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When did piracy die?

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Stars End	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:36:00 - [1] Edited by: Stars End on 05/01/2005 21:36:47 Let me start off by saying that I have been trying to fit into the piracy underground within Eve, such that is. But it's just not working for me. I've read a few posts regarding why piracy doesn't seem to be working within Eve at the moment, and it seems most people think it's a game mechanics issue. I'm no game developer, so I will leave that to the pros. Where is the long storied tradition that is piracy? All we seem to have currently is mindless killers camping at gates and killing EVERYTHING. This is akin to commercial fishing and dragnetting. All this killing with no apparent gain. No "turf" to protect, no ransoming of cargo or ships, no "jet the cargo mate, or you're sucking vacuum". It seems to have turned into the mindless shooting akin to FPS games. I'll admit, this post comes to you all straight away after I was ganked. I have to admit, they did have the setup needed. And I'll also admit, in retrospect, that by killing me, there was a monetary gain. The bounty. In short, my question is this: Where is the P.I.E. for the piracy underground? I'm not saying you have to be "in character", but a good, honest piracy corp is sorely needed! Are you out there? If not, are there any players that feel the way I do, that might want to try this? Thanks for your time!
Dianabolic	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:41:00 - [2] Piracy died the day CCP introduced insurance that lasted 3 months and gave 40% for free. But it's coming back, hopefully they will make POS more profitable, thus making alliances and corps put them in 0.0 and opening up the trade lanes for pirate activity once more. We can only hope.
Shintai	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:45:00 - [3] Piracy died when Setec stopped doing it long, long, long ago. Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Lefevre	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:48:00 - [4] Piracy is not dead. It is just harder convincing people to donate isk to your fair cause now Teddybears
starfox2004	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:55:00 - [5] I agree with star ! i think what he says is true, eve isnt full of carebears and pirates its full of 'gankers' what do they benefit from podding a rifter in 0.0 isk ? NO ! there is absolutely NO POINT and it is slowly ruining the game ! however i think we need to look past this and in turn ruin the game for the gankers ! find where they travel and needlesly and minlessly gate camp and gank them ! dont bother with the we're the l33tt3st and all that balls i think its time you should stand up and be counted ! proove yourself 1vs1 (without logging off in the middle of it) dont do pointless ganking !
Demian Sky	Posted - 2005.01.05 21:59:00 - [6] Edited by: Demian Sky on 05/01/2005 21:59:37 Yes, I think there is so much more potential for piracy. I think, perhaps, the means are there, but just not the will. After all, when a ship is destroyed, half of everything in the hold is lost. So if a pirate stopped a cargo vessel in it's tracks and demanded that he/she drop the cargo and demand a ransom for the ship, they might actually make more than if they just blew it up. Perhaps there is a little more CCP could do--- maybe cargo scanners and ship configuration scanners that have SIGNIFICANTLY longer range. That way, a pirate can weigh his options a bit easier.
Alowishus	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:37:00 - [7] Piracy died when all the main pirate corps quit, were banned or got all political. Now I will laugh at, and probably kill, any "pirate" I see. It's sad. Raven 4TW! Rank(1) SP: 243745/256000
markol	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:43:00 - [8] I used to be a pirate. I used to go from belt to belt in low sec empire, killing everything that moves. Then I went broke. I had no money at all, not even enough to insure my ship. I might go back to it, once I have some money. The sec status hits are bad though. Took me 3 weeks of killing NPC to work off the sec status. If there is no money in it, why pirate? Want to have some fun? Get into a tanked BS, camp a gate and shoot anything that moves. If the bastards won't pay ransom, there is no point in asking. Just blow the bastard up and see what comes out of him. Make piracy more financially viable, and it will return.
Danton Marcellus	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:46:00 - [9] Edited by: Danton Marcellus on 05/01/2005 22:49:08 Most early pirates were morons either way and I'm glad they're gone, what were they thinking blowing everyone up as soon as they got out into 0.0, let them work for you and attack them going back inside instead when they actually had something worth anything. Piracy will never die, it will hopefully just evolve into something you can understand and tolerate. Convert Stations
MooKids	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:48:00 - [10] Instajumps, insurance payoffs and log off tactics pretty much killed it. -------------------------------- CCP can patch away bugs, but they can't patch away stupidity.
Stars End	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:48:00 - [11] Originally by: Demian Sky Edited by: Demian Sky on 05/01/2005 21:59:37 Yes, I think there is so much more potential for piracy. I think, perhaps, the means are there, but just not the will. After all, when a ship is destroyed, half of everything in the hold is lost. So if a pirate stopped a cargo vessel in it's tracks and demanded that he/she drop the cargo and demand a ransom for the ship, they might actually make more than if they just blew it up. Perhaps there is a little more CCP could do--- maybe cargo scanners and ship configuration scanners that have SIGNIFICANTLY longer range. That way, a pirate can weigh his options a bit easier. I agree with alot of what you say here, but it does nothing concerning random killing. I guess we just have to deal with it, but it sure would be nice to select piracy as a careerfield and be successful at it like miners and producers are in theirs. If it's going to get better, we'll have to do it ourselves. I don't see anything changing that subdue random ganking, or at least, make something else more appealing. Miners have their ore thieves. Producers have their scammers. Pirates have their random gankers. Guess we all have problems :)
Stars End	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:53:00 - [12] Originally by: markol If there is no money in it, why pirate? Want to have some fun? Get into a tanked BS, camp a gate and shoot anything that moves. If the bastards won't pay ransom, there is no point in asking. Just blow the bastard up and see what comes out of him. Make piracy more financially viable, and it will return. I agree, the financial situation in piracy is just plain bad. You also mentioned gate camping and paying. When was the last time anyone on the forums was actually ransomed? I can attest, in the (almost) year I have been playing, I have never been ransomed ONCE. ever.
Stars End	Posted - 2005.01.05 22:59:00 - [13] Originally by: MooKids Instajumps, insurance payoffs and log off tactics pretty much killed it. Sorry for the shotgun posts, more came in while I was answering another. I'll agree that insurance and logoff tactics did put a dent in the piracy scene. But Instas only affected it in a uni-directional manner. You still can't get into warp fast enough (depending on the ship of course) to avoid gankers.
sutty	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:21:00 - [14] Edited by: sutty on 05/01/2005 23:21:32 Why dont they introduce some pirate skills. Basically you could have, -Frig ransom skill 5% increase to max ransom ammount -Cruiser ransom skill 5% increase to max ransom ammount -Battleship ransom skill 5% increase to max ransom ammount. You could only train these skills if you had a -5 sec rating, and they would only work if your sec stayed at that level or below. It would work like this, You hold somone down by scramble webbing them, then you goto your menu and select the ransom command. This would prompt the victim and tell him he is being ransomed and the money deducted out of his wallet in 1-2 mins. This would give the victim chance to muster up the money from friends etc. If the victim pays the isk the pirates warp scrambler and web are deactivated for a full cycle period allowing the victim to escape. If the victim does not have the isk it makes him free game and the pirates can do as they wish with him. To stop people abusing it and sending multiple ransom commands there should be some kind of timer stopping that person being ransomed for atleast 10-20 mins. As to the ammount of isk required for a ransom fee, they should leave it upto CCP to decide maybe 5-10million isk for battleships or some percentage of the market average? They also could introduce some other skills where by you could force a percentage of the persons cargo to drop instead of ransoming isk, the possibilitys are endless just need ccp to do somthing.
Thrak	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:25:00 - [15] Jebus Sutty that was awful. Stop trying to think.
sutty	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:26:00 - [16] Edited by: sutty on 05/01/2005 23:31:30 Thrak somthing constructive please Also could limit the ammount of skills or only allow people with high standing towards the pirate factions to have them, maybe each pirate faction have there advantages disadvantages.
Karunel	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:31:00 - [17] I like sutty's idea. The attacked player should have an option to not pay though.
CmdrRat	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:35:00 - [18] Originally by: sutty Edited by: sutty on 05/01/2005 23:21:32 Why dont they introduce some pirate skills. It would work like this, You hold somone down by scramble webbing them, then you goto your menu and select the ransom command. This would prompt the victim and tell him he is being ransomed and the money deducted out of his wallet in 1-2 mins. I'd agree as long as there was a turn down offer buttion. Some time's I'd just rather not pay the pirate. A buttion with a big middile finger would work for me ________________________________________________ Except for Ending Slavery, Fascism and communism, War Has Never Solved Anything
Ulendar	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:35:00 - [19] Edited by: Ulendar on 05/01/2005 23:37:32 Pirating in empire was nerfed to death. The no grief and easy going type of pirating that included some EW and a few missiles was doomed by sentries. From then on the only way to get something out of peopel was to make sure they would die before reaching the gate... People don't buy it though, they think they can make. Hence the ganker is born. Some of the pirates even stopped trying and just started ganking out of boredom and frustration of the nerfbat... After CCP stabbed the final blade into the pirate communities back by eliminating the slow security status regen and by making NPC pirates give very very little boost, most of the left over empire gankers and pirates moved out to 0.0 to gank there or just join some alliance to fight for their cause. I think that pretty much sums up what happened. I also believe that most of the nerfs for security reasons were overdone and decision made in a state of panic by CCP. I don't deny that the chainganking of certain corps/individuals did not lead to some people leaving EVE. I think though that the majority left simply because of the state the game was in back then. Lag, constant reboots, enough bugs to fill the atlantic ocean and very limited content...not to mention most content was just 'thrown' in real quickly so the game didnt look empty. Battleships didnt even work properly at launch and most of the guns except for a few were worthless or overpowered. But yah i'm sure EVE is a better place for everyone now...although i simply cannot imagen it. I feel asif i was robbed of the game i bought... But i still play, so some of the elements that attracked me to EVE are still there, although there are getting harder and herder to find and no amount of POS (piece of sh1t?) or assault bships is gonna fix that. I'm not an EQ gamer, i don't respond to dangling carrots and threadmills... Originally by: cashman It's time for Eris to get a clue. CCP should make a statement about this. It's the exact same things as what Zombie did, you may not attack in "safe-areas" (empire/within sentry range) without loosing your ship.
CmdrRat	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:39:00 - [20] Originally by: CmdrRat Originally by: sutty Edited by: sutty on 05/01/2005 23:21:32 Why dont they introduce some pirate skills. It would work like this, You hold somone down by scramble webbing them, then you goto your menu and select the ransom command. This would prompt the victim and tell him he is being ransomed and the money deducted out of his wallet in 1-2 mins. I'd agree as long as there was a turn down offer buttion. Some time's I'd just rather not pay the pirate. A buttion with a big middile finger would work for me Then again I was only held hostage once, when I was nub. Now I have no fear. Or is it smarts? oh who cares ________________________________________________ Except for Ending Slavery, Fascism and communism, War Has Never Solved Anything
voodoo	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:39:00 - [21] the idea kicks ass sutty i love it The Blue Pills Make Me Happy
Thrak	Posted - 2005.01.05 23:56:00 - [22] Acutally Suttys idea is alright, I read the post this time. Obviously could do with refining, but an ingame method of automated easy-to-pay ransoming could be good.
Jayad	Posted - 2005.01.06 00:12:00 - [23] Fact is there not many honerable pirates out there, many pirates just ask for a rediculous ransom (if they even bother). once had a guy that cought me traveling in a pod(had no instas unfortunatly), asked for 20mill - i mean get real. i just said naa pod jump me please. Saying that i did encounter an intelligent pirate. In the convo we came to an appropriate price of (the amount i stood to loose) Ive payed the ransom and he went on good as gold! sutty's idea is great i think, formalise the agreement even if its a bit un-natural.
sutty	Posted - 2005.01.06 00:14:00 - [24] Originally by: Jayad Fact is there not many honerable pirates out there, many pirates just ask for a rediculous ransom (if they even bother). once had a guy that cought me traveling in a pod(had no instas unfortunatly), asked for 20mill - i mean get real. i just said naa pod jump me please. Saying that i did encounter an intelligent pirate. In the convo we came to an appropriate price of (the amount i stood to loose) Ive payed the ransom and he went on good as gold! sutty's idea is great i think, formalise the agreement even if its a bit un-natural. If you had implants you would pay the 20 mil, espically at the moment.
Jayad	Posted - 2005.01.06 00:23:00 - [25] that was his argument, and yeah that was a year ago, i had no implants, why should he believe me! this ransom problem is a conundrum, how to make a system work would be difficult, but i agree with the principle.
Jane Vladmir	Posted - 2005.01.06 00:27:00 - [26] lose insta jumps and we're pretty much set
Scorpyn	Posted - 2005.01.06 00:35:00 - [27] suttys idea is good, if we add a negotiate price option and a reject ransom option. I disagree with it requiring skills though.
Amicus	Posted - 2005.01.06 01:02:00 - [28] Reform the bounty system to make it profitable for players to hunt pirates and enforce the laws, and then relax the AI restrictions on piracy in Empire space. That is my solution for making piracy a more interesting profession in Eve, not to mention making for a more exciting game generally. (See Bounty Reform - Chapt 3: Solutions.)
Soren	Posted - 2005.01.06 01:28:00 - [29] Originally by: Jayad that was his argument, and yeah that was a year ago, i had no implants, why should he believe me! this ransom problem is a conundrum, how to make a system work would be difficult, but i agree with the principle. The way I see it, if you have implants you'll play, if you don't then who cares? Just pop you anyways. I like the squish _________________________________________________________
Dao 2	Posted - 2005.01.06 02:30:00 - [30] i think insurance should be removed.... instas stay ;p and im fine with a ransom system but im sure tons of ppl are just gonna have someone else jam him and pop him after hes ransomed. make him invunerable for a set amount of time, 10min? 5 min? (invulnerable to players not npcs) oh damn that could be exploited easily too.... crap ;p oh wait not if u have set prices for each ship :D i dont like probes either but hey ;p

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