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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:00:00 -
[1]
What would you argue to keep it in the game? Assuming that they replaced the Caldari Recon ships with an equally effective EWAR, and that ECCM and Sensor Backup Arrays still gave a useful effect, what would you say to defend the ECM mechanic in the game.
Stuff like "I think it is one of the few counters to Spider-Tanking", "I think it is an interesting and challenging mechanic" etc.
I would like to hear your thoughts.
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captain foivos
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:02:00 -
[2]
Q: If CCP proposed that would you stop posting terrible threads?
A: Highly unlikely.
Originally by: CCP Zulu You're assuming I read threads before I turdpost in them :)
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Professor Tarantula
Hedion University
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:03:00 -
[3]
I would argue that it shouldn't have been done just to appease one obsessed person who made lots of threads about it on the forum.
My Warmest Regards. Prof. Tarantula, Esq. |
Forum Guy
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:06:00 -
[4]
Why remove ECM or ECCM, there is no reason to remove them, if they are not working correctly then they don't need removing they need fixing.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:09:00 -
[5]
Originally by: frog0ut Assuming that they replaced the Caldari Recon ships ECM with an equally effective EWAR
ASSUMING that, absolutely nothing against it. But that's a pretty big assumption. Also, weren't you complaining it's TOO effective in the first place ? If something equally effective takes its place, what's the point ?
TL;DR : STFU spammy troll. _
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:10:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Forum Guy Why remove ECM or ECCM, there is no reason to remove them, if they are not working correctly then they don't need removing they need fixing.
It is just a Hypothetical Question, I am not suggesting they are not working correctly, or need to be removed. I am merely interested in peoples responses to maintaining the ECM mechanic if a suitable replacement was given to the Caldari EWAR ships.
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captain foivos
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:10:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Akita T TL;DR : STFU spammy troll.
Not empty quoting.
Originally by: CCP Zulu You're assuming I read threads before I turdpost in them :)
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frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:13:00 -
[8]
Edited by: frog0ut on 07/12/2010 14:13:45
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: frog0ut Assuming that they replaced the Caldari Recon ships ECM with an equally effective EWAR
ASSUMING that, absolutely nothing against it. But that's a pretty big assumption. Also, weren't you complaining it's TOO effective in the first place ? If something equally effective takes its place, what's the point ?
TL;DR : STFU spammy troll.
I am not complaining that it is too effective, this is just a hypothetical question regarding the ECM mechanic itself. By something equally effective I mean something which would allow the Caldari Ewar ships to cripple 2-3 ships in fleets, while not completely "totalhelldeath"ing something into complete uselessness.
As for the personal attacks, grow up you babbies.
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Mashie Saldana
Minmatar Veto Corp
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:14:00 -
[9]
OP unbanned already from the last spamming spree?
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Gallians
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:21:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Gallians on 07/12/2010 14:21:38 Hey frogOut, glad to see you got over your Ecm thi... oh wait..
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:22:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Akita T on 07/12/2010 14:25:53
Originally by: frog0ut I am not complaining that it is too effective, this is just a hypothetical question regarding the ECM mechanic itself.
No, it's not a hypothetical question. Or will you start perhaps claiming that you're no longer totally-anti-ECM ? Or maybe that you somehow magically conjured some reasons why it's completely imbalanced and absolutely needs to go away ? I somehow doubt any of that is true. As in, I am absolutely sure.
What your "hypothetical question" is in reality ? It's equal parts a stealth cry for support when you failed to garner any (or so little as to be negligible) and an attempt to shift the burden of proof from you to us.
HINT : when attempting to argue against the status quo, YOU have to provide arguments the status quo is wrong, NOT for those content with it to provide you with positive proof of why it should be exactly that way. If you have a better alternative, then by all means, present that better alternative in detail.
Quote: By something equally effective I mean something which would allow the Caldari Ewar ships to cripple 2-3 ships in fleets
Yes, I too like to assume something is completely doable without bothering to even come up with any shred of an idea of what it might possibly be. And no, it's not on us to decide what that alternative might be. YOU want something else, YOU come up with a less annoying-to-you alternative that's satisfactory for most of the rest of the people.
HINT : you might try, oh, I don't know, suggesting that ECM should not be chance-based at all but instead have a flat -X maxtargets effect. Of course, that's an even worse idea than how ECM works nowadays, but it's an idea. You come up with a better one. We can't or won't.
Quote: while not completely "totalhelldeath"ing something into complete uselessness.
ECCM (both the local and remote variety), ECCM-like gang effects and implants, friendly ECM targeted at the enemy ECM boats, snipers out of effective ECM range taking potshots at the ECMer, drones and FoF missiles, and I could go on and on about perfectly legitimate counters or "mitigating factors" when faced with ECM, but then again, you heard all of it before and decided to ignore everything while clinging to your idea that "ECM is, like, so totally unfair, and I want it gone".
So, to repeat... TL;DR : STFU, spammy troll. _
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Dr Fighter
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:34:00 -
[12]
the problem with ballencing ECM against any other EW is that its primary effect however likly it 'hits' is totally detrimental to fast paced pvp.
That has to chance for any vauge fair ballence to happen, and since ccp like ecm being toally boring and stupid, then its not going to change.
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Nicholas Barker
Diabolus Ex Machina The Amazing Onjoi and his Educated Rodents
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:39:00 -
[13]
I think they'd just have to give them a slightly better tank and reduce the range of the ECM on falcons. Caldari are mostly about range, and ECM reflects this. The other recons generally have to be reasonably close to do anything effectively and are often part of the fight in other ways where as falcons tend to just sit far away being gay and bringing the fight to a complete halt for the opposing side.
It also wouldn't be a problem if you didn't have large gangs going around with one or two falcons for the sole purpose of making it impossible for the lone ship they're hoping to gank to even put up some resistance. But that's more to do with **** players out for an easy gank rather than a real challenge. ------
0800-LAG-A-NODE
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Gay Greatness
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Posted - 2010.12.07 14:39:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Gay Greatness on 07/12/2010 14:39:55 So, you dare to challenge Easy Mode EWAR do you?
ECM mechanics are just the [What is the opposite of the tip of the iceberg, or the cherry on the cake anyway?].
The whole ridiculous digital locking mechanism needs a kick in the face and all other electronic warfare, sensor, probing, yes cloaking, d-scanning and emission/transmission/absorption attributes need to be brought into a single unifying mechanic based on actual ship properties you can actually change with modules, skills and strategic activities, a change the likes of which would make veterans wish they'd never even heard of Eve:Online.
So it'll never happen.
Trying to fix ECM in Eve today is a lot like trying to find a Kimono that looks good on a fat chick. |
stoicfaux
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:30:00 -
[15]
Change it.
Current problem: ECM can completely lock down a player ship. Being completely locked down and helpless is not fun.
Solution: Let the target ship do something. Allow operations to continue to work while ECM'd but at degraded efficiency.
a) The target of ECM (the ECMee) is under a reverse target painter effect. All of ECMee's targets have their sig sized reduced. This means longer lock times and less damage. (It could also make interceptors almost "invisible" which could be a problem.)
b) Instead of all target locks being lost, only a few at random are lost throughout the ECM cycle.
c1) ECM causes weapons cycles to "skip." Meaning, ECM can cause a gun to not fire this cycle, but you still have to wait a full cycle to fire again. The rationale is that the targeting computer has to recalculate the firing solution.
c2) ECM randomly causes individual weapons to miss. Meaning, if you fire several weapons, ECM causes some of the weapons to automatically miss. The rationale is that the weapon fired at a sensor ghost.
d) The ECMee's overview shows all targets as 'unknown.'
End result: diminished firepower and/or loss of tactical ability (due to unreliable target selection.)
----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
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Jovan Geldon
Gallente Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:32:00 -
[16]
itstimetostopposting.jpg
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Jennifer Starling
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:33:00 -
[17]
Hypothetical Question: If CCP Proposed Removing the Moa Hull for something nice looking .... how much of you would ragequit and why??
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Green-Core The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:36:00 -
[18]
Originally by: frog0ut
I would like to hear your thoughts.
At this point, no you really wouldn't. I'm going to self censor them and provide you with a summary instead.
We understand that you're aggravated about ECM. My guess is you have been/still are getting killed by a team of ships that include one or several ECM ships and they keep jamming you into inaction.
However, your repeated bad posts on the forums are doing nothing but ****ing the rest of us off. ECM is working fine, and it's not unbeatable, if you know how.
Please stop now. We get it, you're mad. Let it go. --Vel
I'm more of a care-badger. |
frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:37:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Jovan Geldon itstimetostopposting.jpg
I think you might be able to join and interact with a community better if it was more on your level of intellect. I recommend signing up and posting here. Your more likely to find men your age (12 years old) who will socially accept you, laugh at your terrible trolling which only makes you look like a douchebag. and have someone actually respect you.
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Green-Core The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:40:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Jennifer Starling Hypothetical Question: If CCP Proposed Removing the Moa Hull for something nice looking .... how much of you would ragequit and why??
As long as it was still asymmetrical I wouldn't care. --Vel
I'm more of a care-badger. |
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captain foivos
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:43:00 -
[21]
Originally by: frog0ut hurr durr
u mad bro?
Originally by: CCP Zulu You're assuming I read threads before I turdpost in them :)
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Aelius
Caldari Mnemonic Enterprises
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:45:00 -
[22]
Special link that ONLY the op should read.
2011 CCP plans to change ECM by Oveur
I hope that link is hypothetical enough for you.
_________________________ CSM Candidate for 2011 (soon a pretty photoshop sig) Aelius 2011 Candidacy Guide Lines |
Corporal Punishment08
NosWaffle Nostradamus Effect
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:46:00 -
[23]
Originally by: frog0ut
By something equally effective I mean something which would allow the Caldari Ewar ships to cripple 2-3 ships in fleets, while not completely "totalhelldeath"ing something into complete uselessness.
This makes no sense. If you're replacing it with something equally effective, why replace it at all? This is just a personal crusade by somehow who wants to get his own way.
Anyways, if you replace ECM boats with a ship that's still able to "cripple 2-3 ships in a fleet", you've just re-introduced the ECM boat. Explain the difference. EXPLAIN IT!
Can I block people on forums like I can in help channel?
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frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:46:00 -
[24]
Originally by: captain foivos
Originally by: frog0ut hurr durr
u mad bro?
Considering you have posted random one liner personal attacks in all my friends, where as I have either completely ignored you or explained my position rationally. It seems you are the one who comes into my threads emotionally.
I'd recommend getting some better outdated 4chan memes than "umad?", you just won't look cool enough to the kool-aid kiddies, which is who I'm presuming is the peer group you're trying to impress with those outdated 2007 memes.
Better yet, stop posting forever.
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Corporal Punishment08
NosWaffle Nostradamus Effect
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:50:00 -
[25]
Oh, and to answer your original question, my argument to keep ECM in the game would be to go throughout the forums and make spam threads demanding ECM stay but not giving any real reasons, just like what you're doing to try to get rid of it.
Why don't you get it? You have no support on this. Give it up. You've completely failed. You're a failure. You fail.
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De'Veldrin
Minmatar Green-Core The Obsidian Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:52:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Corporal Punishment08
Can I block people on forums like I can in help channel?
No, but you can mock them relentlessly, which is almost just as good. --Vel
I'm more of a care-badger. |
CAPSLOCKBROKEN CEO
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:53:00 -
[27]
Originally by: frog0ut I HATE YOU FOIVOS
HE MAD.
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frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:53:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Corporal Punishment08 Give it up. You've completely failed. You're a failure. You fail.
http://www.4chan.org/
Enjoy, a community which will accept your anonymous personal attacks and childish tantrums with glee!
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:57:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Tippia on 07/12/2010 15:57:43
Originally by: frog0ut I am not complaining that it is too effective
Yes you are. Constantly.
I answer to your hypothetical question: I would say that it there was no useful reason for removing it.
Quote: I would like to hear your thoughts.
What made you change your mind? ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
frog0ut
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Posted - 2010.12.07 15:58:00 -
[30]
Originally by: De'Veldrin
No, but you can spam worthless tripe across the forums hoping for once in my life that someone will find me amusing and worthwhile, which is almost as good
Originally by: CAPSLOCKBROKEN CEO
I'm a worthless ***got, and I haven't got any more memes than umad? My mother constantly reminds me that she wished she swallowed that night
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