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New trader looking for some help.

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Ester Rosin	Posted - 2010.03.24 16:21:00 - [1] I am very new to Eve and have been doing as much reading as possible over the last 2 weeks. I began training a character to run missions and make isk, however missioning seems tedious and not very profitable until you can run higher level missions (Level 4+ is what I understand). I did a bit of research on production but it seems that is way out of my reach as a new player, the entire POS system seems very expensive to run and will be something I may try later on in my Eve career, but for now definitely not. So I have decided to create a trading alt so I can trade while my other character trains up for higher level missions. Station trading seems very profitable and I will be parking myself in Jita to see if I can hold my own against the other traders of the Eve community. From what I understand, and please correct me if I am wrong, the ship market is very risky and it seems you need a large starting capital to play in the ship market. Implants was another area I was looking at, however the same thing applies it requires a big capital. I have been looking at T1 items and their named counter parts, mainly due to the fact that there seems to be a lot of mission runners who always need these items and therefor have a high quantity traded daily. Items with over about 400 units a day will be the kinds of items I am shooting for. I have 5 million isk that I gained while missioning which I will be using to begin my adventures. I am just curious what established traders think about my plan...am I heading in the right direction? Another question I had, I see a lot of people asking for public investments and am wondering if that is something I may be able to undertake, a small amount like 25 million or something, however if the majority of MD goers think this is way beyond my abilities or way to early for me even to consider a public investment. Sorry for the wall of text :P Thanks in advance for any responses. Sincerely, Ester Rosin
Lecherito	Posted - 2010.03.24 16:54:00 - [2] Mate, With all due respect, it sounds like Jita, considering your nonchalant attitude, would properly eat you alive. You really should stay clear. With such a trivial starting sum, you should really look into hauling from region to region, buying from a lowball sell order to throw in a frigate and resell in another hub for an immediate turnaround. You seem to be of the prevalent state of mind "station trading is instaprofitz" most mission runners/miners have. Be warned that it can be immensely challenging, extremely time consuming, and it's really the only activity in the game that can reduce your wallet to 0 in one go. Best of luck. -L
Legende Two Brothers Mining Corp. R.A.G.E	Posted - 2010.03.24 17:01:00 - [3] Originally by: Lecherito Mate, With all due respect, it sounds like Jita, considering your nonchalant attitude, would properly eat you alive. You really should stay clear. With such a trivial starting sum, you should really look into hauling from region to region, buying from a lowball sell order to throw in a frigate and resell in another hub for an immediate turnaround. You seem to be of the prevalent state of mind "station trading is instaprofitz" most mission runners/miners have. Be warned that it can be immensely challenging, extremely time consuming, and it's really the only activity in the game that can reduce your wallet to 0 in one go. Best of luck. -L This is excellent advice. Start small, don't try to jump into Jita while you are still learning the market. The market in Jita is a bigger monster than the whole of EVE outside of it. I don't think you are ill suited for trading at all at this point, but it is definitely premature to be asking for a loan before you've gotten your feet wet. I'd suggest running more missions, as boring as they are, to build up the capital you need to start trading.
Elgara	Posted - 2010.03.24 17:06:00 - [4] When i started trading i had around 10m, what i did at that time was buying this i know would sell fast in another trade hub. So what i did was i checked the market in 2 other trade hubs wrote down a few items that cost between 100-500k per item and whent to Jita and put up buy orders or bought straight up if if it allready was at low price. This not a win trading win, prices can change in an hour or two. Be ready to lose some isk before you get the hang if it.
Ester Rosin	Posted - 2010.03.24 17:06:00 - [5] Edited by: Ester Rosin on 24/03/2010 17:09:21 Originally by: Lecherito Mate, With all due respect, it sounds like Jita, considering your nonchalant attitude, would properly eat you alive. You really should stay clear. With such a trivial starting sum, you should really look into hauling from region to region, buying from a lowball sell order to throw in a frigate and resell in another hub for an immediate turnaround. You seem to be of the prevalent state of mind "station trading is instaprofitz" most mission runners/miners have. Be warned that it can be immensely challenging, extremely time consuming, and it's really the only activity in the game that can reduce your wallet to 0 in one go. Best of luck. -L Aye >< I didn't mean to sound nonchalant :P I am more than happy spending time having ISK wars with people in Jita, and seeing as I work 8 hours a day on my laptop I can constantly be updating orders :) The reason trading really interested me is because there IS tons of ISK to be made, and with the turnaround I have seen on some items I'm not too worried about loosing ISK. Obviously not instaprofitz :P but much better than the measly 15,000 isk from mission rewards. As to the hauling idea, I have read a bit about it and while there is profit to be made I feel at my current capacities I would probably get burned out very quickly. I have read peoples horror stories and I would prefer to not afk haul stuff around and risk being blown up(highly unlikely as I would only be hauling 120m3 worth of inventory) but still :P. Thanks for the response though! This is the reason I want to start trading, the challenge and the risks vs rewards :) EDIT: What do you guys think about setting up a few orders in Jita and then heading out of the station and looking around for a few deals, grabbing the inventory quick and then returning to Jita to sell those items and update my buy orders?
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.24 17:28:00 - [6] Feel free to contact me in game and i may share my super secret secrets or just talk to you about station trading in general.
Stan Techov Garneau Heavy Industries	Posted - 2010.03.24 18:10:00 - [7] Edited by: Stan Techov on 24/03/2010 18:10:50 best luck I've had with (relatively) small starting capital is inter-region trading by far. without being too specific: find something that's got a surplus in one region (like Lazer "ammo" in Amarr space) so the price is lower, and move it to somewhere where it's still used, but not as common, like a gallente Mission hub. much easier than having station trading was with people who have 1000X the ISK you do right now, and can run you out of buisness for kicks Edited: my typing skillz are horrid
Rykker Bow Gallente The Blackfold Brotherhood	Posted - 2010.03.24 18:22:00 - [8] Originally by: Lecherito Mate, Be warned that it can be immensely challenging, extremely time consuming, and it's really the only activity in the game that can reduce your wallet to 0 in one go. -L good statement. I don't fully agree with the time consuming part tho, there are many things you can do to streamline the procedure. Don't forget addictive for some of us. I'd say come to Jita and give it a go. My advice would be to research your items first. Know them like the back of your hand and you can reduce your risk considerably. Learn to ride the crashes that come with risky trades. Know when to take a small loss early rather than a big loss later. If you want to make big money you have to be a trader first.
Umega Republic Military School	Posted - 2010.03.24 18:32:00 - [9] The most important skill for a Trader is one that can only really be told and not taught.. it is only one word, yet it still remains complex as is any virtue.. Patience. ---------------------------------------- -Treat the EVE Market like you're a pimp and it is your 'employee'.. freely fondle it as you wish and make it pay you for it-
Jeneroux Gallente	Posted - 2010.03.24 18:51:00 - [10] Suggest you get this. Eve Market Scanner Is very good tool. Pick the items to trade in. Visit the locations you want to work.
Ester Rosin	Posted - 2010.03.24 19:08:00 - [11] Thanks to everyone who has responded, you have been more than helpful! :) Since posting this thread I have set up buy orders(which have been filling surprisingly quickly) as well as bargain hunting in the surrounding systems of Jita. I also, unknowingly, attempted a very tiny market manipulation which worked out and net me about 250% profit on the item I traded :) Thanks again!
Sarajo	Posted - 2010.03.25 09:37:00 - [12] If you have a low amount of money there are a lot of opportunities that players with bigger wallets will not bother with. It is not uncommon to find margins of over 1000%. This is because the absolute amounts of ISK involved are pretty low, and not worth spending an order slot on for the high rollers. Look around and you shall discover. I just posted a couple of tips for a budding trader in S&I, here Maybe it's of use
Sulamani Syrkos Technologies	Posted - 2010.03.25 14:47:00 - [13] If you like to join a trade corp and to get some starting oportunities, then contact me ingame.
Ester Rosin	Posted - 2010.03.25 17:51:00 - [14] Originally by: Sulamani If you like to join a trade corp and to get some starting oportunities, then contact me ingame. Sounds good will shoot you a convo next time I see you online! Originally by: Sarajo If you have a low amount of money there are a lot of opportunities that players with bigger wallets will not bother with. It is not uncommon to find margins of over 1000%. This is because the absolute amounts of ISK involved are pretty low, and not worth spending an order slot on for the high rollers. Look around and you shall discover. I just posted a couple of tips for a budding trader in S&I, here Maybe it's of use Thanks for the info :) Trading is going wonderfully so far! I have a NAV of ~20+ million isk now! Thanks to everyone again who has helped me get started.
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.03.26 03:11:00 - [15] Hey mate, nice post. I have also just started out trading. I started with hauling NPC items from station to station in my Sigil. Started makeing around 200k per trip but its starting to pick up now. I have also started with the buy/sell orders and have found a few little pockets of oppertunity which dosnt seem to get too much competition from other .01 isk war'ers. So far I am up to about 10 million from my initiial 1 Mill about a week and a half ago. Would be cool to keep in touch and find out how you are going and what kinda moves/changes you are making. See who gets to 1 billion first :P lol jokes. Best of luck out there ! Kurri
Ester Rosin	Posted - 2010.03.26 17:00:00 - [16] Originally by: Kurri Conway Hey mate, nice post. I have also just started out trading. I started with hauling NPC items from station to station in my Sigil. Started makeing around 200k per trip but its starting to pick up now. I have also started with the buy/sell orders and have found a few little pockets of oppertunity which dosnt seem to get too much competition from other .01 isk war'ers. So far I am up to about 10 million from my initiial 1 Mill about a week and a half ago. Would be cool to keep in touch and find out how you are going and what kinda moves/changes you are making. See who gets to 1 billion first :P lol jokes. Best of luck out there ! Kurri Hey! Nice to see another budding trader :) Looks like your on your way. Will definitely be in touch. And lets definitely see who gets to 1 billion first :P For fun of course. Best of luck mate. ~Ester
Vandoxarr	Posted - 2010.03.27 00:00:00 - [17] lol.. learnt a bit of a lesson last night. Over the last 3 days I have been setting up buy orders with 4 jump radius. Alot of them have filled etc etc so last night I got in my hauler and set off on the task to pick up all the stuff..... omg took like 2 hours just to get it back to one centralised point... I think from now on I will change it to 2 jumps perhaps. Just to much work (boring too). Cool thing is now I have 30 million tied up in sell orders and 5 million tied up in buy orders and about 500k in my wallet :P lol.... Time to play the waiting game !
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.03.27 00:24:00 - [18] lol.. learnt a bit of a lesson last night. Over the last 3 days I have been setting up buy orders with 4 jump radius. Alot of them have filled etc etc so last night I got in my hauler and set off on the task to pick up all the stuff..... omg took like 2 hours just to get it back to one centralised point... I think from now on I will change it to 2 jumps perhaps. Just to much work (boring too). Cool thing is now I have 30 million tied up in sell orders and 5 million tied up in buy orders and about 500k in my wallet :P lol.... Time to play the waiting game !
Maria Yumeno	Posted - 2010.03.27 01:40:00 - [19] There is a lot of isk to be made from buying in jita and hauling to a different region, this would be much better for you as u have a low start up capital. Another good way is to go to a mission hub, Motsu for example, and set a load of buy orders for meta 2,3&4 stuff. waiting a few hours/days depending on the volume and then hauling to jita for instant profit. Hint:- general pvp stuff sells very well, i.e. armour and guns
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.03.27 02:33:00 - [20] Thanks for the tip Maria, once I get some cash flow back I will def check out that scene.
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.03.29 11:19:00 - [21] How are you going with this Ester ? I worked the whole weekend and had alot of stuff on so I mainly just station traded and updated my orders a few times over the weekend. Still managed to buy and sell a bit. lol Im now at about 35 mill in sell orders and 20 million in buy orders. Holding onto about 5 mill in my wallet for emergency stuff. I am still based around Amarr. Havnt ventured out too far, except for a few NPC trade good runs 8 jumps away and to pick up my gear. Let me know how you are doing. If we are based in different Hubs I don't see why we cant trade info and tips (seeing as though we will not be competing with each other at the same trade hub etc. Catcha later man. Goodluck !
Snibeecha	Posted - 2010.03.29 11:30:00 - [22] I'm willing to discuss a small private loan (50-100M) if you are still interested. Shoot me an ingame mail if so.
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.03.29 23:32:00 - [23] Hi Snibeecha, thats a generous offer, not sure if it was intended for the OP or myself, but thanks if it was for me or the both of us. I will have to pass up your offer though as I would really like to break through these grinding first few weeks unaided, I think it would be much more rewarding doing it on my own. So thanks very very much anyway. I would be very interested though to hear your thoughts on where I should be looking/doing/planning as a small scale trader standing at about 60 million funds at the moment. Feel free to shoot me mail in game if you get a chance. Cheers again.
Vandoxarr	Posted - 2010.04.08 00:26:00 - [24] Edited by: Vandoxarr on 08/04/2010 00:26:09
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.04.08 00:32:00 - [25] Pretty sure Ester has gone Awol, but I will continue to post non the less. I enjoyed reading these type of threads when I was starting out. Lol ohhh yes 3 weeks was a long time ago friends :) Anyways I am now up to about 150 Million Net worth. 90% of that is tied up in Buy/sell orders still operating out of Amarr Trade Hub. I am normally updating orders 3 or 4 times spread through the day. Turn over is decent for most of my products. I have pretty much weeded out my products that were selling too slow (when I started out I didnt really pay enough attention to the Quantity of the item being sold, just the profits :P Newb mistake. I am also gradually replacing cheap products for more expensive ones with perhaps a slightly lower turnover rate / profit margin, but larger gross profit per sale. I juggle about 60 orders at the moment. I am pretty much over just training Trade skills now. I cant go too much further without training skills requring several days to complete. I have decided to keep my trade skills as they are for now, re-map attributes for more PVE/Mission training and have some fun. Will update again. Still welcoming hint/tips etc. Catch yas.
Lori Salvadoria	Posted - 2010.04.08 12:29:00 - [26] Sounds like you're progressing nicely. Once you get into the 50-150 mil range, you're usually fit to aim for Jita. THat doesn't mean that you can't earn big bucks elsewhere though. After all, those who make the most isk, make sure to make that isk in every way they can, and everywhere they can. I'd like to pop one myth though. You can definitely start trading at Jita with just a few millions. There are several products that net 200-500% profit. Combine that with mission running or inter-region / NPC hauling, while you continously invest in the market. That's the thing though. ISK that just sits in your wallet won't grow on its own. Regardless. This is how I introduce my aspiring traders to the business, and most of them usually go from 1-2 mil to 50+ mil within a week. And from there it just goes faster and faster.
Vandoxarr	Posted - 2010.04.09 01:22:00 - [27] Edited by: Vandoxarr on 09/04/2010 01:23:10 Good stuff.. what happened to Ester ?
Kurri Conway	Posted - 2010.04.09 03:04:00 - [28] Thanks Lori, Yeah have been thinking wether or not to head to old Jita town. I think I will give my current hub(s) a few more weeks and see if they continue to provide. I have latched on to a few items now worth a few mill each now which turn over pretty fast and double my investment. I can see myself boosting up to the 200-300 mill range fairly quickly if things continue. As for the hauling from/to other hubs, I havnt really gotten a good taste of this yet (apart from some small time NPC good hauls early in the game). I would be interested in hearing a bit more about this side of things. Sounds attractive as its pretty much instant profits, no sitting around waiting for sell orders to go. Anyways thanks for your post and interest in my ventures. Goodluck to you !
Grayclay Caldari Van Uber. Order of the Rising Sun	Posted - 2010.04.09 03:38:00 - [29] Use eve metrics or eve central to find intra-regional prices. Hauling is incredibly boring. Keep up the work. I turned 30mil into 300mil in 3 weeks just buying and selling, you'll go far if you put the effort in =)
Cyaxares II	Posted - 2010.04.09 05:29:00 - [30] Originally by: Grayclay Use eve metrics or eve central to find inter-regional prices.

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