| Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Estel Arador
   |
Posted - 2010.10.06 17:08:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 06/10/2010 17:15:31
That's right, I'm looking for someone to take over EACS. With the exception of short hiatus due to hardware issues, I have accepted applications and kicked members daily for over 650 days, or 22 months. Unfortunately my situation will soon be such that I can no longer commit to such a regular presence. To prevent EACS from closing down, I see two options.
Firstly, I keep full control over EACS and have some grunt do all the applications and kicking. The grunt would be paid from the donations EACS gets.
This option does not appeal to me. I am somewhat of a control-freak, so this would likely cause me some stress. Though I have no doubt that there would be many people willing and able to do this, the responsibility of finding the right person would lie with me. Furthermore I would have the check if this person is doing the job right, and find someone else if he underperforms or quits. I prefer not to take this upon me.
Secondly, I could sell EACS, giving the new owner full control over the service, including running and changing it as he wishes. This brings up the issue of how to value a free service (which was touched upon in a thread last week). I will be providing some stats below to make valuing EACS a bit less of guesswork. This option has the advantage that I won't be involved in the business at all any more.
Some background
EACS is EVE's leading jumpclone service. It is essentially a monopolist; there is only one other active jumpclone service I'm aware of (run by Genji Ancient) and by the amount of feedback provided in its thread it appears to have lost many of its customers since EACS was launched. At least three other jumpclone services, including a free one with more facilities than EACS (by Cyber Broker), have been started and gone out of business in the period EACS was active.
EACS has jumpclone-grade standings to 49 NPC corporations and offers access to medical services in 1092 stations, which is 70% to 75% of all publicly accessible jumpclone facilities ingame. EACS is currently marketed as an easy to use, free jumpclone service. This a choice made by me; it is certainly not the only viable business model.
EACS has an excellent reputation. It has been mentioned in the news on the login page three times û each time resulting in a sustained increase in users û and on third party websites such as Tentonhammer. On official and unoffical forums EACS is often recommended.
Let's talk money.
Some people choose to donate after using the service, usually between 1M and 10M per donation though some people have made very generous donations up to 100M. In 22 months, EACS has received 5833M isk in donations, which is an average of 265M per month. Though the amount donated varies per day from 0 to 100M, the amount is pretty stable of 30 day periods. The minimum for any 30-day period is 230M, the maximum for any 30-day period is 477M.
EACS has no operating costs at all, other than time needed to run it. Offices are no longer needed (they were during the first year of operation, when I spent up to 100M a month in office fees).
EACS has 100.000 shares. I have sold 958 of these shares at 1M per. All other shares are owned by me and my alts. Anyone taking over EACS should expect getting 99.000 of 100.000 shares.
Other jumpclone services charge or charged between 5M and 15M per user. Such a business model would likely result in less users but a higher income. MicanG reported his service Dark Reality had over 1700 users over the course of 18 months which, at 15M per user, is over 26B.
Comments on how to handle this situation and especially thoughts on valuing the business will be appreciated. If you'd like to make me an offer, you can do so here or send me an evemail.
(Note: due the character limit I have not included links to other threads/sites. If EVE-search or Google fails you, let me know.)
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Claire Voyant
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 17:20:00 -
[2]
Since most of us haven't run jump clone services, maybe you could expand on exactly what would be expected of an operator.
|
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 17:41:00 -
[3]
I know you don't like the first option but since you slready own the shares just appoint a director with no standings and he does the grunt work, since you don't care about the isk him having access to the corp wallet measn nothing.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 17:58:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 06/10/2010 17:58:48
 Originally by: Claire Voyant
Since most of us haven't run jump clone services, maybe you could expand on exactly what would be expected of an operator.
Of course. Basic operation is quite simple, and consists of two tasks:
1) people send in applications to the corp, these apps have to be accepted (one by one, there is no other way). I usually do this once or twice a day. The average number of applications per day is over 25.
2) people who are overstaying their welcome have to be kicked from the corp. I do this once a day. The limit I've set is 4 days. This means that tonight between 2200 and 2400 game time I will kick anyone who has joined on October 2nd if they're still in the corp. Usually this is 4 or 5 people.
If you would operate the service on a fee basis, the step of accepting applications would be preceded by checking who actually paid the fee. (This hassle is one of the reasons why chose for a free model.)
Apart from this, there's publicity which has to be handled, which for me comes down to bumping/maintaining the forum thread.
Answering questions of users is optional. Usually users answer each other's questions in corp chat, which is quite handy  I've also written a comprehensive guide to jumpclones which answers most questions, so if I get a question I usually refer to that.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Aerilis
Gallente
Percussive Diplomacy
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 18:19:00 -
[5]
Sad to see you go mate, hope someone continues your legacy :)
|
Mme Pinkerton
United Engineering Services
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 18:43:00 -
[6]
The number one problem I see is that the biggest asset of EACS is its name which is recognized widely among EVE players (probably only comparable to BIG in this regard) and that name is tied to the name of your character...
If someone were to take over the service he would obviously want to keep that name (while maybe converting EACS to a paid-only service or launching other income-generating services under the same brand-name).
This might lead to nasty disputes in case you don't agree with his ideas - up to the risk of you invoking anti-impersonation policies and having the corpname changed, thus destroying the most important asset of the service.
For that reason I would suggest either to go with the "grunt" model or sell the "Estel Arador" character to the person who takes over the service.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:05:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Mme Pinkerton
If someone were to take over the service he would obviously want to keep that name (while maybe converting EACS to a paid-only service or launching other income-generating services under the same brand-name).
This might lead to nasty disputes in case you don't agree with his ideas - up to the risk of you invoking anti-impersonation policies and having the corpname changed, thus destroying the most important asset of the service.
For that reason I would suggest either to go with the "grunt" model or sell the "Estel Arador" character to the person who takes over the service.
I agree, the name probably is the biggest asset. One of the reasons I prefer a sale of the service is that I won't have to disagree with ideas. If someone else owns it, it's his to do with as he pleases.
I don't think anti-impersonation policies would apply. The corp name is Estel Arador Corp Services, owning a corp with a name is not the same as impersonating a character. Plus there's a public record of the sale of the corp with that name which could be provided as evidence in any investigation.
And though I'm not one to make categorical statements, selling the character would be out of the question.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Ave Volta
Perkone
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:08:00 -
[8]
First, thanks for the service. Looking at my employment history I used it in mid-2009. I think it's impressive that a donation based service gather decent revenue.
Second, I have always been curious of your methed to achieve high standings with so many corps?
Third, good luck with the transition and and with any future endeavors. 
--------------------------------
chown -R us:us /yourbase |
Claire Voyant
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:30:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Estel Arador
Edited by: Estel Arador on 06/10/2010 17:58:48
Originally by: Claire Voyant
Since most of us haven't run jump clone services, maybe you could expand on exactly what would be expected of an operator.
Of course. Basic operation is quite simple, and consists of two tasks:
1) people send in applications to the corp, these apps have to be accepted (one by one, there is no other way). I usually do this once or twice a day. The average number of applications per day is over 25.
2) people who are overstaying their welcome have to be kicked from the corp. I do this once a day. The limit I've set is 4 days. This means that tonight between 2200 and 2400 game time I will kick anyone who has joined on October 2nd if they're still in the corp. Usually this is 4 or 5 people.
If you would operate the service on a fee basis, the step of accepting applications would be preceded by checking who actually paid the fee. (This hassle is one of the reasons why chose for a free model.)
Apart from this, there's publicity which has to be handled, which for me comes down to bumping/maintaining the forum thread.
Answering questions of users is optional. Usually users answer each other's questions in corp chat, which is quite handy I've also written a comprehensive guide to jumpclones which answers most questions, so if I get a question I usually refer to that.
And corp standing never changes? What would happen if you leave the corp? I would have thought that the director character would have to be a no-standing alt and members would have to be admitted right after DT and booted before the next DT. I guess I am out of it.
|
Nathan Jameson
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:32:00 -
[10]
I do hauling from time to time for those in my corp, and I've noticed that simply asking for tips always nets me more income than if I haggle a set price for the trip. Apparently, not wanting to look cheap is a great incentive.
There have actually been restaurants that ran on a tip-only system, and they reported actually earning more money than if they had charged normally for their meals. (I can't find a link at this moment.)
I would not personally want the hassle of EACS, but I think whoever does take the reigns should seriously consider maintaining the free, donation-only system.
|
Luxotor
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:40:00 -
[11]
Just wanted to express my appreciation for an excellent service and good luck. o7.
---------------
Make lowsec useful! |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 19:48:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Ave Volta
I have always been curious of your methed to achieve high standings with so many corps?
Running lots of missions, and having other people who ran lots of mission 'rub off' their standings to EACS.
Originally by: Claire Voyant
And corp standing never changes? What would happen if you leave the corp? I would have thought that the director character would have to be a no-standing alt and members would have to be admitted right after DT and booted before the next DT. I guess I am out of it.
The mechanics you're describing are old.
Members only affect corp standing once they're in the corp for 7 days. During the first 7 days, they will have no effect at all; after 7 days they will be counted fully in the calculation for corp standing (so there's no gradual change any more).
That's why I set a limit of 4 days. It gives me 2 to 3 days to kick a member, so if I for some reason don't kick people on one day, I still have room to catch up.
Since the operator character stays in the corp for more than 7 days, it will have to be an alt with no standings.
As for the question "What would happen if you leave the corp?", I am no longer in the corp, and haven't been for much of the time EACS has been operating. I handle everything with an alt (Estel Also).
Originally by: Nathan Jameson
I would not personally want the hassle of EACS, but I think whoever does take the reigns should seriously consider maintaining the free, donation-only system.
Indeed the free model is profitable, but I'm not sure if it's more profitable than a paid model. To earn 3B a year with a fee of 5M, you'd only need 23 users per week, which is less than the number of users EACS currently has per day.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 20:45:00 -
[13]
So would you like people to get in contact with you in game or how? I have a free alt spot:D.
|
Zia Pow
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 22:33:00 -
[14]
If someone was to buy EACS from you, with the intent of keeping it a free service, what assets if any or support features are included?
What support would you yourself offer and for how long?
Ego - Epeen - Eve
The 3 Amigos of the MMO world. |
egola
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 22:54:00 -
[15]
Edited by: egola on 06/10/2010 22:56:29
it would be a waste to have eacs go down the drain, i mean a couple of us could help ya with the administrative sector, i for one am willing to take an alt and start kicking people for ya, although ill have to make a new one with no standings to anything. i can work on 2-3 days a week, maybe we can have someone else to fill in the other days?
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:08:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 06/10/2010 23:11:04
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
So would you like people to get in contact with you in game or how? I have a free alt spot:D.
I will wait a day or two to see what responses I get here in this thread and ingame; I will then decide on a course of action. I will contact everyone who has expressed interest once it's clear what I'll be doing exactly.
Given the amount of interest so far (6 people messaged me ingame in the past hours, plus the interest in this thread) I might go for an auction, but all options are still on the table.
Please don't hesitate to give your opinion on the valuation or transfer process.
Originally by: Zia Pow
If someone was to buy EACS from you, with the intent of keeping it a free service, what assets if any or support features are included?
What support would you yourself offer and for how long?
Any sale would include the corp and 99.000 of 100.000 shares. I'm willing to provide the full historical data on users and donations per day as well.
As for support, I'll be available to show the new person the ropes, of course. It's not a complicated business, so I wouldn't expect this to last very long, perhaps a week or two. I can also offer some advice on marketing.
Originally by: egola
it would be a waste to have eacs go down the drain, i mean a couple of us could help ya with the administrative sector, i for one am willing to take an alt and start kicking people for ya, although ill have to make a new one with no standings to anything. i can work on 2-3 days a week, maybe we can have someone else to fill in the other days?
Thanks for your support and interest. However, this is exactly the kind of construction I'd like to avoid.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Zia Pow
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:14:00 -
[17]
I hate to ask this, but whats to keep you from just restarting and reselling copy corps every few weeks?
Ego - Epeen - Eve
The 3 Amigos of the MMO world. |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:20:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Zia Pow
I hate to ask this, but whats to keep you from just restarting and reselling copy corps every few weeks?
A fair question, and the very simple answer is: I can't.
EACS has jumpclone grade standings to 49 of the largest corporations of all races, this has been achieved not only by using my own standings, but also the standings of 4 other characters - carefully applied in such a way as to not mess up the upgrade another character did. I cannot copy this. I personally only have jumpclone grade standings to 18 corporations, most Minmatar and some Gallente (plus Caldari Navy), that's a huge difference with what EACS has.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:23:00 -
[19]
1) He obvisouls can answer for himself but he doesn't have all the standings, some of the standings came from other people.
2) He isn't currently in the corp and there are other jumpclone services this is just the most famos.
I'd prefer if you didn't do an auction. If you'd like to keep it free atleast try the voulenteer director option for a few days/weeks first.
Yes it is a great money making opportunity but you don't see to care about the isk you just seem to want the corp to keep running. Get a few of us by whatever filter process you wish and make us directors. We'd work out the details and then you come every so often and check if we screwed with your vision. You keep the shares and control, an we do the hardwork.
I didn't use your services, but know many people who have and are greatful so I'd like to see it kept running as it is as best as possible.
|
Zia Pow
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:27:00 -
[20]
I'm interested in purchasing it and keeping it FREE, and running it just as its always been run. However that brings us strait to the question of Non Profit Value vs Profit value, and we all know the profit guys carry huge purses.
Ego - Epeen - Eve
The 3 Amigos of the MMO world. |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:33:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Zia Pow
I'm interested in purchasing it and keeping it FREE, and running it just as its always been run. However that brings us strait to the question of Non Profit Value vs Profit value, and we all know the profit guys carry huge purses.
This is why I don't think it should be sold. The profit potential for this is quite limitless, as limitless as anything is in the game. And besides even if some benovolent rich person say an Entity or Chribba :D were to come along there is no guareentee of what they would do after they have control. The day to day running of the corp you nolonger have to do but if in a weeks or month's time you don't like what it has become retainning control, assuming you aren't quitting the game, is your best option.
|
Doll
|
Posted - 2010.10.06 23:33:00 -
[22]
Hey Estel,
I'm sure you could use your well-earned reputation to start a 3rd party service if you wanted to. If I were you, I would probably keep the jump clone service running until the 3rd party service was well under way, and then try to offload or gradually shut down the jump clone service.
|
Vilgan Mazran
Aperture Harmonics
K162
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:00:00 -
[23]
I think you have 3 options:
1) Keep running the service yourself, but reduce your personal commitment. Announce that you'll accept all apps on saturday and boot people still sitting around on Wednesday. A lag time is fine if people can anticipate it.
2) Shut it down until you have the time to run it yourself
3) Sell the corp to someone who wants to run it for profit. The massive amount of jumpclone locations is a pretty nifty draw.
I personally don't think handing it over for free or having a director do stuff for you would work. They'll screw it up or do something which annoys you and drama will ensue. Better to either keep it for yourself in some manner or sell it and separate yourself from it entirely.
|
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:10:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
I think you have 3 options:
I personally don't think handing it over for free or having a director do stuff for you would work. They'll screw it up or do something which annoys you and drama will ensue. Better to either keep it for yourself in some manner or sell it and separate yourself from it entirely.
What's to screw up, accept app-> boot person. This isn't a corp that needs activities it just needs accept-> boot. No argument, no blues, no roles nothing, no politics. How can someone mess it up.
|
Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:20:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
1) Keep running the service yourself, but reduce your personal commitment. Announce that you'll accept all apps on saturday and boot people still sitting around on Wednesday. A lag time is fine if people can anticipate it.
This could work if you only have a limited time.
|
cosmoray
Cosmoray Holdings Corp
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:42:00 -
[26]
This is a great service and has a great reputation, unfortunately it is not good at generating a good financial return.
Lets Talk Money
In MD the minimum returns are expected to be at least 3% per month.
According to your calculations you are expecting 100B ISK to buy the business.
The problem is that the business has returned 5.83B ISK in 22 months or 265M ISK per month.
At my 3% per month return valuation (3% is minimum for blue chip businesses) I put a value on EACS of 8.33B.
There is obviously some good will built into the business, and new owners would look to change the business plan to monetize the service but that leaves a huge difference in the two values.
The primary difficulties for new owners will be:
1. To keep the brand value of EACS now that the original owner has left.
2. Generate income from a new business model.
One other thing you don't mention in any of your posts is how much time do you have to spend administering the business,. I am assuming this is time intensive as you have to keep updating posts and accepting members to the corp/alliance.
|
Vilgan Mazran
Aperture Harmonics
K162
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 00:45:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
I think you have 3 options:
I personally don't think handing it over for free or having a director do stuff for you would work. They'll screw it up or do something which annoys you and drama will ensue. Better to either keep it for yourself in some manner or sell it and separate yourself from it entirely.
What's to screw up, accept app-> boot person. This isn't a corp that needs activities it just needs accept-> boot. No argument, no blues, no roles nothing, no politics. How can someone mess it up.
They get busy/distracted/whatever and forget to boot people. Tada, standings ruined.
|
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 01:18:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
I think you have 3 options:
They get busy/distracted/whatever and forget to boot people. Tada, standings ruined.
Nice alliance name :D. Which is why he should accept a couple of us. Four people saying we'll cover 2 days each, if one gets bust you have built in redundancy.
|
Taram Caldar
Royal Black Watch Highlanders
Warped Aggression
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 02:55:00 -
[29]
Sorry to see you shutting EACS down/selling it (which will likely lead to it shutting down :( )
As my corp actually runs it's own jump clone services (we have two corps we maintain very high standings with to keep empire jump clone services for our members) I can totally relate to the level of attention it requires to keep jump clone services in as many locations as EACS does :) I wish you luck in finding a capable owner/operator for the service. Would be a shame to see it close down. While my corp members don't require it's services it will suck for all those who do if it can't be kept running.
Market Alerts Mailing List
|
Noun Verber
Gallente
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 03:46:00 -
[30]
Please be a troll
What if you had a team of 'grunts'? I'd volunteer to be one, as I don't think that I could keep up the daily requirement that you have done (which also seems to be the reason that you're leaving).
|
Thoraemond
Minmatar
Far Ranger
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 05:34:00 -
[31]
Originally by: cosmoray
According to your calculations you are expecting 100B ISK to buy the business.
Note that the shares that were sold do not represent equity positions in the corporation, so their price may not be intended to represent of a valuation of the business. Shares were sold as described in this thread: "WTS: EACS - Anniversary shares (1M isk/share)", which specifically stated: Originally by: Estel Arador
Note: these shares are symbolic only! You will get an actual share of EACS but you will not get any benefits such as dividends or meaningfull voting rights. You can get shares for collection purposes, for e-peen, or as a show of support for EACS. I wish to be absolutely clear on this: there are no benefits other than whatever personal motivation you have to buy shares.
á
á
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 06:01:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 07/10/2010 06:05:45
I only have little time before heading off to work, so I'll just respond to the most important issues now and will cover other things later today. I do appreciate all comments and messages, both here and ingame.
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
I personally don't think handing it over for free or having a director do stuff for you would work. They'll screw it up or do something which annoys you and drama will ensue. Better to either keep it for yourself in some manner or sell it and separate yourself from it entirely.
I fully agree.
Originally by: cosmoray
This is a great service and has a great reputation, unfortunately it is not good at generating a good financial return.
I agree the financial return isn't very good. I haven't run this service with the goal of maximizing profit, which might be a bit strange a choice in the eyes of MD regulars.
Originally by: cosmoray
In MD the minimum returns are expected to be at least 3% per month.
According to your calculations you are expecting 100B ISK to buy the business.
The problem is that the business has returned 5.83B ISK in 22 months or 265M ISK per month.
As Thoraemond pointed out, these are not equity shares. I am not selling the shares at 1M a pop now. Whatever price ends up being paid for EACS, it will include 99.000 of 100.000 shares.
My rationale for having this many shares was explained in the sell thread. I made sure to have 100.000 shares so I could sell up to 4999 without any risk of a hostile takeover (by someone acquiring many shares and running for CEO).
Originally by: cosmoray
At my 3% per month return valuation (3% is minimum for blue chip businesses) I put a value on EACS of 8.33B. There is obviously some good will built into the business, and new owners would look to change the business plan to monetize the service but that leaves a huge difference in the two values.
Thanks for that valuation. It is slightly higher but in the same ballpark as a valuation I got ingame.
I'm still unsure as to how to handle the 'potential value' if EACS were to be run as a for-profit venture. Is it even possible to include that in a valuation?
Originally by: cosmoray
One other thing you don't mention in any of your posts is how much time do you have to spend administering the business,. I am assuming this is time intensive as you have to keep updating posts and accepting members to the corp/alliance.
Accepting apps, kicking people, and making a simple forum bump can be done in 5 to 10 minutes. It's really not that much time per day, but it is every day which is what I unfortunately can no longer commit to. Though it is not strictly needed to accept apps every day, speed of processing apps is one of the current selling points.
Updating the forum posts on the first page of the sell thread is something which I do only every three months or so, it doesn't change that often.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
egola
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 07:55:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Estel Arador
Edited by: Estel Arador on 07/10/2010 06:05:45
I only have little time before heading off to work, so I'll just respond to the most important issues now and will cover other things later today. I do appreciate all comments and messages, both here and ingame.
Originally by: Vilgan Mazran
I personally don't think handing it over for free or having a director do stuff for you would work. They'll screw it up or do something which annoys you and drama will ensue. Better to either keep it for yourself in some manner or sell it and separate yourself from it entirely.
I fully agree.
Originally by: cosmoray
This is a great service and has a great reputation, unfortunately it is not good at generating a good financial return.
I agree the financial return isn't very good. I haven't run this service with the goal of maximizing profit, which might be a bit strange a choice in the eyes of MD regulars.
Originally by: cosmoray
In MD the minimum returns are expected to be at least 3% per month.
According to your calculations you are expecting 100B ISK to buy the business.
The problem is that the business has returned 5.83B ISK in 22 months or 265M ISK per month.
As Thoraemond pointed out, these are not equity shares. I am not selling the shares at 1M a pop now. Whatever price ends up being paid for EACS, it will include 99.000 of 100.000 shares.
My rationale for having this many shares was explained in the sell thread. I made sure to have 100.000 shares so I could sell up to 4999 without any risk of a hostile takeover (by someone acquiring many shares and running for CEO).
Originally by: cosmoray
At my 3% per month return valuation (3% is minimum for blue chip businesses) I put a value on EACS of 8.33B. There is obviously some good will built into the business, and new owners would look to change the business plan to monetize the service but that leaves a huge difference in the two values.
Thanks for that valuation. It is slightly higher but in the same ballpark as a valuation I got ingame.
I'm still unsure as to how to handle the 'potential value' if EACS were to be run as a for-profit venture. Is it even possible to include that in a valuation?
Originally by: cosmoray
One other thing you don't mention in any of your posts is how much time do you have to spend administering the business,. I am assuming this is time intensive as you have to keep updating posts and accepting members to the corp/alliance.
Accepting apps, kicking people, and making a simple forum bump can be done in 5 to 10 minutes. It's really not that much time per day, but it is every day which is what I unfortunately can no longer commit to. Though it is not strictly needed to accept apps every day, speed of processing apps is one of the current selling points.
Updating the forum posts on the first page of the sell thread is something which I do only every three months or so, it doesn't change that often.
well you can really slow down on your operations if you honestly wanted, perhaps make it so that you accept apps once every 2 days and you kick all applicants from the previous 2 day period to keep better track of things. a bi-tri-weekly operations seems to be sustainable. sure the quick processing is gone but atleast the operation is quite sustainable with minimum effort and/or attention
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:02:00 -
[34]
Based on all the feedback I've received so far and on the level of interest, I'll likely be doing a two-stage sealed bid action. I believe such an auction would lead to the fairest price for both the buyer and myself.
"Sealed bid" means that bids are not public, but sent to the auctioneer (me in this case) by private message. In sealed bid auctions, much of the competitive element of open auctions is removed and bidders are encouraged to bid what they consider to be a fair value.
"Two-stage" means that the auction will two rounds, where only the highest bidders of the first round are allowed to participate in the second round; the other bidders are excluded after the first round. I'm looking to do the second round with the 3 highest bidders of the first round. The highest bid of the first round will be disclosed and any bids in the second round will have to be higher than that, else the first-round bid will stand.
Does this seem fair?
Though I have received many serious inquiries, I am concerned about timewasters in the auction, more particularly people bidding but not paying up if they win. I'm considering asking all bidders for a deposit of say 200M for the duration of the auction. For the winner the deposit will go towards to the final price. If the winner fails to pay within 48 hours, the deposit will be forfeit and the second highest bidder will be declared the winner.
Once the sale is complete, the deposits will be returned to the bidders who didn't win.
Again, does this seem fair? Are there other options?
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Keyser Kahn
Stellar-Parallax Corp
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:28:00 -
[35]
Sounds fairly straight forward and certainly would maximise your return - personaly would have no issue in depositing 200m for the duration.
|
Gabriel Rosencrantz
Aliastra
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 15:37:00 -
[36]
I'm not familiar with how to determine the value of a business. Can you please explain how a value of 8+ billion was determined? If the total donations in 22 months are just over 5 billion, that price would require something on the order of 3 more years to earn back the investment, assuming that the service remains free. (I am truly not a finance guy and the question is genuine.)
It was always my impression that you were doing this for something other than money. The reason EACS is the only man standing in this niche is that it killed all of its competitors by offering the service for free. If the service is offered for a price, those competitors are likely to return. Perhaps the majority of those services would not be offered on the universal scale of EACS, but there are certainly enough mission runners with good corporation standings to provide more limited versions of the service. A dedicated mission runner (like the player who created the standings repair plan) with a well thought out plan could probably be enticed to put together a corporation with similar standings if he knew the service was going to generate a nice income. Put a team of like-minded missioners together and it could be done in a reasonably short time
While I understand some of the pitfalls of bringing in a grunt director or similar arrangement, I have to ask if there is anything you want other than money? Money doesnÆt seem to have been the prime motivation. What if some method could be found of guaranteeing that it remained free and open to all? What if the donations were used for a purpose other than just lining someoneÆs pockets? Is there any consideration other than straight sale price?
Red Frog Freight: Hisec Courier Service |
Thrasymachus TheSophist
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 17:01:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Thrasymachus TheSophist on 07/10/2010 17:02:27
EACS provided a great service and Estel will obviously be missed.
I do have one teeeny little complaint/observation:
Some of us who provided you donations over the years for the service did so because we thought it was your only compensation. Hearing now that you're going to make billions selling it, I kinda wish I hadn't donated ....
That said - nothing wrong with what you're doing or what you've done. I just thought I'd share that perspective.
|
Bernard Schuyler
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 20:23:00 -
[38]
Here's my .02 ISK, which may not even be worth that much..
I have used and appreciated your service, so thank you! You are an exemplar in the EVE community.
That being said I think this is not the best course of action in that by selling off the service, it will still never be the same... I am not sure that new management could even count on the same donation levels remaining constant if they kept it free, and is there any real expectation that profitability would be feasible in a market with competition?
EACS is impressive in terms of scope and size, but how much of that is used? If any significant portion of the "buisness" is clustered in a relatively small number of systems or NPC Corps, wouldn't it be vulnerable to competitors that were only in those areas and the rest of the corps/stations just serve as marketing materials?
On the other hand, you have put in a lot of work and helped a lot of people, so I certainly do not begrudge you an opportunity to cash out an exit in a nice and honorable way in a world where so often people cash out by burning both people and trust.
I am just very nervous about the Jump Clone "Industry" starting up in profit mode -- not because I don't think it can or should be done, but just because it will be new and chaotic. If this becomes a really profitable buisness (JC in general not just EACS) I can imagine Wardecs from both griefers AND competitors and who knows what other kinds of tactics as people vie for control of this market.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 20:34:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Estel Arador on 07/10/2010 20:35:58
Originally by: Gabriel Rosencrantz
I'm not familiar with how to determine the value of a business. Can you please explain how a value of 8+ billion was determined? If the total donations in 22 months are just over 5 billion, that price would require something on the order of 3 more years to earn back the investment, assuming that the service remains free. (I am truly not a finance guy and the question is genuine.)
Cosmoray made that valuation here. He's basically saying that he wants to earn 3% on his investments every month. With EACS' current business model donations of 265M a month are expected, so the 265M would have to be 3% of the investment. That brings him to a value of 8.33B. If he would invest 8.33B by buying EACS now, he'd earn the 3% per month he'd like to earn. He also added that this valuation is based on the donations only, EACS has a certain reputation which people might want to take into account in their valuation. Also if another business model is chosen, the expected returns per month might change, changing the calculation.
Originally by: Gabriel Rosencrantz
While I understand some of the pitfalls of bringing in a grunt director or similar arrangement, I have to ask if there is anything you want other than money? Money doesnÆt seem to have been the prime motivation.
Money is not a prime motivation for me, and never has been. Considering my knowledge of the game and the market, I could've been a lot richer than I currently am.
This doesn't mean however that I'm just going to give EACS away to the first person who asks for it, and I believe that someone willing to pay multiple billions for EACS will take better care of it than someone just landing it for free.
Originally by: Gabriel Rosencrantz
What if some method could be found of guaranteeing that it remained free and open to all? What if the donations were used for a purpose other than just lining someoneÆs pockets? Is there any consideration other than straight sale price?
I am still willing to consider other options. Evemail me. Convo me. Let me know what you think, I promise I won't hurt you. (This applies to anyone.) I am on a course towards an auction, but if you have a great idea I might still go for that. Just make sure I get to hear about the great idea before I start the auction, because once I do that, I am committed.
Originally by: Thrasymachus TheSophist
I do have one teeeny little complaint/observation:
Some of us who provided you donations over the years for the service did so because we thought it was your only compensation. Hearing now that you're going to make billions selling it, I kinda wish I hadn't donated ....
I appreciate your honest comment, but made billions running it, so I'm not sure why you would object to me making a similar amount selling it.
As I explained above, I feel that someone paying for the ownership of the service would do a better job than someone just getting it handed to him.
Edit: Bernard Schuyler, I missed your post since I spent too long typing. Thanks for your .02 though, I will respond to it a bit later.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Gabriel Rosencrantz
Aliastra
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 20:48:00 -
[40]
Crazy idea evemailed!
Red Frog Freight: Hisec Courier Service |
egola
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 20:54:00 -
[41]
obviously it would make sense, the person who bought it views it as an active investment as opposed to a guilt-free, responsibility-free venture that they can quit at anytime. that one buyout price can determine if EACS stays around or end up in the back burner of an unknown and reckless owner
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 21:17:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Bernard Schuyler
That being said I think this is not the best course of action in that by selling off the service, it will still never be the same... I am not sure that new management could even count on the same donation levels remaining constant if they kept it free, and is there any real expectation that profitability would be feasible in a market with competition?
These are factors which should be taken into account by anyone wishing to take over EACS. I believe there's little risk in simply continuing EACS as a free service. The donations are mostly many people donating relatively small amounts; I doubt all of 'm will suddenly decide not to donate. Running EACS with a fee-based model would be more risky, but potentially also more profitable. Competition might be an issue, but remember you'll need a lot less users to make the same amount of money.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 22:59:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Jimmy Duce on 07/10/2010 23:04:25
K, I still think it's the wrong choice to sell when there are other options but it's yours to sell. gl, I walsk away now.
{EDIT}
I and others gave you a very simple alternative. Interview say between enough people to get 3-7 new directors. Leave the day to day operation to these directors. Because you will accept multiple directors they will have inate redundancy basically keeping the corp ran as it was in the past and not requiring any of us to work ourselves to death.
If you don't like how we are running it in a week or month, go back to the sale idea. You do it in this order because allowing other peoplr to run it still allows you to sell it at will later, selling it first makes it impossible to try the alternative later.
|
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.07 23:41:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
{EDIT}
I and others gave you a very simple alternative. Interview say between enough people to get 3-7 new directors. Leave the day to day operation to these directors. Because you will accept multiple directors they will have inate redundancy basically keeping the corp ran as it was in the past and not requiring any of us to work ourselves to death.
If you don't like how we are running it in a week or month, go back to the sale idea. You do it in this order because allowing other peoplr to run it still allows you to sell it at will later, selling it first makes it impossible to try the alternative later.
In my first post I explained what issues I have with finding one suitable person to do my work for me. Your "very simple alternative" is that same scenario I already deemed unsuitable, only 3-7 times worse.
You seem to think that I have not carefully considered various options, that I posted this thread on a whim. Let me assure you, I did not. There are no 'very simple' choices here. This is a tough decision I have had to make, parting with EACS, and I want to be sure I do it in the best possible way. I'm grateful for all the suggestions and feedback I'm getting, but so far there's only been one suggestion which didn't involve me doing a lot more than what I already said I can't do.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 00:10:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Estel Arador
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
{EDIT}
I and others gave you a very simple alternative. Interview say between enough people to get 3-7 new directors. Leave the day to day operation to these directors. Because you will accept multiple directors they will have inate redundancy basically keeping the corp ran as it was in the past and not requiring any of us to work ourselves to death.
If you don't like how we are running it in a week or month, go back to the sale idea. You do it in this order because allowing other peoplr to run it still allows you to sell it at will later, selling it first makes it impossible to try the alternative later.
In my first post I explained what issues I have with finding one suitable person to do my work for me. Your "very simple alternative" is that same scenario I already deemed unsuitable, only 3-7 times worse.
You seem to think that I have not carefully considered various options, that I posted this thread on a whim. Let me assure you, I did not. There are no 'very simple' choices here. This is a tough decision I have had to make, parting with EACS, and I want to be sure I do it in the best possible way. I'm grateful for all the suggestions and feedback I'm getting, but so far there's only been one suggestion which didn't involve me doing a lot more than what I already said I can't do.
I disagree, but as I said it's yours to do whatever you want to. You can't/won't log in every day, but if you log in twice a week or every 6 days assuming you are not quitting Eve this isn't an issue. I can't vouch for anyone else, but I can't see any personal benefit to allow standings for the corp to drop so I could guareentee that I'd boot people before 7 days. Since this isn't a normal running corp with hangers and needed ops there is no interpersonal issues to solve. Log in, accept-> boot. Very easy, yes they can and will rob the corp blind, but the accepting of people and booting them is all you need.
Meh, tries real hard to walk away and fails.....
|
Zia Pow
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 01:23:00 -
[46]
When does the auction start?
Ego - Epeen - Eve
The 3 Amigos of the MMO world. |
ForumWarrior
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 01:56:00 -
[47]
Jimmy, when someone does something charitable for 2 years, then decides it's time to move on - you don't say "WTF, DO IT MOAR!"
You say, "Thank you"
In that vein, Estel - "Thank you"
I wish I had more available to bid closer to your estimated valuation.
---
ôThere is a powerful tension in our relationship to technology. We are excited by egalitarianism and anonymity, but we constantly fight for our identity.ö |
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 04:24:00 -
[48]
Originally by: ForumWarrior
Jimmy, when someone does something charitable for 2 years, then decides it's time to move on - you don't say "WTF, DO IT MOAR!"
You say, "Thank you"
In that vein, Estel - "Thank you"
I wish I had more available to bid closer to your estimated valuation.
No I'll say whatever the hell I want!. I said you did a good job and there are ways of keeping it going without u needing tyo run it daily. Had he said it was time to cash in on his hard work I would have said nothing. He said he wanted to keep it as a free service. Selling it makes this impossible.
|
cosmoray
Cosmoray Holdings Corp
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 05:11:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
Originally by: ForumWarrior
Jimmy, when someone does something charitable for 2 years, then decides it's time to move on - you don't say "WTF, DO IT MOAR!"
You say, "Thank you"
In that vein, Estel - "Thank you"
I wish I had more available to bid closer to your estimated valuation.
No I'll say whatever the hell I want!. I said you did a good job and there are ways of keeping it going without u needing tyo run it daily. Had he said it was time to cash in on his hard work I would have said nothing. He said he wanted to keep it as a free service. Selling it makes this impossible.
Did you even read the OP.
Estel has stated that he no longer has the time to run the service, leaving him two options of either having someone run it or sell the business and the new owners make what changes they like.
|
Jimmy Duce
Navy of Xoc
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 05:16:00 -
[50]
Originally by: cosmoray
Originally by: Jimmy Duce
Originally by: ForumWarrior
Jimmy, when someone does something charitable for 2 years, then decides it's time to move on - you don't say "WTF, DO IT MOAR!"
You say, "Thank you"
In that vein, Estel - "Thank you"
I wish I had more available to bid closer to your estimated valuation.
No I'll say whatever the hell I want!. I said you did a good job and there are ways of keeping it going without u needing tyo run it daily. Had he said it was time to cash in on his hard work I would have said nothing. He said he wanted to keep it as a free service. Selling it makes this impossible.
Did you even read the OP.
Estel has stated that he no longer has the time to run the service, leaving him two options of either having someone run it or sell the business and the new owners make what changes they like.
And do you know what your are responding to?
|
Mme Pinkerton
United Engineering Services
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 07:29:00 -
[51]
I would be interested in the rationale behind chosing that particular auction scheme.
As this auction probably is a common value auction for most participants and the flow of information between bidders is severly restricted, I urge all potential bidders to read up on "winner's curse" (wiki) and try to account for this phenomenon in their bidding behavior.
|
Alacta Lithia
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 07:39:00 -
[52]
Others performing the duty would work as long as you trust them, if not at some point they could use an alt to do a couple missions effetely destroying the current standings which I am not sure how easy it would be to fix.
Sure, you have 7 days to kick them, but I doubt it is something that will be watched closely, and more importantly if you notice too late, you first need to remove roles so it will take 24hours at least.
|
ForumWarrior
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 09:12:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Alacta Lithia
Sure, you have 7 days to kick them, but I doubt it is something that will be watched closely, and more importantly if you notice too late, you first need to remove roles so it will take 24hours at least.
Actually, once someone has been in corp for 7 days, you'd only have until downtime to kick them. Thus, if they had roles, it would be too late the moment they had standings.
---
ôThere is a powerful tension in our relationship to technology. We are excited by egalitarianism and anonymity, but we constantly fight for our identity.ö |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 11:07:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Zia Pow
When does the auction start?
I'm planning to start it Saturday. As I said earlier, there has been someone who has made a good suggestion and I want to explore that a bit further before continuing. I will message everyone who has expressed interest once the auction starts.
Originally by: Mme Pinkerton
I would be interested in the rationale behind chosing that particular auction scheme.
As this auction probably is a common value auction for most participants and the flow of information between bidders is severly restricted, I urge all potential bidders to read up on "winner's curse" (wiki) and try to account for this phenomenon in their bidding behavior.
I'd choose this auction scheme because sealed bids allow everyone to put in a well-considered offer without getting into a bidding war (which could raise the price higher than anyone wants) and without getting put off by someone bidding aggressively.
The auction would be two-stage to maintain some competition. Especially if the bids are very close, the second and third highest bidders might want to up their bid a bit.
Another consideration is what to do if the winner fails to honour his bid. With open bids the entire auction would have to be restarted to get a fair result (particularly if there had been lots of bids between just two bidders - giving it to the second highest bidder would mean his price has been inflated due to the participation of an illegitimate bidder). With sealed bids, that is not an issue.
As for bidding strategies, everyone should whatever bidding strategy they deem most appropriate.
Originally by: Mme Pinkerton
edit: I'd also like to point out that cosmoray's 8b valuation is based on a 3% interest rate, i.e. a common interest rate for supposedly riskless investments in MD. While this might be reasonable approach to value that business under the leadership of Estel Arador (as revenue has allegedly been stable under her guidance), there is imo a substantial risk that customers will change their donation behavior due to the sale. This risk is not reflected in cosmoray's valuation.
As I said before, the donations consist of lots of small donations adding up to a decent amount. I don't think all of those would suddenly stop. And there are ways to increase donations - all I've done is put a small sentence on donations in the middle of a two-post wall of text.
As for the valuation, there are lots of 'unknowns' not included in cosmoray's valuation. What would another business model bring in per month? Could more be earned with that? Is the value of EACS really determined only by it's income alone? Doesn't it have significant "goodwill" (wiki)?
Originally by: Alacta Lithia
destroying the current standings which I am not sure how easy it would be to fix.
Very, very hard.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Gabriel Rosencrantz
Aliastra
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 14:51:00 -
[55]
I'm not sure what people are complaining about. I don't know what other people were proposing, but I pitched my crazy idea and he heard me out. I appreciate the time he took to consider it. I think the concern we all have for the survival of such a unique EVE institution is a testament to the work he's put into it. My only quibble, and it isn't with Estel, is that it is likely that the service will be monetized by the new owner. That would be a shame. But it will not necessarily be the end of free jumpclones in EVE. I guess we'll see how it plays out.
Thanks for all the free jumpclones over the years, Estel. Seriously, I used your service a lot on various characters.
Red Frog Freight: Hisec Courier Service |
Zia Pow
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
|
Posted - 2010.10.08 15:37:00 -
[56]
We will be making a bid.
Though we do not believe we can beat the deep pockets, we feel our bid will be solid for its nature.
If we win we will keep the service FREE as it has always been, and will strive to run it in the same manner and respect,as Estel has shown over the years. We bring 5 years play time to eve, and feel we could continue the service in the same respectful manner it has always performed.
Ego - Epeen - Eve
The 3 Amigos of the MMO world. |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 12:28:00 -
[57]
the auction for EACS has started. It is listed here: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1396907
Please read the conditions and the procedure carefully. I have tried to be as specific as possible.
If you'd like to bid, take your time. Any bids entered before Wednesday 22:00 will be accepted. Since this is a sealed bid auction, there is no advantage or disadvantage to early or late bidding.
Free universal jumpclone service: 10.000 users! |
Sonnerin
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 17:10:00 -
[58]
why not just give it to Eve University? They already run a lot of free services and has a lot of staff to handle the necessary administration and I am sure they would take very good care of it.
|
Caust1c
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 18:33:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Caust1c on 09/10/2010 18:38:03
Originally by: Sonnerin
why not just give it to Eve University? They already run a lot of free services and has a lot of staff to handle the necessary administration and I am sure they would take very good care of it.
This sounds like an excellent idea! (Coming from a greenhorn currently applying to E-UNI) :)
I do think that they would take excellent care of the service however!
|
Taram Caldar
Royal Black Watch Highlanders
Warped Aggression
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 21:46:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Estel Arador
Though I have received many serious inquiries, I am concerned about timewasters in the auction, more particularly people bidding but not paying up if they win. I'm considering asking all bidders for a deposit of say 200M for the duration of the auction. For the winner the deposit will go towards to the final price. If the winner fails to pay within 48 hours, the deposit will be forfeit and the second highest bidder will be declared the winner.
Once the sale is complete, the deposits will be returned to the bidders who didn't win.
Again, does this seem fair? Are there other options?
This seems fair. If you'd like to have a 3rd party hold the deposit isk I can hold it on an alt that doesn't have isk for you. (thus eliminating any risk of wallet spam confusion). Your call of course. Just thought I'd offer. I would not charge anything for the service. Just so that you have as little chance of people hollering 'scam' as possible.
Pretty much I'm offering this (and never have to anyone before) due to my respect for the free service you've provided to the community for so long.
Market Alerts Mailing List
|
ForumWarrior
Center for Advanced Studies
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 23:14:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Taram Caldar
This seems fair. If you'd like to have a 3rd party hold the deposit isk I can hold it on an alt that doesn't have isk for you. (thus eliminating any risk of wallet spam confusion). Your call of course. Just thought I'd offer. I would not charge anything for the service. Just so that you have as little chance of people hollering 'scam' as possible.
Pretty much I'm offering this (and never have to anyone before) due to my respect for the free service you've provided to the community for so long.
No offense meant by this - I'm not an "MD Person" - but I have no clue who you are. And I definitely trust someone who's been doing something great (And free) for Eve for 2+ years more than I trust yet another MD "rep" persona. The later are becoming a bit commonplace.
---
ôThere is a powerful tension in our relationship to technology. We are excited by egalitarianism and anonymity, but we constantly fight for our identity.ö |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.09 23:48:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Sonnerin
why not just give it to Eve University? They already run a lot of free services and has a lot of staff to handle the necessary administration and I am sure they would take very good care of it.
This is in fact the idea which I was waiting on before starting the auction. I was contacted Thursday night by an E-Uni graduate who proposed this idea. However, he and I both were unable to get catch an E-Uni contact online during Friday and Saturday morning so I was unable to work something out before starting the auction.
Originally by: Taram Caldar
This seems fair. If you'd like to have a 3rd party hold the deposit isk I can hold it on an alt that doesn't have isk for you. (thus eliminating any risk of wallet spam confusion). Your call of course. Just thought I'd offer. I would not charge anything for the service. Just so that you have as little chance of people hollering 'scam' as possible.
Pretty much I'm offering this (and never have to anyone before) due to my respect for the free service you've provided to the community for so long.
Thank you very much for the offer Taram Caldar. However judging from the complete lack of opposition against the idea my own reputation is sufficient, and my wallet does not see a lot of action these days  so it's easy enough to track the deposits.
EACS, EVE's leading jumpclone service, is FOR SALE |
Estel Arador
|
Posted - 2010.10.16 13:27:00 -
[63]
EACS has been sold for 10.6B to Alacta Lithia. She has decided to continue the service as it is.
The two-stage sealed bid auction worked very well. The high bid after the first round was 8.1B. The winning bid in the second stage was 10.6B.
The only thing I'd do differently if I'd have to do it again is not to allow people to withdraw or change their bids. I allowed that now, and even put it in the procedure, since I know that it is something people will do or try to do even if it's not mentioned. In the future though, I'd be more strict and only allow people to put in a single, well-considered bid. If they'd want to withdraw or change their bid, they'd forfeit their deposit.
Though no single bidder was annoying in withdrawing/changing their bid, all of them combined did create a lot of work for me.
EACS, EVE's leading jumpclone service, is FOR SALE |
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page] |