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What was the use of pirate faction ships before Dominion?

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KWyz	Posted - 2010.02.27 11:27:00 - [1] Come Dominion, a lot of old faction ships got their specs refined/rebalanced, and from what I can tell, most of these changes were more than welcome, creating awesome ships both from a PVP and a PVE viewpoint. But since I'm a rather new player, having limited experience in this field(I only flew a Daredevil back when the price of one was around 70 million), I'd like to find out the uses the old pirate faction ships had before they were buffed, other than being pimp factors. Looking at them before the patch, I wasn't really able to figure them out. So have a pick from the list of rat ships and tell your opinion about how bad/worse they were compared to how they are today. Personally I LOVE tales of the old times, so if you have the minutes, please write in detail about them and these craft(this is also the reason for wich I started this thread instead of looking up on the internet) Pirate faction ships: Guristas - Worm, Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") and Rattlesnake Blood Raiders - Cruor, Ashimmu, Bhaalgorn Sansha's Nation - Succubus, Phantasm, Nightmare Serpentis - Daredevil, Vigilant, Vindicator Angel Cartel - Dramiel, Cynabal, Machariel Also, am I the only one thinking all of these ships have awesome names?especially when paired with their design? Thank you in advance for your patience and understanding.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2010.02.27 11:38:00 - [2] Edited by: Gypsio III on 27/02/2010 11:41:55 Worm - being an expensive Merlin. Gila - being an expensive Moa. Rattlesnake - being an expensive Raven. They were useless. Some people used the old Rattlesnake to run missions in, but it was pretty stupid as it basically had the same DPS as a Raven. The only real difference was the useless extra lowslot. You could put a passive tank on it, but this didn't make you run L4s any quicker, and other, cheaper, ships can passive-tank L5s.
Dimitrios Ypsilanti	Posted - 2010.02.27 16:06:00 - [3] Originally by: KWyz Gila (how do you pronounce the name of this ship...) Hard G as in "giga." I sounds like an E as in "heel."
Zeba Minmatar Honourable East India Trading Company	Posted - 2010.02.27 16:21:00 - [4] Originally by: KWyz What was the use of pirate faction ships before Dominion? They were mostly used as the basis for epic boost threads as every single one of them except the sansha line sucked arse. Now after getting the massive buffs they are the basis of epic whinge threads because they are so powerful. Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu The only thing separating us from frightened, feral monkeys is running water on tap, fuel in the tank, and current in our wall sockets.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.27 16:21:00 - [5] Phantasm and Nightmare was good before Dominion, that was about it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Zephirz Cruoris Seraphim Exalted.	Posted - 2010.02.27 17:06:00 - [6] machariel did its part in the nanoage :)
Tiska Drak Gallente Dreddit	Posted - 2010.02.27 17:31:00 - [7] Originally by: KWyz Guristas - Worm, Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Neither.
Slade Hoo Amarr Corpse Collection Point	Posted - 2010.02.27 17:41:00 - [8] Edited by: Slade Hoo on 27/02/2010 17:41:48 Ashimmu had about the same grid as a t1 omen (i remember some cpu issues as well). Couldn't be fit for anything else than a fancy hauler. Useless ship. Cynabal now is a better vaga...before dominion it was a better rupture. ------ Make Lowsec useful! Vote in the CSM-Forum!
Sig Sour	Posted - 2010.02.27 17:47:00 - [9] Originally by: KWyz how do you pronounce the name of this ship? Gila Monster
Destroperuk Auctoritas Fleet Auctoritas Empire	Posted - 2010.02.27 17:54:00 - [10] Quote: Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Let me guess. English is your first language?
Alt Tabbed	Posted - 2010.02.27 18:19:00 - [11] Originally by: Destroperuk Quote: Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Let me guess. English is your first language?
Sokratesz	Posted - 2010.02.27 18:25:00 - [12] i say djeela CSM Iceland meeting minutes - READ THEM :D
Sumelar	Posted - 2010.02.27 19:00:00 - [13] It's hee-la, just like the lizard. It is NOT a hard G like in 'good'.
KWyz	Posted - 2010.02.27 19:16:00 - [14] I'm flattered, really. But english is not my first language. And this is the first time I hear about that lizard creature. Still, what does my first language have to do with the pronunciation of a word I never heard before? Back on topic, there is one ship I'm still somewhat confused about today. The Bhaalgorn has and had some serious PVP bonuses on it, come Dominion its dps also got boosted. Do people actually use these things for such fighting?
Pater Peccavi Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force	Posted - 2010.02.27 19:22:00 - [15] Originally by: Destroperuk Quote: Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Let me guess. English is your first language? At least he recognized that he didn't know how to pronounce it, as opposed to that other guy that responded "hard G." _________ Originally by: CCP Zymurgist You have always had permission to kill anyone in game you see fit to lose a ship! My name is Pater!
lollerwaffle Sileo In Pacis THE SPACE P0LICE	Posted - 2010.02.27 19:23:00 - [16] Flew the daredevil a bit pre-nanonerf. 'Twas pretty much an expensive tackle ceptor with low low low low dps. Could only solo t1 frigs and some interceptors but maybe I was more of a noob back then Haven't bought nor flown one since nanonerf, didn't see a reason apart from the pimp factor. Also haven't flown one since Dominion but I'm looking to get one soon to try them out. My ex-corpmate used to fly the Gila a bit, was pretty much a Moa with missiles. Don't think he's flown them since Dominion though. Originally by: salva dore Cloak should not be AFK solution. What do you think? Originally by: AFK Cloaker
Katarlia Simov Minmatar Cowboys From Hell	Posted - 2010.02.27 20:48:00 - [17] Edited by: Katarlia Simov on 27/02/2010 20:55:50 Originally by: Pater Peccavi Originally by: Destroperuk Quote: Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Let me guess. English is your first language? At least he recognized that he didn't know how to pronounce it, as opposed to that other guy that responded "hard G." Much as you are all 'right' in the empirical sense of the word, public opinion really does beg to differ. Try saying it 'HEEla' to someone you don't know on TS and see what happens ... Edit- Preface: I'm a Brit, not a yank, and there isn't a whole heap of spanish over here, so apologies for near total ignorance... How comes the g makes an h sound ? I was under the impression that j made that sound in spanish
SuperSlow	Posted - 2010.02.28 01:28:00 - [18] Originally by: Katarlia Simov How comes the g makes an h sound ? I was under the impression that j made that sound in spanish You mean like javelinas?
KWyz	Posted - 2010.02.28 16:53:00 - [19] Did people actually use the Bhaalgorn for PVP?
Kyra Felann Gallente	Posted - 2010.02.28 17:57:00 - [20] Originally by: Dimitrios Ypsilanti Originally by: KWyz Gila (how do you pronounce the name of this ship...) Hard G as in "giga." I sounds like an E as in "heel." Actually, no, it's pronounced "heela". See here. Silly Europeans (I'm assuming).
Meiyang Lee Gallente Azteca Transportation Unlimited Gunboat Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.02.28 18:06:00 - [21] Originally by: Slade Hoo Edited by: Slade Hoo on 27/02/2010 17:48:31 Edited by: Slade Hoo on 27/02/2010 17:47:29 Edited by: Slade Hoo on 27/02/2010 17:41:48 Ashimmu had about the same grid as a t1 omen (i remember some cpu issues as well). Couldn't be fit for anything else than a fancy hauler. Useless ship. Now its kind of a pilgrim with 90% webber without cloak and more damage. Cynabal now is a better vaga...before dominion it was a better rupture. Nightmare has already had its redesign in 2007(?). In former times it had split weapon bonuses on torpedos and lasers (4 siege, 4 mega pulse) You could squeeze a fairly weak but fun PvE fit out of the Ashimmu, running almost entirely off the ships NOS and you needed to faction fit a large chunk it to make do with it's tiny CPU and powergrid, and even then you usually needed a grid mod to fit it all. But it was fun to fly, missions get a nice sense of urgency if you know you'll be out of cap in less than 3 minutes if you don't find a nice NOS target to leech from, and you're flying a 100m Isk cruiser.
Xiaodown Guiding Hand Social Club	Posted - 2010.02.28 19:35:00 - [22] Edited by: Xiaodown on 28/02/2010 19:36:33 Originally by: KWyz Did people actually use the Bhaalgorn for PVP? Not really; they were always (previously at least) an expensive oddity - everyone knew that they could be amazing, but no one really figured out how. It's been hit around by the buffs and nerfs - lasers are better than they were a year or two ago, but webs and nos are both way worse. There was always another way to do what they did for cheaper. Vindicators, on the other hand, were the pimp daddy ship, especially back in the days of solo PVP and blasterthron supremacy and before the ECM and MWD nerf and disruptor nerf(?) - a blaster boat with a 5th midslot, so you can fit an MWD, web, scram, and injector (the holy 4 midslots of solo PVP) AND have an extra slot left over for a 2nd web or a multispec EMC?!? Yay! God, as I write that, I'm thinking of all the things that have been nerfed / buffed just since I started playing, which doesn't feel like that long ago. Blasters - nerfed ECM - nerfed Lasers - buffed NOS - nerfed MWD's - nerfed scrams - buffed / ab's buffed (?) webs - nerfed armor - buffed speed - nerfed torps - nerfed bombers - buffed wow, crazy. Edit: how could I forget stabs. --
Amuse Crimson-creed	Posted - 2010.03.01 20:56:00 - [23] Originally by: Xiaodown Edited by: Xiaodown on 28/02/2010 19:36:33 Originally by: KWyz Did people actually use the Bhaalgorn for PVP? Not really; they were always (previously at least) an expensive oddity - everyone knew that they could be amazing, but no one really figured out how. It's been hit around by the buffs and nerfs - lasers are better than they were a year or two ago, but webs and nos are both way worse. There was always another way to do what they did for cheaper. Vindicators, on the other hand, were the pimp daddy ship, especially back in the days of solo PVP and blasterthron supremacy and before the ECM and MWD nerf and disruptor nerf(?) - a blaster boat with a 5th midslot, so you can fit an MWD, web, scram, and injector (the holy 4 midslots of solo PVP) AND have an extra slot left over for a 2nd web or a multispec EMC?!? Yay! God, as I write that, I'm thinking of all the things that have been nerfed / buffed just since I started playing, which doesn't feel like that long ago. Blasters - nerfed ECM - nerfed Lasers - buffed NOS - nerfed MWD's - nerfed scrams - buffed / ab's buffed (?) webs - nerfed armor - buffed speed - nerfed torps - nerfed bombers - buffed wow, crazy. Edit: how could I forget stabs. Yes, vindicators used to be the **** back in the days. I remember some of the pilots with the cash and balls to fly faction and even officer vindicators taking out whole gatecamps solo, and back then even simple faction mods cost much more than these days :D Im talking about before the emergence of nano ships. And once nano ships came into the picture, some pilots flew nano-vindis with greate efficency to. Check out some of the old Vindicator movies like Vindication 1-3 to see how they were. Some videos with Marko out there to i think. Remember one pilot in particular bringing hes vindicator to fleet fights back in FIX, that was quite a sight :p
Last Wolf Rage For Order	Posted - 2010.03.01 22:14:00 - [24] /remembers the nightmare line before it was buffed. missile/laser split weapon bonuses and armor tanked. Oh no you don't! Incoming witty reply, ETA: 600 seconds!
Guillame Herschel Gallente NME1	Posted - 2010.03.01 22:53:00 - [25] Edited by: Guillame Herschel on 01/03/2010 22:53:16 Originally by: KWyz Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") Quote: The Gila monster (pronounced /ˈhiːlə/, HEE-la), Heloderma suspectum, is a species of venomous lizard native to the southwestern United States and northern Mexico (but not Baja California). Gila monster *-- He said "The President is near."*
Guillame Herschel Gallente NME1	Posted - 2010.03.01 22:59:00 - [26] Originally by: Katarlia Simov How comes the g makes an h sound ? I was under the impression that j made that sound in spanish The animal is named after the Gila River region, where it is found. "Gila Akimel" is the Pima name for the river. And "O'odham" is the O'odham name for the Pima and Papago language. *-- He said "The President is near."*
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2010.03.02 00:17:00 - [27] Originally by: KWyz Guristas - Worm, Gila(how do you pronounce the name of this ship?Is it like the "gi" in "aging", or like in "gigabyte?") and Rattlesnake Blood Raiders - Cruor, Ashimmu, Bhaalgorn Sansha's Nation - Succubus, Phantasm, Nightmare Serpentis - Daredevil, Vigilant, Vindicator Angel Cartel - Dramiel, Cynabal, Machariel Also, am I the only one thinking all of these ships have awesome names?especially when paired with their design? Thank you in advance for your patience and understanding. guristas ships were pretty much worthless, I had a moa bpc from ratting a while back got a bit excited for the faction ship changes. Rattlesnake made for a decent passive tank lv5 runner much like it is now, only it was pretty much all missiles. the Bloods, were mostly the same as they are now, Bhaal was and is nasty, made better in dom. ash/curor were both kinda worthless, hard to fit and easy to pop. Sansha got rebalanced a while ago, used to be lasers, missiles, and armor tank. the Nightmare was a 8/5/8 beast with 4 launcher 4 turret slots. then got changed to pretty much what it is now. got some slight adjustments with dom. angels got made much better with dom. although the Macha used to be an awesome 15km/s monster pre nano nerf. cant say much about serpentis other than the vindi used to be super nasty years ago, and I think the vigilant was just an expensive thorax.
KWyz	Posted - 2010.03.02 00:21:00 - [28] Checking things out and comparing, the gurista ships seem to have gained the most buffs in terms of PVE. Isn't the Gila now at least at the same level with the Isthar? And the Vigilant seems to be something out of a horror movie for close-up slaughter. I know for certain people use the dramiel in PVP. Providence is full with the little buggers.
Salvia Olima The All-Seeing Eye Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2010.03.03 10:14:00 - [29] I used Cynabals in the early days of combat booster production, it was my stylish vessel for smuggling drugs from empire to 0.0 agents.

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