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Idicious Lightbane
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 08:34:00 -
[1]
What went down today in Tama was epic, for 3 hours nonstop Caldari and Galante went head to head nonstop, only warping out to get new ships, new warpins etc. There was no capital escalation (1 carrier entered from caldari side at one point but nothing serious), not very blobby, just people going in, dying and getting a new ship and coming back to do it all over again.
http://gallente.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=8460106
Around 10 Bil ISK in damage done total, Galante held the field but fck, no-one cared toward the end who would have won. Just Epic fights in local all around. This should really get a news article on it, one of largest fights ISK and ships killed in FW ever.
Great fight to all you Squids, lets do it again soon 
Oh and Draketrain, what's that with not helping Gallente? 
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 08:36:00 -
[2]
lol
it was a total ass****ry of a fight for both sides i lost 4 ships but who cares it was ****ing awsome.
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Daniel Essig
Ascendent.
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Posted - 2011.01.06 08:45:00 -
[3]
You forgot how your stragglers kept getting killed by pies 
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:08:00 -
[4]
umm no
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Mutant Caldari
Caldari
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:11:00 -
[5]
God damnit. All of the good **** happens when I am sleeping 
Yeah I am a pirate. What are you gonna do about it?
Killboard link is not allowed to be used in a signature.Applebabe
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Corewin
NoD Imperium
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:17:00 -
[6]
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part. Its as if someone in the Caldari fleet was actually suggesting that things were going well. Far from it. FC should have called it way sooner, seriously people going in and losing HACs and BCs over and over? Something seriously broke down on the command level.
This may be a large fight as of late, but I've personally run fleets of 100 plus ships with 30 BS present, up against similar numbers, back when ACHMED Fleets and FOOM/Caldarus Rex Fleets would duke it out.
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Eva Valeer
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:27:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Corewin
unorganized mess on the CalMils part
When where these bunch of mission runners ever organized
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:30:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part. Its as if someone in the Caldari fleet was actually suggesting that things were going well. Far from it.
My best guess is they stayed on the field since they outnumbered us anywhere between 2:1 - 4:1 throughout that fight.
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Corewin
NoD Imperium
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:31:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Eva Valeer
Originally by: Corewin
unorganized mess on the CalMils part
When where these bunch of mission runners ever organized
When I led them. When Gavin led them. First General has got it going on at the moment. DrakeTrain in general knows the in and outs, but seems to have not been present. =\
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Damar Rocarion
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:31:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part.
Seems so (I was not present). I cannot believe people in militia channel actually said it was awesome fight or had fun there.
Damar Rocarion
Brigadier General
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Idicious Lightbane
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:32:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part. Its as if someone in the Caldari fleet was actually suggesting that things were going well. Far from it. FC should have called it way sooner, seriously people going in and losing HACs and BCs over and over? Something seriously broke down on the command level.
This may be a large fight as of late, but I've personally run fleets of 100 plus ships with 30 BS present, up against similar numbers, back when ACHMED Fleets and FOOM/Caldarus Rex Fleets would duke it out.
It was most likely the fact that they outnumbered us by a fair amount, and were trying to get a good warp-in on us (they got very close several times, had probes out constantly and keeping an eye on nearby wrecks) because in all honesty if they'd been able to land on top of us just once with points we'd have been dead there.
And on top of that everyone was just having great fun, there was alot friendly chatter in local and private convo's during and after.
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Corewin
NoD Imperium
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Posted - 2011.01.06 09:34:00 -
[12]
Originally by: chatgris
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part. Its as if someone in the Caldari fleet was actually suggesting that things were going well. Far from it.
My best guess is they stayed on the field since they outnumbered us anywhere between 2:1 - 4:1 throughout that fight.
Well then that just sounds like half the people present from CalMil in Tama weren't even in fleet and were just told to "COME TO TAMA QUICK"
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:03:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Damar Rocarion
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part.
Seems so (I was not present). I cannot believe people in militia channel actually said it was awesome fight or had fun there.
Damar Rocarion
Brigadier General
dude not everyone is as big a ***** as you are bro, nobody cares asmuch as you do when it comes to kills and losses they just have a good time so why dont you go eat ****? or stick t sucking eachothers ****s in villore?
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Corewin
NoD Imperium
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:06:00 -
[14]
Originally by: SaltyandSweet
Originally by: Damar Rocarion
Originally by: Corewin
It sounds like and looks like a completely unorganized mess on the CalMils part.
Seems so (I was not present). I cannot believe people in militia channel actually said it was awesome fight or had fun there.
Damar Rocarion
Brigadier General
dude not everyone is as big a ***** as you are bro, nobody cares asmuch as you do when it comes to kills and losses they just have a good time so why dont you go eat ****? or stick t sucking eachothers ****s in villore?
Chillax bro, everyone has their own opinion in general. I like to have fun in Eve too, but even I think that this was a pretty poor Caldari performance.
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Idicious Lightbane
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:12:00 -
[15]
While the battle report might be fairly lopsided the actual engagement wasn't a turkey shoot by any means, considering they were constantly doing fleet warps in and out to try and get on top of us and get us tackled they were all in fleet and on comms. We had some amazing logi pilots and very good fleet coordination, it could have very easily gone south if anything had gone wrong on our part.
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:13:00 -
[16]
my hat is off to the caldari for sticking and fighting more than i can say to any pies or OTHER caldari militia corps.....
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Aerilis
Gallente
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:13:00 -
[17]
Looks like a Chatgris led pack of Gallente nano BC's.
Seriously, what happened to the good ol' Brutix blobs? I'm disappointed in my militia :(
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Eva Valeer
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:30:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Eva Valeer on 06/01/2011 10:33:48
What an outsider gets from all this
1. caldari militia is full of idiots flying mission fit drakes
2. gallente militia and various pirates farm them for killmails
3. gallente give fake props and gfs to the caldari even tho the caldari won't engage without favorable numbers (despite flying pieces of crap)
In the end the only people who are both competent and honest are the pirates
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 10:41:00 -
[19]
way to show supreme idiocy and lack of sportsmanship.
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Evil Angel69
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Posted - 2011.01.06 11:23:00 -
[20]
That was an awesome fight and i had my (hands?) full with the scimitar repping our guys, it did seem to get more disorganized on the caldari side as things progressed. But props to the FC for focus fire and a good fight all around. I know i would not want to FC for 3+ hours.
Hats off to chatgris for leading our side aswell some of the best fc'ing ive experianced. And more props to other combat a logistics aswell awesome job done by all.
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Eva Valeer
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Posted - 2011.01.06 11:29:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Eva Valeer on 06/01/2011 11:34:12
Originally by: SaltyandSweet
way to show supreme idiocy and lack of sportsmanship.
Oh please, cut the crap. 
There's nothing sporting about beating down on opponents who have no idea whats actually going on. Of course there's nothing wrong with this since EvE isn't supposed to be fair but pretending its some kind of epic fight is just funny. There are guys who ride in helicopters and shoot at caribou with high-powered rifles. I'm sure if you asked one of them he would actually look you in the eyes with a straight face and say "I'm a hunter" but do you actually think he believes it himself? Pirates might say "gf" in local but they don't make threads like this or even worse actually convince the bear they just ganked it was an "epic fight". Then again faildari are probably dumber than the average carebear.
Originally by: Evil Angel69
That was an awesome fight and i had my (hands?) full with the scimitar repping our guys, it did seem to get more disorganized on the caldari side as things progressed. But props to the FC for focus fire and a good fight all around. I know i would not want to FC for 3+ hours.
Hats off to chatgris for leading our side aswell some of the best fc'ing ive experianced. And more props to other combat a logistics aswell awesome job done by all.
lol sounds like some stage performance not a fight in EvE
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Aerilis
Gallente
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 11:46:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Aerilis on 06/01/2011 11:48:21
You're a ****. Yeah this fight seems pretty lopsided, but some of the best fights I've enjoyed have been ones where we've been thoroughly stomped.
Just a couple examples:
1. Holding out heavily outnumbered Alamo style in RRBS on a gate, eventually going down when we ran out of cap boosters.
2. Leeroying into enemy fleets in full gank unrigged cruisers and totally dying in a fire.
I would have thoroughly enjoyed this fight even if I was on the Caldari side.
Killmails aren't everything for everyone.
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praznimrak
Gallente
Level Up
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Posted - 2011.01.06 11:51:00 -
[23]
Now it should be done every weekend but in frig size ships and clash ammar-caldari militia vs gall-min militia.Imagine 1000 frigs fight raging in Tama for hours.All standard fleet stuff, primary calling from fc and stuff would be replaced fore pure dog fight ....awsommmmmm.
And cheap fun.
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SaltyandSweet
Amarr
Steady Mobbin
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Posted - 2011.01.06 12:17:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Eva Valeer
Edited by: Eva Valeer on 06/01/2011 11:34:12
Originally by: SaltyandSweet
way to show supreme idiocy and lack of sportsmanship.
Oh please, cut the crap.
There's nothing sporting about beating down on opponents who have no idea whats actually going on. Of course there's nothing wrong with this since EvE isn't supposed to be fair but pretending its some kind of epic fight is just funny. There are guys who ride in helicopters and shoot at caribou with high-powered rifles. I'm sure if you asked one of them he would actually look you in the eyes with a straight face and say "I'm a hunter" but do you actually think he believes it himself? Pirates might say "gf" in local but they don't make threads like this or even worse actually convince the bear they just ganked it was an "epic fight". Then again faildari are probably dumber than the average carebear.
Originally by: Evil Angel69
That was an awesome fight and i had my (hands?) full with the scimitar repping our guys, it did seem to get more disorganized on the caldari side as things progressed. But props to the FC for focus fire and a good fight all around. I know i would not want to FC for 3+ hours.
Hats off to chatgris for leading our side aswell some of the best fc'ing ive experianced. And more props to other combat a logistics aswell awesome job done by all.
lol sounds like some stage performance not a fight in EvE
point is they didnt run like a buch of *****es like im sure you would. its ok tho i understand the ***gotry of most in eve. i think it was a good fight dont act like such a homo, personally i lost 4 ships in that fight did i care no i didnt i came back for more as did they.
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Isaac Avernas
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 12:27:00 -
[25]
The recent surge of FW trolling/bashing in Warfare and Tactics is really getting old. If your some butthurt pie or somebody go post about it in C&P though I'm sure they will just tell you to use some lube next time. I mean even "FW sucks, stop playing it" Guy thinks it has the potential to be be "awsommmmmm".
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Bunzan Cardinal
Ascendent.
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Posted - 2011.01.06 13:07:00 -
[26]
confirming that you can in fact have fun even when you lose ships.
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Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 15:20:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Aerilis
good ol' Brutix blobs?
~
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Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
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Posted - 2011.01.06 16:28:00 -
[28]
A battlereport of The Alamo in Tama - having fun when things become ******ed:
Last night we form up the usual late shift patrol. We quickly kill any target in Tama and head off on a roam. Coming up to Heydelies we banter in local about finding nothing to fight... turns out we would.
A few minutes later scouts report a 30 man fleet is heading right for us. We're in Abune and get stuck, but managed to find and fight our way out, and head back to Tama.
In the process we get new people into the fleet. Our numbers rise to 51 (which was the max in fleet during the whole fight). It's divided into two wings, with the primary wing sitting on the Kedama gate at optimal. Gallente jump in. We kill them and hold the field - a brief sense of victory, but spirits are high!
Some good pilots have to leave fleet for RL reasons as our numbers fall a little. Then the Gallente come back, and an epic fight of willpower & attrition begins.
They are using their now familiar kiting tactics against our Drake/Cane heavy gang. We have a mix of veteran and new players, but it doesn't hamper us in the start. The initial battle goes well, but things start to lag. We warp on top of them, they burn to 70k. Their Lachesis'es are key to holding onto a single friendly while their fleet pounds. We kill their long range tacklers, but they keep reshipping in new ones. Both sides reship and resupply several times. Ship types become more random, we become a militia:)
Then Pirates appear. They are in few numbers and get dispatched by whichever fleet is closest, though I see they get counted on our side in the eve-kill battlereport.
Lag starts to become hard for any player that still has brackets on. I'm unable to have anything showing except war targets. I ask for people to broadcast the close wrecks to get a fleet warp-in. It's during one of these that we notice that someone in a carrier has joined our fleet...
Gallente manage to burn out as we land over and over, by now we're starting to see which pilots to repeatedly kill, and which we're unable to unless we land on top of them. Excellent piloting on their part considering that fatigue must be setting in on all sides. As the second hour draws to a close we're starting to get continuously outmaneuvered, and we're now gone from winning to losing badly.
So we go back to a rallying point to build up numbers again. We won't give up on holding the field though. There's billions in loot on it. People not get forever to rally up. It becomes a battle of willpower. Calls go out for X'es on all channels, even general militia, we get some people, our fleet swells back to 46, sadly half never fight in any organized fashion
We continue fighting and we lose many ships, though we have many kills in this last period. It went full ******. All experienced pilots on fleet voice stare at the battlefield in disbelief, the newbies ask "this normal for you guys?".
In the end it becomes apparent we cannot hold the field by willpower alone, and have to call it quits.
The final battlefield had wrecks stretching 750km from the gate in one direction and 300km in the other. We killed 76 and lost 186 by the last BR.
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Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
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Posted - 2011.01.06 16:28:00 -
[29]
We were soundly beaten in the end, but we also felt happy. All in fleet agreed it was more fun than we've had in months, and it was incredible learning experience in attrition battles in high-lag environments. Few of us had experience with 3 hours of continuous fighting. Now 40 more CalMil fighters have.
My hat is off to Chatgris for leading our enemies. Never seen anything like it. Kiting and maneuvering non-stop for 3 hours. I'm waiting with bated breath for that video. Also thanks to the Gallente militia members to gave us loot from the battlefield after the fight.
To our fleet members, thank you. It was a blast. When we do this again, we'll be the winning side:)
To our detractors. Keep theorycrafting, we'll be fighting! Though you might be right, since fools rush in where angels fear to tread, the experience our newer fleet members gained today will bear plenty of fruit for the Caldari Militia in the future.
I was repeatedly being called primary for about a third of the fight, and spend a lot of time warping between tacticals and off field with secondary taking over. Now I need to go run missions for 4-5 hours to replace the 3BS, 1 HAC, 1 Recon & 2 BC's I lost. Leading by example I guess, even in losses.
To all who partook on all sides: True Gladiators you are! Damn I love Faction War.
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Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
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Posted - 2011.01.06 16:39:00 -
[30]
Oh and Wolfsbrigade is recruiting
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Psychotic Sidekick
Spiritus Draconis
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Posted - 2011.01.06 16:47:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Evil Angel69
That was an awesome fight and i had my (hands?) full with the scimitar repping our guys, it did seem to get more disorganized on the caldari side as things progressed.
Also hats off to the scimitar pilots, that was the best logi piloting I have ever seen.
As for the Caldari side, I found they started picking up near the middle of the fight. I saw less drakes charge forwards and more focus firing (not meant as offhand insult, but with engagement ranges of 50-80k I think even we had trouble keeping DPS on primaries.. ).
They were also more on the ball with warpins as the fight went on, coming in faster and as a group. I was surprised a few times how they managed to land just 30k from us.. especially with that Huginn which really messed me up. What surprised though me was how many hictors there were on the field, where a similar number of Rapiers could have really started eating away at our numbers.
I also applaud how you managed to bring out so many newer members in t1 frigs.. add all those rifters/merlins/kestrels to your already sizable group of fast tackle and it really put the pressure on us. All in all GFs all round, I hope all that loot we left in Tama will be put to good use (PS: Next week, same place?  )
psy |
joshua boston
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Posted - 2011.01.06 18:00:00 -
[32]
I joing FW a few days ago.... first day did a great roam worked with Zee for the first time and got quite a few kills and basically just had a blast. 2nd and 3rd days... fights here and there but it was hard to get into fleets and I was honestly starting to consider going back to missioning and all that....Last night however.... lol
That **** was so fun... Yeah I lost 6 ships (i just found out it was that many by checking the killboard) but I really enjoyed the **** out of that fight... I learned some valuable lessons the hard way about particular modules on my fits that I need to change around and how to better employ and ecm ship in a fight... I had a blast regardless of the sound ass whupping I took lol.
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Salicaz
Caldari
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.06 18:24:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Idicious Lightbane
Oh and Draketrain, what's that with not helping Gallente?
So a draketrain member (only 1 i see) stumbles into a huge battle, appears on the wrongside of a killboard (and they are always accurate ) but you still feel the need to insert a comment into a thread about a battle we had **** all to do with?
And alot of people say we generate our own reputation in these forums?
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Dark Pangolin
Caldari
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
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Posted - 2011.01.06 18:33:00 -
[34]
Zeerover has all the fun while I'm gone! Glad to hear there was some pew pew!
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Bad Messenger
draketrain
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Posted - 2011.01.06 19:11:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Salicaz
And alot of people say we generate our own reputation in these forums?
Who is generating reputation in forums?
You can not get any reputation in forums, it does not matter what you post, trollers twist it how they like  .
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Dark Pangolin
Caldari
Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
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Posted - 2011.01.06 20:06:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Dark Pangolin on 06/01/2011 20:06:59
Originally by: Bad Messenger
Originally by: Salicaz
And alot of people say we generate our own reputation in these forums?
Who is generating reputation in forums?
You can not get any reputation in forums, it does not matter what you post, trollers twist it how they like .
We can agree on this!
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Oathborne
Caldari
Genstar Inc
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Posted - 2011.01.06 20:36:00 -
[37]
You klingon bastard's you've killed my SON!
Ok guys, stop poastin about this. I already feel bad enough I missed it. When i read about it in the other thread this morning I cried in my coffee. DAMN YOU Time ZONES! HOW I HATE YOU!
Congrats guys, sounds like a blast. can we do another one tonight say around 2:30ish EvE Time?
Doesn't have to be 3 hours though.
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Idicious Lightbane
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.06 22:19:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Idicious Lightbane on 06/01/2011 22:19:34
Serious respect to both Chatgris and Zeerover, I know Chatgris was amazing in that fight, was getting us new warp-ins, pointing, maneuvering us around wrecks balls and target calling all at once. I'm sure Zeerover was just as inspiring and managing his fleet considering morale held out on both sides till the very end, I can only imagine how fatigued both of them were after that fight, FC'ing a fleet for 3 straight hours nonstop while keeping people coming and excited to come back is an amazing achievement in itself.
Another cry out to our logi's which did a phenomenal job, they along with Chat were the heroes of that fight on our side.
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:07:00 -
[39]
Edited by: chatgris on 06/01/2011 23:13:53
Now that I've recovered from that 3 hour ordeal (read, slept!) I thought I might as well add some gallente perspective (not that anything was incorrect in zeerovers post, more filling in some gallente specific details).
I believe we started with just one scimitar for the first hour - the pilot asked "what would you prefer, another nano bc or a scimitar". I infamously answered nano bc, but to bring whatever he felt like flying - how glad I am that the pilot ignored me and brought the scimitar! While the scimitar couldn't really keep anyone alive under concentrated fire (not even the caldari thanatos could do that), it did allow us to get repped up after we burned out of range of the enemy and get right back into the fight in a hurry. Very, very useful.
We had intel on a large squid gang (about 40 IIRC) around tama. Formed up a nano bc fleet and started moving in that direction. When we jumped into tama, we did so on intel that the squid fleet was all in Sujarento - how wrong we were! There were an additional 15-20 caldari waiting in tama on the kedama gate.
Since our fleet was strung out, I had fleet hold their cloak. I estimated that I had jumped first and my cloak would therefore end first. Unfortunately, X Gallentius had jumped first, decloaked first in his lach, and died. We started that fight very disorganized minus a lach, but did our best.
After that - zeerover pretty much explained it all. The gallente fleet took a number of station stops to buy more ammo and get more drones, though I do not believe our fleet ever left during a combat session with the caldari: Instead, the caldari would warp in, we'd fight for a while, the caldari would warp off to try and get a better warpin on us, I would ask fleet if anyone needed resupply and if more than one or two people did, we'd warp to station. I don't think we spent more than 2 minutes during any station "pitstop", my fleet showed very good discipline (and stamina!) in resupplying in a timely fashion.
The only part of zeerover's report I might disagree with is the role of X Gallentius's lach's (plural!).
Quote:
Their Lachesis'es are key to holding onto a single friendly while their fleet pounds.
While he made our life a lot easier when he was there (and we only had him), he only got on about 1/3 of the killmails (since you guys kept sending him home in a pod :P). Apart from the obvious accolades given to our logi and lach pilots who did a heroic job and contributed a lot of ISK to the fight, I really want to shine a light on who really won that fight for us - the grunts in the nano battlecruisers. Their manuveuring was perfect, they kept diving in for points, burning out when they took aggro and burning *right back in* once the aggro switched away from them to continue holding points on our primary - a daunting task where one slipup meant you got webbed and dead. Without those pilots, we wouldn't have been able to get even half the kills we did.
By no means do I want to diminish the work of the scimitar or lach pilots. (I will say that the HAC pilots had it *comparatively* easy hanging out at range not holding point :P). But without the grunts taking most of the losses on the front lines and holding the majority of our points, that fight could not have happenned. And said grunts seemed to have been somewhat ignored in this thread.
I'll finish off by saying that this fight really became a pleasure to FC about half way through - in the first hour, those who had brought the wrong type of ship, or didn't really know how to fly nano died (not that all losses were due to pilot error, there's a certain amount of "oh ****" that happens). Those who survived really learned how to fly (practice makes perfect!), and I could see our ball of purple reacting perfectly to the ball of orange not requiring any specific movement commands from me.
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:17:00 -
[40]
(ran out of space in my previous post)
Finally - big thank you to our logi pilots that kept me locked and repped at all times. If I had to broadcast for reps on top of everything else I was doing, I think I would have sufferred a multitasking breakdown!
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Tekitha
Gallente
Shadows Of The Federation
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:23:00 -
[41]
looks and sounds like a lot of fun and a great fight
now wheres our EUTZ suicide squid fleet please ... Qcats are steaming ahead on the killboard for the month thanks to u god damn lemmings! :P
Don't believe the hype! |
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:29:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Tekitha
looks and sounds like a lot of fun and a great fight
now wheres our EUTZ suicide squid fleet please ... Qcats are steaming ahead on the killboard for the month thanks to u god damn lemmings! :P
Don't drop carriers, and undership your enemy. The caldari wouldn't have kept coming at us for that long if they didn't maintain a consistent advantage in numbers and ship types. At one point we were outnumbered 3:1 on the field - and I think SOTF would have probably dropped caps at that point, basically ending the fight.
US TZ comms are always full of "dammit, dock that battleship up, if the squids see it they won't fight us".
Just some constructive advice on "how to keep caldari shooting at you" :)
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Tekitha
Gallente
Shadows Of The Federation
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:34:00 -
[43]
oh we try mate, honestly .. and the whole carrier thing with SOTF is way overblown .. we very rarely drop carriers other than in late night lol fleets (consisting usually of 5 BS's with a cyno)
but guys like FG and draketrain tend to be damn organised and unhappy to throw themselves at us :( |
Mutnin
Amarr
Mutineers
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:40:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Mutnin on 06/01/2011 23:42:43
Sounds like our Cal mil boys need some probing lessons.. it should take less than 30 seconds to get a 100% hit on anything less than 1 AU of a gate/station or any other celestial in space.
If any of you need help with this hit me up in Militia chat as there shouldn't be any reason to not of got them probed and tackled if they were on grid longer than 30 seconds at a time.
I guess well done Gal guys.. Cal guys I'm disappoint..
edit.. serious offer to Cal guys if u nee tips on probing hit me in Militia as it's pretty easy once you know how. |
Dr BattleSmith
PAX Interstellar Services
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:41:00 -
[45]
And to think.... CCP hates FW so very much...
Wake the **** up CCP.
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.06 23:43:00 -
[46]
Edited by: chatgris on 06/01/2011 23:45:07
Originally by: Mutnin
Sounds like our Cal mil boys need some probing lessons.. it should take less than 30 seconds to get a 100% hit on anything less than 1 AU of a gate/station or any other celestial in space.
If any of you need help with this hit me up in Militia chat as there shouldn't be any reason to not of got them probed and tackled if they were on grid longer than 30 seconds at a time.
I guess well done Gal guys.. Cal guys I'm disappoint..
I saw a buzzard on field a few times, I wouldn't be surprised if they actually did do this.
Tbh, I don't think that tactic would have been incredibly effective: When we were waiting for the enemy, I kept my fleet moving or aligned at all times. As soon as we saw the caldari enter warp, we started a fast burn in case they were warping to us at 0.
And it's not like they couldn't tackle us. A number did get tackled and went down - a lot of the fight was fought in the 30km range. |
Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
|
Posted - 2011.01.06 23:49:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Tekitha
oh we try mate, honestly .. and the whole carrier thing with SOTF is way overblown .. we very rarely drop carriers other than in late night lol fleets (consisting usually of 5 BS's with a cyno)
but guys like FG and draketrain tend to be damn organised and unhappy to throw themselves at us :(
Oh we're happy to throw ourselves at you in the EU timezone. It's just that we have a lot more veteran players for said timezone, which means it's a completely different metagame. In the fight I had with you (8 hours before Tama), we came, we killed and you didn't come back. I understand completely why. We have more and better pilots at that timezone.
Several times during the last weeks we've had fleets of 50+, with perfect organization on in the late EU timezone, with nothing to show for it except blue balls.
Now if you had Chatgris'es US timezone members to back you up, I'm sure you could have reshipped and returned to give us hell.
What I'm trying to say is that the Caldari need more active veteran US timezone corps, and the Gallente need more EU timezone ones. |
Mithril Ryder
Genstar Inc
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:11:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Mutnin
Edited by: Mutnin on 06/01/2011 23:42:43
Sounds like our Cal mil boys need some probing lessons.. it should take less than 30 seconds to get a 100% hit on anything less than 1 AU of a gate/station or any other celestial in space.
If any of you need help with this hit me up in Militia chat as there shouldn't be any reason to not of got them probed and tackled if they were on grid longer than 30 seconds at a time.
I guess well done Gal guys.. Cal guys I'm disappoint..
edit.. serious offer to Cal guys if u nee tips on probing hit me in Militia as it's pretty easy once you know how.
The were trying, there were a few combat probes and extended launchers picked up from wrecks. But there are some large problems with using that tactic:
1. both fleets were often moving at 1KM/s or more, which means then your "perfect" warpin is 10+ KM away from the guy you locked in on or worse by the the your fleet aligns, warps, and drops out of warp.
2. warping means you come out at the spot with your prop mods off and have to get back up to speed, easily costing you another 10+KM unless you happen to have a short point and land within overheated shortpoint range.
3. Overview updates were bad enough most fo the time, anytime someone warped their distance update was fairly choppy and laggy, someone who looked 5KM from you ended up being 50KM away, or the other way around. That makes getting points, and not getting pointed, quite sketchy for a second or two after any given person warps in or within the field of battle.
4. The fleets were often within engagement range (for the majority of the time), since you can't warp that close it would require a double warp for the fleet, or a properly aligned (and cloaked obviously) warp-to fleet member, not impossible but hard to line up especially as much as both fleets were moving about.
5. If the smaller fleet is smart, they stay aligned out a good deal of the time, and will hit evasive maneuvers or bail the second that something looks like a tarp.
6. Have fun ignoring all of the ship results you don't want and picking the right ship to use as your warp in, not hard, just time consuming and adds more possibilities for mistakes.
7. You're also assuming decent in and out of game skill (both can be learned) and a willing pilot who will miss out on KMs and possibly die in a non combat ship (I know we have issues with getting scanners and logi for that reason).
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Mutnin
Amarr
Mutineers
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:15:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Mutnin on 07/01/2011 00:20:04
Originally by: chatgris
I saw a buzzard on field a few times, I wouldn't be surprised if they actually did do this.
Tbh, I don't think that tactic would have been incredibly effective: When we were waiting for the enemy, I kept my fleet moving or aligned at all times. As soon as we saw the caldari enter warp, we started a fast burn in case they were warping to us at 0.
And it's not like they couldn't tackle us. A number did get tackled and went down - a lot of the fight was fought in the 30km range.
It would also require the caldari fleet to land and apply tackle in a spread out fashion - something I've never seen a fleet really pull off even in 0 range slugfests (caldari or gallente).
Not saying it's a bad tactic - but it's definitely not a silver bullet. What the caldari needed was better piloting and better fits (we had our share of propmodless BS's show up too, and they're on the killboard for all to see).
I've spent a lot of time over this last month or two drilling into peoples heads tactics and fits for this kind of fighting - with a significant amount of resistance. (Tip: Gallente militia don't like you telling them that gallente ships (with a few notable but expensive exceptions) are generally trash). It was the individual pilots and their piloting that won this fight, not the FC's choice of warpins etc. Any pilot who just showed up to approach shoot the primary and failed maintain complete battlefield awareness (positioning of wrecks, the enemy and their movements, celestials in relation to the enemy to use as warpouts, positioning of friendlies so you know who to warp to to get back into the fight after leaving the fight etc) promptly died.
Yea, I must admit that general Milita guys don't really know how to work well with one another and because of that, it's fairly easy for smaller hit and run type gangs to kill them off.
Much less the average Mil types even in well known corps from both sides tend to not be that great with situation awareness. I really wish more people in FW would get out of the blobs and do smaller gang work. The big 20-30 man gangs really teach them nothing but how to gank **** or die horribly.
As far as getting tackles, from the probing.. you don't warp the fleet in you warp the tackle cepters in to get stragglers as they try to bail. At the very least if you had ceptors warping in on your gang it would of likely forced you out of the fight causing a lot less losses on Cal side even if your entire gang got away.
of course that would mean they would have to be working well with one another and we just can't have that in Cal Militia as it's much easier to just troll the chat chan and talk about missions..
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:25:00 -
[50]
Edited by: chatgris on 07/01/2011 00:29:21
Edited by: chatgris on 07/01/2011 00:27:59
I definitely agree with the smaller gang stuff. Small gangs also teach you what you need to make large gangs work.
Originally by: Mutnin
As far as getting tackles, from the probing.. you don't warp the fleet in you warp the tackle cepters in to get stragglers as they try to bail. At the very least if you had ceptors warping in on your gang it would of likely forced you out of the fight causing a lot less losses on Cal side even if your entire gang got away.
I don't believe our fleet ever warped away during an engagement - and any tackle ceptors that got even remotely close to us died quickly - tackle was always an automatic primary above all else. One thing I learned from draketrain is that ceptors die very very quickly to a large blob of range fit bc's. Long points didn't really bother us - we just kept burning anyways. I think I only warped off the field once due to enemy fire - the rest of the time I burned behind my fleet out of range of the enemy dps, and then burned back in.
2pt scram ceptors would be a different story, but they are even more vulnerable than long point ceptors.
Again - my point here is that the caldari fleet wasn't lacking for tackle or warpins. They had PLENTY of both. They were lacking individual pilot skill (NOT SP) and appropriate fittings.
IMO - in fleets like that, fast tackle is pretty much useless. Heavy tackle (lach's and battlecruisers) are what you need. (Our pilot showing up in a lot of small ships, murat, kept doing so not because we asked for tackle, but that he thought the fight would end at any minute and kept bringing the fastest ship he could to ***** on mails :D )
And finally last - no side was perfect. Even after all my efforts, people still brought brutixes :(
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Aerilis
Gallente
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:39:00 -
[51]
Hey Chat I'll train missiles if you get 20 kills in a Brutix
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:42:00 -
[52]
Edited by: chatgris on 07/01/2011 00:45:44
Originally by: Aerilis
Hey Chat I'll train missiles if you get 20 kills in a Brutix
But will you fly a nano hml drake with said skills?
If so - I might take you up on the offer. But I admit... it's gonna be hard. It is a *brutix* after all :P
EDIT: I also don't know if it's fair to my fleet to bring deadweight to the fight :P
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Mithril Ryder
Genstar Inc
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Posted - 2011.01.07 00:57:00 -
[53]
Originally by: chatgris
Edited by: chatgris on 07/01/2011 00:45:44
Originally by: Aerilis
Hey Chat I'll train missiles if you get 20 kills in a Brutix
But will you fly a nano hml drake with said skills?
If so - I might take you up on the offer. But I admit... it's gonna be hard. It is a *brutix* after all :P
EDIT: I also don't know if it's fair to my fleet to bring deadweight to the fight :P
I'll build a nano rail bruitix for you chat, don't forget to keep the guns unlinked ;)
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 01:07:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Mithril Ryder
I'll build a nano rail bruitix for you chat, don't forget to keep the guns unlinked ;)
I was actually going to go with artillery and ecm drones :) I've theorycrafted a lot of rail fits.. capacitor is an issue.
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Aerilis
Gallente
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.01.07 01:10:00 -
[55]
Originally by: chatgris
Edited by: chatgris on 07/01/2011 00:45:44
Originally by: Aerilis
Hey Chat I'll train missiles if you get 20 kills in a Brutix
But will you fly a nano hml drake with said skills?
If so - I might take you up on the offer. But I admit... it's gonna be hard. It is a *brutix* after all :P
EDIT: I also don't know if it's fair to my fleet to bring deadweight to the fight :P
Never! I just want HAM's for my fleet gank cane :P
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Squatdog
State Protectorate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 03:57:00 -
[56]
I think the battle reached the point where people just wanted to keep it going and be part of something epic. It was basically a dedicated nano-BC gang with logi support against a fleet of whoever happened to be online and had ships parked in Nourv to keep throwing into the meat grinder.
The single biggest thing people are forgetting is that Caldari held the field for 95% of the time and were scooping loot (and huge wads of drones) while the Gallente gang was doing 2000ms in the opposite direction. This was one of the biggest incentives to keep the fight going.
Gallente would warp off to refit for 10 minutes at a time and this usually led to an orgy of ninja-looting around the gate, with at least 2 neutral alts in fleet shuttling stuff back to Nourv.
Originally by: chatgris
My best guess is they stayed on the field since they outnumbered us anywhere between 2:1 - 4:1 throughout that fight.
By your own killboard, the odds were around 1:1.5, probably less factoring in the ridiculous number of times Caldari pilots reshipped.
Zeerover personally bankrupted his corp's ship replacement program.
[yellow]Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Navigato |
Mithril Ryder
Genstar Inc
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Posted - 2011.01.07 04:43:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Squatdog
I think the battle reached the point where people just wanted to keep it going and be part of something epic. It was basically a dedicated nano-BC gang with logi support against a fleet of whoever happened to be online and had ships parked in Nourv to keep throwing into the meat grinder.
The single biggest thing people are forgetting is that Caldari held the field for 95% of the time and were scooping loot (and huge wads of drones) while the Gallente gang was doing 2000ms in the opposite direction. This was one of the biggest incentives to keep the fight going.
Gallente would warp off to refit for 10 minutes at a time and this usually led to an orgy of ninja-looting around the gate, with at least 2 neutral alts in fleet shuttling stuff back to Nourv.
Originally by: chatgris
My best guess is they stayed on the field since they outnumbered us anywhere between 2:1 - 4:1 throughout that fight.
By your own killboard, the odds were around 1:1.5, probably less factoring in the ridiculous number of times Caldari pilots reshipped.
Zeerover personally bankrupted his corp's ship replacement program.
By my taly, 51 Gal mil to 82 Cal Mil. That is the numbers of pilots involved in any part of the fight (or fighting before/after)I know we lost quite a few near the srt when they couldn't nano well or had the wrong ship, and many showed up near the end/halfway through etc on both sides. Our fleet size in system tended to be anywhere from 20-30, the Cal fleet also varied quite a bit.
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Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
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Posted - 2011.01.07 07:03:00 -
[58]
A short video by BuckSwanson.
It's good, and shows the kiting, but doesn't really capture how absurdly long this fight was.
On the tactical front I notice several things, for instance how he gets red boxed by a few people several times
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Hidden Snake
Caldari
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
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Posted - 2011.01.07 07:35:00 -
[59]
omg ... fg finally made it. calis back in highsec getting slaughtered by more organized gals. gj. In IBS times this could never happen. glad I am out. and yes my dear corp exmembers u fallen to the gavins spell again if u wake up let me know.
WE ARE RECRUITING!
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Zeerover
Wolfsbrigade
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Posted - 2011.01.07 08:33:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Hidden Snake
omg ... fg finally made it. calis back in highsec getting slaughtered by more organized gals. gj. In IBS times this could never happen. glad I am out. and yes my dear corp exmembers u fallen to the gavins spell again if u wake up let me know.
Stop trolling, would you please? You know full well that one fight does not define a corp. Or should I ask if you believe this defines IBS? Where we, experienced players, and even joint-op'ing with Snuff Box and Legion of Darkness, got owned by the Gallente militia.
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Hidden Snake
Caldari
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
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Posted - 2011.01.07 09:31:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Zeerover
Originally by: Hidden Snake
omg ... fg finally made it. calis back in highsec getting slaughtered by more organized gals. gj. In IBS times this could never happen. glad I am out. and yes my dear corp exmembers u fallen to the gavins spell again if u wake up let me know.
Stop trolling, would you please? You know full well that one fight does not define a corp. Or should I ask if you believe this defines IBS? Where we, experienced players, and even joint-op'ing with Snuff Box and Legion of Darkness, got owned by the Gallente militia.
well in this one we jointoped with snuff and made very very very bad coordination (we on evevoice, them on vent) ... result is well ... bad.
my point is we started this op from lowsec.
You are again starting fleets in nourv and being manipulated by gals. and this one is just the top of the iceberg (I have seen some organized lost of cali where FG lost his bhal).
have fun... I am smacking I know ... but it is nature of the beast and I would rather see some of my old friends with me in EAK then dancing like puppets in tama.
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Toshi Zawa
Gallente
Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2011.01.07 09:57:00 -
[62]
I don't normally post. Just wanted to say how it started for me. It was a break during lunch to login and maybe do a bit of a solo-run from a laptop at work. Let's just say, 3 hours later, I was still eating my lunch and leaving once (to submit a report) and heading back to the screen again.
Without being able to speak, nor see my gangmates (only have enemy brackets on) I was basically flying somewhat blind and oft-times in a different direction from the rest. The lag that hit me was ever present but at least my link didn't died on me mid-fight.
I think one of the things we could learn from this is to know the ranges your enemy is at and fight with your head on. Primaries/Secondaries being called is one thing, but if the target being called is too far away from you, don't go charging in. Up to you to make your judgement call, especially in a fight like that.
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chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 10:24:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Squatdog
By your own killboard, the odds were around 1:1.5, probably less factoring in the ridiculous number of times Caldari pilots reshipped.
Actually - our guys had to run all the way to heyd and back to reship - caldari reships happenned in tama or nourv. I stand by my rough estimation of numbers on the field.
However, I'll admit that I spent the vast majority of my time with only caldari on my overview - but the purple ball generally looked smaller than the orange one.
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Igloo
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.01.07 14:12:00 -
[64]
Originally by: chatgris
the purple ball generally looked smaller than the orange one.
You might want to get that checked out.
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