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Lord Zim
1018
   |
Posted - 2012.07.11 00:46:00 -
[121] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Lord Zim wrote:If CCP dropped the whole "the ihub, tcu and station are sov structures" and changed everything over to "the POCOs (or added something similar) are sov structures", then maybe there would be more incentives to even try to have more than 1 large fight, followed by a sov structure grind/rep by the victor, and smallish gangs could possibly do some damage even at the sov level.
Combine this with a repurposing of titans and supercarriers, and you should probably see a lot more interesting wars than today's mechanics currently allow. You mean kind of like what they had Pre-Dominion with POSes? Only with less HP, less possible numbers of structures to shoot and less cockfaggery by f.ex shooting your own POS with its own guns to get a timer you like. But yes. Don't POCOs get their timer set by dropdown menu? 
Sadly, yes. It's why I said "or added something similar", because personally I'd prefer it if there were some mechanic which means that losing SOV is a bit of a tug of war between the attacker and the defender, where the defender can make fuckups beyond just "didn't bring enough people".
But yeah, nothing like this is going to happen. |
Marconus Orion
Massive PVPness
183
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 00:51:00 -
[122] - Quote
Remove structure mails. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
361
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 01:01:00 -
[123] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Lord Zim wrote:If CCP dropped the whole "the ihub, tcu and station are sov structures" and changed everything over to "the POCOs (or added something similar) are sov structures", then maybe there would be more incentives to even try to have more than 1 large fight, followed by a sov structure grind/rep by the victor, and smallish gangs could possibly do some damage even at the sov level.
Combine this with a repurposing of titans and supercarriers, and you should probably see a lot more interesting wars than today's mechanics currently allow. You mean kind of like what they had Pre-Dominion with POSes? Only with less HP, less possible numbers of structures to shoot and less cockfaggery by f.ex shooting your own POS with its own guns to get a timer you like. But yes. Don't POCOs get their timer set by dropdown menu? Sadly, yes. It's why I said "or added something similar", because personally I'd prefer it if there were some mechanic which means that losing SOV is a bit of a tug of war between the attacker and the defender, where the defender can make fuckups beyond just "didn't bring enough people". But yeah, nothing like this is going to happen.
Maybe bring back POSes, prevent them from shooting themselves, and introduce "Strategic" moons, as the only moons that count?
This is just off the top of my head, I haven't really thought it through.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 01:11:00 -
[124] - Quote
Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 02:12:00 -
[125] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it.
You'd have to do something about the iHub's role. Maybe untie it from holding Sov, so the new owner can kill it at their leisure?
It would be a pretty decent idea. Bring back the skill of stront timing and kiting, allow people the opportunity to screw up (though, I've heard of Sov timers getting set wrong... somehow).
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
MotherMoon
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
956
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 03:23:00 -
[126] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it.
Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons?
That's.... So stupid
Why dust 514 is on Console and not PCBattle field 3 sales Xbox 360: 2.2 million PlayStation 3: 1.5 million PC: 500,000http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 03:27:00 -
[127] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it. Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons? That's.... So stupid
Try reading the thread and you might notice that we're suggesting improvements now.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
MotherMoon
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
956
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 04:40:00 -
[128] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it. Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons? That's.... So stupid Try reading the thread and you might notice that we're suggesting improvements now.
What does that have to do with my post?
I'm just posting my surprize becuase I've been give a long time. I thought that changed Allready, there was a dev blog on tying sov to planets in 2005. Was my post unclear?
Why dust 514 is on Console and not PCBattle field 3 sales Xbox 360: 2.2 million PlayStation 3: 1.5 million PC: 500,000http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 07:50:00 -
[129] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it. Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons? That's.... So stupid Try reading the thread and you might notice that we're suggesting improvements now. What does that have to do with my post? I'm just posting my surprize becuase I've been give a long time. I thought that changed Allready, there was a dev blog on tying sov to planets in 2005. Was my post unclear?
Sigh. |
Marconus Orion
Massive PVPness
183
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 07:52:00 -
[130] - Quote
So anyone change their opinion on anything in this thread or just become more entrenched in their opinion on the matter? |
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Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:02:00 -
[131] - Quote
Marconus Orion wrote:So anyone change their opinion on anything in this thread or just become more entrenched in their opinion on the matter?
Gonna post anything constructive, or just spout silly one liners about how you're too lazy to read the thread?
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:02:00 -
[132] - Quote
Marlona Sky? Post anything other than silly one-liners?
Perish the thought. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:04:00 -
[133] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Marlona Sky? Post anything other than silly one-liners?
Perish the thought.
I don't recognize the name. Why does he now post under a different name?
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:06:00 -
[134] - Quote
Notorious badposter from SHC. I've no idea why he changed his name, don't really care. |
MotherMoon
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
956
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:12:00 -
[135] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Lord Zim wrote:Tying sov to planets make more sense than tying it to moons, though, and I'd much prefer they make some sort of minipos with just a stront bay, a shield and ... that's it. Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons? That's.... So stupid Try reading the thread and you might notice that we're suggesting improvements now. What does that have to do with my post? I'm just posting my surprize becuase I've been give a long time. I thought that changed Allready, there was a dev blog on tying sov to planets in 2005. Was my post unclear? Sigh.
You want a flame war ? Becuase the last thing you want is a flame war with a forum vet.
Bring it
Why dust 514 is on Console and not PCBattle field 3 sales Xbox 360: 2.2 million PlayStation 3: 1.5 million PC: 500,000http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1206/scimi.jpg |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:13:00 -
[136] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:Notorious badposter from SHC. I've no idea why he changed his name, don't really care.
Ah. I don't spend much time on the other forums. I thought SHC guys had a thing about being too good for EvE-O.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:18:00 -
[137] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:You want a flame war ? Becuase the last thing you want is a flame war with a forum vet.
Bring it
Sigh. Is that supposed to scare me? You might want to actually read before you go all "imma internet tuff tuff guy" next time.
Actually, scratch that, you need to read and understand first. Go do that now, we'll wait. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
362
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:18:00 -
[138] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:Lord Zim wrote:MotherMoon wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:MotherMoon wrote:
Wait ... I was gone for 3 years and your telling me sov os still tied to moons?
That's.... So stupid
Try reading the thread and you might notice that we're suggesting improvements now. What does that have to do with my post? I'm just posting my surprize becuase I've been give a long time. I thought that changed Allready, there was a dev blog on tying sov to planets in 2005. Was my post unclear? Sigh. You want a flame war ? Becuase the last thing you want is a flame war with a forum vet. Bring it
Because I feel sorry for you, OH Great Gazib, Sov is not tied to moons. It's tied to big honking structures. We were trying to brainstorm ideas for how to move away from those structures, something you could have picked up on by reading the the posts since your last post.
Zim was simply shooting down the idea of moving Sov back to moons.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Arkon Olacar
Imperial Guardians
The Aurora Shadow
62
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 08:20:00 -
[139] - Quote
MotherMoon wrote:
You want a flame war ? Becuase the last thing you want is a flame war with a forum vet.
Bring it
This **** just got real.
"The rest will be in the blog rather than invented at the keyboards of forum posters and bloggers."
-á-á-á-á-á-á-á - CCP Sreegs, 23/06/2012
Umad forum warriors? |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1174
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:16:00 -
[140] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Sov is not tied to moons. It's tied to big honking structures. We were trying to brainstorm ideas for how to move away from those structures, something you could have picked up on by reading the the posts since your last post.
Yeah instead of POS, it's now SBU, TCU, IHUB and Station.
Are there other structures involved in sov? There's like 5 timers you have to go through to take sov, or is it 6, or more than that?
You have to SBU, then shoot station and IHub (multiple timers) and then the TCU (more timers). Any other steps?
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
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Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
364
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:23:00 -
[141] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Sov is not tied to moons. It's tied to big honking structures. We were trying to brainstorm ideas for how to move away from those structures, something you could have picked up on by reading the the posts since your last post. Yeah instead of POS, it's now SBU, TCU, IHUB and Station. Are there other structures involved in sov? There's like 5 timers you have to go through to take sov, or is it 6, or more than that? You have to SBU, then shoot station and IHub (multiple timers) and then the TCU (more timers). Any other steps?
If they're clever, they might SBU their own system, so you have to kill those SBUs before you can put up your own.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:29:00 -
[142] - Quote
And if they start to, or prepare to shoot the SBUs, just unanchor and reanchor them. Voila another time extension. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
364
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:33:00 -
[143] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:And if they start to, or prepare to shoot the SBUs, just unanchor and reanchor them. Voila another time extension.
And you were complaining about RFing your own POS with its guns? 
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Degren
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
1812
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:36:00 -
[144] - Quote
Hedion's oracle wrote:Mention TEC and Goons come outta the woodwork. TEC nerf you say? Not happening. Only thing CCP understands it seems is massive Unsub threats and thats not far off the way things are going it seems.
There are 9000 of them. 7000 TEST folks. Both with founding corps from a sort of forum out of game.
We post a lot.
Mention anything stupid, like the OPs idea, and you're going to get responses from some of us.
That was your one and only free pass. Try not to let your stupid show next time.
Better consult the chart. |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:36:00 -
[145] - Quote
The SBU trick is also filled with cockfaggotry, but at least that's just a 1 hour extension (I believe), unlike the POS trick.
It's still a dumb mechanic which should never have been in there. I mean, seriously, who thought "tell everyone 8 hours in advance when and where the next attack shall be" was a good idea? |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1176
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:41:00 -
[146] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:The SBU trick is also filled with cockfaggotry, but at least that's just a 1 hour extension (I believe), unlike the POS trick.
It's still a dumb mechanic which should never have been in there. I mean, seriously, who thought "tell everyone 8 hours in advance when and where the next attack shall be" was a good idea?
Well timers are usually longer than 8 hours, aren't they?
I remember the most hilarious op though. We sat on a titan for a while. Jumped though, no carriers so scimitars had to rep it the rest of the way.
And then Boat told us to shoot it. Then said stop. The scims repped it a bit more. Ok, now shoot it again.
Yeah, it was reinforcing our own POS. After it came out of RF, guess what? We blew it up because it was a ninjaed-into-place small POS, and we had to put a big one up. Pffttt
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
364
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 09:58:00 -
[147] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:The SBU trick is also filled with cockfaggotry, but at least that's just a 1 hour extension (I believe), unlike the POS trick.
It's still a dumb mechanic which should never have been in there. I mean, seriously, who thought "tell everyone 8 hours in advance when and where the next attack shall be" was a good idea?
It's a much longer extension if you RF the Sov Brick after SBUing it. Then when they come for the timer, you offline the SBUs and BAM. They have to shoot down your SBUs to put up their own.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 10:03:00 -
[148] - Quote
I think that generally just works the very first time, the subsequent times are harder to do this with, but true enough.
As I said, it's a dumb mechanic which should never have been in there. |
Pipa Porto
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
364
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 10:24:00 -
[149] - Quote
Lord Zim wrote:I think that generally just works the very first time, the subsequent times are harder to do this with, but true enough.
As I said, it's a dumb mechanic which should never have been in there.
Honestly, I think it's fine that the defender gets these little tricks to short circuit or stall an attack. It takes a fair bit of effort to SBU and RF your own system.
I wish the attacker got some tricks like that or ways of exploiting the owner's ineptitude (Didn't most "safe" systems have a room for Ninjaing a system via ninjaing POSes into place? Or am I badly mistaken about the old mechanics?) aside from just hoping for a screwed up timer.
-RubyPorto
IB4TS |
Lord Zim
1018
|
Posted - 2012.07.11 11:13:00 -
[150] - Quote
The old system worked on the basis that the guys with the most of the biggest POSes (in the system, not in the game, so you could take a system with a single sov-claiming small POS). Meaning it was up to you to choose how expensive you wanted your space to be.
There's also the whole "only 5 POSes anchorable pr corp or alliance pr day" thing which puts a kind of limit on how quickly you can harden a system, and something about sufficient amounts of constellations in a region being SOV3 meant you had a capital constellation or system (I forget which) which turned into SOV4 where everything not a ship was invulnerable.
Instead, we now have a system where the only difference between systems is whether or not they're cynojammed, and whether or not htey have an ihub, tcu or station online, and if the attacker loses even a single fight, they lose all progress in that system. Progress. :colbert: |
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