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PavlikX
Shadows of the Day HeII Gate Alliance
5
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 13:58:00 -
[1] - Quote
For now we have situation in the game when Shield tank (ST) is better in general than Armor tank (AT) Inferno gave us new modules in both tanks. I've allready seen few succesful fits with cap booster charges fueled ST modules, meanttime new AT modules are not so good. I can remember one advantage of AT before ST - free medium slots for stasis webs, scramblers and so on. But AT needs Low slots, the same slots weapons uprages demands. It is especially bad, because two races, who uses AT have worst weapons with limited types of damages and high weaponry cap usage. For now CCP declared that all ships will be rebalanced, but i hope that they will fix AT. So i have few sugestions. I don't want the nerf of ST, only AT optimisation. Let it be a rule - ST ships more faster and manerable, meantime AT ships have stronger defence entirely. No other changes.
1. Increase bonuses of armor compensation skills. 2. Inferno module Reactive armor hadener. Good idea. Let this module will be ordinary meta 0 T1 module, meantime CCP will bring to the game full stack of meta levels - meta1-4, meta5 akaT2, meta8, 9 faction modules, dead space and oficer modules. It will be great for PvE runners 3. We have today imo very strange group of modules - Resistance platings. Before Inferno there was useless passive resistance mods. Sorry, i have not seen even single fit with this modules. Their single positive aspect - very low fit demands. All players used Energised platings as passive mods, or Reactive plating as active mods. For now new type was added - Layered plating. The same passive mod with very low fit demands, adding armor HPs. 5% bonus T1 module, 8,5% T2 module. For sure it is more usefull, than old resistance platings, but i can not name it a really effective mods. Armor plates with their penalties and higher fit demands will be more effective imo. So i suggest to join modules in this group. Let it be modules, adding % of armor HP and resistances both. Full line of meta levels included 4. Armor plates. Looks good for now, but according to their penalties it would be great to make them a bit stronger. Also, as i can remeber, there are no dead space and officer armor plates, it must be improoved. 5. Armor repairer system. For now it's acts like shield one, but more slower. But shield hae regenerate ability, meantime armor have not. So i suggest to make possible cap booster charges (CBC) used by reairer system. Without cbc it's act like right now, but if you will charge it with CBC armor repairer will act more faster or will have more repair amount. 6. New active armor resistance module. Uses CBCs. Two options possible a. stronger CBC - more resistances at fixed time d. stronger CBC - longer time with fixed amount of resistances
And it would soooo great, if CCP will fix reactive hardeners, who gave no additional EHP when activated
PS Sorry for my English |

Paikis
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
16
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 14:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
No.
Armour and Shield tanking are different and more or less balanced. What you are asking for would make armor tanks ridiculously over the top. No. |

nahjustwarpin
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 14:19:00 -
[3] - Quote
Paikis wrote:No.
Armour and Shield tanking are different and more or less balanced. What you are asking for would make armor tanks ridiculously over the top. No.
no, they are far from balanced.
problem is the fleet compositions, which have bubblers and tacklers, and this more or less eliminates armor tanking ships with some spare mids (gallente) from current doctrines. gallente ships just don't fit to fly in a blob. don't say that's balanced, because 3 other races have their doctrines. |

Postitute
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
10
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 16:28:00 -
[4] - Quote
nahjustwarpin wrote:Paikis wrote:No.
Armour and Shield tanking are different and more or less balanced. What you are asking for would make armor tanks ridiculously over the top. No. no, they are far from balanced. problem is the fleet compositions, which have bubblers and tacklers, and this more or less eliminates armor tanking ships with some spare mids (gallente) from current doctrines. gallente ships just don't fit to fly in a blob. don't say that's balanced, because 3 other races have their doctrines.
|

Eternal Error
Exitus Acta Probant
48
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 16:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
What you posted is bad. The main problem with armor tanking is the penalty you take to speed. The rig penalties need to be reduced by a fair amount. Plates in general need to be looked at because it gets kind of stupid with cruisers fitting 1600mm plates IMO.
Active tanking for pvp sucks relatively equally for both shield and armor, so I consider it a separate (but significant) issue. |

nahjustwarpin
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
20
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 17:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Postitute wrote:nahjustwarpin wrote:
no, they are far from balanced.
problem is the fleet compositions, which have bubblers and tacklers, and this more or less eliminates armor tanking ships with some spare mids (gallente) from current doctrines. gallente ships just don't fit to fly in a blob. don't say that's balanced, because 3 other races have their doctrines.
2 questions for you: 1) There are some other very potent uses for mid slots beyond straight-up tackling, can you tell me what some of those might be? 2) "because 3 other races have their doctrines" - What fleet doctrines do the squids have besides "fly a Drake"?
1. target painter? ecm? it's already in drakeswarm.
2. whelp fleet(hurricane), drake swarm, alpha fleet (maelstrom with scorpion ecm support), ab zealot, abaddon, alphanado, sniping nagas, sometimes alpha muninns. only ship that gallente has to offer for fleets is lachesis. |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2048
|
Posted - 2012.06.24 22:02:00 -
[7] - Quote
Gall have Ishtarcats. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
314
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 02:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
When BCU's are changed to be middle slots then AT and Shield tanking will be balanced. brb |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2053
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 02:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:When BCU's are changed to be middle slots then AT and Shield tanking will be balanced.
When plates balloon your Sig, shield and armor tanks will be balanced.
They're different styles and sets of benefits/drawbacks.
(Also, armor tanking ships tend to do more damage before damage mods. A Hellcat does around 900dps with just 2 dps mods.) This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
30
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 02:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:When BCU's are changed to be middle slots then AT and Shield tanking will be balanced.
Do you also suggest low slot webs and scrams??
Why do so many people think everything must be exactly the same for it to be "balanced"? Use your brain and capitalize on the strong points of your ship!
I'm sure it wouldn't be very hard to make all ships of each class exactly the same except looks. You would be in a different ship with different weapons but doing the same thing.
As much as I hate to admit it the 'ship" is just something on a computer program. If the computer was programed that the Drake and Hurricane did the exact same things except look different then they would.
The same could be done for modules and weapons.
It would be perfectly "balanced" but would it be any fun???
We could have the Drake and Hurricane with the exact same HP, slots, DPS and all but would that be any fun |

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
8135
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 04:19:00 -
[11] - Quote
PavlikX wrote:For now we have situation in the game when Shield tank (ST) is better in general than Armor tank (AT) Right now, we have a situation which is pretty much exactly the same one as when armour tanks were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ than shield tanks (and they were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ back then in the same way that shields are GÇ£betterGÇ¥ now). All that has changed is the doctrines, and it will swing back towards armour again before long. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
|

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2054
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 04:20:00 -
[12] - Quote
Tippia wrote:PavlikX wrote:For now we have situation in the game when Shield tank (ST) is better in general than Armor tank (AT) Right now, we have a situation which is pretty much exactly the same one as when armour tanks were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ than shield tanks (and they were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ back then in the same way that shields are GÇ£betterGÇ¥ now). All that has changed is the doctrines, and it will swing back towards armour again before long.
Wait, are shield-caps back? This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

Paikis
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 04:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote:Tippia wrote:PavlikX wrote:For now we have situation in the game when Shield tank (ST) is better in general than Armor tank (AT) Right now, we have a situation which is pretty much exactly the same one as when armour tanks were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ than shield tanks (and they were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ back then in the same way that shields are GÇ£betterGÇ¥ now). All that has changed is the doctrines, and it will swing back towards armour again before long. Wait, are shield-caps back?
caps are different :because of slaves: |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2054
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 05:06:00 -
[14] - Quote
Paikis wrote:RubyPorto wrote:Tippia wrote:PavlikX wrote:For now we have situation in the game when Shield tank (ST) is better in general than Armor tank (AT) Right now, we have a situation which is pretty much exactly the same one as when armour tanks were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ than shield tanks (and they were GÇ£betterGÇ¥ back then in the same way that shields are GÇ£betterGÇ¥ now). All that has changed is the doctrines, and it will swing back towards armour again before long. Wait, are shield-caps back? caps are different :because of slaves:
Really, my god. Tell me more. Could it also have something to do with the qualities of Capital missiles? This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

Rel'k Bloodlor
Mecha Enterprises Fleet Villore Accords
191
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 05:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
It's mostly fine the only real problem is that one is best at the smallest end of the scale and one better at the largest end. Aside from that most people just don't know how to use each or enuff about them to know what to use when thats all. Stack on that doctrens that need all ships to fly the same tank and whala in some catigorys its just more likly you will see/use one type. I am in Factional Warfare. Have been from day one.-á-áI will never work for a mega corp in null-sec. Do not make FW like null-sec. Were is the FW exclusive frigate sized ship? I see the cruiser and battle ship.......... |

PavlikX
Shadows of the Day HeII Gate Alliance
6
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 19:16:00 -
[16] - Quote
Have no idea what doctrines you talking about guys :) But according to the statistics ST tanked ships are more often croses the gates then AT ships. I have experience mission "Evolution" on Palladin and i saw like my friend deals with it using Machariel. Shields restores much faster, and Macahariel had no risk at all, mean time i've rewarped using the Paladin, because his armor can not withstand for a long time against fire of over 20 rogue drones different ships. We both fitted in high meta levels. I am talking about small tuning, not revolution. Hardly all my points will bring huge advance to the AT, especially that list is not solid, i am clearly understands that everything there can not be implemented. It would great if CCP will do something (even non included in my list) AT is much worse then ST for PvE at least. More bonus points to armor compensation skills. Is this so strange? Armor is more "hard" thing. More meta levels to the allready existing modules? What's wrong with this? Improovement of compleetly useless group of modules, again, what's wrong with it? and so on.
And i want to ask those, who oposes AT baff, what ships you operate? Harly it will be AT ships |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2063
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 19:22:00 -
[17] - Quote
PavlikX wrote:Have no idea what doctrines you talking about guys :) But according to the statistics ST tanked ships are more often croses the gates then AT ships. I have experience mission "Evolution" on Palladin and i saw like my friend deals with it using Machariel. Shields restores much faster, and Macahariel had no risk at all, mean time i've rewarped using the Paladin, because his armor can not withstand for a long time against fire of over 20 rogue drones different ships. We both fitted in high meta levels. I am talking about small tuning, not revolution. Hardly all my points will bring huge advance to the AT, especially that list is not solid, i am clearly understands that everything there can not be implemented. It would great if CCP will do something (even non included in my list) AT is much worse then ST for PvE at least. More bonus points to armor compensation skills. Is this so strange? Armor is more "hard" thing. More meta levels to the allready existing modules? What's wrong with this? Improovement of compleetly useless group of modules, again, what's wrong with it? and so on.
And i want to ask those, who oposes AT baff, what ships you operate? Harly it will be AT ships
You're having trouble with L4s in a Marauder? That's bad and you should feel bad.
EDIT: Oh, and you balance ships around PvP, not PvE. Armor is just fine. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

PavlikX
Shadows of the Day HeII Gate Alliance
6
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 19:35:00 -
[18] - Quote
Quote:You're having trouble with L4s in a Marauder? That's bad and you should feel bad. Well, that mission is one of the deadliest if you will shoot down trigger in second pocket. Also 6th pocket of Angel Extravaganza in case if i want standart (for all other missions at least) number of heat sinks - 4. Angels are not best NPCs to Amarr players and amount of damage done by my ship is more important in comparison with anti Sansha missions for example. So, i removeone heat sink to replace it with additional energised plating
Both tanks must have clear roles, positive and negative aspects. There must not be universal options (we have this situation for now). CCP must chek one more this matter and rework entire system of penalties and bonuses and modules. |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2064
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 19:47:00 -
[19] - Quote
PavlikX wrote:Quote:You're having trouble with L4s in a Marauder? That's bad and you should feel bad. Well, that mission is one of the deadliest if you will shoot down trigger in second pocket. Also 6th pocket of Angel Extravaganza in case if i want standart (for all other missions at least) number of heat sinks - 4. Angels are not best NPCs to Amarr players and amount of damage done by my ship is more important in comparison with anti Sansha missions for example. So, i removeone heat sink to replace it with additional energised plating Both tanks must have clear roles, positive and negative aspects. There must not be universal options (we have this situation for now). CCP must chek one more this matter and rework entire system of penalties and bonuses and modules.
Active Shield tanking is great for PvE, but, uh, nobody cares about balance between ships with PVE. You pick the right hammer for the job (shield Mach, or Shield NM) and call it good.
With PvP, both Shield and Armor tanks have significant benefits and drawbacks. They're just fine. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
535
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:00:00 -
[20] - Quote
PavlikX wrote:Have no idea what doctrines you talking about guys :)
I'm afraid that blows your credibility talking about ship balance right there. Sad but true. You have to know the metagame in order to talk about balance.
PavlikX wrote:But according to the statistics ST tanked ships are more often croses the gates then AT ships.
Which means what exactly? There are a ton of Drakes and Tengus fit for PvE. They use gates. That means nothing with regard to ship balance.
PavlikX wrote:Hardly all my points will bring huge advance to the AT, especially that list is not solid, i am clearly understands that everything there can not be implemented. It would great if CCP will do something (even non included in my list) AT is much worse then ST for PvE at least.
Armor probably is a bit out of favor in PvE; that much is true. But we don't balance around PvE, we balance around PvP and then make PvE work however it works. And Paladins are pretty much fine here.
PavlikX wrote:More bonus points to armor compensation skills. Is this so strange? Armor is more "hard" thing.
Since when? And why would we want to further encourage people to train armor comps when it's shield comps that are widely regarded as a relative waste of time?
PavlikX wrote:And i want to ask those, who oposes AT baff, what ships you operate? Harly it will be AT ships
I fly both with pretty much equal skill (core skills 5 except TSM, comps 4). And I just finished off Shield Compensation itself. So I guess technically I had better armor tanking skills for years. |

PavlikX
Shadows of the Day HeII Gate Alliance
6
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:21:00 -
[21] - Quote
Yes, i am talking about PvE mainly and can't agree about this game created for PvP players, meantime others must stay aside. Sorry, dut there are no such postulates in the rules :) I am glad that you are agree with me about this part of the game. It was my mistake that i have not indecated more clearly that i am speaking about PvE mainly and have no big PvP experience.
Still i hope that CCP will make few (i repeat, noone needs revolutions, CCP allready done one really big mistake in the past) improovements and changes to the tank system. |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
323
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:21:00 -
[22] - Quote
RubyPorto wrote: Armor is just fine.
When it comes to use ships with bonus to armor resists? yes, significantly increases reps efficiency but that you already know it.
Armor is just not that fine, riggs and plates penalty are far more penalising than signature bloom in ships mostly using MWD's for pvp (sign radius is not a problem apparently ^^). Permanent MWD Drake 1200m/s and capital sign radius is the first example but cookie cutter shield cane is another and on the other side of the rope you've got stand still Abbadon and Rokh ducks with a hell of a buffer resist/profile and shortest range weapon spewing stuff "over there" Take away that +resist on Abbadons and lets see how many we will see around.
PVP is about get the best tool for "x" job, ST ships are generally better on subcap fleets (cap we can debate about slaves or Chimaera no tank cap stable or with tank and no cap after a few reps), caps and supers should just be removed from the game anyway or get bigger ship hangars to just move ships around 
If really armor tanking would be that awesome why does not fleet doctrines use 1K dps Brutix instead of 400'ish dps Drakes? Armagedons, Apocs (Pulse apoc is deadly) Hyperions and Megathrons (/toss)
My male part are already giggling about 2KVindicators raping everything in the system including planets with lost bullets.
brb |

Ayeshah Volfield
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
11
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:31:00 -
[23] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
If really armor tanking would be that awesome why does not fleet doctrines use 1K dps Brutix instead of 400'ish dps Drakes? Armagedons, Apocs (Pulse apoc is deadly) Hyperions and Megathrons (/toss)
I'm not too familiar with drake fleets but aren't these used over the ships like the brutix due to superior dmg projection ?
|

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2064
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:32:00 -
[24] - Quote
Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:RubyPorto wrote: Armor is just fine. When it comes to use ships with bonus to armor resists? yes, significantly increases reps efficiency but that you already know it. Armor is just not that fine, riggs and plates penalty are far more penalising than signature bloom in ships mostly using MWD's for pvp (sign radius is not a problem apparently ^^). Permanent MWD Drake 1200m/s and capital sign radius is the first example but cookie cutter shield cane is another and on the other side of the rope you've got stand still Abbadon and Rokh ducks with a hell of a buffer resist/profile and shortest range weapon spewing stuff "over there" Take away that +resist on Abbadons and lets see how many we will see around. PVP is about get the best tool for "x" job, ST ships are generally better on subcap fleets (cap we can debate about slaves or Chimaera no tank cap stable or with tank and no cap after a few reps), caps and supers should just be removed from the game anyway or get bigger ship hangars to just move ships around  If really armor tanking would be that awesome why does not fleet doctrines use 1K dps Brutix instead of 400'ish dps Drakes? Armagedons, Apocs (Pulse apoc is deadly) Hyperions and Megathrons (/toss) My male part are already giggling about 2KVindicators raping everything in the system including planets with lost bullets.
Alphabaddons, Hellcats, AHACs, and IshtarCats are all armor. That's a good chunk of the common fleet doctrines. Then we have the more esoteric AT3s.
Sig tanking is great when you want to hit above your weight class. See many sig-tanking Shieldboats?
PvP is about Rock Paper Scissors ships/fleetcomps. There is not meant to be a best tool for the job or you get Rock Rock Rock, which is pretty boring.
Arguing that armor is weak because not every ship uses it amazingly well is equivalent to saying that shield tanking sucks because the Abaddon sucks when shield tanked. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

RubyPorto
SniggWaffe YOUR VOTES DON'T COUNT
2064
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:34:00 -
[25] - Quote
PavlikX wrote:Yes, i am talking about PvE mainly and can't agree about this game created for PvP players, meantime others must stay aside. Sorry, dut there are no such postulates in the rules :) I am glad that you are agree with me about this part of the game. It was my mistake that i have not indecated more clearly that i am speaking about PvE mainly and have no big PvP experience.
Still i hope that CCP will make few (i repeat, noone needs revolutions, CCP allready done one really big mistake in the past) improovements and changes to the tank system.
The game is balanced around PvP because relative differences between PvE boats don't actually matter because NPCs don't have a say in this. This is EVE. -á Everybody Versus Everybody. |

Gitanmaxx
Viziam Amarr Empire
49
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 20:35:00 -
[26] - Quote
in my opinion the two new modules are completely backwards. They both make so much more sense and seem like they'd be more logical if flipped. Armor rep is the one that needed the cap booster using repair and shields being the passive long drawn out defense should have the slowly adjusting Resistance mod.
I won't pretend to be an eve genius since I'm almost a noob being a returning player but shield tanking is definitely better than armor tanking currently. That's why the advice even on supposed armor focused ships is to fit shields on. It's suggested that it's better to squeeze a single LSE and one resist mod to an amarr or gallente ship rather than bother with armor tanking it with all those lows. Doesn't that show that something is wrong with armor tanking?
There are many more options and more skills for shield tanking. A passive shield tank can regen faster than an active armor tank in some cases without requiring any cap use. |

Apolyon I
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
88
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 21:08:00 -
[27] - Quote
Gitanmaxx wrote:in my opinion the two new modules are completely backwards. They both make so much more sense and seem like they'd be more logical if flipped. Armor rep is the one that needed the cap booster using repair and shields being the passive long drawn out defense should have the slowly adjusting Resistance mod.
I won't pretend to be an eve genius since I'm almost a noob being a returning player but shield tanking is definitely better than armor tanking currently. That's why the advice even on supposed armor focused ships is to fit shields on. It's suggested that it's better to squeeze a single LSE and one resist mod to an amarr or gallente ship rather than bother with armor tanking it with all those lows. Doesn't that show that something is wrong with armor tanking?
There are many more options and more skills for shield tanking. A passive shield tank can regen faster than an active armor tank in some cases without requiring any cap use. you're pretty wrong, sir.
shield is better in roamming because it has the option to disengage anytime.
generally speaking if 2 fleets commit in a fight, armor wins.
all good pvp ships are armor archon, bhaal, loki, proteus |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
327
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 21:09:00 -
[28] - Quote
Ayeshah Volfield wrote:Lin-Young Borovskova wrote:
If really armor tanking would be that awesome why does not fleet doctrines use 1K dps Brutix instead of 400'ish dps Drakes? Armagedons, Apocs (Pulse apoc is deadly) Hyperions and Megathrons (/toss)
I'm not too familiar with drake fleets but aren't these used over ships like the brutix due to superior dmg projection ?
It's one of the points but not the most important, shield cookie cutter auto canes can't spew crap that far and those are still valid comp, Supers and Titans fear the sight of those. "ho noes not them" Those can be fit MWD or AB fit a hell of a tank and...Cap stable. Hell even armor cane can push about 80k EHP and still push 400dps but they're soooooo slooooooow
First Drakes were used to be cheappo, 6months ago Drake hulls were about 32Mils, now more about 55. Secondly have enough dps in numbers to achieve "x" task and last but not least, battleship tank with a huge resist profile, can perma mwd cap stable and spew stuff over 80km. This makes your fleet value a cheappo throw away you don't mind loosing because it's cost effective.
Being able to project 400dps at 80km does not make it ubber, 720 T2 hotwizer can too and if you look the numbers Alpha is awfully bigger so it's not that much how far you can project missiles with a ship mwd'n and capital sign radius taking 115% dmg. It's a lot easier to keep drakes alive because EHP/resist profile than cookie cutter canes or ridiculous Brutix caping out just because they shoot ammo. Drake has also a ridiculous shield regen amount increasing significantly the more physical hp you have (about 100+ with no shield regen mods and fleet fits), it's an awesome fleet ship just lacking a bit of dps but this is about to change, and it's EHP? -peh 65k instead of 80 and moar dps.
Fleets are usually set with moto "cost effective", you can put on the field 4 drakes for the price of 1 abbadon (full fits +/-), this means more fun and more dudes ready to put some isk for a lot of fun rather then a lot of isk for a big loss and stand still duck like amazing fun game play brb |

IIshira
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
33
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 21:18:00 -
[29] - Quote
Gitanmaxx wrote:I won't pretend to be an eve genius since I'm almost a noob being a returning player but shield tanking is definitely better than armor tanking currently.
In one sentence you state you're pretty much a noob and in the next you make a decisive statement about armor tanking is inferior.
Maybe you should play the game a little more before jumping to conclusions. |

Lin-Young Borovskova
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
329
|
Posted - 2012.06.25 21:34:00 -
[30] - Quote
Apolyon I wrote:all good pvp ships are armor archon, bhaal, loki, proteus
Archon racial ship bonus: 5% all armor resist per level, the best capacitor of 4 carriers
Bhaalgorn: "hey' you seem me there? (50km)" Victim: "pwahaha FU flying banana!" Bhaalgorn: activates 1 energy neut 1 Web Victim: "erm, wtf? -wait, I have 0 cap and can't move??-wtf is this??) Bhaalgorn: "bzzzz -bzzzzz-bzzzz" Victim: "what tha...I didn't even..."
1.5Bill ship = 15 drakes
Proteus: slap 2 faction EANP 1New resist mod TE's plate and med rep(faction is cool) 1explo rig 1trimark 1 ambit extension. Shoot ammo with +25% tracking at 30km+, point at 40km (solo) push battleship HP and HAC dps 1Bil ship = 10 drakes
But we see more often Tengu fleets than ishtar fleets (bombs love for sentry everyone?), or Proteus fleets. Lokis are very common in fleets too however you'll not see full loki fleets tomorrow.
I know I have English grammar issues, however in my book it's completely different saying AT is "completely useless" from "not worthy" or "less good" or "not as effective as" It works in some specific cases that always turn around 2 major points:
-dmg projection: pulse abby ok, blaster mega:no -tank: +5 resist abby ok, blaster armor mega: no
Mega has a good drone bay: 1 set of lights 1 st of sentry Mega has a much better dps: 130k EHP for over 1400dps with
Problem here? -tank, Mega vs Abby has 100% less tank and even if you manage to land on top of those abby they'll pop like popcorn because cost effective = abby, mega is a nice snowflake at gates/station undocks for short time fights brb |
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