can still be nber vs anything no mater how that anything is fit" and "if there is something that can pown me solo i have a stealth over9000 man fleet next to me , just in case" your logic douse not make any sense, especially the part about a solo ship with a stealth alt, and what ever sead that a solo pvp ship = 1v1 ? many times killing 1 of 2-3-4 foes
SwineFlu H1N1	Posted - 2009.11.19 21:53:00 - [106] Originally by: Dizeezer Velar Edited by: Dizeezer Velar on 19/11/2009 20:45:49 Its too slow to hold anything, its got big em/therm holes, dps sucks and you can signature tank it along with the usual resist/rep tanking. If its fit for tackling with a speed mod, it's tank buckles really, really fast. Here's a guy who is either completely clueless or has been fighting the most lolfit Drakes in the game. I'm guessing the former...
Dizeezer Velar Caldari League of Disgruntled Fast Food Employees	Posted - 2009.11.19 22:00:00 - [107] Originally by: SwineFlu H1N1 Originally by: Dizeezer Velar Edited by: Dizeezer Velar on 19/11/2009 20:45:49 Its too slow to hold anything, its got big em/therm holes, dps sucks and you can signature tank it along with the usual resist/rep tanking. If its fit for tackling with a speed mod, it's tank buckles really, really fast. Here's a guy who is either completely clueless or has been fighting the most lolfit Drakes in the game. I'm guessing the former... Wrong homo, do your research before assuming anything. I've probably killed more drakes than your total pvp kills altogether.
Meeko Atari	Posted - 2009.11.19 22:02:00 - [108] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Meeko Atari I am going to take the same stand as all the Ammar Whiners when anyone mentions Nerfing Lasers. "The Drake does not need to be Nerfed, it's the Other Battle Cruisers that need to be brought up to the drakes level" People are just now starting to figure out how to fit and fly them, so a nerf is called for? ...Classic Don't adapt or use teamwork, Ask CCP to do it. hey!! maybe we can ask CCP to PvP for us too!!! Everyone gets 1 Dev hotdrop per hour !!! "Just now"? People have been saying the drake is a good PvP ship for a year now. Yea i know!! For some reason people are very resistant to a buffer / HAM fit drake, makes no sense.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2009.11.19 23:01:00 - [109] Originally by: MADDOGzors Originally by: Gypsio III In an arranged 1v1, where you know that your opponent will be flying a turret BS, you can do some truly hilarious things with a triple-TD armour-tanking Raven. Mega or Rokh - cripple optimal and stay at range. Laser BS - hit tracking speed and orbit close. Try not to remember that the Domi or Typhoon exist as you do this, though. You are the reason a lot of people don't do 1v1's. It's pretty sad when you feel the need to setup for someone. 1v1's are a test of skill not who can bring the gayest sisi fit. Yes, there's no skill in innovative fittings, but lots of skill and HONOUR in two obvious cookie-cutter fits blasting away at each other and the obvious, predictable conclusion.
Removal Tool Space Jerks	Posted - 2009.11.19 23:24:00 - [110] Any happy solo Taranis pilots these days? or AF pilots? *and my Griefwatch Killboard sig seems to be stuck
Hiroshima Jita	Posted - 2009.11.19 23:28:00 - [111] Solo ship criteria in some order of importance. Can I avoid the blob? Can I burn back to the gate/cloak/whatever when I jump into a gatecamp? Can I kill a target quickly or disengage before the blob lands on me? Do I have high dps? Can I tank the enemy long enough to kill him? Can I prevent the enemy from escaping? Can I tackle the enemy to start? Am I likely to be underestimated because of my ship type? The Drake answers: Yes, but only if I am extremely careful and don't jump gates with hostiles in system or uses a noob alt or friend to scout. (At which piont its not soloing anymore.) No, I die when I jump into a competent gatecamp Maybe, I can gank a scramble ceptor before the blob lands on me with a web/scram setup but anything larger that gets its claws into me is going to tank long enough for a gang to be all over me from one jump away Not really for a battlecruiser. On the other hand 4-500 dps with minimal tracking issues isn't bad. Yes, I can probably defeat any other solo ship up to another bc before my tank fails. I can take on a very small gang of sub bc ships. Anything more and I die. Yes, my web/scram combo my many midslots allow me to fit make it hard to escape in a reasonable ammount of time if someone gets within that range. No, I'm slow as a brick and I just fit a scram which makes it hard to tackle on gate. I could theoretically lose the web or the scram for a disruptor but then my combat preformance really begins to collapse. For one I lose the ability to quickly kill intercpetors that are on me. Yes, people think I'm an idiot in a drake. It makes for nice ceptor kills. People who should know better in other bcs will engage me often hopping that I'm a noob. And then I kill them. By comparison the Nano-Hurrican answers: Yes in a large number of situations. Yes I can burn back to the gate. I am only daunted by large gate camps and camps that make sure to put enough tackle and firepower on either side of the gate. Yes I do 650dps with cruiser tracking and my medium nuets make it difficult for anything to keep mwding and hold a full point on me. Yes I do 650 dps. No I am relatively thin. I expect to be able to defeat nanod t2 cruisers, all t1 cruisers, and all frigates. Other BC scare me alot. I don't engage them and unless they have tacklers with them I succede at this task. If I accidentally engage a non-nano t2 cruiser (trimarked plated ishtar) life has just gotten very interesting. I probably make fireworks in that case. I can prevent most people from escaping with my scram/web combo. Frigate ABs get turned off from cap issues. A scram web combo will slowly pull away from me. The only way to keep from being tackled by me for a bit is to avoid scram range in the first place Somewhat. I have high velocity but a lowish locking speed. I'm also fitting a scram. I can tackle most carebear ships including bs and haulers. Anyone else who is competent can get away. Yes people underestimate me, although they do expect me to have high dps. I get many kills from people who intentionally engage me.
Hiroshima Jita	Posted - 2009.11.19 23:59:00 - [112] Continued The Rapier weighs in saying: YES YES, my cloak and high speed mean that when piloted right, as long as I dont jump into an uber blob I almost never die in a gatecamp. YES, I web and point the target from 24km or longer if I have a faction point. I kill ceptors quickly, and I can disengage relatively easily. The exceptions are an arazu which I shouldn't have engaged anyway. A ceptor with a fleet on the other side of the gate where I am fighting, a ceptor orbiting me at 500 that kills all my drones before it dies(very unlikely), a nuet bs, some af although they tend to be pretty slow and squishable, and another rapier. Vagas with scram and pure bad luck of somehow landing on top of a cruiser size ship with a scram also can lead to mty death. Despite these scenarios I consider my ship among the most difficult to gank. I have crap for dps 250 maybe. No, if they can hit me solidly and I can't gank them real quick I'm in trouble. I have to run away from things like drakes. Yes almost always with the exception of heavy nuets, ecm, and a couple other random things. Yes I'm pretty good at catching people. Frigates do give me problems but I'm probably after carebear prey that temd to be bc/bs which I have no problem with. People are afraid I have a gang beghind me. Frigates fear my webs. Everyone else figures they cant catch me. Most people who think they can solidly tackle me will probably have a go at me though. And of course the blob. The Taranis is also proud: YES Yes I burn back to the gate and jump out. Easy. Yes, if I'm fighting another frigate. Frigate battles happen so fast that the blob has no time to come to the aid of their comrade. Iether I win or they win very fast. But I do like 250 dps and then tends to shred other frigs. If i got firmly tackled by something bigger then a frig I'm **ed but that shouldnt happen. For a frigate. 250 dps is equivilant to some cruisers. I shred my intended targets. 250 dps isnt really substantial against larger ships No, I can wipe out other inties but afs tend to out tank me even though I have more dps. Anything bigger with some form of tackle will ** me up. Noone is getting away from me without ecm or nuets. I can tackle everything short of fast frigates. People in small ships fear me and run away.
Hiroshima Jita	Posted - 2009.11.20 00:11:00 - [113] You can't really get everything in one go. Survivable ships tend to fare more poorly in combat. The heaviest combatants are easily caught. Generally people try to choose the heaviest ship that will survive the intended environment. In 0.0 you really need to be able to survive gatecamps. Frigates, Afs, Stealth Bombers, Interceptors and Recons can do this somewhat reliably. Nanohacs and the nanocane can do this moderately but not great. The Drake doesn't really cut it as a 0.0 solo ship. Although it is one of the nastiest sub BS things you can pimp around in by yourself.
TRD 2371	Posted - 2009.11.20 00:55:00 - [114] dominix
Mr Prong	Posted - 2009.11.20 02:40:00 - [115] Originally by: TRD 2371 dominix What he said. I always thought that the neut-nos domi was always a surprise ship. You might not see a lot of them around. I mean really people just like their guns in this game, especially the new peeps that are going down the long road to a navy mega. That plus the fast that the NOS nerf still radiates on the forums. However load up a capnapper with very good drone skills: NOS + NEUT = SURPRISE It`s one of those ships that are like an urban legend these days, people hear about them, hardly see them, but once they show up, for a fair number of people, that are not that skilled, it comes down to awww **** what do I do now.......keywords `fair number` :-)
Patri Andari Thukker Tribe Antiquities Importer	Posted - 2009.11.20 03:21:00 - [116] Originally by: Gypsio III Clearly the Drake's tank is too good. We should therefore remove the resist bonus. And replace it with, erm, a ROF bonus! Gogo 900 DPS Drake! This man is motivated and full of zeal! Send his campaign a check! /signed Patri A fool usually thinks he is a genius
Fat Buddah	Posted - 2009.11.20 04:45:00 - [117] Drake Is a good salvage ship, too 8 highes, big cargo, and can perma run MWD with Cap rechargers fitted.
Exitar Stormscion	Posted - 2009.11.20 07:56:00 - [118] Edited by: Exitar Stormscion on 20/11/2009 07:56:29 Originally by: Neesa Corrinne Originally by: Torothin none compare to the drake. Harbi doesnt, Myrm maybe it is limited, Cane is decent. Drake still tops all of them for versatility. Two evenly skilled pilots one in a Hurricane and one in a Drake and I'll bet on the Hurricane every time. A smart Myrmidon pilot running Lasers will shove a Drake's wimpy EM tank in his hairy armpits while laughing maniacally. If the Drake isn't running a mission or ratting, then it belongs in a hangar, not on a battlefield. If you want to fly solo, then go with a Blaster Falcon or a Curse or if you want to stay on the insured side of the game, then go with a Laser Myrmidon or Hurricane. What a pile of crap ... i bet you never faced HAM DRAKE in pvp ... i bet you never did some pvp. Drake is great pvp ship but wouldnt go that far to say its best solo ship in game. Mortal in body Eternal in will.
ArkAngel666	Posted - 2009.11.20 22:22:00 - [119] I used to LOVE to solo in my blaster arazu. Good DPS, decent buffer, ability to shut down MWD's. Sure, you had to be selective about what you engaged but that was part of the fun. Solo bubble camping with my Arazu was maybe the most fun I have ever had in eve. Rook is also a fine solo ship.
xxxak Caldari Infinite Improbability Inc Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2009.11.20 23:34:00 - [120] Originally by: Berendas All I'm getting from this thread is that the Drake is in desperate need of a nerf. Nothing should ever be best in EVE. People are going to be all; "It's not overpowered, its just a good ship when you use it right." Thats utter crap, the Drake is far too easy to use and you get far too much out of it (apparently best solo PVP ship and we already know its the best PVE ship next to the Raven variants). LOTS of ship are "best" in EVE. The Geddon is by far the best short range PVP fleet ship. The Apoc is by far the best long range pvp fleet ship. The Taranis is the best dps ceptor. The Ishkur is BY FAR the best AF. The Vagabond has the best ability to dictate engagement of any ship. The Broadsword is the best HIC in anything but a huge RR fleet. The Stilleto is the best tackle ceptor. The Zealot is the best sniping HAC by about 10000%. ETC ETC ET AL.
Deva Blackfire 24th Imperial Crusade	Posted - 2009.11.21 00:41:00 - [121] For 0.0 solo roams? I would say bomber beats drake easily :) Similiar dps, kills NPCers fast, hard to catch, evades gatecamps easily. But dies as soon as something with medium/light guns locks it ;p
Endless Subversion The Accursed	Posted - 2009.11.21 01:39:00 - [122] Shameless plug I stand by cyclone, drake and myrm.

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