| Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Papermate
   |
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:21:00 -
[1]
I know that both of these ships have their close combat setups. I was wandering to ask if the dmg of a vagabond with tech 2 425's and 1-2 dmg mods would be comparable to a deimos(i dont mean same dmg, but close to it.) Thanks.
"Master of Papercuts" |
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:25:00 -
[2]
not even close, only possible chance if the deimos aint going anywhere is to stay outside its blaster effective range and try and pick it of.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Bad'Boy
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:27:00 -
[3]
well, if deimos got 15km webber....bye bye vagabond in few sec
B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling
"Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
|
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:30:00 -
[4]
well you could fit 2 gallente racial jammers....warp scrambler, mwd, 2 med nos and win but thats just a ship specific setup. bascially if you see a deimos - get out and get to range, get bb buddy to jam it to high hell.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Kelly O'Connor
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:31:00 -
[5]
Trick is not to get close :)
The deimos owns close up, buttttttttt as ive said before in fleet battles would u charge at a gankageddon or a raven cos i wouldnt, ive seen all HA cruiser blow in battle to 5 or 6 torps.
All the ships have diff uses and are good at em, this lunchtime i got hammered by 5 BS in my sacrilidge she held her own but if i hadnt have warped the ravens torp would have hit me and id have been dust. I limped home
|
Vicker Lahn'se
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:32:00 -
[6]
Deimos has 0% base shield EM res and 10% base armor exp res. The Vagabond has the ability to use ammo that can do any type of damage. The Deimos can only do kin and therm damage. Even with hardeners and such, the Vagabond pilot has the ability to choose suitable ammo for his situation and adapt.
|
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:35:00 -
[7]
aye but deimos has 6 low slots to fill, thats a pretty good armour tank tbh.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Iratus Caelestis
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:35:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Iratus Caelestis on 24/01/2005 16:36:12
I wouldn't think so. Blasters track faster a lot faster than 425's and the vagabond is much faster overall than the deimos so your shots would be hitting for a lot less than the deimos even if the damage mods were the same.
Plus the deimos has an extra low slot so is actually more likely to have a damage mod and armor tank than you are.
A tracking computer will balance it a little but you're gonna get outtanked, exploit the damage choice and keep maximum range and you can do well though.
|
Istvaan Shogaatsu
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:43:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Istvaan Shogaatsu on 24/01/2005 16:48:18
If you want to beat a Deimos in a Vagabond, you have to do it by focusing on the advantages a Vagabond has over a Deimos, not trying to challenge the Deimos where it is a god - fighting Deimos in blaster range is tantamount to bringing a q-tip to a swordfight.
The Vagabond is the fastest assault cruiser, period. The Deimos is among the slowest. Use this to your advantage. Soon as you see the Deimos, MWD the hell away and pace it. Try to kite it rather than orbit, and pound with 650mm artillery. Take its drones away as soon as possible using your heavy missiles, because a Vagabond can't take much punishment. If the Deimos pilot is stupid, you'll probably win. If he has railguns instead of blasters, you're probably screwed, but most Deimos pilots won't. Use lots of explosive ammo, since a Deimos is weakest to that damage type overall.
Similar tactics apply to other engagements. Don't bother with autocannons, use the Vagabond as an extremely agile artillery/missile slugger.
|
Meridius
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:49:00 -
[10]
The Vagabond has by far the fastest base speed of all HAC.
275m/s compared to the Zealot at 195m/s.
Definetly a HAC I would love to try or see in action 
Good thing it can't dish out deimos like damage, that would be freaky...
________________________________________________________
|
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:51:00 -
[11]
but then the deimos just warps away if he cant hit or close on you, 1 vs 1 scenarios offer poor comparison to reality, in gangs or fleets, the deimos will rule as a destroyer of ships if allowed to get close. A pack of them together would be give your average bs a few seconds to live,very little time to fight them off and being cruisers a lot more mobile than bs's.
My guess would be a pack of cerberus and deimos would be pretty wicked to fly in with a few bb's for taht extra edge and a stiletto or two you got yourself an evil little team.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Nafri
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 16:55:00 -
[12]
I heard Vagabund sux pretty much 
Wanna fly with me?
|
Vicker Lahn'se
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:00:00 -
[13]
It may be true that the Deimos has more slots for tanking, but the Deimos will have to tank twice as much as the Vagabond. The Vagabond only has to tank Kinetic and Thermal while the Deimos will have to tank all four types.
|
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:04:00 -
[14]
 Originally by: Vicker Lahn'se
It may be true that the Deimos has more slots for tanking, but the Deimos will have to tank twice as much as the Vagabond. The Vagabond only has to tank Kinetic and Thermal while the Deimos will have to tank all four types.
aye but all projectile is 50% or more explosive dmg based. Slap 4 energised adaptive nano II's on a deimos and you'll smile at anything a vagabond has to offer while you mwd towards him and if you got a officer web, he's toast.
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Grimpak
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:07:00 -
[15]
well, vagabond is speed. deimos is damage... but tbh I wouldn't fight a deimos with a vagabond in a 1vs1... I would call a friend in a bb and jam him to hell....
-------------------
Quote:
Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
|
Selim
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:11:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Selim on 24/01/2005 17:23:00
The deimos will win unless its piloted by an idiot. The Deimos does much, much more damage, and tanks much, much better. Damage types don't matter much since the Deimos will be tanked on epxlosive and EM if he's smart, just as any tanked ship is tanked on its weakest. The Vagabond's guns, projectiles of course, track like hell unlike blasters which are obscenely efficient trackers.
The problem is that the Vagabond is weak to the most common dmg type in game, kinetic, but it's kind of hard to tank it. Shield tanking is kind of bad on a minmatar ship due to poor cap, and its got absolute crap kin and explosive armor resist, thats two its weak to, unlike all the others which are weak in only one spot which is easily compensated for.
As far as the damage. the Vagabond will do about half the damage of a Deimos.
Why not upp the Vagabond's speed by 25%, take out that not-as-useful-as-a-gun-bonus velocity bonus, and add a second ROF bonus? It still wouldn't outdamage a Deimos, but it would be more effective of a cruiser, and live up to its name of being a hit-and-run. Right now, its only got the 'run' part down. I'd really like to see it being the second most damaging close-range HAC, given its exceptionally poor defenses. It isn't so much to ask. I could go so far as asking for more damage than the Deimos, because it tanks ALOT better
|
Face Lifter
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:24:00 -
[17]
It's very likely that both Deimos and Vagabond will be using webs. When mutually webbed, Vagabond will still be slightly faster and so it'll be able to stay at desired range, which is outside effective blaster range.
Autocannons have more falloff, so Vagabond could tank Deimos at 8km or so.. but then Vagabond's dps would be about 33%, due to falloff. Also, Vagabond has 6 high slots while having 5 turrets, that means people will put Nos in there. So if you are smart and lucky to keep range of about 8km, then you could win.
If Deimos also carries medium and light drones, then it would be even trickier, gotta kill the drones first, stay as far from Diemos as possible while drones are alive.
Basically, I think it takes more skills to effectively fight with Vagabond than with Deimos
|
Lord Zap
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:44:00 -
[18]
More like you'd need to be more stupid to fly a Vagabond, seriously the Minmatar HAC's suck compared to the AMarr and Gallente ones. They tank worse, do less damage but erm the Vagabond is a bit faster
|
Papermate
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:46:00 -
[19]
Yeh so accordingly a well set up vagabond only does 25% of the dmg of a deimos, would that be able to break thru some BS tanks?
"Master of Papercuts" |
Papermate
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:49:00 -
[20]
I dont fly one, i just wanted to know the comparisons between the only 2 close combat HAC atm. * I mean vagabond only does half dmg of a deimos then?
"Master of Papercuts" |
Bad'Boy
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:50:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Papermate
Yeh so accordingly a well set up vagabond only does 25% of the dmg of a deimos, would that be able to break thru some BS tanks?
yea, gankadonns..
B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling
"Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
|
Hakera
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 17:54:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Hakera on 24/01/2005 17:54:17
if i petition - do you think i can get minmatar cruiser V swapped for gallente cruiser V?
with the ac boost maybe a muninn has a chance but it'll still be the poor cousin.
poor minnie ships just dont know what to do with themselves, suffer from too much versitility, jack of all trades, master of none 
oh wait there is the stiletto! 
Dumbledore - Eve-I.com |
Seto Mazzarotto
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:06:00 -
[23]
Ideally I'd see this as an Ali vs. Foreman scenario.
Though sadly, rope-a-doping blasters doesn't work well. 
-----------
Fighting for the ideals of freespace, posthuman ethics, and rock & roll. |
Bad'Boy
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:24:00 -
[24]
think of it as jaguar vs enyo(with 3 med slots), who you think gonna win?
B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling
"Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
|
Papermate
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:28:00 -
[25]
i guess ill just stick to my zealot for now :D
"Master of Papercuts" |
Synthemesc
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:30:00 -
[26]
*waits for Mechcore to post about his Eagle*
|
Bad'Boy
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:34:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Synthemesc
*waits for Mechcore to post about his Eagle*
B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling
"Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
|
Barbicane
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:36:00 -
[28]
Edited by: Barbicane on 24/01/2005 18:39:30
Originally by: Meridius
The Vagabond has by far the fastest base speed of all HAC.
275m/s compared to the Zealot at 195m/s.
Definetly a HAC I would love to try or see in action ...
Add a local hull OD and a 10 MN Afterburner II, and you'll go 1050 m/s. And there is no problem to keep the AB running constantly. It can even run together with the Large Shield Booster II for quite a while.
|
Grimpak
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:44:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Papermate
I dont fly one, i just wanted to know the comparisons between the only 2 close combat HAC atm. * I mean vagabond only does half dmg of a deimos then?
Deimos is for damage with avg tank. period.
BUT you cannot forget that Vagabond is made for an entire different role. It's meant for speed, lightning attacks while providing some survivability and damage.
this is all IMHO thou...
-------------------
Quote:
Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
|
Selim
|
Posted - 2005.01.24 18:46:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Selim on 24/01/2005 18:48:32
Is it more like 25% of the damage of a deimos? It couldn't be that bad... or could it?
Anyway, if CCP even realizes there is a problem they'll, as usual, nerf the Deimos without even looking at the Vagabonds problems, thus making two useless piles of junk.
Here is an alternative:
Boost Vagabond's velocity by 25%
Take away velocity bonus, replace with 25% reduced projectile ROF (ohnose!)
Give Vagabond a touch more powergrid
Increase the shields a touch
Increase the cargo hold a touch, to hold all that ammo it will be burning through.
Actually, do the same thing to the stabber. The velocity is needed, but it isn't fair that it takes up a bonus 'slot' which should rightfully be given to a damage/ROF mod.
Ah noticed Grimpaks post - lightning attacks you say? Well, a lightning bolt does more damage than a Vagabond... lets face it a Deimos tanks better, does more damage, and to top it off has twice the drone bay, the speed does not make up for it all. Lightning attack, sure but its not going to have any effect on the enemy when it can't tank the enemy when its attacking like the Deimos can, and it doesn't even do as much dmg.
For all the Vagabonds shortcomings it should outdmg a Deimos...
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |