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Nadec Ascand	Posted - 2004.12.30 13:45:00 - [91] now little calcul... 235 % resistance on shield for jaguar 210 for harpy... where are thoose 25% gone? Gimme back my 25% and put it on em so i only need 1 hardener and my cap will now be able to last :) Yeah im caldari... and yeah im flying a megatron... Why coz maybe now only caldary are tough enough to fly those and evryone use caldari ship...
Nadec Ascand	Posted - 2004.12.30 13:45:00 - [92] now little calcul... 235 % resistance on shield for jaguar 210 for harpy... where are thoose 25% gone? Gimme back my 25% and put it on em so i only need 1 hardener and my cap will now be able to last :) Yeah im caldari... and yeah im flying a megatron... Why coz maybe now only caldary are tough enough to fly those and evryone use caldari ship...
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa	Posted - 2004.12.30 21:26:00 - [93] Originally by: Nadec Ascand now little calcul... 235 % resistance on shield for jaguar 210 for harpy... where are thoose 25% gone? Gimme back my 25% and put it on em so i only need 1 hardener and my cap will now be able to last :) Really ? Let's put armour next to it then, Caldari: 218.75 total, Minmatar 195 total... Dev's.... put the missing 23.75% resists for the Wolf on Kinetic so it can also fly with only one hardener. Besides... it is not as if you own those resists or actually need EM-shield-resists at 75%. If you wanted those you should have taken your 100 Year-War against the Amarrians and not against the Gallenteans. But please, don't let me keep you from begging the designers of EVE to unbalance the game even further just to please you.
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa	Posted - 2004.12.30 21:26:00 - [94] Originally by: Nadec Ascand now little calcul... 235 % resistance on shield for jaguar 210 for harpy... where are thoose 25% gone? Gimme back my 25% and put it on em so i only need 1 hardener and my cap will now be able to last :) Really ? Let's put armour next to it then, Caldari: 218.75 total, Minmatar 195 total... Dev's.... put the missing 23.75% resists for the Wolf on Kinetic so it can also fly with only one hardener. Besides... it is not as if you own those resists or actually need EM-shield-resists at 75%. If you wanted those you should have taken your 100 Year-War against the Amarrians and not against the Gallenteans. But please, don't let me keep you from begging the designers of EVE to unbalance the game even further just to please you.
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.30 21:49:00 - [95] Point about blasters is dumb - lasers are by far most used weapon type in this game, and they do massive EM and thermal damage, which is basicaly instant wtfpwnage against Caldari, due to shields having least resistanses to those dmg types (0 and 20%). Now why da hell _assault_ ship would have 0 defence against already most devastating damage type? Isnt that kinda defeats the whole "assault" idea? What kind of assault ship is that, if i cant even kill 3 dumb 35k bloodrider cruisers in it? Even if i stack two passive EM hardeners, I still have only 46% resistance... Screw pvp - thats not acceptable even for missions Even aside from assault frigs - idea that i HAVE TO run at least two active hardeners, just to keep some cheap skillless amarr rats from insanely outdamaging me is simply frustrating. I actually just had a great idea (or i think it is ). We need a new engineering skill, that would give 5% EM resistance to shileds ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.30 21:49:00 - [96] Point about blasters is dumb - lasers are by far most used weapon type in this game, and they do massive EM and thermal damage, which is basicaly instant wtfpwnage against Caldari, due to shields having least resistanses to those dmg types (0 and 20%). Now why da hell _assault_ ship would have 0 defence against already most devastating damage type? Isnt that kinda defeats the whole "assault" idea? What kind of assault ship is that, if i cant even kill 3 dumb 35k bloodrider cruisers in it? Even if i stack two passive EM hardeners, I still have only 46% resistance... Screw pvp - thats not acceptable even for missions Even aside from assault frigs - idea that i HAVE TO run at least two active hardeners, just to keep some cheap skillless amarr rats from insanely outdamaging me is simply frustrating. I actually just had a great idea (or i think it is ). We need a new engineering skill, that would give 5% EM resistance to shileds ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Nadec Ascand	Posted - 2004.12.31 00:49:00 - [97] As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... Yeah im caldari... and yeah im flying a megatron... Why coz maybe now only caldary are tough enough to fly those and evryone use caldari ship...
Nadec Ascand	Posted - 2004.12.31 00:49:00 - [98] As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... Yeah im caldari... and yeah im flying a megatron... Why coz maybe now only caldary are tough enough to fly those and evryone use caldari ship...
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.31 03:21:00 - [99] Originally by: Nadec Ascand put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... i'd say more - armor for Caldari is just a buffer zone to be able to get away if shield tank was broken. Shield <20% = run like hell. It would make little difference if armor resistances on Caldari ships were all 0%. Its just a fancy hull extention... it even has much less HP than hull... Now Harpy got about twice less armor HP than shield. Tank it? Thats just laughable.... ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.31 03:21:00 - [100] Originally by: Nadec Ascand put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... i'd say more - armor for Caldari is just a buffer zone to be able to get away if shield tank was broken. Shield <20% = run like hell. It would make little difference if armor resistances on Caldari ships were all 0%. Its just a fancy hull extention... it even has much less HP than hull... Now Harpy got about twice less armor HP than shield. Tank it? Thats just laughable.... ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
Slithereen	Posted - 2004.12.31 09:32:00 - [101] Originally by: Meridius Oversized turrets looks cool, anyone who says otherwise should be shot in the face. The Khanid ship with medium turrets got me so wet about assault frigates way back when. What a shame. What a shame that these have also been removed from the missions. Replaced by a blue Khanid Augoror, which does look cool on its own right. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Slithereen	Posted - 2004.12.31 09:32:00 - [102] Originally by: Meridius Oversized turrets looks cool, anyone who says otherwise should be shot in the face. The Khanid ship with medium turrets got me so wet about assault frigates way back when. What a shame. What a shame that these have also been removed from the missions. Replaced by a blue Khanid Augoror, which does look cool on its own right. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Slithereen	Posted - 2004.12.31 09:49:00 - [103] Originally by: Nadec Ascand As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... My guess is that the wars really didn't end, and the empires still have some suspicions on each other. Having said that, I kind of agree that the role playing setup on the armor damages have little relevance. For example, the Amarr assaults are hardened especially against Minmatar explosive damage, yet they consistantly fight laser (EM/Thermal damage) based opponents with the Sansha and the Bloods. The missions are also supposed to fit some backstory, but now you fight a lot of Mordu, Guristas and Serpentis as well. But like everything in this game, something is never supposed to best on everything, adaptable to everything. The game is moving away from a generalist view on ships, and towards specialization. The specialization in assault damages is another dimension of expression of this concept. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Slithereen	Posted - 2004.12.31 09:49:00 - [104] Originally by: Nadec Ascand As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... My guess is that the wars really didn't end, and the empires still have some suspicions on each other. Having said that, I kind of agree that the role playing setup on the armor damages have little relevance. For example, the Amarr assaults are hardened especially against Minmatar explosive damage, yet they consistantly fight laser (EM/Thermal damage) based opponents with the Sansha and the Bloods. The missions are also supposed to fit some backstory, but now you fight a lot of Mordu, Guristas and Serpentis as well. But like everything in this game, something is never supposed to best on everything, adaptable to everything. The game is moving away from a generalist view on ships, and towards specialization. The specialization in assault damages is another dimension of expression of this concept. _______________________________________________ "Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies, "Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. "Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
Novarei	Posted - 2004.12.31 10:16:00 - [105] The problem that most people have is the expense of these frigs, they're not worth the money they cost. But theres nothing that ccp can do about the prices, only those selling the ships. +--------------------------------------------+
Novarei	Posted - 2004.12.31 10:16:00 - [106] The problem that most people have is the expense of these frigs, they're not worth the money they cost. But theres nothing that ccp can do about the prices, only those selling the ships. +--------------------------------------------+
fairimear	Posted - 2004.12.31 10:53:00 - [107] AF's are PVP ships. I would never dream of fitting 1 to npc theres no point. they come in 2 versions. the small gang AF's: Enyo. retribution. harpy. Wolf and the solo pvp hunter/raiders. Ishkur. hawk. jaguar. vengeance. each fits the role just fine (all min are a little under powered to the other races atm). Don't expect them to hold up in any large battles. the class assault ship and escort ship are both rong these are more patrol ships. so really its not a imbalance just a miss-naming. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
fairimear	Posted - 2004.12.31 10:53:00 - [108] AF's are PVP ships. I would never dream of fitting 1 to npc theres no point. they come in 2 versions. the small gang AF's: Enyo. retribution. harpy. Wolf and the solo pvp hunter/raiders. Ishkur. hawk. jaguar. vengeance. each fits the role just fine (all min are a little under powered to the other races atm). Don't expect them to hold up in any large battles. the class assault ship and escort ship are both rong these are more patrol ships. so really its not a imbalance just a miss-naming. (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:05:00 - [109] Originally by: Nadec Ascand As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... I don't care you want you're little boat to be the cream of the crop, as many have said before.... ADAPT. And as the Stones said: You can't always get what you want...
Shan'Talasha Mea'Questa	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:05:00 - [110] Originally by: Nadec Ascand As joe said i dont care about the old war against gallente... Now war is evrywhere minmattar are no more slaves nor ammar slavers... This last 2 years made some change in history lines and greatest threat is bloodraiders wich actually uses em ... So why the hell ishukone gonna build a ship unable to overide thoose pirates menace. I dont care my armor is greater than minmattar one... i dont care get 0% resistance in both armor resistance coz im caldari proud of technologie and shield... BTW if something bypass my shield im dead as evry caldari. This is a Tech 2 ship an advanced ship build for war... and unable to fire to be able to get away alive. put 3 heavy em missile my shield is over then go cut in my armor butter... I don't care you want you're little boat to be the cream of the crop, as many have said before.... ADAPT. And as the Stones said: You can't always get what you want...
Magorath	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:12:00 - [111] Originally by: fairimear AF's are PVP ships. I would never dream of fitting 1 to npc theres no point. they come in 2 versions. the small gang AF's: Enyo. retribution. harpy. Wolf and the solo pvp hunter/raiders. Ishkur. hawk. jaguar. vengeance. each fits the role just fine (all min are a little under powered to the other races atm). Don't expect them to hold up in any large battles. the class assault ship and escort ship are both rong these are more patrol ships. so really its not a imbalance just a miss-naming. I don't see the minmatar assault frigs underpowered. i took on a corp mates Retribution and we both got down into structure at the same time.
Magorath	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:12:00 - [112] Originally by: fairimear AF's are PVP ships. I would never dream of fitting 1 to npc theres no point. they come in 2 versions. the small gang AF's: Enyo. retribution. harpy. Wolf and the solo pvp hunter/raiders. Ishkur. hawk. jaguar. vengeance. each fits the role just fine (all min are a little under powered to the other races atm). Don't expect them to hold up in any large battles. the class assault ship and escort ship are both rong these are more patrol ships. so really its not a imbalance just a miss-naming. I don't see the minmatar assault frigs underpowered. i took on a corp mates Retribution and we both got down into structure at the same time.
Intensity Green	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:20:00 - [113] I just love how every ship balancing thread brings out stories about how uber everyone is. Totally disregarding skill point distribution, circumstances etc. Every dog has it's day but can we not have a serious ship balancing discussion without the irrelevant fairytales?
Intensity Green	Posted - 2004.12.31 11:20:00 - [114] I just love how every ship balancing thread brings out stories about how uber everyone is. Totally disregarding skill point distribution, circumstances etc. Every dog has it's day but can we not have a serious ship balancing discussion without the irrelevant fairytales?
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.31 15:38:00 - [115] Originally by: Slithereen My guess is that the wars really didn't end, and the empires still have some suspicions on each other. Having said that, I kind of agree that the role playing setup on the armor damages have little relevance. For example, the Amarr assaults are hardened especially against Minmatar explosive damage, yet they consistantly fight laser (EM/Thermal damage) based opponents with the Sansha and the Bloods. The missions are also supposed to fit some backstory, but now you fight a lot of Mordu, Guristas and Serpentis as well. But like everything in this game, something is never supposed to best on everything, adaptable to everything. The game is moving away from a generalist view on ships, and towards specialization. The specialization in assault damages is another dimension of expression of this concept. You talkin about rock-paper-scissors rule.... well that supposed to apply to ship types/configs, but not factions! ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."
JoeSomebody	Posted - 2004.12.31 15:38:00 - [116] Originally by: Slithereen My guess is that the wars really didn't end, and the empires still have some suspicions on each other. Having said that, I kind of agree that the role playing setup on the armor damages have little relevance. For example, the Amarr assaults are hardened especially against Minmatar explosive damage, yet they consistantly fight laser (EM/Thermal damage) based opponents with the Sansha and the Bloods. The missions are also supposed to fit some backstory, but now you fight a lot of Mordu, Guristas and Serpentis as well. But like everything in this game, something is never supposed to best on everything, adaptable to everything. The game is moving away from a generalist view on ships, and towards specialization. The specialization in assault damages is another dimension of expression of this concept. You talkin about rock-paper-scissors rule.... well that supposed to apply to ship types/configs, but not factions! ____ When flying by Concord Customs Commander's Dominix I distinctly heard him saying "... world domination..."

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