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Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.01.28 03:55:00 - [1] Cruor, daredevil, thrasher, jaguar, and ishkur! Provided it catches u or you get a jump on it which ever, thoughs ships can kill the dram. The thrasher can do it if the dude doesnt run which they have from me atleast. Also the jag/ab with a ab can take it down fo sho! Provided you can catch it or it catches u. The iskur can also take it down provided it doesnt try to run away. Ive seen arty drams, duel prop drams, ab drams, and mwd drams. Im sure you can take out anyone of these at some point or another. The dram cant hold down a cruor or daredevil and if it gets close it dies so i would say them! Maybe even the worm can do it with a combination of extreme tank and good dps. But the dram is mEH and pretty last year tbh! Must be a new for the moment by now... Also i would submit the little known armor tanked ab/dram which is hella tanky compared to the shield version with around the same dps. Got the fit from a good sir in back to yarr, but cant be bothered to find it. Its intresting how affective it is to...
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.01.28 06:48:00 - [2] I guess we can agree to disagree about assault ships. About the amour tanked dram; its been putting up major stats and not to mention its the only dram fit to ever beat me thrasher! Honestly when i lost that fight it was hella funny! First the drams with shields my thasher has gone threw hella fast its jsut that they tend to run at that point. Sir Quentin, Val Erian and Kruger81 fly armor tanked drams and have crazy success against steep odds. 3 of the best pilots in game btw you can check them out on battleclinic if u would like... The preformance speaks for it self... Not to mention i have seen a duel prop dram get pwned by a jag, because we warped in only to find are bro already poped the dude with that exact fit btw! Jag over heated ab, the dram couldnt get away under web/scram. the speed of a overheated dram under webs is slower than a over heated jag and they both have around the same dps but one has a better tank! Anyways its not a big deal and drams arent all that uber SOOO CRUOR!!!!
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.01.29 05:18:00 - [3] Edited by: Proxyyyy on 29/01/2010 05:18:05 Darthewok you are pretty spot on dude! The dram is the best because its the most well rounded. Its no unbeatable, and honestly the majority of the fits i see flying around are kiting fits tbh. Also drams miss out on alot of fights because of theyre uber rep. When dom came out i bought the worm and dram but quickly got rid of the dram when i found it to be one of thoughs i win ships... I replaced it with the ship i used to figure out a fit for the dram, which was the firetail and is kinda like the dram! Honestly i to dont like i win ships and it doesnt intrest me atleast in flying them. Mainly cause i like a challenge! I like to fly gimp ships tbh and thoughs that are overlooked entirely (You get more fights that way). Infact i dont like the ham/drake now! becuase its to hyped and the same with the triple rep/mrym BLAH BLAH BLAH! Just gets boring and annoying after awhile and even worse hearing it from pilots who dont solo or fly the ships theyre hyping go on and on about how great they are... Dram is uber but can be beat! Anyways here is the armor tanked fit; THe one that beat my slaved/thrasher was also slaved... [Dramiel, Junk in the Trunk!] 200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Small Armor Repairer II Damage Control II 1MN Afterburner II Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I 200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S 200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S Small Diminishing Power System Drain I Small Trimark Armor Pump I Small Anti-Kinetic Pump I Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Warrior II x3
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.01.29 13:56:00 - [4] Originally by: Kimura Masahiko Wow stop whining, the answer was posted right at the start; Daredevils or Cruors toast Dramiels 1vs1. Just because you fail repeatedly at trying to kill them does not mean they are unkillable. HAHAHA! Anyways show a little respect to kimura. As far as i know he was the originator of that fit and then my bro proz started flying the same fit and made a vid about it! But i think kim theory crafted and flown that dram fit first tbh. Anyways the dram is not a big deal imo and dies like any other ship. You can kite under scram with the cruor and you should prolly slave it; 9067/ehp 100/dps with scorch 2200m/sec you can drop the EANM FOR A HEAT SINK and get around 120 with scorch i think... [Cruor, Bum RUSHA!] Dark Blood Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane 400mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Damage Control II Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Dark Blood Warp Scrambler Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency S Dual Light Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency S Dark Blood Small Energy Neutralizer [empty high slot] Small Energy Burst Aerator I Small Anti-Explosive Pump I Small Anti-Kinetic Pump I
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.07 16:53:00 - [5] Lol Merdaneth at first i thought you were just confirming the drams known strength and not realy whining. The rest of them on here whining doesnt surprise me at all tbh! I'm surprised to see one of the best sader pilots in game here whining about how he cannot undock his sader. Merdaneth you fly the best close range sader fit ingame imo and can take out many other ceptors and t1 frigs. So why are you engaging drams? Im sure u know your ships limitations, unless you believe engaging ships like a claw or dram would produce your desired outcome. I would also consider not gimping yourself by being in PIE inc. with the whole not being able to destroy any random ship you encounter, which limits the amout of targets available to you. The genos use to fly alot of taranis do you want to nerf thoughs? I personaly dont care what they fly or who is piloting, only about how its possibly fit and how effective my ship is against whatever. 90 precent of the frigs in null are either ceptors or cloaky ships. Pilots in null like to run and cloak! If a ship is not able to do thoughs things they cry about how theyre gimp. Af's Strength are in tank, firepower and not in overall speed. These pilots want af's to be like ceptors! Which is essentially what ccp tried to do, then reverse that decision not to make af's so overpowered they would bring back a new nano age. The dram is what all thoughs who feared the af buff would do. My concern was they would produce ships that could sig tank most incoming damage with the focus on buffing bonuses towards (Afterburners). In low sec the picture is more diverse than null and many ship types are cultivated. In low sec Af 's are seen even more than ceptors and are for the most part (omg AB fit)! This is where destroyer's where used to maximuim affect, rifters got theyre reputation and so on. The Changes to scram gimped many ceptors and boosted mainly the claw. It gimped the ranis to the point that rifters, merlins and punisher are able to defeat them with no trouble. To which duel prop ranis's tried to but failed to fix that issue atleast against ab/t1 frigs. Some quickly changed with the new way of things and started to ab fit certain frigs which now found that theyre more viable against cruisers and battlecruisers. At the time i thought af's are now overpowered, but was quickly balanced with the new way of fitting cruisers and above. It was nothing that a combo of neuts and drones couldnt fix! Even small blaster thorax's made that ship more viable to the new dangers.
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.07 17:01:00 - [6] Recently one of my corpmates asked me about soloing blobs and killing ceptors! He found that he couldnt kill ceptors and how is anyone able to take out ships with their fleet on grid watching. Ceptors (he went on to say) didnt want to engage his jag and he couldnt get to them even if he wanted too. I then asked him if he wanted to gimp himself against 75% of the other frigs/destroyers in eve that are not ceptors. If you drop your ab for a mwd you will gimp yourself in combat just to be able to kill ceptors. Then why use a mwd at all? Well If you wannna solo blobs i.e. split them up on grid otherwise i dont see a reason to use mwd's on a frigs that are not ceptors in low sec. In null where most frigs are ceptors you might as well fit mwd's because the chances of you finding another af/frig/Ab is slim to none. Under scram range's ab's are superior in frig combat and the only reason this has'nt found its way to null is because of the fear of bubble/Hics. Under scram ranges the ab dram is unstoppable but the duel prop dram without duel overdrives and snakes can be held down and killed by any af with web/scram and overloaded ab. The tank on the dram is very much overstated and must mean that the dudes your fighting are to busy running away to fire back = ) or are crows. The Worm with a ab/scram/web can indeed beat a duel prop dram but not hold a ab focused dram. The worms strength is in its tank which is substantial and its balanced dps which is about 135 with a neut. The worm is more a counter to the daredevil and curor than it is to the dram in anycase. The worm can beat any ship destroyer and below be it t2 or faction. The curor is not gimp and is able to deal better with multi-ple targets than the dram could. Within its 18.9k Sphere of influence its the fastest ship and in beast mode can take alot of damage something that the dram cannot do! The diffrence between the cruor and dram is like mohamed ali and george foreman. If you get into the cruor or daredevils web range its over! The worm doesnt have that fear because its just a beast and doesnt realy need to move. The worm's only weakness is its drones! Compared that to the ishkur's active repair, shortrange/slaster's which also use's cap, speed and its drones... Ive engaged many drams and have only lost once to a armor tanked version while the rest just got away because of speedz!!!!!!!!!!! I have even engaged drams in my gank fitted firetail forcing them off grid once they feel the damage and that its not a push ovA!!! Also as far as i know the claw is the only ceptor that is not a push over for the dram because i have went after them in it tooo = ) I guess when i start dieing to them alot i'll start whining about it. Untill then i gots no issue with them... "Adapt or die"
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.08 00:10:00 - [7] Edited by: Proxyyyy on 08/02/2010 00:10:36 Onin Ra I dont agree bro! I remember having a convo with you about the ranis and claw and how you felt it was overpowered etc. I then suggest a alternative to the setup your use to, which was the rail ranis. the claw has its weaknesses and i was guessing you came to that conclusion after engaging proz who will more than confirm the claws weaknesses. My bro annie flies the rail ranis and has no trouble taking out any other ceptor ingame including the 400mm plate claw. But you came to the conclusion that the ranis sucks and is now out classed my minmatar whatever! You didnt want to adapt or atleast was not open to the use of a rail ranis or even doubted it could work even though it does. I dont need to tell you how to fly your ships or how to fit them because your a good pilot period... But im not sure why you like many others quickly decide that a ship or weapon system is overpowered without trying to find a more well rounded fit that can do what you do generaly and counter something your not incline to face. I have no fear in space and will engage just about anything, many know that! Im also open to any new fits or concepts just to understand my own ships limitations and strength not bias's. Merdaneath knows his limitions but went after a dram anyways and he's now on the "over powered" train when a 200mm/Repper claw or 400mmplate claw with or without a ab can take him out everytime! Why didnt he come to the conclusion that the claw is omg overpowered? Anyways Merdaneath here is something that can eat a dram and most af's but cant hold a dram down and is a amarr ship btw = ) [Imperial Navy Slicer, Look into the light!] 200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I Adaptive Nano Plating II Small Armor Repairer II F85 Peripheral Damage System I Heat Sink II Catalyzed Cold-Gas I Arcjet Thrusters Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I Gatling Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency S Gatling Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency S Small Diminishing Power System Drain I Small Energy Locus Coordinator I Small Energy Locus Coordinator I Small Energy Locus Coordinator I Yeah a sentinal can take out a curor and daredevil but against a worm or dram i doubt it! Anyways the cruor daredevil can preform just as well against most targets not just the dram. In frig combat what non pirate faction ships can realy beat them? imo maybe 1 or 3. Pretty much alot of dudes are more incline to whine than actually go out and test new setups or try new things at all! In eve there are Innovators and imitators. Most pilots wait till someone good who is not inclined to just brand a ship "garbage" and try the thing then when it produces great results the sheep jump on the train then start talking about how good the ship is. Not to mention thoughs who are not quick to adapt to new changes will always be left behind asking for something to be nerfed or boosted! What if i just started linking pilots that fly worms, daredevils and curor's destroying drams and other frigs would that help? Cause there are btw... Adapt or be destroyed...
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.08 19:31:00 - [8] Edited by: Proxyyyy on 08/02/2010 19:32:18 Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Slicer does jack **** to a Dramiel. You get exactly one volley before its under the guns .. it has speed enough to tracking tank DLPII@4km for Goddess sake. Tried it and it doesn't work, you quite simply lose the dps race which decides all frig bouts. Caracal will by its very nature (Assault launchers everywhere now) prevent the Dramiel from ever engaging, so boohoo awesome counter. Dramiel has enough buffer and speed to go in to test the damage output and bug out if it isn't doable (can almost be done in an AB Crusader). Yes Curse will probably kill a Dramiel if it chooses to engage, but so will a Titan DD .. see, anyone can make ridiculous statements. And the gang/blob argument, really? Have you FoTM jockeys run out steam already? You still have to make a single argument that wasn't made in defence of nano's prior to Quantum Rise. Dramiel can be killed, Dramiel does have counters .. but it can only be killed if it chooses to (ie. messes up) and counters are limited to 2-3 ships that is able to serve a purpose beyond killing Dramiel's, everything else needs gimp-fits to do it. Anyways Im not sure why pilots are so in love with duel lights! Gats have better tracking, less cap usage, with a slight damage reduction. The slicer is pretty much a tanky crusader with less overall dps and speed. The kiting fit that is out there alot can easly taken out and fill killboards everywhere! The ship it self is slower than the hookbill and the firetail can skool it all day! imo it should be tanked and operate under scram range. Now if you gimp the tank and put just reppers alonet even a claw/ranis can still take it out which my corpmate quickly found out! The plate and active repair adds the ehp and damage mitigation nessecary to make that fight one sided. Crusader lacks the tank of the slicer and capacitor. So imo its better equipped and i was mainly recommending it to someone who is a amarr role player who can only fly amarr ships. It also maybe unbelievable to pilots on these forums that feel there fits are better than others and no one should ever use anything else. What this thread perceived to be a "general fit" is not what is use ingame by the majority of pilots. Alot of the dram fits out there are kiting or ab drams and its very rare that you'll actually engage duel-prop/drams. So yeah in that case that slicer fit has more than the ability to engage them effectively!
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.08 20:32:00 - [9] Anyways on topic; all ships splode at some point or another to whatever. There are plenty of ships that can take out the dram not to mention the good old gank! null Jaguar V Dram null Worm V Dram null Thrasher V Dram Anyways there was this dude that took out 5 drams in his slicer. 2 of them being the same dram fit this thread is on about... I have to ask my bro for the link again and ill post it.
Proxyyyy Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2010.02.08 22:10:00 - [10] Originally by: Kadesh Priestess Edited by: Kadesh Priestess on 08/02/2010 21:48:07 Edited by: Kadesh Priestess on 08/02/2010 21:46:33 Originally by: Proxyyyy Anyways on topic; all ships splode at some point or another to whatever. There are plenty of ships that can take out the dram not to mention the good old gank! null Jaguar V Dram null Worm V Dram null Thrasher V Dram Anyways there was this dude that took out 5 drams in his slicer. 2 of them being the same dram fit this thread is on about... I have to ask my bro for the link again and ill post it. Killmails are lame argument because they don't offer all the information for analysis. Fraps from both sides, gamelogs, list of skills, equipment and implants can provide enough info for that. Otherwise... t1 cruiser kills carrier c/d? ps I know Mortaly... CEO of his corp are my friends :P he flies ab-only jag. Why all these counters barely can kill dram while they don't offer such mobility and several other cool thingies? Whatever! I dont care about all that or realy why it happened only that it did and was hella funny! Anyways the point was all ships explode, not every pilot in eve is good or has max skillz. ME SHOOT IT WIT ME GUNNZ!!! Plus yeah i agree with you about the Killmail/killboards whatever. Ab/jag ftw btw... STABBA POWA = )

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