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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 12:27:00 -
[1]
Currently like on all other ships you can't remove fitted rigs without destroying them. This isn't usually an issue on regular ships because their bonuses, etc are fixed.
On T3 ships though where they were always intended to fit many different roles this is a real bind.
If you go for the subsystem that gives you a bonus to shield/armour HP then naturally one would choose Trimarks/CDFEs to maximise this benefit. If you went with the shield boost/armour rep bonused subsystem you'd likely pick subsystems that either increase this rep (Aux Nano Pump/Nanobot Inj), the duration of shield boost cycles or even just more cap for the booster.
As of right now whilst you can swap out subsystems and modules with ease to radically change the utility of your T3 ship you're forced to either be sub-optimal and go with the same-old-same-old cookie-cutter rigs that everyone fits to every ship anyway, or destroy your rigs every time you want to change your ship.
Allowing people to swap out rigs would improve the market for other rigs that people hardly ever buy (e.g. gravity capacitor upgrade rigs for a dedicated prober T3 ship, etc).
So, how about one of these two solutions:
1) T3 ships retain the same 3 rig slots but you can remove rigs from them the same way as you can remove subsystems.
OR
2) Each subsystem has a rig slot which you can use (or not). When you insert a rig into a subsystem is it in there until you decide to destroy it or replace it.
The calibration would remain the same on the ship, or maybe even different subsystems giving differing amounts of calibration (probably too complex to consider to begin with).
Thoughts?
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 13:23:00 -
[2]
How is it variety when the only obstacle currently is buying more T3 hulls? It's not as if you can't fit all the rigs you want assuming you feel like buying more T3 hulls, unless you figure how much something costs should be the defining factor of whether it is deemed overpowered or not?
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 13:58:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Winters Chill
If you can't afford the 3-10 mil in medium rigs for a t3 refit, you probably shouldn't be flying a t3 ship.
Nice generalisation. I use T2 rigs.
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 15:02:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Durzel on 20/11/2009 15:02:54
Originally by: Sig Sour
Commit to your setup or don't use them.
Cool, so make the subsystems fixed too right? Good job Einstein.
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 17:25:00 -
[5]
Thanks Marko. Seems like only you actually understand what I'm talking about.
Let's take a Legion for example, all lvl 5 skills, each setup has 3 T2 EANMs and a T2 DC.
Legion with 1 1600mm RT plate, "Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating" subsystem = 15054 armour hitpoints, 94,596 EHP
Legion with 1 1600mm RT plate, "Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating" subsystem, 3 T1 Medium Trimark rigs = 22956 armour hitpoints, 137,211 EHP
Legion with 1 1600mm RT plate, "Legion Defensive - Augmented Plating" subsystem, 3 T2 Medium Trimark rigs = 26082 armour hitpoints, 154,156 EHP
Quite a big difference no? Last I checked T2 Trimarks were about 50M each, so not exactly breaking the bank to buy but certainly something you wouldn't want to keep having to buy over and over.
With the active tanking variant:
Legion with 1 T2 Medium Armor repairer, "Legion Defensive - Nanobot Injector" subsystem = 480hp repped every 9 seconds
Legion with 1 T2 Medium Armor repairer, "Legion Defensive - Nanobot Injector" subsystem, 3 T1 Auxiliary Nano Pump rigs = 677.36 repped every 9 seconds
Legion with 1 T2 Medium Armor repairer, "Legion Defensive - Nanobot Injector" subsystem, 2 T2 Auxiliary Nano Pump rigs, 1 T1 Aux Nano Pump = 733.99 repped every 9 seconds
Obviously with the second active-tanking configuration the Aux Nano Pump rigs would be completely useless for a passive tanked build, and likewise Trimarks would be suboptimal for an active-tanking build.
The point I've been trying to make is that if you have a T3 ship now and you want to maximise your build you basically either have to resign yourself to using T1 rigs (suboptimal) and destroying them every time you decide to change your build, or write-off 100M+ every time by destroying your T2 rigs. Or you just carry on buying generic rigs like CCCs which don't make the most of your subsystem choices.
Anyone who doesn't realise the significance of rigs on these ships when they get such huge bonuses to tanking (50% extra hitpoints/50% extra rep/boosting) is an idiot.
It just seems to me that the whole principal of T3 being configurable is ruined slightly by the fixed rig system.
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 18:05:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Durzel on 20/11/2009 18:07:18
Originally by: Whitehound
Originally by: Marko Riva
Which part of "T3 ships are modular but due to T2 rigs they're not really that modular at all" don't you understand.
Choose your rigs wisely or you will need to pull them out again. Seeing you complain about how you rigged your T3 wrong and with T2 rigs is just funny.
It's not a case of rigging it wrong you spastic, you rig it according to whatever works best with the subsystems you're using. Subsystems, I might add, that were designed to be taken out at will.
If you went with a fully passive fit + plate(s) and DIDN'T rig it with Trimarks you'd be doing it wrong, but apparently if you switched to an active-tank fit (for whatever reason - I dunno, wormholing) you've stlil got the Trimarks in which are useless compared to Aux Nano Pumps.
Learn to read eh?
Originally by: Sig Sour
Originally by: Durzel
Cool, so make the subsystems fixed too right? Good job Einstein.
No. Just rigs. That is the way rigs work. Learn the rules.
No shit sherlock, what do you think the point of this thread was? I'll give you a clue: it's not a wiki entry.
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 18:20:00 -
[7]
Holy fuck you really are retarded aren't you.
I figured rigs that "add to armour hitpoints" work best with subsystems that "add to armour hitpoints", and don't work very well with subsystems that don't - was a pretty obvious concept, but I guess not.
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Durzel
The Xenodus Initiative.
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Posted - 2009.11.20 18:32:00 -
[8]
Thanks, at least you understood what it was I was proposing which is a small mercy I guess.
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