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Drake or Myrmidon?

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Tusen Takk Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:06:00 - [1] so im just getting to battlecruisers but ive come across a dilemma: should i get the ultimate shield tanking Drake that everyone in my corp worships, or should i get the Myrmidon; something that i know little about other than it is powerful and to be feared. so basically what im asking is which would be the better low sec PvP ship cheers for the help :D
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:11:00 - [2] Depends on the gang or if its solo. Drake for shield gang and myrm for armor gang. Unless you roll with energy transfer instead of RR, in which case either is good. I hear the active drake with energy transfer is a beast at tanking, although not sure if it can beat its passive cousin or a Myrm. If its solo PvP both are pretty good, but Drake is better IMHO. When you say "fanboi" try to picture a fat man doing burlesque with 2 big ass fans that say CCP on one and HTFU on the other. Because that dude is me.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates The Star Fraction	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:19:00 - [3] If you're talking pirate style PvP, then definitely the Drake - sentry guns and drones don't mix well. For ... other stuff, I think the Drake is a nice ship, but the Myrmidon has a lot going for it as well. And bear in mind, you can actually shield tank a Myrm, and potentially do a better job than a Drake would... (OK, that mostly applies to PvE recharge setups, but still - don't assume the Drake is the only BC to be able to shield tank).
Tusen Takk Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:24:00 - [4] i would mostly use her for guarding mining ops from can flippers and occasionally ganking a good indie ship so if i got the drake, what would you suggest using offensive module-wise? blasters, missiles, hybrids? anything in particular? ive seen a billion fits for drakes but idk what would be most effective for what i would use it for i know i would need: warp inhibitor cargo scanner shield tanks galore with shield pump rigs ??? PROFIT
Titus Phook Amarr	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:56:00 - [5] Edited by: Titus Phook on 28/09/2010 16:58:49 Drake is missile fit only as it only has launcher slots. Myrm will give you more options offense wise as you can use projectile, blaster, rails etc, shield tanked Myrm with autocannons or artillery is always fun. --------------------------------------------- Proudly posting with my Alt since 2009
Tyraeil Starblade	Posted - 2010.09.28 16:57:00 - [6] myrm.. drake's make me lol
Tusen Takk Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division	Posted - 2010.09.28 17:05:00 - [7] exactly why i dont know much about Myrms lol... fanboys say OMG MYRMS ROCK but never really say why other than "lol drake"
Xpaulusx Intergalactic Syndicate Galactic Syndicate	Posted - 2010.09.28 17:19:00 - [8] Forget both of them, Nanoed Hurricane cause all the cool kids fly them.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions	Posted - 2010.09.28 17:37:00 - [9] Edited by: Zhilia Mann on 28/09/2010 17:37:59 Originally by: Tusen Takk i would mostly use her for guarding mining ops from can flippers and occasionally ganking a good indie ship so if i got the drake, what would you suggest using offensive module-wise? blasters, missiles, hybrids? anything in particular? ive seen a billion fits for drakes but idk what would be most effective for what i would use it for Umm. On a Drake you fit missiles. Period. Because, well, you can't fit anything else. And it has a missile bonus. You probably want heavy missiles, as they're easier on fitting and can damage at very long range. Heavy assault missiles are tough for a newer player to make use of. Otherwise, a scram is good and obviously you want a shield tank. Your lows should pack lots of damage mods and likely nothing else. A cargo scanner is... meh. At best. If you suspect your mark might have good loot, kill it. If not, kill it. You'll find out after the fact either way. The cargo scanner is more for suicide ganks in high sec than actual piracy -- and a Drake is not the ship for high sec suicide ganks.
Psiri	Posted - 2010.09.28 17:48:00 - [10] Drake is better for solo PvP, gangs AND missions. Cane is considered better overall in PvP and Myrm can be quite costly to fit in PvP due to drones and armor rigs adding to the cost. People tend to underestimate the Myrm in PvP however and it can fit a beastly active armor tank or e-war modules like tracking disruptors, which may turn the tide in its favour.
Mutant Caldari Caldari Percussive Diplomacy	Posted - 2010.09.28 17:59:00 - [11] Originally by: Tusen Takk Edited by: Tusen Takk on 28/09/2010 17:06:54 exactly why i dont know much about Myrms lol... fanboys say OMG MYRMS ROCK but never really say why other than "lol drake" i have 45mil to blow on either ship so convince me to go one way or the other and i'll send you a finder's fee :) With 45 mil, you'll barely be able to afford the ship + insurance . Fly something smaller until you can afford bigger. Yeah I am a pirate. What are you gonna do about it? Killboard link is not allowed to be used in a signature.Applebabe
Templar Dane Amarrian Retribution	Posted - 2010.09.28 18:03:00 - [12] A myrm is a wonderful ship, in that there is a plethora of things you can do with one. -shield gank with blasters/autos/pulse lasers -triple rep mega-tank -passive shield tank for drake-like tanking for pve (train for artillery because it uses no cap) -big buffer with small guns and lots of webs for pwning entire frigate gangs It's my favorite battlecruiser because of it's flexibility. Though a drake is much easier to train for, and you'll probably get more mileage out of one.
Maz3r Rakum	Posted - 2010.09.28 18:49:00 - [13] I'd say get the myrm, as the BC skill is not race specific, and if you get projectile skills, you can fly a Cain also (with prereqs). This gives you a lot of options and versatility. Either way both Drake and Myrm are pretty solid, however, IMO, the Myrm is probably the 4th best BC, behind the Cain, Drake, and Harby. But unlike most gallente ships, it isn't hamstrung by having to use hybrids, and why it might not be quite as good as some other BC, it makes up for this in versatility. There are tons of effective potential fits, like a nano shield tanked Myrm, a Neut myrm (curse-a-don) Laser Myrm, Ac myrm, Psyco Myrm (shield gank blaster myrm).
Sewer Urchin	Posted - 2010.09.28 19:28:00 - [14] If you're gonna be dealing with gate guns and what not, I'd say go with the drake at first just cuz it's easier(assuming you already have some shield/missile skills seeing as you're caldari). You can always train the myrm later.
Ogogov	Posted - 2010.09.28 20:11:00 - [15] Drake. There are enough things broken with Gallente ships in general coupled with the poor state of drone control to make the Myrmidon a distant second place, even if it is a good contender.
Captain Nares	Posted - 2010.09.28 20:24:00 - [16] Drake is better for PvE, but I cant say the same about PvP. Drake is... drake. FOTM, most odious ship in eve. Myrm fitting is more versatile. It is more surprising imo. Myrm needs moar skills (armor/shield + heavy drones + med turrets while drake needs shield only + HM/HAM + light drones). Myrm looks better imo.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2010.09.28 20:29:00 - [17] Originally by: Captain Nares Drake is... drake. FOTM, most odious ship in eve. hehe, its kinda funny... when I started out in EVE all "elite PVPers" back then would scoff at using a drake in PVP, and now far later it is basically unchanged, actually its weaker since the Javeline nerf, but many rage thats its overpowered :P Personally I prefer the Drake over the Myrm, but my shield+laser gank myrm is fun to fly. My triple rep myrm is also interesting but limited. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Captain Nares	Posted - 2010.09.28 21:16:00 - [18] Edited by: Captain Nares on 28/09/2010 21:17:56 Originally by: Sidus Isaacs hehe, its kinda funny... when I started out in EVE all "elite PVPers" back then would scoff at using a drake in PVP, and now far later it is basically unchanged, actually its weaker since the Javeline nerf, but many rage thats its overpowered :P I don't know any pvp corp which doesn't use cheap and effective BC's (drake, cane, etc). So flying a drake is like dating a fat chick, you know...
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2010.09.28 21:43:00 - [19] Originally by: Captain Nares Edited by: Captain Nares on 28/09/2010 21:17:56 Originally by: Sidus Isaacs hehe, its kinda funny... when I started out in EVE all "elite PVPers" back then would scoff at using a drake in PVP, and now far later it is basically unchanged, actually its weaker since the Javeline nerf, but many rage thats its overpowered :P I don't know any pvp corp which doesn't use cheap and effective BC's (drake, cane, etc). So flying a drake is like dating a fat chick, you know... it is 2.5 years since I joined EVE mind you. Things have changed player wise, but the ship remains the same, I have used the default HAM fit for 2 years now. People eventually caught on that the drake can be good when fitted right :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Footoo Rama Gallente Beyond Control.	Posted - 2010.09.28 22:45:00 - [20] Honetly if your going to sit in a bc and go after can flippers, your going to get hosed, or bored out of your mind. If a BC is going to sit on the cans, no one is going to grab your cans. Or he will be ready to warp in a fleet that will own you. If you can explain what tactic your going to use we may be able to help you better. ------- "Because the Dominix is the Chuck Norris of Eve!"
TheMahdi	Posted - 2010.09.28 23:36:00 - [21] [Myrmidon, Triple Rep Madness] Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800 Stasis Webifier II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Warrior II x5 Hobgoblin II x1 Hammerhead II x2 Ogre II x2 You can fit a whole other set of 2/2/1 in the Myrm or 10 lights or medium ECM, up to you. Also this is great solo or small gang as with an Exile Booster it can tank a small gang for quite a while. If your not a projectile man, it works just as well with Medium Pulse Laser II's (yes, the small ones) and Scorch and a neut/nos to taste. Would not recommend Hybrids in any way shape or form! Drake I like but not for solo, this Myrm can take on more than one BC solo
Tusen Takk Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division	Posted - 2010.09.29 00:31:00 - [22] Originally by: TheMahdi [Myrmidon, Triple Rep Madness] Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800 Stasis Webifier II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Warrior II x5 Hobgoblin II x1 Hammerhead II x2 Ogre II x2 You can fit a whole other set of 2/2/1 in the Myrm or 10 lights or medium ECM, up to you. Also this is great solo or small gang as with an Exile Booster it can tank a small gang for quite a while. If your not a projectile man, it works just as well with Medium Pulse Laser II's (yes, the small ones) and Scorch and a neut/nos to taste. Would not recommend Hybrids in any way shape or form! Drake I like but not for solo, this Myrm can take on more than one BC solo pretty sure this just sold me on the Myrm haha. i'll have to train my skillz up so i can use the drones more effectively though
Wacktopia Bi-Tech Theory Focused Intentions	Posted - 2010.09.29 09:32:00 - [23] Originally by: Tusen Takk Originally by: TheMahdi [Myrmidon, Triple Rep Madness] pretty sure this just sold me on the Myrm haha. i'll have to train my skillz up so i can use the drones more effectively though Yeah man, and the Drake is a really boring ship. Auto's are nice on the Myrm and you can also then fly FOTM Winmattar easier.
AstarothPrime	Posted - 2010.09.29 09:59:00 - [24] Originally by: TheMahdi [Myrmidon, Triple Rep Madness] Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Medium Armor Repairer II Damage Control II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800 Stasis Webifier II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Dual 180mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Medium Nanobot Accelerator I Warrior II x5 Hobgoblin II x1 Hammerhead II x2 Ogre II x2 You can fit a whole other set of 2/2/1 in the Myrm or 10 lights or medium ECM, up to you. Also this is great solo or small gang as with an Exile Booster it can tank a small gang for quite a while. If your not a projectile man, it works just as well with Medium Pulse Laser II's (yes, the small ones) and Scorch and a neut/nos to taste. Would not recommend Hybrids in any way shape or form! Drake I like but not for solo, this Myrm can take on more than one BC solo Tip of the day: Ogre dies quickly (say 3 volleys = 18 sec) webbed and shot with T2 precision scourge (which I allways pack with me on roams just because everyone and their mother sends those at me since we roam gallente space). So does the hammerhead Warrior II and small autocannons need like 20 minutes to eat thru 70k EHP 250 EHP/s passive regen drake (if you even manage to break it). Now then only question here is: can you fit enough Republic Fleet EMP M slugs and Cap Booster 800 to 400 m3 hold to be able to eat 550+ dps from HAMII furys on drake for 20 minutes I. P.S. Answer to OP: basic principle is - fly the one which you can fit with 60k+ EHP buffer, 500+ DPS, MWD and tackle If you cant fit neither with given spec -> fly the one closer to that achievement
Wacktopia Bi-Tech Theory Focused Intentions	Posted - 2010.09.29 10:19:00 - [25] Originally by: AstarothPrime Ogre dies quickly (say 3 volleys = 18 sec) webbed and shot with T2 precision scourge (which I allways pack with me on roams just because everyone and their mother sends those at me since we roam gallente space). Or even from HAM which are kinda bad for them... If only there was a way to hot-key drone return and attack so that breaking the lock on them was easy. Oh wai... Talking about particular situations is difficult and Drake vs Myrm has different outcomes depending on the situation. I could counter your argument by saying "I can tank your dps for ages with my reppers whilst all I have to do is eat through your buffer to win" but of course that would be entirely situational. Personally, I think it comes down to this... - The drake is a very good BC. It's easy to fit, easy to fly and easy to skill for. However, there are only a couple of variations when fitting a drake for PvP so you might find it gets boring. Also if you're trained for Caldari you might find your PvP options are less flexible than other races. - The Myrm, in contrast, is a very flexible ship. As you can see from the posts above there are many ways in which you can fit and fly the Myrm - you can keep your enemies guessing and have fun playing with fits (the Dominix and Brutix are similar in this respect). The down side of this is that it will take longer to skill for these variations (ACs, Hybrids, Drones, Shield, Armor) and you will need to learn how to take advantage of your random creations. You will also suffer the fate of hybrids being a difficult weapons system to master in their current state.
Mona X Caldari C0VEN	Posted - 2010.09.29 10:40:00 - [26] Edited by: Mona X on 29/09/2010 10:41:17 Originally by: Wacktopia If only there was a way to hot-key drone return and attack so that breaking the lock on them was easy. Oh wai... Fortunatelly, their shield insta reps itself when they dock in drone bay. Oh wai... Join Eve-Online, meet interesting people, grief them.
Moose Burger	Posted - 2010.09.29 11:01:00 - [27] battlecruisers can almost instalock ogre's. To make it worst, one volley will put ogre's into 10%-50% armor. Most people dont have drone dura V. Another shot into structure. Once it goes pop, your left drones and unbonused unmoded guns wont even break the drakes passive tank. No. NEVER use 1/2/2 drones on a myrm even if the setup seems to give good dps, its much better to use medium,eccm and the like. Decent dps, damage choice, and you can fit web/ecm drones which are always awesome to have.
TheMahdi	Posted - 2010.09.29 11:15:00 - [28] Originally by: Moose Burger battlecruisers can almost instalock ogre's. To make it worst, one volley will put ogre's into 10%-50% armor. Most people dont have drone dura V. Another shot into structure. Once it goes pop, your left drones and unbonused unmoded guns wont even break the drakes passive tank. No. NEVER use 1/2/2 drones on a myrm even if the setup seems to give good dps, its much better to use medium,eccm and the like. Decent dps, damage choice, and you can fit web/ecm drones which are always awesome to have. Your fighting in scram range, the recall is INSTANT, you should have atleast Drone Durability IV and I've yet to have an Ogre anywhere near 2 volleyed like you say. Usually it just drops shields and a little armor, the whole time they are pew pewing at your drones, your saving on cap. You can fit plenty of replacement drones in a Myrm, even 2 full sets of 2/2/1, but like I said, I don't carry 2 full sets of 2/2/1, I carry spare light and medium drones including ECM.
Natasha Hec Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2010.09.29 11:24:00 - [29] Originally by: AstarothPrime [ Tip of the day: Ogre dies quickly (say 3 volleys = 18 sec) webbed and shot with T2 precision scourge (which I allways pack with me on roams just because everyone and their mother sends those at me since we roam gallente space). Or even from HAM which are kinda bad for them... So does the hammerhead Warrior II and small autocannons need like 20 minutes to eat thru 70k EHP 250 EHP/s passive regen drake (if you even manage to break it). Now then only question here is: can you fit enough Republic Fleet EMP M slugs and Cap Booster 800 to 400 m3 hold to be able to eat 550+ dps from HMII furys on drake for 20 minutes I. P.S. Answer to OP: basic principle is - fly the one which you can fit with 60k+ EHP buffer, 500+ DPS, MWD and tackle If you cant fit neither with given spec -> fly the one closer to that achievement Although im not advocating the use of the 2-2-1 drone layout or ogre's what pvp drake fit do you use to get 250 ehp/s passive rep
TheMahdi	Posted - 2010.09.29 11:24:00 - [30] Originally by: AstarothPrime Warrior II and small autocannons need like 20 minutes to eat thru 70k EHP 250 EHP/s passive regen drake (if you even manage to break it). Now then only question here is: can you fit enough Republic Fleet EMP M slugs and Cap Booster 800 to 400 m3 hold to be able to eat 550+ dps from HMII furys on drake for 20 minutes As in my last response, this is a solo fitting and will be fighting in scram range vs a Drake (hence the scram) so recalling drones is easy and the yrep shields, so thats never been a problem. The Medium Pulse Laser II's fit is better for Drakes since it doesn't use ammo and focuses on EM/therm damage. But the AC fit is fine too and this fit still puts out almost 500 DPS while EASILY tanking the DPS of an HML Drake with even 1 or 2 reppers for that time Personally I like to use the Medium Pulse Laser and medium neut fit when I know I'm fighting a Drake camp, the neut helps break the tank a little quicker and the damage type is better. Keep in mind, the Drake is generally a better pirate ship since sentry guns eat drones quickly so use the Myrm _defensively_, it makes a good camp buster thats for sure.

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