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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 16:08:00 -
[1]
Edited by: DHB WildCat on 03/04/2011 16:12:00
Hello all, this is a post to discuss soaly the "anti cyno" ship idea. Please feel free to add ideas or changes or simply discuss them in this thread.
So what is an "anti cyno" ship? Well as the name states, it is a ship that would have an activated module that prohibits a cyno field from being used on the same grid as the "anti cyno" ship. Yes just the grid, it is not meant as a movable cyno field blocking module for the entire system.
Ship types -
Developer - based on recovered Jove technology.
Hyasyoda is one of the oldest of the Caldari mega corporations, having been formed shortly after first contact with the Gallenteans when the Caldari were still in the Industrial Age. It's conservative and cautious, but adheres to the old saying: 'Only the paranoid survive.'
There would be three ship class types. A frig / Battlecruiser / and Battleship sized ship. Each having modified EHP and tank for each class. Yes it would be a large tank but nothing insane. Something to allow the ship to survive a min or two if primaried.
Fittings -
High slots - 1, yes only 1. No missile or turret hardpoints. Only meant for the "anti cyno" module. And obviously no cloak.
Mids - A few for cap mods if needed maybe a propulsion mod.
Lows - 8 for tanking.
CPU and PG - would be comperable to the class type, so as not to be able to fit oversized mods to make a tank insanely strong.
The cyno module?
It would be almost identical to the triage module used by carriers. It would have 10 min timer, with the same restrictions. The ship once activated would not be able to move, could not be remote repped .... ect.
It could also use a new form of fuel, so that worm hole users could have something new to harvest.
Obviously the main idea of these ships is to give a gang / fleet a window to know a potential hot drop is incoming.You would not be able to stop the hot drop but by the time the enemy jumps into system AND warps to your grid you may have time to retreat or gain tactical range to counter them. This would help small gang pvp tremendoulsy from capitals online.
Also it would add a new mindgame set to engagements. Are they worried about a hot drop? omg we are losing the fight... maybe if we primary the anti cyno ship they'll think a hot drop is coming....ect.
Anyhow pls discuss! 8)
WildCat
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Dr Richard Dawkins
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Posted - 2011.04.03 17:18:00 -
[2]
How about a chance for Jove warships to destroy supercaps when they cyno in/out. Same effect and storyline, much more simple to execute.
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Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
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Posted - 2011.04.03 17:49:00 -
[3]
Right, because we need more alts to do PvP in this game.
Got the covert ops alt, the falcon alt, the ganglink alt, the logistics alt, the dictor alts and now the no cyno alt.
...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala. |
DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 18:10:00 -
[4]
lol thats an interesting idea Dr. but we havent seen jove ships in the game 8P.... but would be funny lol
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dreamingtoday
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Posted - 2011.04.03 20:22:00 -
[5]
I have an alternative idea how about a dedicated cyno ship, this way at least not every ship on grid has the potential to field a cyno.
You could give it some silly bonus to ehp or resis once the cyno is lit
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Kastsumi Kobayariel
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Posted - 2011.04.03 20:40:00 -
[6]
No.
It took me less than 2 minutes to find ways to exploit this ship and system to completely break capital/supercapital engagements.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 21:04:00 -
[7]
 Originally by: Kastsumi Kobayariel
No.
It took me less than 2 minutes to find ways to exploit this ship and system to completely break capital/supercapital engagements.
Please explain, how can you lock down every grid in the system?
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2011.04.03 21:24:00 -
[8]
Edited by: fkingfurious on 03/04/2011 21:26:17
This just wouldn't work.
There are too many ways that these anti-cyno ships could be used simply to ensure that a fleet would be unable to counter a hotdrop. Two fleets engage, Fleet A has Capitals and anti-cynos waiting at a titan. Fleet A primary the Anti-Cynos of fleet B (assuming they have them) and then jump in their own caps and anti cynos, light the anti-cyno beacons and wtfpwn everything in sight.
Grats, you've just made the hotdrop situation even worse.
And if simply jumping the caps onto a deifferent grid and then warping in is an effective counter to that then the module achieves basically nothing except allowing a smaller gang to run away leaving a stupidly expensive anti-cyno ship behind to die.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 21:47:00 -
[9]
Edited by: DHB WildCat on 03/04/2011 21:47:13
So light your cyno in a safe less than 1 au from fight? Then warp into battle like the original hot drop had to?
The ship only AFFECTS the grid it is on!
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2011.04.03 21:57:00 -
[10]
Edited by: fkingfurious on 03/04/2011 22:03:21
Forcing Caps to come in offgrid and warp into the fight stacks the odds so far in favour of a capital fleet that is already setup that it will break so much more than it could possibly fix.
In 0.0 especially you can use warp disrupt bubbles to then further screw up the warp ins.
In your very narrow niche of "I want to go back to the days where i could fight totally outnumbered and still expect to win" I'm sure this thing seems like a great idea but the implications of it reach far further and would totally bugger up an already pretty screwed up system.
EDIT: It's all redundant anyway cos CCP have stated that "Force Projection" aka jump portals and hotdrops is high on their list of things to change. They hate the it works atm and fingers crossed they're gonna be inline for a nerf bat before too long.
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Kastsumi Kobayariel
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Posted - 2011.04.03 22:19:00 -
[11]
Basically what fkingfurious said, not to mention grids are not something that is static. It's easy, if time consuming, to manipulate grids into stretching distances greater than the predefined idea of a 250km radius sphere as well as weird shapes.
The idea in itself isn't bad per se, it's that the implications of such a change or addition go a lot further than "boosting solo/small group pvp". Boost something for those people, then stop and wonder how a group of 1500 people will try to turn your mechanics change to their advantage.
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Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2011.04.03 22:35:00 -
[12]
Mobile cyno disruption on itself isnt a horrible idea imo, I was thinking this could be an interesting (lowsec) role for the light dictors.
Give them a cynosural field suppression probe, same range as their warp disrupt probes. This wouldnt affect large-scale capital fights much, but give the small gangs that are really really paranoid about hotdrops opportunity to sacrifice a few damage dealers for very localized cyno protection.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 22:43:00 -
[13]
Most replies I have seen have been "lazy" ones.
The module only works on the grid its on.... zomg jump in somewhere else in cap fights and have spots to warp in on the grid of the fight.
I mean really the only thing this ship would do is help small gang pvp, it wont affect large scale cap fights other than maybe the cap having to wait another min for jump in, align, and warp to grid. And in a game with 10 min lag in those fights it wouldnt be a big deal!
Besides if you dont like em then kill em... I mean really stop being lazy. Nothing would be broke about them
Wild
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Kastsumi Kobayariel
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Posted - 2011.04.03 22:51:00 -
[14]
I'm sorry I didn't you give you my endless support. I apologize for being lazy. Hopefully me saying your idea is the best ever and was never suggested and shot down in the past for reasons similar to those stated in this thread will make you see me as a good person despite my shortcomings.
Sincerely,
Me.
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Omara Otawan
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Posted - 2011.04.03 22:57:00 -
[15]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
The module only works on the grid its on.... zomg jump in somewhere else in cap fights and have spots to warp in on the grid of the fight.
The whole grid is too much really. Anything more than a 20km radius to just cover the ship you suspect to be opening the cyno would be way too much imo.
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Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
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Posted - 2011.04.03 23:25:00 -
[16]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
I mean really the only thing this ship would do is help small gang pvp, it wont affect large scale cap fights other than maybe the cap having to wait another min for jump in, align, and warp to grid. And in a game with 10 min lag in those fights it wouldnt be a big deal!
It doesn't help small gang PvP one tiny bit because the person flying is absolutely useless for any other role (personally, the reason why small gang appeals so much to me is because EACH. PERSON. MATTERS). If somebody primaries your beloved anti cyno, you'll all run screaming from the grid as fast as possible, and in the scenario that you aren't going to be hotdropped (the majority of the time), it will die last, cold and alone.
To field it, somebody has to the be "*****" and take it for the team or somebody has to skill an alt for it. Not fun gameplay, either way.
It simply doesn't improve the game at all. The solution for hotdrops rests with jump spoolups or something else, not an alt in a ship going "LOLOLOLOL U CANT JUMP HERE BROHAM"
...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala. |
DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.03 23:52:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Patient 2428190
Originally by: DHB WildCat
I mean really the only thing this ship would do is help small gang pvp, it wont affect large scale cap fights other than maybe the cap having to wait another min for jump in, align, and warp to grid. And in a game with 10 min lag in those fights it wouldnt be a big deal!
It doesn't help small gang PvP one tiny bit because the person flying is absolutely useless for any other role (personally, the reason why small gang appeals so much to me is because EACH. PERSON. MATTERS). If somebody primaries your beloved anti cyno, you'll all run screaming from the grid as fast as possible, and in the scenario that you aren't going to be hotdropped (the majority of the time), it will die last, cold and alone.
To field it, somebody has to the be "*****" and take it for the team or somebody has to skill an alt for it. Not fun gameplay, either way.
It simply doesn't improve the game at all. The solution for hotdrops rests with jump spoolups or something else, not an alt in a ship going "LOLOLOLOL U CANT JUMP HERE BROHAM"
Thats exactly right..
Thats its purpose. To give smaller gangs / fleets a chance to escape the "hotdrop". You dont have to field one. However maybe you do and it dies but your fleet gets away. maybe you dont but a cyno goes up right on your head and 20 Black ops / bombers come and kill your entire gang.... or maybe moms and titans come in to kill your entire fleet?
The purpose it to slow down capitals online.
If you guys dont believe capitals are a problem then I would understand your statements better, but I think you guys think capitals and "hotdrops" titan bridges are out of control too.
Wild
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Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
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Posted - 2011.04.04 00:05:00 -
[18]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
Thats exactly right..
Thats its purpose. To give smaller gangs / fleets a chance to escape the "hotdrop". You dont have to field one. However maybe you do and it dies but your fleet gets away. maybe you dont but a cyno goes up right on your head and 20 Black ops / bombers come and kill your entire gang.... or maybe moms and titans come in to kill your entire fleet?
The purpose it to slow down capitals online.
If you guys dont believe capitals are a problem then I would understand your statements better, but I think you guys think capitals and "hotdrops" titan bridges are out of control too.
Wild
The character in that ship does absolutely nothing else. Its not a ship for a person to fly, but somebody's alt. Assume you are in a small gang and only the FC is dual boxing a scout. You would have to lose a Recon, a logi or a DPS ship to have a buddy stare at the screen and push a button once. He's not going to have fun. Would you fly this ship if you only could bring one character on a roam?
Yes, cynos, bridging and hotdrops are a problem. Forcing everybody to bring useless alts to the battle isn't the solution. Something has to be done, maybe a timer to charge your jump drive, or some mechanic for the portal. Adding a ship to toss your POS gunner/cyno alt and warp to a battle at 100km is not the solution.
...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala. |
DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.04 00:50:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Patient 2428190
Originally by: DHB WildCat
Thats exactly right..
Thats its purpose. To give smaller gangs / fleets a chance to escape the "hotdrop". You dont have to field one. However maybe you do and it dies but your fleet gets away. maybe you dont but a cyno goes up right on your head and 20 Black ops / bombers come and kill your entire gang.... or maybe moms and titans come in to kill your entire fleet?
The purpose it to slow down capitals online.
If you guys dont believe capitals are a problem then I would understand your statements better, but I think you guys think capitals and "hotdrops" titan bridges are out of control too.
Wild
The character in that ship does absolutely nothing else. Its not a ship for a person to fly, but somebody's alt. Assume you are in a small gang and only the FC is dual boxing a scout. You would have to lose a Recon, a logi or a DPS ship to have a buddy stare at the screen and push a button once. He's not going to have fun. Would you fly this ship if you only could bring one character on a roam?
Yes, cynos, bridging and hotdrops are a problem. Forcing everybody to bring useless alts to the battle isn't the solution. Something has to be done, maybe a timer to charge your jump drive, or some mechanic for the portal. Adding a ship to toss your POS gunner/cyno alt and warp to a battle at 100km is not the solution.
Your arguement is that its an alt ship? Does nothing just takes up space. Okay so thats its role? Again you dont have to field one? Why hate on an intended role. You may not like it, but Im sure someone else would love to have a ship that will prevent incoming hotdrops.
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I likegirls
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.04 01:32:00 -
[20]
Worst idea I have heard all day...
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Justin Cody
Caldari
Instant Annihilation
Everto Rex Regis
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Posted - 2011.04.04 04:19:00 -
[21]
in general it already exists...except its called a "sniper ship" and can be used many times to insta-lock a cheap cyno ship and pop the offender before the capitals can come though. HIC's are another matter as are capitals with their own cynos.
ugh
Remind people that profit is the difference between revenue and expense. This makes you look smart.
Scott Adams
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Mufa Jaynara
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Posted - 2011.04.04 04:35:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Mufa Jaynara on 04/04/2011 04:36:26
I like the idea to be honest, but it should only be a battleship sized ship then, as you said, not be able to recieve remote reps... and then I suggest one more thing... not be able to repair itself while in this "anti cyno mode" so it basicly just have a bunch of effective HP... and it has to be armor only :) (passive regen could potentially be op?)
Forcing the enemy fleet to either pop it or cyno in off grid would work fine, it doesn't break the game from my point of view, it just adds a extra layer of tactical gameplay
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Chris Bailey
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Posted - 2011.04.04 06:40:00 -
[23]
Just use a remote sebo'd Titan with a DD
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Knokploeg
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Posted - 2011.04.04 06:50:00 -
[24]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
The purpose it to slow down capitals online.
If you guys dont believe capitals are a problem then I would understand your statements better, but I think you guys think capitals and "hotdrops" titan bridges are out of control too.
Wild
2007 called. They want their game back. HTFU
This proposal is just as silly as the 'anti cloaking' ships that are requested from time to time.
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Crellion
Parental Control
HELL4S
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Posted - 2011.04.04 07:02:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Knokploeg
Originally by: DHB WildCat
The purpose it to slow down capitals online.
If you guys dont believe capitals are a problem then I would understand your statements better, but I think you guys think capitals and "hotdrops" titan bridges are out of control too.
Wild
2007 called. They want their game back. HTFU
This proposal is just as silly as the 'anti cloaking' ships that are requested from time to time.
Not taking sides on the particular suggestion but 2007 EvE was a vastly superior game to EvE as it is now... so getting it back should be high on everyone's list of priorities (gameplay wise)...
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Cheque Norris
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Posted - 2011.04.04 07:28:00 -
[26]
Wait, we already have an anti-cyno ship. Okay, more of a gang than a ship, a few or more sniper Hurricane can instapop your cynoship before you can say "cyno up". And it is a features and ideas discussion, thx.
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Knokploeg
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Posted - 2011.04.04 07:43:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Crellion
Not taking sides on the particular suggestion but 2007 EvE was a vastly superior game to EvE as it is now... so getting it back should be high on everyone's list of priorities (gameplay wise)...
Sadly it doesn't work that way. If CCP hadn't made any changes to the game (except fixing lag) since 2007 then the bitter vet brigade would (rightfully) be complaining about a stagnant game.
A game developer needs to create new content to keep the player base interested. Once all niches are filled there is only one way out: moar power. Seen it happen to many wargames and RPGs as well.
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Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
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Posted - 2011.04.04 09:15:00 -
[28]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
Your arguement is that its an alt ship? Does nothing just takes up space. Okay so thats its role? Again you dont have to field one? Why hate on an intended role. You may not like it, but Im sure someone else would love to have a ship that will prevent incoming hotdrops.
Trust me, its a terrible idea. Everybody would field multiple ones of these. You'd have them at gatecamps, sitting at 0 and at various spots on the grid. Anything larger than 5 people or the second you field a battleship, somebody has to bring his alt to sit in this ship.
You haven't answered my question. If you could only bring one ship and one character on a roam, would you fly this ship?
...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala. |
Loraine Gess
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Posted - 2011.04.04 09:25:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Kastsumi Kobayariel
Basically what fkingfurious said, not to mention grids are not something that is static. It's easy, if time consuming, to manipulate grids into stretching distances greater than the predefined idea of a 250km radius sphere as well as weird shapes.
The idea in itself isn't bad per se, it's that the implications of such a change or addition go a lot further than "boosting solo/small group pvp". Boost something for those people, then stop and wonder how a group of 1500 people will try to turn your mechanics change to their advantage.
Grid manipulation is now a petitionable offense after goonswarm released their notes on it.
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Wacktopia
Dark Side Of The Womb
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Posted - 2011.04.04 11:39:00 -
[30]
Originally by: dreamingtoday
I have an alternative idea how about a dedicated cyno ship for SC+Titan, this way at least not every ship on grid has the potential to field a cyno that can bring in a super-cap.
You could give it some silly bonus to ehp or resis once the cyno is lit
Fixed.
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numbfromtheneckup
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Posted - 2011.04.04 12:39:00 -
[31]
Edited by: numbfromtheneckup on 04/04/2011 12:39:52
A ship like this is not the way to fix the problem with hotdropping.
CCP themselves alluded to an idea they have in the last CSM meeting and it is by far the most elegant solution anyone has yet put forth.
In combination with potential jump range changes the idea that got hinted at was that of putting a "Spool up" time on jump drives, presumably one that increases the larger the ship doing the jumping (or portalling). Presumably it would be very short on a Black Ops but much longer on a Titan/Scar. Losing the high speed deployment currently associated with Hot Drops of all types at a stroke deals with this problem.
It was also suggested that different "Sizes" of cyno could also/instead be used as a fix. For example the only thing capable of opening a cyno for a Super Carrier is a regular Carrier.
There are plenty of ways of solving this issue that don't require a half thought out potentially game breaking "anti-cyno" ship and CCP are adamant they want to make the changes.
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Pod Amarr
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Posted - 2011.04.04 14:20:00 -
[32]
Whatever Did not read the whole thread.
Easy fix would be Have the Cyno module have spin up time of 20 seconds.
If the cyno ship lights the cyno and within the 20 seconds a anti cyno module is fired it will destabilize the beacon [percentage chance]
So the incoming ships will land in random positions as if the cyno ship was destroyed.
Pod |
DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.04 14:52:00 -
[33]
Edited by: DHB WildCat on 04/04/2011 14:54:16
I agree that a "spool up" time would help tremendously. It just doesnt add any strategy to the situation. Yes it would help small gangs more so than a "anti cyno" ship would, that is until a super tanked Hic has you tackled and now you have to wait 20 more seconds to die rather than instantly.
Time is an issue and would fix Black Ops hot drops absolutely! However the real issue wouldnt even be touched with capitals. Even recons have tanks that would last beyond the 20 second spool up time, and the capitals would come on grid, on top of a gang and still pwn everything.
Its not a good solution. You need to be able to defend yourself against capitals in sub caps... and right now you can't period.
*IDEA - Cyno has such a disruptive effect on the grid that everyone electronics go down for a 20 second timer, including warp disrupt probes. This way you can still cyno your caps on the enemy but they can run if they want to.
WildCat
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Tigris Pantherinae
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Posted - 2011.04.04 15:36:00 -
[34]
Originally by: DHB WildCat
...
Sorry no new ships or anything space related untill 2014 since they are making closets for captains and gaybars are next big 'incarna' hit.
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Dr Fighter
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Posted - 2011.04.04 16:07:00 -
[35]
this ship and module would make single siege cycle dread bombs alot more viable instead of the "just use moms" mentality.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.04 17:00:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Dr Fighter
this ship and module would make single siege cycle dread bombs alot more viable instead of the "just use moms" mentality.
I never thought of that, you are correct sir, it would bring a niche back for the dreads.
Good point sir
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2011.04.04 17:27:00 -
[37]
The cyno based changers are a far better solution and DO in fact add a good deal of strategy, far more so than a ship that sits inert in space and simply makes cynoing impossible.
I don't know where this 20 second crap came from, thats a number that just got made up in this thread. The point of the changes CCP themselves hinted at are to alleviate this kind of problem and as such you should work on the theory that the timings are going to be sufficient to make the difference.
Plus DHB you do keep side stepping the problem of just how much this ship of yours would break things.
Two scenarios have already been suggested where the existence of these ships would make life next to impossible for a fleet to respond effectively to Capital level aggression. You saying theyd have to come in off-grid and then warp in is either a) stupid because warp bubbles will make getting the warping capitals into a useful position on the battle field basically impossible or b) is stupid because if thats all it takes to get round the anti-cyno ship it doesn't really solve a whole lot of anything. Cynoing in to the closest off grid position possible and having a few webbing ships nearby to facilitate rapid warping makes a mockery of the whole idea.
Altering the mechanics that make this kind of stupid long range instantaneous travel massive scale force projection so trivially easy is the way to fix the problem, not some silly floating brick that actually wouldn't really solve anything anyway.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.04 18:03:00 -
[38]
Edited by: DHB WildCat on 04/04/2011 18:06:53
Originally by: fkingfurious
The cyno based changers are a far better solution and DO in fact add a good deal of strategy, far more so than a ship that sits inert in space and simply makes cynoing impossible.
I don't know where this 20 second crap came from, thats a number that just got made up in this thread. The point of the changes CCP themselves hinted at are to alleviate this kind of problem and as such you should work on the theory that the timings are going to be sufficient to make the difference.
Plus DHB you do keep side stepping the problem of just how much this ship of yours would break things.
Two scenarios have already been suggested where the existence of these ships would make life next to impossible for a fleet to respond effectively to Capital level aggression. You saying theyd have to come in off-grid and then warp in is either a) stupid because warp bubbles will make getting the warping capitals into a useful position on the battle field basically impossible or b) is stupid because if thats all it takes to get round the anti-cyno ship it doesn't really solve a whole lot of anything. Cynoing in to the closest off grid position possible and having a few webbing ships nearby to facilitate rapid warping makes a mockery of the whole idea.
Altering the mechanics that make this kind of stupid long range instantaneous travel massive scale force projection so trivially easy is the way to fix the problem, not some silly floating brick that actually wouldn't really solve anything anyway.
Im honestly confused about what exactly you are upset about? Everything about this ship is designed to help smaller gangs / fleets have a fighting chance of escaping a superior force hotdropping them.
Now for capital fleet fights... Whoever gets in system first and has the field will have an advantage.. however isnt that supposed to be the case? Are you not supposed to have "homefield" advantage?
Even then all it takes as you stated is a close off grid cyno area.... some frigs for fast webbing, and a good cloaker to get you a spot in. In the grand scheme of things on large capital fights that..... 20-30 ish seconds is meaining less. I agree. However the 20-30 seconds for a smaller force to escape is literally the difference between living and dieing to ships they cannot possibly kill due to the tremedous gap between capitals and sub caps.
Im not sure again, of what exactly you are upset about here... please try to explain it to me so I can try to understand your perspective better. thank you, and sorry for misunderstanding you i mean no disrespect, just on another page.
Wild
Also for capital engagements.... this would mean that pure numbers wont automatically win the fight. You may have a smaller force but with these ships, you can then strategically place HIC's, bubbles to mess with the larger force making positioning difficult. So the better tacticians will have a chance to win the fight.... not just zomg we have more ships we win!
Also no these mods cannot be activated in pos shields!
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fkingfurious
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Posted - 2011.04.04 18:49:00 -
[39]
My problem is that I think this is a band aid where what we really need is an amputation.
The problem with cynos and stuff goes so much further than screwing up small gang warfare with silly hotdrops.
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Sigras
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Posted - 2011.04.04 19:00:00 -
[40]
I have an alternate proposal,
What if instead of stopping cynos on grid, it was a targeted module that prevented ships from coming through the cyno of the ship its activated on.
That way, it could be a normal module, usable on every ship (though with high CPU requirements) but it would take a fast-locking frigate to do so before any ships came through, but it would add a bit of strategy to large gang engagements as you could try to trap half their cap fleet on the wrong side of the cyno with a few of these ships.
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.04 22:39:00 -
[41]
Originally by: fkingfurious
My problem is that I think this is a band aid where what we really need is an amputation.
The problem with cynos and stuff goes so much further than screwing up small gang warfare with silly hotdrops.
Okay, I understand now, and I agree. There are many things wrong with cyno's and capitals ect. This is one solution for a small part of that.
Feel free to toss ideas around about others aspects, people may like them, and all ideas are progress in the moving foward of fixing capitals online.
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Noisrevbus
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Posted - 2011.04.05 03:00:00 -
[42]
Personally, i find the idea very appealing. I don't do much capital warfare and i don't do much stealth tactics, which means i generally don't do hotdrops but face them on a daily basis.
However, i'd like to remind everyone here about the same things i've mentioned in several threads regarding supercapitals: it's a double-edged issue. As much as Hotdrops is there to ambush and quickly blitz an opposing force, it's also CCP's encouraged way to deal with the blob. There's been a heavy profileration the past year or two towards quick drops and covert gangs to bypass chokes, reaction times and gate, pos or station games. I'm much of the old breed myself, me and my friends have not embraced much of this new deal - but that doesn't mean we don't have to be cautious not to futher encourage blobs and blob mentality.
Somehow, trying to reminisce, i think that people trying to trap you geographically with numbers or hiding in structures you can't touch with a small gang (until they are capable of blanket lockdown) have annoyed me far more than the times i've been hotdropped either by coverts or capitals.
I'm not trying to shut the idea down, i'd even go as far as to say that i like it. I'm just offering a word of caution that there's two sides of the coin.
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Silver Hair Carson
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Posted - 2011.04.05 14:15:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Patient 2428190
Right, because we need more alts to do PvP in this game.
Got the covert ops alt, the falcon alt, the ganglink alt, the logistics alt, the dictor alts and now the no cyno alt.
every decent player has enough alts to sacrifice one for the purpose. if someone can't multitask, it doesn't mean multitasking needs to be nerfed.
amount of clients is the skillcap in eve
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CCP Zymurgist
Gallente
C C P
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Posted - 2011.04.05 18:32:00 -
[44]
Moved from Ships and Modules.
Zymurgist
Community Representative
CCP NA, EVE Online
Contact Us |
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DHB WildCat
Flash Over.
WE FORM VOLTRON
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Posted - 2011.04.06 02:55:00 -
[45]
Interesting they moved the thread into a dead area of the forums.
lol, how dare I say capitals are running rampid and ruining eve! How dare I!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Voltron
Caldari
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2011.04.06 04:18:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Voltron on 06/04/2011 04:20:57
Edited by: Voltron on 06/04/2011 04:19:41
Originally by: Crellion
Not taking sides on the particular suggestion but 2007 EvE was a vastly superior game to EvE as it is now... so getting it back should be high on everyone's list of priorities (gameplay wise)...
2007 EvE was a vastly superior game to EvE as it is now
This.
Also - it is a bit of an alt ship - I get the intended role and what not, but I don't think you'll find a whole lot of people willing to fly around in a ship with 1 high slot that can't fit any weapons nor rep the rest of the fleet.
I may be wrong, you may consider this response lazy but it's my opinion and you're asking for it.
I wouldn't even train an alt for it - flying a guardian would be much more engaging as far as I'm concerned. I wouldn't even entertain the idea of plugging the skill into my main.
Also - anti-cloak ships or mods would be great but that's for another thread another time.
Furthermore - your alliance owes me royalties for the use of my name.
Last edit - what if it could also fit one or possibly two gang links? Might entice a few more people to use/purchase/train for them......I dunno, blue sky thinking.
It's great touching your own dink isn't it?
Volt |
Shingorash
Caldari
Silentium Mortalitas
Mortal Destruction
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Posted - 2011.04.06 09:41:00 -
[47]
Originally by: dreamingtoday
I have an alternative idea how about a dedicated cyno ship, this way at least not every ship on grid has the potential to field a cyno.
You could give it some silly bonus to ehp or resis once the cyno is lit
That is what Recon ships are for. A better idea would be to make it so frigates etc cannot Cyno.
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I'm in your space, eating your ships! |
SiIver Twin
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Posted - 2011.04.06 10:29:00 -
[48]
Originally by: dreamingtoday
I have an alternative idea how about a dedicated cyno ship, this way at least not every ship on grid has the potential to field a cyno.
You could give it some silly bonus to ehp or resis once the cyno is lit
The whole idea of cyno's are that they can be used on the field to bring in reinforcements. Either in the form of capital ships or a jump bridge with a titan to send a secondary fleet to assist.
Having dedicated ships for cyno, or anti-cyno breaks the flow of the game. Why not simply offer HIC's the option of blocking cyno's instead of their warp field generator? It would just be an extension of their current role, which is negating enemy movements.
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