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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
13
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Posted - 2012.06.28 15:42:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hey all -
Sorry to bring these news, but we need to delay getting CREST into your hands. This is due to a couple of things - it has taken us longer than we expected to get the legal side of the "Developer License" in place, and we are also busy with making CREST work like it needs to for DUST 514.
Once we do get the beta rolling, we will start on Sisi as many of you have suggested. We are also likely to roll out some of the supporting infrastructure before the actual API access - stuff like signing up as a developer, and starting to create apps and select what oAuth scopes you'd like for the app to use. I don't have any release dates for this yet though.
So - no big picture plans have changed - we are releasing CREST to 3rd party devs, it will have read-write functionality, and it will be the same tech as we use ourselves, that we just extend to you through oAuth. We just need a bit more time to get it ready for external consumption.
Thanks for your patience, and let me know if you have any questions.
/CCP Seagull
Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Dragonaire
Corax. The Big Dirty
45
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Posted - 2012.06.28 20:57:00 -
[2] - Quote
Sorry to hear about the delay but can understand it taking a while since it's a major change for CCP as well on the inside to make it happen. Finds camping stations from the inside much easier. Designer of Yapeal for Eve API. Check out the Yapeal PHP API library thread for more information. |
Acid Kanshi
Chaotic Tranquility
6
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Posted - 2012.06.29 08:34:00 -
[3] - Quote
We shall wait! EVE-Cost is a manufacturing tool for EVE players.
http://www.eve-cost.eu |
Etil DeLaFuente
New Eclipse Initiative Mercenaries
9
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Posted - 2012.06.30 09:13:00 -
[4] - Quote
Quote:There will be endpoints for a bunch of public read-only stuff, that require no authentication. Things like starmap data, basic character and corp info and such, item info and so on.
Does it mean the actual API system will be replaced at term with CREST ? |
TornSoul
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
76
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Posted - 2012.07.08 14:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Shame about the delay - But such is life (and EVE in particular it seems )
--
As per the tech-demo from the FF, in it's current form the (implemented) functionality of CREST is very very limited.
Come time this will obviously be expanded.
As one of the first expansions, could I humbly suggest the ability to "give away ISK" (aka transfer ISK from my own wallet to someone else). Being able to do this via a web-interface, and thus having the ability to automate it would be a HUGE help for me personally.
Currently I'm doing 100+ wire transfers each day of the alliance tournament (betting wins), and it's such a BIG pain in the arse having to manually do those transfers that many times...
I'm aware of other businesses out there who share the same woe as well...
Any word on whether you'd consider this as one of the first "expansions" would be greatly appreciated. |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
2043
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Posted - 2012.07.08 18:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
TornSoul wrote:Shame about the delay - But such is life (and EVE in particular it seems ) -- As per the tech-demo from the FF, in it's current form the (implemented) functionality of CREST is very very limited. Come time this will obviously be expanded. As one of the first expansions, could I humbly suggest the ability to "give away ISK" (aka transfer ISK from my own wallet to someone else). Being able to do this via a web-interface, and thus having the ability to automate it would be a HUGE help for me personally. Currently I'm doing 100+ wire transfers each day of the alliance tournament (betting wins), and it's such a BIG pain in the arse having to manually do those transfers that many times... I'm aware of other businesses out there who share the same woe as well... Any word on whether you'd consider this as one of the first "expansions" would be greatly appreciated.
I've asked CCP Seagull for this several times, hopefully it makes the early list of functionality. CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
15
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Posted - 2012.07.16 13:25:00 -
[7] - Quote
Two step wrote: I've asked CCP Seagull for this several times, hopefully it makes the early list of functionality.
There is nothing technically hindering this, but it's a call for game design to make. As we get closer to release, Soundwave and other designers will have a proper look at what functionality they are OK with releasing in CREST.
Most of the tricky questions here are around botting scenarios where people could combine legitimate API use with client botting, and get an automation chain that is way too good. So we will likely be careful with moving money around. But the request is noted, and we'll also do our best to release as much as we can that makes life in large-scale EVE operations easier.
Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
802
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Posted - 2012.07.16 16:46:00 -
[8] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:Two step wrote: I've asked CCP Seagull for this several times, hopefully it makes the early list of functionality.
There is nothing technically hindering this, but it's a call for game design to make. As we get closer to release, Soundwave and other designers will have a proper look at what functionality they are OK with releasing in CREST.
just make sure that you can write to the fittings, skill queue and read/write the corp chat ;)
market is probably the highest botting risk a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked |
iskflakes
Magnets Inc.
26
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Posted - 2012.07.16 21:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote: Most of the tricky questions here are around botting scenarios where people could combine legitimate API use with client botting, and get an automation chain that is way too good. So we will likely be careful with moving money around. But the request is noted, and we'll also do our best to release as much as we can that makes life in large-scale EVE operations easier.
Think of this differently - If you give everybody high levels of automation then suddenly bots have no advantage anymore. Bots will only exist as long as there are tedious and boring things to do like updating market orders, missioning and mining. If mining was done more like PI (where you plan the extraction rather than doing it yourself) we would see fewer bots. Although I don't expect CREST to fix this problem, giving some automation to traders could still be a big improvement.
In other news, I would like to see CREST give access to corpse names, as currently these are not available through the existing API for some reason. |
Desmont McCallock
190
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Posted - 2012.07.16 22:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
iskflakes wrote:In other news, I would like to see CREST give access to corpse names, as currently these are not available through the existing API for some reason. I suppose you mean corp members names. Doesn't MemberTracking API call suffice? |
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Mikokoel
Mining Industry Exile Foundation Eternal Evocations
2
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Posted - 2012.07.17 08:04:00 -
[11] - Quote
Desmont McCallock wrote:iskflakes wrote:In other news, I would like to see CREST give access to corpse names, as currently these are not available through the existing API for some reason. I suppose you mean corp members names. Doesn't MemberTracking API call suffice?
I think he really means Corpse names. In your inventory, every corpse is a "Corpse". But if you call show info, you get the actual name, e.g. "Mikokoel's corpse". I think he wants that information to be available through the API (AssetList for example) EvE API Development zap - advanced programming |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
2049
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Posted - 2012.07.18 13:49:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mikokoel wrote:Desmont McCallock wrote:iskflakes wrote:In other news, I would like to see CREST give access to corpse names, as currently these are not available through the existing API for some reason. I suppose you mean corp members names. Doesn't MemberTracking API call suffice? I think he really means Corpse names. In your inventory, every corpse is a "Corpse". But if you call show info, you get the actual name, e.g. "Mikokoel's corpse". I think he wants that information to be available through the API (AssetList for example)
Did you try the locations API? It gives the name of cans, I think it might work for corpses. CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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iskflakes
Magnets Inc.
28
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Posted - 2012.07.18 17:13:00 -
[13] - Quote
Two step... I love you! It works perfectly.
Though seriously, was this documented? I never even considered using the locations API to retrieve item names. If it was called the "ItemNamesAndLocations" API then maybe it would make sense? |
Two step
Aperture Harmonics K162
2049
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Posted - 2012.07.18 22:50:00 -
[14] - Quote
iskflakes wrote:Two step... I love you! It works perfectly.
Though seriously, was this documented? I never even considered using the locations API to retrieve item names. If it was called the "ItemNamesAndLocations" API then maybe it would make sense?
Well, can you say any of the API functions have been documented? It was mentioned when the locations API came out, as it was (and still is) the only way to get the names for POS mods and ships. CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
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Desmont McCallock
193
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Posted - 2012.07.19 07:01:00 -
[15] - Quote
Truth is that the API functions (except for the Location) is documented but for the Legacy keys. As I said on another thread, personally I don't intend to update the documentation (in EVElopedia or EVE Dev) until CCP pulls the plug on the Legacy keys. |
TornSoul
BIG Gentlemen's Agreement
76
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Posted - 2012.07.31 20:36:00 -
[16] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote: Most of the tricky questions here are around botting scenarios where people could combine legitimate API use with client botting, and get an automation chain that is way too good. So we will likely be careful with moving money around.
It would be very naive to think that any bot-operators aren't already doing this via *gosh* bots/macros if they feel they have the need to do so.
I'm a programmer myself, and it would in fact be rather trivial for me to write a program to control my mouse clicks, and enter the necessary text in to the wire ISK menu.
So I repeat : Any money launderer/whatever who needs this kind of functionality already has it and are already using it. They couldn't care less if this feature was added or not, it would make no difference to them.
Those it _would_ make a difference for however, are those of us choosing to abide by the TOS/EULA,
Please consider that. |
Artem Valiant
NecroRise Squadron ROOT Alliance
17
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Posted - 2012.08.05 08:04:00 -
[17] - Quote
Have you any assumption when will be released a beta version? I really can't wait to try it. |
Captain Thunk
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
123
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Posted - 2012.08.05 11:54:00 -
[18] - Quote
Desmont McCallock wrote:Truth is that the API functions (except for the Location) is documented but for the Legacy keys. As I said on another thread, personally I don't intend to update the documentation (in EVElopedia or EVE Dev) until CCP pulls the plug on the Legacy keys.
Legacy keys are better. They can do everything CAK can do and more.
If I have an account with 3 directors of different corps then I would need 4 CAKs to be able to access every page available. With legacy keys, I need only 1.
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
542
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Posted - 2012.08.05 16:56:00 -
[19] - Quote
Captain Thunk wrote:Desmont McCallock wrote:Truth is that the API functions (except for the Location) is documented but for the Legacy keys. As I said on another thread, personally I don't intend to update the documentation (in EVElopedia or EVE Dev) until CCP pulls the plug on the Legacy keys. Legacy keys are better. They can do everything CAK can do and more. If I have an account with 3 directors of different corps then I would need 4 CAKs to be able to access every page available. With legacy keys, I need only 1.
So a legacy key can expose only a certain page, when I don't want to hand a lot of extra information to, say, a killboard site?
Would be nice if CAKs allowed multiple corp data on a single key, but I guess that would be a trifle complex. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities. |
Captain Thunk
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
123
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Posted - 2012.08.05 17:57:00 -
[20] - Quote
indeed, if only it were somehow possible to run both systems concurrently |
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Desmont McCallock
218
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Posted - 2012.08.05 18:17:00 -
[21] - Quote
The only prob I see with corp CAK's is the denial of data access to ppl that are accountant or factory managers. IMO it's not hard to change that. Adding an additional option to allow access to those ppl would do the trick, but CCP has abandoned any development to the current API system in favor of CREST. |
Dino Boff
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
14
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Posted - 2012.09.09 11:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
Any updates? Just deploying Oauth on its own first and as soon as possible would be great. It will finally give a way to authenticate eve player*. If it would give have access to the classic API as well and not just the CREST API, that would give us a better way to query API keys from users.
*it would allow us to link eve accounts to other forms of authentication. |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
19
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Posted - 2012.09.13 08:47:00 -
[23] - Quote
Sorry for the radio silence, we're juggling a lot of dates and plans around at the moment.
We are gearing up to get CREST and our Auth service to a test server soon(tm) so that you can all get a real sense for how to develop against CREST APIs. As soon as I have a more locked down concrete plan I'll post a better update. Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Evanova Android
Traquenard Labs
9
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Posted - 2012.09.15 00:46:00 -
[24] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:Sorry for the radio silence, we're juggling a lot of dates and plans around at the moment.
We are gearing up to get CREST and our Auth service to a test server soon(tm) so that you can all get a real sense for how to develop against CREST APIs. As soon as I have a more locked down concrete plan I'll post a better update.
I am not in a hurry |
MotherMoon
Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
1130
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Posted - 2012.09.19 20:41:00 -
[25] - Quote
is this the stuff that will let us use 3rd pary programs to set skills and do more in game stuff out of game? If not then who cares? http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
657
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Posted - 2012.09.19 20:44:00 -
[26] - Quote
That's what Crest /may/ be.
It's all about what they decide to open up.
and who you trust with read/write access to your account. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities. |
Khorkrak
Confetti Explosion
25
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Posted - 2012.09.20 17:11:00 -
[27] - Quote
Word on whether the EVE API functions, especially getting killlogs, will be reimplemented and made available via CREST would be appreciated. Developer of http://www.decloaked.com and http://sourceforge.net/projects/pykb/ |
TornSoul
BIG Everywhere - Everything
86
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Posted - 2012.10.20 21:26:00 -
[28] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:Sorry for the radio silence, we're juggling a lot of dates and plans around at the moment. .
It's been a month - Radio broken?
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
21
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Posted - 2012.10.22 09:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
Yup, radio is a bit broken - sorry about that. We are aiming for shipping CREST to you with the EVE winter release, and test it on a public test server before that, but we are still wrangling a bunch of details before I can promise things. There will be a full devblog on this once we announce what we're doing, including the Developer License stuff.
/CCP Seagull Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries Solar Assault Fleet
265
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Posted - 2012.10.22 09:50:00 -
[30] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:is this the stuff that will let us use 3rd pary programs to set skills and do more in game stuff out of game? If not then who cares?
Steve Ronuken wrote:That's what Crest /may/ be.
It's all about what they decide to open up.
and who you trust with read/write access to your account.
I think that the issues for CCP when they decide what they want/dare to open isn't 100% down to pure technical stuff and what they can do in a safe manner on their side.
Imagine that CCP opens up to allow us to change skills or market orders or something like that.
Then someone codes a nifty 3:rd party tool to make it real easy for everyone to twiddle their skills or orders or whatever from their phone.
Now imagine that there was a serious flaw in that tool, that for some reason (either by mistake or intentionally ) messed up skills/orders for hundreds of players.
Creating a serious amount of quite angry users.
Is there anyone who thinks that those miffed users would limit themselves to blame the 3:rd party coder (or themselves for trusting him/her/it)?
Of course not, CCP would be flooded in pure vitriol via any channel that is available (and possibly some new ones).
And valid complaints or not, there are lots of more or less serious sites around the world that happily would crank out article after article covering the drama and demanding, or rather DEMANDING!!!, that CCP explains why they allowed such an atrocity to happen.
So I'm afraid that the project that CCP Seagull has been blessed with isn't a very easy one to manoeuvre through either technical or internal policy waters :/
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TornSoul
BIG Everywhere - Everything
86
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Posted - 2012.10.25 21:04:00 -
[31] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:We are aiming for shipping CREST to you with the EVE winter release, and test it on a public test server before that
That is actually sooner than I was starting to expect.
CCP Seagull wrote: There will be a full devblog on this once we announce what we're doing, including the Developer License stuff.
F5 F5 F5 F5 |
Artem Valiant
NecroRise Squadron
17
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Posted - 2012.10.26 05:15:00 -
[32] - Quote
I can't wait to integrate it in Neocom for iOS. |
Shellac Brookdale
RAZOR Alliance
6
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Posted - 2012.11.15 12:13:00 -
[33] - Quote
I have this little feeling CREST wont make it into the winter expansion. |
Desmont McCallock
218
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Posted - 2012.11.15 12:34:00 -
[34] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:We are aiming for shipping CREST to you with the EVE winter release,... /CCP Seagull Aiming doesn't guarantee a hit. So keep your hopes down. |
Peter Powers
Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play
95
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Posted - 2012.11.15 13:53:00 -
[35] - Quote
Desmont McCallock wrote:CCP Seagull wrote:We are aiming for shipping CREST to you with the EVE winter release,... /CCP Seagull Aiming doesn't guarantee a hit. So keep your hopes down. especially since there is already tests for the winter release but no CREST test available.. 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
23
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Posted - 2012.11.15 17:34:00 -
[36] - Quote
The code for it is definitely going out with Retribution, the question is then when we will turn it on for Tranquility. A pretty hefty devblog is written and currently in the publishing pipeline - because this also introduces the new Developer License, and we've had some... issues.. in the past when it comes to that (99 dollars and all that) I want to be pretty careful with this. And then the technical release itself is a pretty serious deal - we don't take giving read/write access to Tranquility lightly.
While I can't promise as usual, as there are factors outside my control, don't lose all hope yet - but also know that the formal launch date of CREST on Tranquility is not tied to being the 4th of December - we will test on a test server until we feel confident to flip the TQ switch, once the code is out with Retribution. Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Aryth
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
626
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Posted - 2012.11.15 23:56:00 -
[37] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:The code for it is definitely going out with Retribution, the question is then when we will turn it on for Tranquility. A pretty hefty devblog is written and currently in the publishing pipeline - because this also introduces the new Developer License, and we've had some... issues.. in the past when it comes to that (99 dollars and all that) I want to be pretty careful with this. And then the technical release itself is a pretty serious deal - we don't take giving read/write access to Tranquility lightly.
While I can't promise as usual, as there are factors outside my control, don't lose all hope yet - but also know that the formal launch date of CREST on Tranquility is not tied to being the 4th of December - we will test on a test server until we feel confident to flip the TQ switch, once the code is out with Retribution.
This will usher in the next generation of ....emergent gameplay. I can't wait. Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Cabal |
killallnerds exe
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.11.16 00:12:00 -
[38] - Quote
Is there anything concrete AT ALL as to what you are going to allow developers access beyond what is already available on the current V2 api. |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
24
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Posted - 2012.11.16 00:17:00 -
[39] - Quote
killallnerds exe wrote:Is there anything concrete AT ALL as to what you are going to allow developers access beyond what is already available on the current V2 api.
First release is read/write for contacts. After we are stable, we'll be releasing other features along with the normal EVE release cadence. It's up to EVE game design and product folks to decide what those features should be, so I can't answer that from my tech point of view. Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Peter Powers
Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play
95
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Posted - 2012.11.16 13:31:00 -
[40] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:The code for it is definitely going out with Retribution, the question is then when we will turn it on for Tranquility. A pretty hefty devblog is written and currently in the publishing pipeline - because this also introduces the new Developer License, and we've had some... issues.. in the past when it comes to that (99 dollars and all that) I want to be pretty careful with this. And then the technical release itself is a pretty serious deal - we don't take giving read/write access to Tranquility lightly.
While I can't promise as usual, as there are factors outside my control, don't lose all hope yet - but also know that the formal launch date of CREST on Tranquility is not tied to being the 4th of December - we will test on a test server until we feel confident to flip the TQ switch, once the code is out with Retribution. so, please correct me if i got this right:
- Step 1: you will put CREST on TQ but leave it disabled,[/*]
- Step 2: we register for the license
- Step 3: CREST will be available to us on Testserver, we will start building our first libs against Crest[/*]
- Step 4: you monitor the impact of what we do on Testserver, and once your happy [/*]
- Step 5: CREST will be enabled on TQ[/*]
- Step 6: we can now start deploying apps to users that use CREST[/*]
please correct me if i got the order wrong.
Now, just a rough guess of time, and looking at the upcoming holidays, etc. this means we probably can start with the testserver in january, and it will be on TQ in February or March. (hoping no marketing guy gets the great idea of delaying the tq release till fanfest)
is this a realistic estimate?
3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications |
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killallnerds exe
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.11.16 18:07:00 -
[41] - Quote
I can't say I'm particularly excited about read/write to contacts and then 'it's up to the game designers' . |
iskflakes
Magnets Inc. Disaster Strikes
82
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Posted - 2012.11.16 18:51:00 -
[42] - Quote
Are there any details about this "developer license" around? I don't understand why one should or would be required. If I am required to buy a developer license in order to spend my free time improving CCP's product with third party apps I can tell you now that I will not be buying one.
I hope CCP keep working on CREST though. I look forward to the day I can chat to my corp or update a market order without having to log into the game. The game client should only be for fighting other ships anyway. Track your wealth with EVE Stats: https://ohheck.co.uk/EVEStats/home.php |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
788
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Posted - 2012.11.16 19:13:00 -
[43] - Quote
iskflakes wrote:Are there any details about this "developer license" around? I don't understand why one should or would be required. If I am required to buy a developer license in order to spend my free time improving CCP's product with third party apps I can tell you now that I will not be buying one.
I hope CCP keep working on CREST though. I look forward to the day I can chat to my corp or update a market order without having to log into the game. The game client should only be for fighting other ships anyway.
It was talked about at fanfest. https://plus.google.com/photos/104420254081686601186/albums/5723099856571622625
Free license, but tied to an account that you've paid for by credit card (so it's tied to an address. Legal reasons)
You still won't be able to charge money for stuff. That'll require a paid for license that you get by talking to CCP directly FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
788
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Posted - 2012.11.16 19:14:00 -
[44] - Quote
killallnerds exe wrote:I can't say I'm particularly excited about read/write to contacts and then 'it's up to the game designers' .
Something to be more excited about:
Single sign on via Eve FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
iskflakes
Magnets Inc. Disaster Strikes
82
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Posted - 2012.11.16 19:27:00 -
[45] - Quote
Thanks for the link.
I pay for all 7 accounts by PLEX, so no developing for me..
The presentation says they are looking for feedback on the license, so here is my feedback: The license terms are too restrictive. This new license should only apply to developers who want to charge for their apps. If you do insist on going ahead with the credit card requirement, please place something in the EVE Store that costs $0.01 which we can buy to validate a card. Track your wealth with EVE Stats: https://ohheck.co.uk/EVEStats/home.php |
Jognu
French Kiss Singularity Astromechanica Federatis
20
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Posted - 2012.11.17 15:39:00 -
[46] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Single sign on via Eve With the CREST API ? EveAI developper: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=21803 YamlToSQL developper: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1362009 |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
789
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Posted - 2012.11.17 17:27:00 -
[47] - Quote
Jognu wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:Single sign on via Eve With the CREST API ?
The crest API depends on OAUTH2 to work. As long as we're provided an appropriate read only scope, to pull back minimal information (corp id, alliance id, pilot id, or similar) than we can do single sign on. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
Szet Kaplak
1st. Legion
0
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Posted - 2012.11.19 14:17:00 -
[48] - Quote
CVA and friends will be happy with the automated syncing of contacts.
That will make their and their friends' life a lot easier.
However I would love to see another feature in CREST which is personal wallet write access... (corporate could come later). This would enable a lot of the SRP programs to be automated, would simplify the payouts of websites such as EOH-Poker or Summer Blink.
Certain automated tasks could lift off a huge weight of those people who are running such popular services and would allow them to concentrate on their product instead of the management of it. |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
24
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Posted - 2012.11.19 19:15:00 -
[49] - Quote
Peter Powers wrote:so, please correct me if i got this wrong:
- you will put CREST on TQ but leave it disabled,
- we register for the license
- CREST will be available to us on Testserver, we will start building our first libs against CREST
- you monitor the impact of what we do on Testserver, and once your happy
- CREST will be enabled on TQ
- we can now start deploying apps to users that use CREST
Now, just a rough guess of time, and looking at the upcoming holidays, etc. this means we probably can start with the testserver in january, and it will be on TQ in February or March. (hoping no marketing guy gets the great idea of delaying the tq release till fanfest) is this a realistic estimate?
That list is pretty much exactly how it will happen.
As for time lines, we are hoping to get test server access launched before the holidays, but this might slip to January for sure, so yes,your timeline is pretty realistic, with possibility for faster turnaround if things go well. Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
24
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Posted - 2012.11.19 19:18:00 -
[50] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:killallnerds exe wrote:I can't say I'm particularly excited about read/write to contacts and then 'it's up to the game designers' . Something to be more excited about: Single sign on via Eve
Yup, we will specifically provide single sign on as part of the Developer features we launch. This should hopefully make life easier for a number of EVE related applications, regardless of CREST.
Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
24
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Posted - 2012.11.19 19:20:00 -
[51] - Quote
iskflakes wrote:Thanks for the link. I pay for all 7 accounts by PLEX, so no developing for me.. The presentation says they are looking for feedback on the license, so here is my feedback: The license terms are too restrictive. This new license should only apply to developers who want to charge for their apps. If you do insist on going ahead with the credit card requirement, please place something in the EVE Store that costs $0.01 which we can buy to validate a card.
By the time we launch this, we will very likely, or in the near future from launch, have an option to do a free card transaction for identification purposes. So people will have the option to do that, or wait for the feature to be available in Account Management before agreeing to the Developer License. Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.20 06:04:00 -
[52] - Quote
Is the api going be using Oauth 2.0, and is it going to be RESTful with correct verbs or are we going to be doing nothing but gets with a huge query strings.... sorry pent up rage of nothing gets for a "RESTful" are spilling out.
Also choosing between json and xml would be nice, or do we have that already?
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Desmont McCallock
218
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Posted - 2012.11.20 07:28:00 -
[53] - Quote
Dan Hour wrote:Also choosing between json and xml would be nice, or do we have that already?
It will more likely be Yaml.
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Peter Powers
Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play
96
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Posted - 2012.11.20 08:35:00 -
[54] - Quote
Desmont McCallock wrote:Dan Hour wrote:Also choosing between json and xml would be nice, or do we have that already?
It will more likely be Yaml. bullshit.
this has been said on fanfest, there is already documentation on evelopedia, and there is an example project on github.
CREST in its first iteration will support oAuth2 CREST is a real REST API and CREST in theory allows to choose the output by accept headers in the requests, but it will launch with json first. documentation is for json and the example is in javascript and using json why on earth would you spread this yaml story? 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications |
Desmont McCallock
218
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Posted - 2012.11.20 10:10:00 -
[55] - Quote
Simple because SDE will be switched to Yaml. And why do you take it so personal? Someone can easily think that you are 'working' for CCP acting like that. |
Snus Mumriken
EVE University Ivy League
8
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Posted - 2012.11.20 11:57:00 -
[56] - Quote
Desmont McCallock wrote:Simple because SDE will be switched to Yaml. And why do you take it so personal? Someone can easily think that you are 'working' for CCP acting like that.
The SDE switching to YAML is for the internal development, so people don't have to deal with the database, but can work on (even human readable) files. I'm on Twitter. |
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CCP Seagull
C C P C C P Alliance
24
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Posted - 2012.11.20 13:39:00 -
[57] - Quote
As a side note, if you are interested in some of the plumbing behind the scenes of how we are making CREST, these posts have a lot of detail on how we are using nginx to do loadbalancing and caching for CREST, given some of the pretty specialized requirements of a virtual world like EVE:
Load Balancing Stateful Services With Nginx http://jimpurbrick.com/2012/07/30/load-balancing-stateful-services-nginx/
Adding Vary Header Support To Nginx http://jimpurbrick.com/2012/10/14/adding-vary-header-support-nginx/
Caching Shared, Private Data With Ningx http://jimpurbrick.com/2012/11/11/caching-restricted-data-ningx/
Technical Producer CCP Games Reykjavik |
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iskflakes
Magnets Inc. Disaster Strikes
83
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Posted - 2012.11.20 14:09:00 -
[58] - Quote
CCP Seagull wrote:By the time we launch this, we will very likely, or in the near future from launch, have an option to do a free card transaction for identification purposes. So people will have the option to do that, or wait for the feature to be available in Account Management before agreeing to the Developer License.
Thanks for providing the option. I still don't like the Developer License concept -- I've never needed one to develop for other games -- But at least this will make it as painless as it can be.. Track your wealth with EVE Stats: https://ohheck.co.uk/EVEStats/home.php |
Gilbaron
Free-Space-Ranger Ev0ke
428
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Posted - 2012.11.20 14:34:00 -
[59] - Quote
i always want the devs to post more techporn, but you have posted hardcore techporn :/ im am more into softcore stuff :( |
Peter Powers
Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play
97
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Posted - 2012.11.20 15:09:00 -
[60] - Quote
Gilbaron wrote:i always want the devs to post more techporn, but you have posted hardcore techporn :/ im am more into softcore stuff :( why would you want softcore?
3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications |
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Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.21 00:34:00 -
[61] - Quote
Not in the first iteration of the API but are you guys considering something other than rest as well? Say something with websockets. If the API connects to the in game chat at all it would be very cool. However last time i checked Nginx did not have much support for websockets proxies. (Insert plug for xmpp with json). |
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CCP Zero Gravitas
C C P C C P Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.11.21 12:04:00 -
[62] - Quote
CREST currently uses Twitter style HTTP streaming to push notifications to clients. One of the reasons we chose Nginx is that it supports very high numbers of concurrent connections, which is required if each client is keeping an HTTP request open permanently to receive notifications.
The latest version of contactjs (https://github.com/jimpurbrick/contactjs) demonstrates how to receive and filter notifications from JavaScript. You make an AJAX request, then instead of waiting for it to complete, periodically check the received data and handle any new notifications that have arrived.
I imagine the notifications could be sent over websockets relatively easily, but HTTP streaming works well on a wide variety of plaforms including the PS3 which we need to support to send notifications to Dust. |
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Shellac Brookdale
RAZOR Alliance
6
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Posted - 2012.11.21 16:54:00 -
[63] - Quote
The way I understand your code in contact.js works is that the complete contact list is re-rendered upon successfully (indicated by http status) calling the contactListUri endpoint, as well as after receiving a contact list update notification. So when exactly can we assume an operation was completed? Will notification have any details about what actually has been changed in the contact list?
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Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.21 17:42:00 -
[64] - Quote
I can settle for that, but how about that chat part? Granted I've never given the in game chat system much thought about how it was implemented, but anyway I'm 99.9% positive the PS3 talks xmpp. I'd really like too do something like an irc/xmpp protocol bridge with the in game chat. It's been a while since i watched that fanfest (I think it was fanfest) video about CREST. So is chat something thats within the scope of CREST, can you say? Or what isn't within the scope of crest? Sorry if I'm asking something here that was already answered... |
Liu Ellens
Blame The Bunny The Dark Nation
43
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Posted - 2012.11.22 07:23:00 -
[65] - Quote
CCP Zero Gravitas wrote:CREST currently uses Twitter style HTTP streaming to push notifications to clients. One of the reasons we chose Nginx is that it supports very high numbers of concurrent connections, which is required if each client is keeping an HTTP request open permanently to receive notifications.
The latest version of contactjs (https://github.com/jimpurbrick/contactjs) demonstrates how to receive and filter notifications from JavaScript. You make an AJAX request, then instead of waiting for it to complete, periodically check the received data and handle any new notifications that have arrived. I don't know the Twitter stream and also couldn't find the protocol definition for your stream, but how far off is it from "Server-Sent Events" as defined by W3C (http://dev.w3.org/html5/eventsource/) ? There exists a great polyfill for the client side (https://github.com/Yaffle/EventSource) as well.
The very basic example for the client side (taken from W3C site):
Quote: var source = new EventSource('updates.cgi'); source.onmessage = function (event) { alert(event.data); };
(If it's not this format, I guess it's far too late in the game to ask for a change there, right? ;) ) upro - an online browser application to support navigation in New Eden and beyond. |
Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.22 08:21:00 -
[66] - Quote
Liu Ellens wrote: I don't know the Twitter stream and also couldn't find (didn't look far for) the protocol definition for your stream.
here is a link to twitter doc for their streaming api: https://dev.twitter.com/docs/streaming-apis
You can kind of think of it as a tcp connection that remains open and the server will write http down the pipe.
I would imagine that they wont implement Server sent events as that is mainly a browser thing, what i mean by that is that the browser is responsible for the connection and not your code, so while it could be an elegant solution it is limited in that way. Plus it does stuff with dom events?? No one likes dom.... |
Liu Ellens
Blame The Bunny The Dark Nation
43
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Posted - 2012.11.22 11:51:00 -
[67] - Quote
Thank you for the link!
The focus of my request was a little bit different though, that didn't come through as I intended. Conceptually, the Twitter stream and the server-side events are pretty much similar, Twitter sends objects in JSON delimited with CRLF, server-side events are text messages (thus also applicable for JSON) delimited by an empty line. The benefit I saw with the server-side events is that the data format is also a defined one and even supported on the client side out-of-the box, in an event-driven fashion.
I'd be equally happy with the Twitter variant (or any other defined one), there would most likely be corresponding libraries already doing the legwork.
tl;dr: I was asking for a defined stream format, ideally with existing library support on the client side. The W3C variant seemed just the most neutral ("standard") one to me. I like to build all the underlying things myself, but I don't want to reinvent every wheel all the time, especially if I know there is already one out there. ;)
upro - an online browser application to support navigation in New Eden and beyond. |
Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.22 21:02:00 -
[68] - Quote
I see what you mean now, have you done much work Server Sent Events? I personally have never touched them, even though all the work i do is "real time" Server Sent events have just never fit the bill. By that I mean all the talking between client and server is too bi-directional. I had mentioned websockets early in the thread because you can send information both ways, faster and with less overhead than making lots of rest calls. Where server sent events is just server to client and is more limited to browser (please correct me if I'm wrong about that).
The point that I'm getting at with the Server Sent Events is that they are limiting the clients to the browser (again correct me if im wrong about that), where with CREST api your "clients" maybe other applications. There would be a security concern if you are making direct CREST api calls from your browser. The user after they got their Oauth token could then make any CREST call that YOUR developer key could use. Leaving your application open for unintended abuse.
I believe the intended architechure is: YourClient <---> Your App <---> CREST api and not Your APP ---> Your Client ---> CREST api
but now im starting to ramble and have drifted away from server sent events
TL;DR: ramble ramble use case for websockets = chat, use case server sent events? market data maybe? but that seems more like PubSub (*cough* websockets)territory.... oh boy must stop rambling. |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
794
|
Posted - 2012.11.22 21:17:00 -
[69] - Quote
Dan Hour wrote:I see what you mean now, have you done much work Server Sent Events? I personally have never touched them, even though all the work i do is "real time" Server Sent events have just never fit the bill. By that I mean all the talking between client and server is too bi-directional. I had mentioned websockets early in the thread because you can send information both ways, faster and with less overhead than making lots of rest calls. Where server sent events is just server to client and is more limited to browser (please correct me if I'm wrong about that).
The point that I'm getting at with the Server Sent Events is that they are limiting the clients to the browser (again correct me if im wrong about that), where with CREST api your "clients" maybe other applications. There would be a security concern if you are making direct CREST api calls from your browser. The user after they got their Oauth token could then make any CREST call that YOUR developer key could use. Leaving your application open for unintended abuse.
I believe the intended architecture is: YourClient <---> Your App <---> CREST api and not Your APP ---> Your Client ---> CREST api
but now im starting to ramble and have drifted away from server sent events
TL;DR: ramble ramble use case for websockets = chat, use case server sent events? market data maybe? but that seems more like PubSub (*cough* websockets)territory.... oh boy must stop rambling.
Kinda yes, kinda no.
Because your app might be running directly in their client. The joys of Javascript.
As for the rest, you can quite happily have an application that runs and talks to crest on the uses behalf. they just need to have an auth token given to them. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.22 21:30:00 -
[70] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Kinda yes, kinda no.
To what exactly are you referring, in the abuse case what i mean is if you are make CREST api calls from javascript then you as a developer have lost control what calls are being made by Your application with the developer agreement, what ever it may be. And to me that would be a massive mistake. Allowing your web base client to make calls to the crest api is too open to abuse, and create more spots for security problems.
Im assuming that the CREST api agreement will before YOUR appilcation, so if you move those calls to the api to client without having to go through your app then you are leaving yourself open to having ccp shutdown you access to the api because some **** decided to make a ton of calls before the oauth token expires
Yes i agree your application should make calls or your users be haft that is not the security point i was making. |
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Liu Ellens
Blame The Bunny The Dark Nation
43
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Posted - 2012.11.23 08:02:00 -
[71] - Quote
The selection of the transport method should not be driven by the fictional requirement to be able to use it easily in the browser, you're right, Dan - Thanks for reminding me of the security concerns, I'm with you there.
Server-side events are similar to the Twitter stream, essentially a long-poll HTTP request, where the response has no end and consists of chunks of messages. (I'm using them for upro) - I don't exactly understand though what you mean by "limiting the clients to the browser" - all three discussed variants (WebSockets, Twitter, SSE (Server-side events)) can be used by any language/framework that is capable of creating and handling a HTTP request.
From an abstract point of view, we have the difference in the way how the client sends its request to the server. For Twitter, SSE and CREST, requests are sent in dedicated HTTP requests each (but the downstream event notification is always done through one long-poll). WebSockets would allow the requests to be sent reusing the same connection used for the downstream events.
I guess it comes down to what is supported by the used stacks, and I believe to have found the reason why WebSockets wont be available: Using nginx will deny you WebSockets as they apparently are not supported (first google hit: http://serverfault.com/questions/391274/linux-web-servers-that-support-websockets) (that is without knowing the versions involved) Short: Only a long-poll variant is possible for CREST.
I was asking for a standard format for the CREST event downstream, but since there is no explicit need to have it easily supported in the browser, support for dissecting an input stream on our own is easy anyway in any other framework (node.js, php, java, what have you) upro - an online browser application to support navigation in New Eden and beyond. |
Dan Hour
Ghost Fleet.
0
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Posted - 2012.11.23 08:17:00 -
[72] - Quote
Yes cool thanks for confirming that nginx still does not support websockets, I knew that was the case awhile ago and mentioned in an earlier post. While I would love them to use websockets I'm defiantly not expecting them in when they first launch CREST. Also thank you for the clarification on Server Sent events, like i said i have never used them so I don't claim know much about them. Why I'm so heart set on WebSockets is because I'm hoping the in-game chat will someday be in the scope of CREST, and WebSockets are a two way pipe.... All of my programing experience has been in "real time" so I'm just bitter and don't want to do any kind of long polling.
and I will be more than willing to give any CREST using web app a free one day pen test if they are ok with it!
EDIT: Nginx has plans to add web socket support as well? I think... going to ask google now EDIT2: Nginx is plan to support websockets in version 1.3.x |
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