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CCP, you've got a big challenge ahead of you...

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Ori Blake	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:21:00 - [1] ...because according to Massively, Star Wars: The Old Republic just confirmed they will have space combat. It looks like it's going to be an alternate form of PvE, but considering how many players in EVE solely do PvE in empire it looks like there might be a game for all the soloists, casuals, and carebears to go to. I wonder how this might affect upcoming development: does it still make sense to try and get more casuals and retain current ones through PI and Incarna, or will the game shrink back to a more hardcore focus? Either way, good luck CCP in responding to what may come from this.
Albetta	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:22:00 - [2] So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish!
Athena Machina Caldari SPORADIC MOVEMENT	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:25:00 - [3] Didnt you make this same kind of topic before Star Trek Online was released?
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux War.Pigs.	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:30:00 - [4] Originally by: Albetta So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! I appreciate having people to shoot. And make my ships for when I'm feeling lazy. And mine. -Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter Blog
Aiwha Caldari 101st Space Marine Force Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:32:00 - [5] OMG! Lego universe videos...
Ori Blake	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:36:00 - [6] Originally by: Albetta So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! Don't make me hit you with the shillelagh. Originally by: Athena Machina Didnt you make this same kind of topic before Star Trek Online was released? No, I'm not a trek fan so it didn't bother me. Plus, I played Champions Online-anyone who did had no illusions to how good STO might be. I think this is a steeper challenge though, especially for PvE only players. A lot of EVE's PvE is solitary, even if you are in a corp. For those players and small corps it's going to be even more of a challenge to retain them.
mechtech SRS Industries SRS.	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:40:00 - [7] SW:TOR is a story driven MMO, pre-made content laden mmo. It's absolutely the farthest possible an mmo can be away from eve, they aren't competing in the slightest.
Ressiv Cooperative Freelance Navigators Association	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:43:00 - [8] Originally by: Ori Blake ...because according to Massively, Star Wars: The Old Republic just confirmed they will have space combat. It looks like it's going to be an alternate form of PvE, but considering how many players in EVE solely do PvE in empire it looks like there might be a game for all the soloists, casuals, and carebears to go to. I wonder how this might affect upcoming development: does it still make sense to try and get more casuals and retain current ones through PI and Incarna, or will the game shrink back to a more hardcore focus? Either way, good luck CCP in responding to what may come from this. There is a HUGE difference between sandbox space combat, and some space invaders rip-off star wars style ... so I doubt it's even remotely a challenge. ========================== Nothing is true, everything is permitted. ==========================
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:43:00 - [9] Originally by: Albetta So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! Actually, yes. Let me use baby speak. You see, there are these things called bills. And bills are paid by subscription fees. And subscription fees are paid by "subscribers." Those players you like to look down your nose at because for some reason the way you play an internet spaceship game makes you feel superior (wow that's sad) pay to run Eve every bit as much as you do. And there's a lot more of them than there are of you. So with TOR we have a massive built in audience and a setting with mass appeal, a refined user interface, actual story and characters, space combat, ground combat... oh and it's made by a company that specializes in RPGs and is arguably the best at what they do. Yeah I'm sure it's not threat to Eve at all.
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:53:00 - [10] Originally by: mechtech SW:TOR is a story driven MMO, pre-made content laden mmo. It's absolutely the farthest possible an mmo can be away from eve, they aren't competing in the slightest. I agree that they're different, but we're talking about casual players. The kind of people CCP is trying to appeal to with Incarna. And in that arena CCP just can't compete with Bioware.
Aldarica Spinal Discipline	Posted - 2010.07.23 22:56:00 - [11] SWTOR is indeed one MMO game that real pose a serious threat to EVE... everyone should be aware of that. Most of the CCP's total income comes from people who rarely or never leave hisec and PvE activities - if they move to SWTOR CCP will in serious trouble.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux War.Pigs.	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:05:00 - [12] I should disclose that I will be signing up for a SWTOR account. :) -Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter Blog
Ti'anla Minmatar	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:24:00 - [13] Eh, I won't be signing up.. conceptually it seems interesting, but Bioware have late have been so.. iffy. I enjoy their RPG's, but I feel uncomfortable playing an MMORPG made with their style. For one, I don't like their favoured CG-style when it's applied to my OC's >.>
Monkey Saturday Unknown Soldiers The Spire Collective	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:27:00 - [14] Edited by: Monkey Saturday on 23/07/2010 23:26:49 Originally by: Albetta So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! Been in 0.0 since '07 (granted not as long as some but longer than most) and my 3 accounts are canceled. This one is just over a week away from running out of time. Your point, she is weak.
MatrixSkye Mk2 Minmatar	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:33:00 - [15] Originally by: Albetta So your telling me that casuals and carebears leaving EVE is a threat? You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! I'd tell you to rethink this statement but you seem to be one of those that doesn't and never will get it. So I'll just agree with you. No, casual players that only log in once in a while to use game bandwidth but pay their subscription fees anyway are not a threat. And neither are carebears. They aren't needed for anything at all. The only play style needed and which is a significant threat is yours. Grief a PVP'er. Run a mission today!
FreddyMac	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:40:00 - [16] Confirming that Eve has always had the ammount of subs it has now, and has never survived with less.
MatrixSkye Mk2 Minmatar	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:45:00 - [17] Originally by: FreddyMac Confirming that Eve has always had the ammount of subs it has now, and has never survived with less. Confirming that CCP hasn't expanded and would not be in the red if it went back to a less-than-3000 subscription base. Grief a PVP'er. Run a mission today!
Wacktopia Dark Side Of The Womb Focused Intentions	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:49:00 - [18] Originally by: Jada Maroo You see, there are these things called bills. And bills are paid by subscription fees. And subscription fees are paid by "subscribers." Those players you like to look down your nose at because for some reason the way you play an internet spaceship game makes you feel superior (wow that's sad) pay to run Eve every bit as much as you do. And there's a lot more of them than there are of you. So.... all these 'other' players who outnumber everyone else and apparently don't like space combat... they are going to go and play TOR instead because they announced space combat? Just because a new SciFi mmo comes out does not mean it will suddenly take over from all the other Scifi mmos. On the other side of the fence (the MMO who's name will not be mentioned but involves wizards and swords) they have many times more competition but I don't see them going anywhere - do you? Oh no though - what about those bills? Bawwwhaaawww hawawwwww.
Intense Thinker Minmatar	Posted - 2010.07.23 23:54:00 - [19] Wasn't Star Trek Online supposed to do the exact same thing? I'm not worried
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:09:00 - [20] Edited by: Jada Maroo on 24/07/2010 00:11:50 Originally by: Wacktopia So.... all these 'other' players who outnumber everyone else and apparently don't like space combat... they are going to go and play TOR instead because they announced space combat? Nice straw man. Not. I said nothing about them not liking space combat. My reply was in response to a certain style of play which is a hardcore minority (even in Eve), and my point was clear. When/if you wish to respond to the point I actually made, I'll address your response. Quote: Just because a new SciFi mmo comes out does not mean it will suddenly take over from all the other Scifi mmos. On the other side of the fence (the MMO who's name will not be mentioned but involves wizards and swords) they have many times more competition but I don't see them going anywhere - do you? Age of Conan is failing, Aeon is a fairly minor player, Everquest is a shell of what it was, DDO is a joke. In terms of long term success, there's pretty much WoW and... WoW. The other games survive, and have subscribers. Eve will survive and have subscribers. But you need to understand that CCP has embarked on an 18 month journey of bringing us new features that are supposed to appeal to the masses while leaving in place an overly complex interface system that's difficult for the masses to interact with. All that new blood CCP hopes to bring in isn't going to stay, for the most part. A lot of it will be lost to TOR. And in the mean time, while they're trying to attract newbies with Incarna, they're neglecting the Eve that the current subscriber base actually players. So all around it's a bad plan and while Eve is plugging along with that plan for the next 18 months, TOR will enter the picture all nice and shiney. While you may not be worried, I guarantee you the beancounters at CCP factoring in the impact of TOR on Eve in the next fiscal year or two.
Lucia Warbler Ordo Novus Mul-Zatah	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:14:00 - [21] While I'm addicted to all things Bioware, I am not interest in another MMO. If I ever visited their forums, I imagine I could troll something about them wasting resources that could've been used to make Mass Effect 3.
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:18:00 - [22] Or a Mass Effect MMO. /drool
Hainnz Imperial Academy	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:32:00 - [23] I wouldn't worry too much just yet if I were CCP. MMOs are notoriously difficult to get right, I imagine even for one of the great game companies like BioWare. Also, I reckon the game is 1-2 years away... (That said, my inner SW & BioWare geek really wants this game to be good.) It's a flawed gem of a game in many ways, but EVE's greatest weakness is its PVE game-play, and I seem to recall that CCP is working on some major PVE improvements. So, that's one reason to be optimistic about EVE's future. Besides, competition is good. With another serious player in the SF-MMO genre, maybe CCP will stop being so damned conservative and shake things up around here. (Also Ambulation will be big I think, and maybe we'll get a better UI by then too.)
Eneko Clarius	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:36:00 - [24] Originally by: Lucia Warbler While I'm addicted to all things Bioware, I am not interest in another MMO. If I ever visited their forums, I imagine I could troll something about them wasting resources that could've been used to make Mass Effect 3. Or Star Wars Nights of the Old Republic 3. KOTOR/2 were the best rpgs ive ever played, still blowing dragon age out of the water for example. IMO MMORPG's are in no way as good as a single player RPG where the story is more cohesive and can be far more complex, twisting and tailored to suit the player than some mmorpg where hugh sacrifices have to be made to the traditional way an RPG works.
Nerodon Gallente Darkwave Technologies Blade.	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:42:00 - [25] Bah... It's star wars. The only fits you can have on your ships are Blaster, Blaster MkII, Blaster MkIII, Blaster MkIV ... etc, you get the idea. I honestly can't imagine it being any fun (Or at least MORE fun than eve). To me, star wars based games lost their appeal because we've seen enough Jedi related games from KOTOR and Jedi Knight, when it comes to space and star wars all I remember and care about is Star Wars: Xwing (That's right on DOS!). The rest is usually low-profile, low-budget filth by 3rd party developers that love to make games in under 12-months with 5-year old graphic SDKs.
Lucia Warbler Ordo Novus Mul-Zatah	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:44:00 - [26] Originally by: Eneko Clarius Edited by: Eneko Clarius on 24/07/2010 00:37:04 Or Star Wars Nights of the Old Republic 3. KOTOR/2 were the best rpgs ive ever played, still blowing dragon age out of the water for example. Do they even have rights for Kotor 3? Obsidian did Kotor 2 (source). Anyway, yup, they should definitely stick with single player games.
Kyusoath Orillian Haters Gonna Hate	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:46:00 - [27] Edited by: Kyusoath Orillian on 24/07/2010 00:46:03 anyone actually seen the beta footage of shi:TOR ? its wow but worse, its the most horrible thing i've seen in a long time.
Khamerernebty	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:52:00 - [28] Originally by: Kyusoath Orillian Edited by: Kyusoath Orillian on 24/07/2010 00:46:03 anyone actually seen the beta footage of shi:TOR ? its wow but worse, its the most horrible thing i've seen in a long time. Was about to post something similar. Everything i've seen of the game looks absolutely terribad. Kind of a big shame, I had high hopes. I'll still try it, but not expecting it to be anygood.
Apoctasy Lethal Injection. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2010.07.24 00:58:00 - [29] Originally by: Albetta You are as presumptuous as you are poor and irish! Tarnish notte the majesty of my TOWER of HATS.
Nerodon Gallente Darkwave Technologies Blade.	Posted - 2010.07.24 01:01:00 - [30] Originally by: Kyusoath Orillian Edited by: Kyusoath Orillian on 24/07/2010 00:46:03 anyone actually seen the beta footage of shi:TOR ? its wow but worse, its the most horrible thing i've seen in a long time. I know, I thought is "MIGHT" have been the resurrection of Galaxies in a good way... But after seeing the videos, it gave me the same feeling that I got from watching the trailers for NCSoft's Tabula Rasa. In both cases I was utterly disgusted, confused and overwhelmed by disappointment. Turns out the game (Tabula Rasa) didn't survive very long.

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