Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Zakhodit
Amarr Heretics and Hooligans
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:11:00 -
[1]
Quite often while running missions (lvl 4) I will have interlopers scan me down and start to salvage my wrecks. This is theft pure and simple. If I take action against these thieves then CONCORD will (and has) destroy me.
This makes no sense because often the salvage is equal to or is more than the worth of the loot.
Pilots are stealing from mission runners without those mission runners having the means to stop the theft or react to it. This is a loop hole in the way High Sec is intended to work and it needs to be changed now.
|
darius mclever
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:15:00 -
[2]
waaaaaaah it is this late in the week already?
salvage is not yours. the loot is. salvage is owned by the guy who salvages first. you are late. well bad luck. get over it, its a few hundred thousand isk at most. compared to the millions you made in the mission.
|
Hugo Lordmagnus
Caldari Vexillari
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:43:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Zakhodit Pilots are stealing from mission runners without those mission runners having the means to stop the theft or react to it. This is a loop hole in the way High Sec is intended to work and it needs to be changed now.
While I have plenty of opinions on ninja-salvaging, the most relevant one is that I think it's completely fair game. Here are some ways that you can prevent or respond to it:
1. Bring a friend to salvage for you. 2. Equip a tractor and salvager on your mission ship. 3. Warp out of the mission and come back later. 4. Shoot the wrecks. 5. If you can tank the damage, just stop killing things and wait until they leave. 6. If someone steals loot and you're confident in whatever way you can do it: blow up his/her ship.
I have used any of the above tactics, and nine of ten times, the ninja(s) leave and don't come back. Sometimes you get a persistent one, but from my experience--even in Dodixie--these aren't very common.
So, while I can sympathize with the frustration, I disagree that salvaging others' wrecks should be stealing.
|
Zakhodit
Amarr Heretics and Hooligans
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:43:00 -
[4]
By that same logic the loot is owned by the person who loots first.
Clearly a moron like your self who doesn't understand that the very basis of his argument contradicts his point has no place in this forum.
Begone **** ant.
|
Zakhodit
Amarr Heretics and Hooligans
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:48:00 -
[5]
Quote: 1. Bring a friend to salvage for you. 2. Equip a tractor and salvager on your mission ship. 3. Warp out of the mission and come back later. 4. Shoot the wrecks. 5. If you can tank the damage, just stop killing things and wait until they leave. 6. If someone steals loot and you're confident in whatever way you can do it: blow up his/her ship.
1. Doesn't change the fact that he's not flagged when he steals our salvage and would just get my friend and myself blown up for trying to stop him. 2. I have both on my paladin. I can't salvage everything at once. 3. So that all my salvage is stolen? Seriously what kind of advice is that? 4. Thus destroying my salvage so that NO one can have it. Pure genius. 5. The point is that because it's not a criminal offense, CONCORD will kill me if I attack him. Can't tank CONCORD. 6. They are not stealing the loot, and I'm quite confident I can blow up their ship. They are stealing my Salvage. And I can't blow him up for that because it's NOT a criminal offense which is the point of this thread.
Thank you for your comments and your poor comprehension skills.
|
darius mclever
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:49:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Zakhodit By that same logic the loot is owned by the person who loots first.
Clearly a moron like your self who doesn't understand that the very basis of his argument contradicts his point has no place in this forum.
Begone **** ant.
Oh rofl!:) Cute! :D
Now would you be sad, when i tell you that CCP stated that ninja salvaging is a wanted mini profession in this game? stated multiple times by different GMs?
sadly i always forget to bookmark the thread with the quote.
But i am happy you have a nice colorful language!:D Whine more please. *gets popcorn*
|
Larkonis TrassIer
Neo Spartans Laconian Syndicate
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 20:56:00 -
[7]
That time of the month? Get your tubes tied princess, it won't happen. This is exactly the arguement presented for can theft mechanics. I can guarentee that within an hour of such a change being made and you firing upon an 'interloper' you will have lost your ship and be right back here crying for a rollback.
This is pretty much as is intended. Salvage is 'junk' it's there for everyone, Devs have stated it etc etc. Go and google salvage rights or something.
|
Maxsim Goratiev
Gallente Imperium Technologies
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:07:00 -
[8]
Quote: Salvage is 'junk' it's there for everyone
i disagree, i should be able you WTFPWN ninjasalvagers if they are dumb enough to get into crosshairs of my 8-gunned BS with no transversal. Give ninjasalvager profession some risk.
|
darius mclever
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:11:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Maxsim Goratiev
Quote: Salvage is 'junk' it's there for everyone
i disagree, i should be able you WTFPWN ninjasalvagers if they are dumb enough to get into crosshairs of my 8-gunned BS with no transversal. Give ninjasalvager profession some risk.
And then i can watch the ninja salvager WTFBBQ your leet mission ship with his pvp ship. like that absolution which got pwned by the hurricane. (commandship would beat t1 BC any time no?;))
|
Hugo Lordmagnus
Caldari Vexillari
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:14:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Zakhodit 1. Doesn't change the fact that he's not flagged when he steals our salvage and would just get my friend and myself blown up for trying to stop him. 2. I have both on my paladin. I can't salvage everything at once. 3. So that all my salvage is stolen? Seriously what kind of advice is that? 4. Thus destroying my salvage so that NO one can have it. Pure genius. 5. The point is that because it's not a criminal offense, CONCORD will kill me if I attack him. Can't tank CONCORD. 6. They are not stealing the loot, and I'm quite confident I can blow up their ship. They are stealing my Salvage. And I can't blow him up for that because it's NOT a criminal offense which is the point of this thread.
Thank you for your comments and your poor comprehension skills.
Don't get me wrong; I don't like pilots taking salvage from my missions either. But, in your rush to point out what you perceive as poor comprehension on my part, I think you may have missed that my post was not really advice as much as reasons that I use to support my disagreement with your proposal.
In sum, I believe there are ways to try to protect "your salvage"; therefore, I disagree that salvaging others' wrecks should be a red-flagging or criminal action.
|
|
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar Undivided
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:19:00 -
[11]
Quote:
If I take action against these thieves then CONCORD will (and has) destroy me.
Clearly a moron like your self who doesn't understand that the very basis of his argument contradicts his point has no place in this forum.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:19:00 -
[12]
See here, here, here and here for recent assembly hall threads that failed like yours is going to.
It's all been gone over a hundred times already. Unless you have some new argument to bring other than WAHHH I WANTS IT ALL, then the devs will not change their stated policy that salvage beings to the person who creates it from the wreck, not the person who creates the wreck.
|
darius mclever
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:28:00 -
[13]
Thank you Malcanis! Finally the quotes bookmarked! ;D
|
Zahorite
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:30:00 -
[14]
The problem with flagging them is that then you can blow their ship up, but then they can also come back with a pvp ship and blow your ship up also. And trust me their 10 million (at most) salvaging ship is worth far less than your 150 million (at least) mission ship.
If you really want to get rid of them just blow up the wrecks (as long as they are yours).
Personally my proposal would be to add more salvaging skills into the game. This would make it so that a better salvager would get more salvage. Which would in turn mean that mission runners would basically hire salvagers to salvage their missions since both people could get more out of it.
|
Maxsim Goratiev
Gallente Imperium Technologies
|
Posted - 2009.12.15 21:31:00 -
[15]
Quote: And then i can watch the ninja salvager WTFBBQ your leet mission ship with his pvp ship. like that absolution which got pwned by the hurricane. (commandship would beat t1 BC any time no?;))
Yeah, many ninja looters think the same thing, looks especially funny when one of them gets instapoped and the second one cannot break my tank and dies horribly to drones or warps off in case he is a stabbed *****. In more serious mood: I've killed looters/gankers/salvagers and can flippers, and i got killed by them (when i made a bad call), it's solely my choice if i should shoot him. MOre destruction is good. Nija salvagers should need to protect themselves, and not just print isk, and it's even better if both sides call in teammates. Yes, some idiot died to a hurricane in a commandship because it was mission fitted, obviosly, such people deserve to die. People that nija-salvage in failfit Battleships/Bc's also deserve to die. Survival of the fittest/smartest/people with the most teammates.
|
Syberbolt8
Gallente Terminal Impact Kairakau
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 00:03:00 -
[16]
If you don't like other peoples reply to this thread, your not gonna like CCP's
Per CCP Mitnal: Originally by: CCP Mitnal "Our policy on this is extremely clear... Salvaging is a mini-profession within EVE and does not constitute stealing."
Per GM Faolchu : Originally by: GM Faolchu Salvaging other peoples wrecks.... This is an intended game mechanic and is in no way an exploit. People salvaging your missions npcs or the player you just blew up are doing nothing wrong. The players are salvaging what is effectively floating rubbish in space and Concord places no value on this wreckage. Eve is a harsh place you won't always have everything go your way, its a do or die world and people do what they can to get along. If salvaging some wreckage gets them a few more ISK someone will do it, it doesn't matter who just blew it up.
Per Senior GM Ytterbium : Originally by: GM Ytterbium Players are still completely free to salvage other pilot wrecks at will ... and doing so is not considered as an exploit.
Per CCP Prism X : Originally by: CCP Prism X Why is stealing salvage OK? It's not. It shouldn't even be possible to move an item from your cargo-hold / hanger to another persons cargo-hold / hanger without opening a trade window. Before the salvage enters those containers it is not considered your stuff by the server code. Hence it's not stealing.
The Resurrection: Support the Revised Dead Horse Pos thread in Assembly Hall |
Isaac Starstriker
Amarr The Confederate Navy Forever Unbound
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 00:47:00 -
[17]
Anything that makes high-sec missioning safer I DO NOT SUPPORT. Accept the risk or get more players with you. Quit whining.
--Isaac
Signature is now under construction: check back in a couple weeks. Or months....
AMAAR VICTOR!
"You just can't fix stupid"
|
D melanogaster
Minmatar The Fruit Flys
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 02:19:00 -
[18]
You don't even have one support yet.. and I won't change that...
|
Komi Toran
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 09:31:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Zakhodit 1. Doesn't change the fact that he's not flagged when he steals our salvage and would just get my friend and myself blown up for trying to stop him.
When people steal your salvage, they are flagged. Although why you would put your salvage in a jet can in the first place is a mystery.
|
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 10:46:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Zakhodit Stealing salvage should be a criminal offense.
Pah. Half-measures.
Originally by: Zakhodit Salvaging should be a criminal offense.
|
|
Sokratesz
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 11:48:00 -
[21]
No.
When will TQ hit the 100K PCU mark? Place a bet! |
Dave Meltdown
Capital Construction Inc.
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 12:01:00 -
[22]
Someone should make a wiki or a sticky about the salvaging issue in mission and complexes sub forum.... I cant even tell u how many half arsed salvage whining post i have seen past 3 months....
|
Discrodia
Gallente Experimental Horizons
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 12:35:00 -
[23]
Salvage is not owned by you, it is owned by whoever salvages it first.
This has been explained MANY MANY TIMES by CCP.
If it annoys you so put insurance on your ship and 1-shot the ****ers, but this issue has been beaten to death and you WILL NOT WIN.
Not signed. Countered, in fact.
Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Locked, thread is filled with trolling.
|
Maxsim Goratiev
Imperium Technologies
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 15:26:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Maxsim Goratiev on 16/12/2009 15:29:23 Edited by: Maxsim Goratiev on 16/12/2009 15:26:16
Originally by: D melanogaster You don't even have one support yet.. and I won't change that...
Quote: this issue has been beaten to death and you WILL NOT WIN.
And i say "Yes we can!" I say no to absolutely secure and effortless and skill less profession of ninja salvaging. Hell, miners have more risk then ninja salvagers! And they need to spend alot of time training to make anywhere near the amount ninja salvager makes.
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 15:38:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Sokratesz No.
What about a compromise: remove salvage from hi-sec rats. Problem is then completely resolved forever. Also gives a real reason to go to 0.0
Everyone wins!
Or how about my long-standing Plan B:
Make mission spaces lo-sec. Then missioners can freely shoot naughty salvagers before they can "steal" so much a single Charred Micro Cicuit!
|
Hugo Lordmagnus
Caldari Vexillari
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 15:40:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Komi Toran
Originally by: Zakhodit 1. Doesn't change the fact that he's not flagged when he steals our salvage and would just get my friend and myself blown up for trying to stop him.
When people steal your salvage, they are flagged. Although why you would put your salvage in a jet can in the first place is a mystery.
LOL
|
Insa Rexion
Minmatar CTRL-Q
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 18:23:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Zakhodit By that same logic the loot is owned by the person who loots first.
Clearly a moron like your self who doesn't understand that the very basis of his argument contradicts his point has no place in this forum.
Begone **** ant.
Ships --->(via your guns/missiles)---> loot. you created this, you own it.
Wrecks --->(via the salvager's salvage tackle)---> salvage. if it wasn't your salvage tackle, you don't own it.
Offensive weapons DO NOT create salvage, salvage tackle DOES, ownership confers accordingly --------------------------------------------
well mannered ****ole |
Brasky Bill
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 20:27:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Insa Rexion
Originally by: Zakhodit By that same logic the loot is owned by the person who loots first.
Clearly a moron like your self who doesn't understand that the very basis of his argument contradicts his point has no place in this forum.
Begone **** ant.
Ships --->(via your guns/missiles)---> loot. you created this, you own it.
Wrecks --->(via the salvager's salvage tackle)---> salvage. if it wasn't your salvage tackle, you don't own it.
Offensive weapons DO NOT create salvage, salvage tackle DOES, ownership confers accordingly
This is horrible logic.
What you kill is yours. No matter what. IE: IF I kill a deer, that deer is mine. You can't come in with a knife and say, I'm skinning and cooking the deer thus it's mine.
Look. It is what it is. It's theft. So what?
I agree with the point that stealing salvage is allowed because it offers a mini profession. That's it. it is stealing but it is an intended game mechanic.
|
Sokratesz
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 20:54:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Hugo Lordmagnus
Originally by: Komi Toran
Originally by: Zakhodit 1. Doesn't change the fact that he's not flagged when he steals our salvage and would just get my friend and myself blown up for trying to stop him.
When people steal your salvage, they are flagged. Although why you would put your salvage in a jet can in the first place is a mystery.
LOL
Wow how did I miss that little gem the first time around :P
When will TQ hit the 100K PCU mark? Place a bet! |
Traidor Disloyal
Private Nuisance
|
Posted - 2009.12.16 21:01:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Brasky Bill
Originally by: Insa Rexion
Wrecks --->(via the salvager's salvage tackle)---> salvage. if it wasn't your salvage tackle, you don't own it.
Offensive weapons DO NOT create salvage, salvage tackle DOES, ownership confers accordingly
This is horrible logic.
If you don't have salvage gear on your ship but the other guy does then he gets the salvage cause he made it. Sure, you made the wreak and the loot inside. And that is why he will get flagged if he takes the loot. But he made the salvage which is why it's in his ship. Salvage is never stolen from an NPC wreak. Get over it and move on. ************************************************* I have three characters. One has Cov Ops V along with all the bells and whistles that goes with it. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |