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Gehennar
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Posted - 2010.12.03 07:51:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Gehennar on 03/12/2010 07:51:59
see topic line: how do we capsuleers deal with getting jammed? do we fit eccm? use drones? FoF missiles? or just live with it?
edit: specifically ecm in missions / from ratting
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Culmen
Caldari
Blood Phage Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.12.03 07:58:00 -
[2]
The answer is All Four.
Combination there of or individually depending on situation
ECCM being ineffective against rats is a myth that just refuses to die.
ECCM works.
That being said, losing a mid or low slot is often unacceptable in many fits, so you'll have to decide whether your fit can lose some tank/cap stability/fire power.
Otherwise the other options work well.
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Btek
Blue Republic
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Posted - 2010.12.03 08:01:00 -
[3]
Kill the jammers ASAP :)
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DeMichael Crimson
Minmatar
Republic University
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Posted - 2010.12.03 11:18:00 -
[4]
Have overview settings to show EWAR, try to kill those rats first. If Target lock is lost, launch drones and switch to FoF missiles. With Drones set to aggressive, they should start attacking the rats. Keep trying to get a Target lock on the rats that are doing the EWAR. After a while you'll eventually kill them.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Overview_scanner#Appearance
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General Advice
Mentors Administration
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Posted - 2010.12.03 11:25:00 -
[5]
 Originally by: Culmen
The answer is All Four.
Combination there of or individually depending on situation
ECCM being ineffective against rats is a myth that just refuses to die.
Tt's not a myth so much as just out of date. If people do a search and it brings up old information, that was true at the time, we can't be surprised that these things persist.
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PureMurder
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Posted - 2010.12.03 14:08:00 -
[6]
um, wow, does anyone have a link to either ccp stating changes (that eccm now works vs npcs) or new test data from players that would suggest that eccm matters? This is news to me, lol. :)
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Louis deGuerre
Gallente
Amicus Morte
Dead Muppets
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Posted - 2010.12.03 14:24:00 -
[7]
Was news to me as well some time back.
Here ya go.
-----
Amicus Morte is recruiting. Dive into the world of 0.0 !
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PureMurder
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Posted - 2010.12.03 14:47:00 -
[8]
Edited by: PureMurder on 03/12/2010 14:47:59
Originally by: Louis deGuerre
Was news to me as well some time back.
Here ya go.
Thanks :)
I think I'd seen this somewhere before also, but with so much info it was hard to determine which source was accurate. Um, yeah, good job on that. :)
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Tau Cabalander
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.12.03 16:20:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Gehennar
Edited by: Gehennar on 03/12/2010 07:51:59
see topic line: how do we capsuleers deal with getting jammed? do we fit eccm? use drones? FoF missiles? or just live with it?
edit: specifically ecm in missions / from ratting
I just ignore it. The only time it is a problem is when you get perma-jammed, but that is extremely rare.
Since I've been playing EVE (over 2 years), I've been perma-jammed in only 2 missions. F.O.F. missiles were the solution for those 2 missions.
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Iosue
Black Sky Hipsters
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Posted - 2010.12.03 16:46:00 -
[10]
T2 drones (set to aggressive) are how i handle this, when its an issue.
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gfldex
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Posted - 2010.12.03 17:44:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Louis deGuerre
Was news to me as well some time back.
Here ya go.
Careful with that "data". He forgot to check how high the variation with the same fitting is. So it could very well be that 1h samples will show between 50% and 20% jammed with the same fitting. Just 200 samples _could_ show a trend but for sure are not a good sample size.
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2010.12.03 18:28:00 -
[12]
Originally by: gfldex
Careful with that "data". He forgot to check how high the variation with the same fitting is. So it could very well be that 1h samples will show between 50% and 20% jammed with the same fitting. Just 200 samples _could_ show a trend but for sure are not a good sample size.
Fitting variation? In what respect? ECM jam success/failures are measured against your ship's sensor strength.
What the data shows is the relationship of jam success (in %) vs ship's sensor str, which clearly correlates to the statement that "ECCM works against NPC ECM". Whatever your fitting, as long as you can take your sensor str up to a certain level, you should see a reduction in NPC jam success.
Note: The data was recorded with Guristas elite cruiser jammers, the strongest you'll ever encounter. There are variations in Guristas NPC jamming str across different NPC hulls and different sensor types. You can check them out at - http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/npc_ships.php?supergroup=9&return_to=
The trend is already clear, there is no could.
The sample size is within the statistical error margin of +/-7%.
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2010.12.03 18:55:00 -
[13]
To answer the OP, there are several practical ways dealing with NPC ECM, in order of preference :
1) Identify/memorize jamming ship names and kill them asap with everything you've got.
2) If you frequently encounter situations where there are too many jammers, fit ONE ECCM (mid-slot) or a Backup Array (low-slot), but not both. It's not usually worthwhile to sacrifice two or more slots for ECCM. Go back to 1).
3) Use FoF. Not very reliable when it comes to targeting the proper ships, it treats the symptoms, but not the root issue.
4) Live with it.
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gfldex
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Posted - 2010.12.03 19:39:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sturmwolke
Fitting variation?
Variations of the result with the same fittings. See Standard Deviation.
You don't know how good the samples you have taken are because you don't know how big the to be expected error is. Statistics are very very tricky. Peter Donnelly can tell a tale about statistics going wrong.
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Joe Starbreaker
M. Corp
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Posted - 2010.12.03 20:27:00 -
[15]
The other thing that works well for me is to fly missions together with my alt. The NPCs will usually all be targeting one character, so the other is free to take out the jamming ships, and then you can finish up the mission together.
...
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Black Dranzer
Caldari
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Posted - 2010.12.03 21:06:00 -
[16]
I find swearing angrily in corp chat to be a moderately effective solution.
|24 Hour Plex|Mining Makeover| |
Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2010.12.03 21:38:00 -
[17]
Originally by: gfldex
Variations of the result with the same fittings. See Standard Deviation.
You don't know how good the samples you have taken are because you don't know how big the to be expected error is. Statistics are very very tricky. Peter Donnelly can tell a tale about statistics going wrong.
The aim of the exercise was to show a clear trending that confirms the assumption that ECCM helps against NPC ECM, measured via your ship's sensor strength. The sample size is within the reasonable limits so that the results can be interpreted without any disputes. The value differences between the high (57.5 sensor str) and low (12 sensor str) clearly indicates the trending unless you like to accuse it of deviating over +/- 67% for a 207 sample size.
I'm not a math jock, but if you feel the need to get anal about it, feel free to run your own log data sets and post about it.
The methods on how to do have been indicated.
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