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Icarus3 Gallente DAEDALUS X The Star Fraction	Posted - 2010.02.01 14:53:00 - [91] Originally by: kossaw You can spin the propaganda in a million different ways, but it boils down to some simple facts ...... 1. Provibloc and -A- are sparring partners, not natural born enemies 2. When CVA lost Sov due to a malfunction of the CONCORD database, -A- was among the groups who stepped up to help you 3. LFA's leadership have made a stupid decision to try and change the mutualy understood borders of our space 4. -A- have responded to LFA's aggression with a show of force but followed up with an offer to return to the status quo between us The choice is now up to you. We have made our offer.If you choose to accept then we will welcome the return to our previous happy (ish) relationship which I believe we both benefited from. If not, then -A- will burn Providence to the ground. We do not ask or expect servitude. You are our respected neighbours. We only ask for the same respect that we have shown you. Noble of AAA. But why? Considering the statements above... why offer then anything let alone a station you recently took control of?
kossaw H A V O C Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.02.01 15:09:00 - [92] See point 1
Lykouleon Trust Doesn't Rust Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 15:30:00 - [93] Originally by: Mighty Baz Providence is sill loved by most of EvE community, because of individual feature. Start naming those lovers and you'll be suprised at how short the list is. Providence is a space-faring joke, with more and more of its disgruntled former members returning to destroy that which they once protected. (([/troll] this is IGS, take the OOC stuff to CAOD where i can troll you more epically)) Quote: CCP Mindstar > Sorry - I've completely messed all that up. lets try again
desertfly Caldari Blackbeards Last Stand	Posted - 2010.02.01 15:33:00 - [94] *turns on his communications device. I would like to suggest a different type of peace treaty; you see I believe that Curatores Veritatis Alliance and Against ALL Authorities could have a treaty that mutually benefits everyone living in the Catch and Providence areas. The ugly impression of who started what in this little border war is actually wrong, Libertas Fidelitas Alliance is not the culprit, but the Ushra'Khan Alliance of corporations might be! ThatÆs right Ushra'Khan is the alliance that everyone needs to be watching. You see, they are always causeing trouble and, and bloody trouble at that. They pod anyone they feel does not support there cause. Everyone knows that the Holders Alliances operate a NRDS system. They love peace. Ushra'Khan on the other hand, runs a modified version of NRDS, if you are not red to Holders, and fly through Providence, then you are very red to the Ushra'Khan Alliance. Maybe the Holders thought they had no other choice? I am fairly sure that Against ALL Authorities and Curatores Veritatis Alliance could get along quite well together, if only Ushra'Khan would publicly announced there willingness to lay down there arms perhaps? Stop flying into Providence once and for all? Change there NRDS policy. Or more then likely, if Ushra'Khan wonÆt or canÆt stop attacking innocent pilots and corporations and alliances, then maybe they should be put out of there own misery? Now ask yourself what could be gained by this peace treaty? A completely secure border, for the Against ALL Authorities alliance of corporations? The completion of part of the ôProject Deliveranceö for the Curatores Veritatis Alliance? Maybe this is the win, win situation for everyone? Anyway I thought this might be a good idea.
kossaw H A V O C Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.02.01 15:52:00 - [95] Originally by: desertfly *turns on his communications device. stuff Good grief, have you even thought for a few seconds past the cheap "he said she said" crap about U'K and Provibloc. You didn't attack U'K. You attacked -A-. Forget the political dogma (read roleplay) and get with the real world of practical politics. We have made you an offer of a "treaty that mutually benefits everyone". Talk to your leaders and get it sorted.
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 15:52:00 - [96] Desertfly, U'K roe are stunningly simple: NRDS except in Providence and Catch where we operate NBSI. If you are in Providence and the Provibloc held elements of Catch then you are supporting CVA. CVA are very clearly working for the empire to 'reclaim' space in its name and thus enslave people. Just because every single person in providence is not aware of the regime they are supporting doesn't give them the right to not be shot at. Ever heard the adage, if its too good to be true it probably is? Ushra'Khan are of course a war like entity, in fact I believe it is because we were a war like entity we came to the attention of -a-. Whilst based in Curse we were mainly Red to -a- for those with short memories. We are commited to defending our space and the space of our close allies in -a- and obviously we commit ourselves further afield in support of those intentions. The CVA and Ushra'Khan fight is long and bloody and there are many facets to be found for those that have only joined recently. Ask around and try and learn a bit more about the history before making some ill advised assumptions based on whatever propoganda you were fed on joining up.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:02:00 - [97] Originally by: Sapphrine Desertfly, U'K roe are stunningly simple: NRDS except in Providence and Catch where we operate NBSI. If you are in Providence and the Provibloc held elements of Catch then you are supporting CVA. CVA are very clearly working for the empire to 'reclaim' space in its name and thus enslave people. Just because every single person in providence is not aware of the regime they are supporting doesn't give them the right to not be shot at. Ever heard the adage, if its too good to be true it probably is? If PIE were to start operating along NBSI principles in low-sec Republic territory, we would rightly be condemned for it, and no doubt supporters of your cause would be amongst our most vocal critics. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Maurok Ortega Minmatar Universal Army Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:17:00 - [98] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Sapphrine Desertfly, U'K roe are stunningly simple: NRDS except in Providence and Catch where we operate NBSI. If you are in Providence and the Provibloc held elements of Catch then you are supporting CVA. CVA are very clearly working for the empire to 'reclaim' space in its name and thus enslave people. Just because every single person in providence is not aware of the regime they are supporting doesn't give them the right to not be shot at. Ever heard the adage, if its too good to be true it probably is? If PIE were to start operating along NBSI principles in low-sec Republic territory, we would rightly be condemned for it, and no doubt supporters of your cause would be amongst our most vocal critics. We are not the republic fleet and we have no ties to the minmatar republic anymore. If you decide to engage in piracy in any empire space it is not of our concer. If you start taking, trading or utilizing slaves then we will come for you. Desertfly: We will lay down arms the day all men are free and no man would call himself master over another. We fight for those who dont have a choice, those who can't fight for themselves. Those who's forced labour you and all your "peace loving", "innocent" friends keep utilizing and benefiting from. We come for our people
Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:21:00 - [99] Getting U'K to stop fighting you is even simpler than our ROE, renounce slavery, stop supporting those who practise the deplorable practise and UK will not shoot you. If everyone in new eden did this, UK would lay down our arms, because we would have nothing left to fight for and nobody to fight about it.
Uprising	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:29:00 - [100] Well that statement is welcomed but I will slave for my masters. I will assist to reclaim ammar space how ever it be for my adopted god the combined peoples of prov. I just hope the next provi blob we all put our hands in our pockets and bring a real fight to reclaim D-G. I personaly welcome the AAA redrawal from D-G but under no surrender terms, UK have poke there noise to much in our space so you AAA started this war a long time ago. May main more pilots blood spill in D-G and the increasing expense on both sides force the withdrawal either way I will continue my offense on command.
desertfly Caldari Blackbeards Last Stand	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:34:00 - [101] *Stares intently at Sapphrine through the communications monitor, I think you mean the Holder alliances and the Ushra'KhanÆs fight is long and bloody. Do not propose, that members of the Ushra'Khan corporationÆs have any special legitimate history in Providence, because terrorism is not, and can not be ôlegitimateö. Make no mistake Sapphrine everyone in the area knows the inhumanities visited upon us and our friends by your member organisations. The only one here spreading propaganda is yourself. The NRDS system that your corporations run is no better then NBSI. You shoot who ever displeases you. This has been proven time and time again. If the neutral pilot does not publicly support your views, then they are shot. This is terrorism or?
Xennith Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:37:00 - [102] Originally by: desertfly the Ushra'Khan corporationÆs have any special legitimate history in Providence bursts into laughter, tears streaming down her face Oh, thats a good one. Tell me another.
Uprising	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:53:00 - [103] Yeah Cloak and run ! lol.
Sapphrine Neh'bu Kau Beh'Hude Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 16:58:00 - [104] Originally by: desertfly The NRDS system that your corporations run is no better then NBSI. You shoot who ever displeases you. This has been proven time and time again. If the neutral pilot does not publicly support your views, then they are shot. This is terrorism or? Since we're all busy on other matters in this particular thread, I'd ask you to look back through the archive and find the longer answers on this matter but in short: CVA set anyone that does not follow a codified set of rules they have defined, to red. On top of that, even if you do follow it but you annoy the right people, they'll set you red. This is no different to us setting people red because they side with slavers either overtly or otherwise.
Merdaneth Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2010.02.01 17:47:00 - [105] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Sapphrine Desertfly, U'K roe are stunningly simple: NRDS except in Providence and Catch where we operate NBSI. If you are in Providence and the Provibloc held elements of Catch then you are supporting CVA. CVA are very clearly working for the empire to 'reclaim' space in its name and thus enslave people. Just because every single person in providence is not aware of the regime they are supporting doesn't give them the right to not be shot at. Ever heard the adage, if its too good to be true it probably is? If PIE were to start operating along NBSI principles in low-sec Republic territory, we would rightly be condemned for it, and no doubt supporters of your cause would be amongst our most vocal critics. Indeed, if PIE were to operate NRDS everywhere except inside the Amarr Empire (its home) and the Republic territories (its enemy) I think people would rightly think PIE an NBSI entity with some exceptions. No one really cares if PIE practices NBSI in Delve or in Venal, they care about what PIE practices in the areas they frequent the most. The same is true of Ushra Khan. They are an NBSI alliance with exceptions. However, this is not really what this thread is about. The question remains if the continued and directed attacks of Ushra Khan, while -A- provides them a home, can support a state of 'limited' war between CVA and holders as -A- seems to prefer. ____ The Illusion of Freedom \| The Truth about Slavery
Hawkcrest	Posted - 2010.02.01 18:00:00 - [106] Originally by: Sapphrine Originally by: desertfly The NRDS system that your corporations run is no better then NBSI. You shoot who ever displeases you. This has been proven time and time again. If the neutral pilot does not publicly support your views, then they are shot. This is terrorism or? Since we're all busy on other matters in this particular thread, I'd ask you to look back through the archive and find the longer answers on this matter but in short: CVA set anyone that does not follow a codified set of rules they have defined, to red. On top of that, even if you do follow it but you annoy the right people, they'll set you red. This is no different to us setting people red because they side with slavers either overtly or otherwise. I have to Agree with Sapphrine's assesment here. I spent from 2005-2008 supporting providence and CVA goals, and working to develop a relationship with much of providence. I belived in the development of those freindships then and now. I formed my first 1000 man allinace with the intention of working within CVA politics to expand thier policies to other regions. I fully expected that my time having been spent defending thier space and working with others would be recognized. I soon found that CVA the alliance have a double standard that they apply to themselves vs others they work with in thier circle of control. there seemd to be a good ole boy network that was based on who you knew rather then what you had contributed through dedication and work within the area. I guess this should have been expected as with any 0,0 entity, but I belived in the ideals they claimed to posses. I heard a particular lie repeated to me often "hang around the area for 6 months, keep your nose clean and good things will happen for you" Well I spent 3 years supporting providence through various means developing my team and expanding our influence through development and growth, but at the end of the day I always let Aralis know he could count on us. My final straw with CVA was when they interfered with a disagreement that was far from thier territories, based on an alliance who agressed our corporation in Outer Ring by the name of Black Isle. MY guys spent the next 3 days Killing every Black Isle corp that undocked in that NPC region until they cried to CVA to have us leave the area. a CVA diplo convoed us and we informed them of the situation, that these guys agressed us and should be set KOS, CVA insisted they were blue to them even though they were "NBSI" and I needed to move my corp down to the Lowsec surrounding Providence and patrol for UShra Khan. My answer to that was quite clear, they wouldnt support us, why should we continue to support them. It was strange to find ourselves flying with Unity on occasion given our past histories, but for the roleplay aspect of thier gameplay they are a pleasure to deal with most of the time. My only regret is I enjoyed my personal relationship with Aralis as he has helped my corporation on occasion, but the lack of respect shown by the rest of the commanders in CVA had reached a boiling point in my corporation. From late 2008 to 2010 We have gone through much, but my decision to work with -A- long term has not disspointed me nor my pilots. We have enjoyed much respect from our senior partner with the exception of the occasional shot for being a renter corp, we share the battlefield with -A- Proudly and will continue to do so in the future. I must say the respect we have begun to earn with -A-, and recognition of our efforts is a refreshing contrast to the contempt we were greeted with from our past allies I hope I have not overstepped any boundaries by posting here and look forward to the pew, GL and fly safe, or unsafe depending on your realities in this game we call eve.
Eolandae Minmatar Minmatar Ship Construction Services Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.02.01 18:25:00 - [107] Edited by: Eolandae on 01/02/2010 18:27:41 Slavers and religious Kooks of Providence, I don't know much about your God, but I've heard (ad nauseum) about the mission you carry out for Him. I imagine He is already displeased by your failure to hold D-G in His name. Wouldn't capitulation to a mortal authority and acceptance of limitations of your borders be turning your back on His mission? At this point martyrdom is probably your best chance for salvation. I, for one, encourage you to continue grinding your ships and pilots into a meaty paste, and am only to happy to assist with your redemption.
William Pierce Caldari Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.02.01 18:26:00 - [108] CVA, I suggest you reconsider.
Samuel Cole Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2010.02.01 18:53:00 - [109] Originally by: Eolandae Slavers and religious Kooks of Providence, I don't know much about your God, They know less about their God then they think they do.
Liam Fremen Insurgent New Eden Tribe Systematic-Chaos	Posted - 2010.02.01 19:12:00 - [110] I, as sys-k executor confirm that sys-k fully approve and support the proposal that Manfred gave to CVA. Wake up guys, from the first time aaa and us decided to come to d-g and ass-**** you the objective was to open a diplomatic channel and offer you this. If you want to take the chance ok, otherwise it means you have to find a lot of isk for replacing the thousands of ships that will cost your proudness. Have fun o/ -- Systematic-Chaos, Executor
Charlemeign BESTIAL CARNAGE	Posted - 2010.02.01 19:58:00 - [111] This is honestly the most stupid thread I have ever seen on the eve-o forums.
Mad Frontier	Posted - 2010.02.01 20:53:00 - [112] Edited by: Mad Frontier on 01/02/2010 20:53:59 Providence will burn, im ready for it Just give us a go Liam
Dirk Culliford H A V O C Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.02.01 21:26:00 - [113] We come for your people!
Nooblog Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:15:00 - [114] What exactly are your demands and what was discussed as a resolution? You say that there was a scenario where D-G was handed back. Enlighten the citizens of Providence so that we may understand your side a bit better. From where we stand, you are harboring UK against the wishes of CVA. In my opinion, if you wanted to, or truly cared, for keeping neighbors as friends, you would have rectified this a long time ago. If you are as powerful as you say you are, why do you need UK to bolster your numbers?
Daughter Aggressive Commerce Solutions Ltd.	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:20:00 - [115] Edited by: Daughter on 01/02/2010 22:20:42 Originally by: Nooblog What exactly are your demands and what was discussed as a resolution? You say that there was a scenario where D-G was handed back. Enlighten the citizens of Providence so that we may understand your side a bit better. From where we stand, you are harboring UK against the wishes of CVA. In my opinion, if you wanted to, or truly cared, for keeping neighbors as friends, you would have rectified this a long time ago. If you are as powerful as you say you are, why do you need UK to bolster your numbers? I believe thus far its been a pretty straight foward offer of "here have your station back, dont invade our space again" regarding AAA's relationship with UK, I think the general attitude is to kindly mind your own business. I don't think AAA is interested in group hugging up and down providence and catch, but instead AAA wants to preserve the mutual respect and limited hostility. Many would have you believe that AAA is the cat playing with a mouse, but I would urge you to consider that the relationship between AAA and Provi over the past years have yielded not only pvp enjoyment for AAA members but also the residence of providence. To say that AAA gains from Provi stepping down and thereby shaming itself is rather shallow. We provide you with pvp as much as you provide us, and to disregard this mutually beneficial relationship, however unoffical it may be, would be a true shame.
Nooblog Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:27:00 - [116] Originally by: Daughter Edited by: Daughter on 01/02/2010 22:20:42 Originally by: Nooblog What exactly are your demands and what was discussed as a resolution? You say that there was a scenario where D-G was handed back. Enlighten the citizens of Providence so that we may understand your side a bit better. From where we stand, you are harboring UK against the wishes of CVA. In my opinion, if you wanted to, or truly cared, for keeping neighbors as friends, you would have rectified this a long time ago. If you are as powerful as you say you are, why do you need UK to bolster your numbers? I believe thus far its been a pretty straight foward offer of "here have your station back, dont invade our space again" regarding AAA's relationship with UK, I think the general attitude is to kindly mind your own business. I don't think AAA is interested in group hugging up and down providence and catch, but instead AAA wants to preserve the mutual respect and limited hostility. Many would have you believe that AAA is the cat playing with a mouse, but I would urge you to consider that the relationship between AAA and Provi over the past years have yielded not only pvp enjoyment for AAA members but also the residence of providence. To say that AAA gains from Provi stepping down and thereby shaming itself is rather shallow. We provide you with pvp as much as you provide us, and to disregard this mutually beneficial relationship, however unoffical it may be, would be a true shame. To preserve the mutual respect, wouldn't -A- and pets have had to respect CVA in the first place by respecting the wishes to keep UK out of Amarr space? They are murderers, they do nothing but terrorize the neutral, innocent who make use of the relatively peaceful space in Providence. This campaign -A- has set out on to consider anyone in the space as an enemy means they are willing to attack and kill the innocent. They have openly admitted to being murderers and New Eden should be aware of the criminal acts being done not only by UK, but now by -A- and pet corporations.
Samuel Cole Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:30:00 - [117] Edited by: Samuel Cole on 01/02/2010 22:32:20 Originally by: Nooblog From where we stand, you are harboring UK against the wishes of CVA. In my opinion, if you wanted to, or truly cared, for keeping neighbors as friends, you would have rectified this a long time ago. If you are as powerful as you say you are, why do you need UK to bolster your numbers? If -A- thinks that Ushra'Khan would be better neighbors than CVA has been, then it would make total sense for them to topple CVA's control of Providence and allow U'K to step into the gap. Personally, I hope this happens. Originally by: Nooblog They have openly admitted to being murderers and New Eden should be aware of the criminal acts being done not only by UK, but now by -A- and pet corporations. Criminal according to whom? There is no international law in nullsec. -A- is a sovereign power, beholden only to the treaties it makes.
Nooblog Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:34:00 - [118] Edited by: Nooblog on 01/02/2010 22:35:15 Originally by: Samuel Cole Originally by: Nooblog From where we stand, you are harboring UK against the wishes of CVA. In my opinion, if you wanted to, or truly cared, for keeping neighbors as friends, you would have rectified this a long time ago. If you are as powerful as you say you are, why do you need UK to bolster your numbers? If -A- thinks that Ushra'Khan would be better neighbors than CVA has been, then it would make total sense for them to topple CVA's control of Providence and allow U'K to step into the gap. Personally, I hope this happens. Because you and your Alliance have never been able to accomplish anything on your own and are hoping to pick up the scraps of what is left behind. In specific, admit you're targeting -7- space to setup shop. I have a question for you. Lets say Providence was purged of CVA and all the space was up for grabs. Would your alliance turn down offered sov under -A-? Originally by: Samuel Cole Criminal according to whom? There is no international law in nullsec. -A- is a sovereign power, beholden only to the treaties it makes. Under the code of god.
Daughter Aggressive Commerce Solutions Ltd.	Posted - 2010.02.01 22:49:00 - [119] Edited by: Daughter on 01/02/2010 22:53:06 Originally by: Nooblog To preserve the mutual respect, wouldn't -A- and pets have had to respect CVA in the first place by respecting the wishes to keep UK out of Amarr space? They are murderers, they do nothing but terrorize the neutral, innocent who make use of the relatively peaceful space in Providence. This campaign -A- has set out on to consider anyone in the space as an enemy means they are willing to attack and kill the innocent. They have openly admitted to being murderers and New Eden should be aware of the criminal acts being done not only by UK, but now by -A- and pet corporations. I wasn't RPing, your RP response holds no realizable value in the greater eve community regarding the topic at hand. Again, maybe respect is too strong of a word to describe the relationship between AAA and CVA over the paste to years. Think what you want of other players but you cannot deny that providence has benefited from being able to engage against a nearby enemy without expecting serious reprisal as result. Again this is not a RP statement, please don't talk to me about murderers, criminals and innocence, Thanks.
William Pierce Caldari Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.02.01 23:19:00 - [120] ((This thread has gone way outside the bounds of RP, should be moved)) Anyways, Providence has less than an hour left to respond. I hope they accept the generous -A- offer, but I have a feeling their pride will be their undoing.

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