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Mirime Nolwe
APOCALYPSE LEGION
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Posted - 2011.04.24 15:56:00 -
[31]
I did around 10 to 12bil with invention and manufacturing with my alt in a few months without much effort or time consumption, so you can do ISK with it. Get a POS and start doing invention with some modules, just forget ships.
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Hetero Black
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Posted - 2011.04.24 16:06:00 -
[32]
Manufacturing takes a bit of basic knowledge but also time and patience. If you want a profit, you have to have researched blueprints and your production effeciency skill maxed out. You generally need to use buy orders and you may even have to search more than one market to get the best prices (damn isogen). You need to anaylze the market and make spreadsheets to see how much it cost to make a ship and how much does it sell for. To really maximize revenue you also have to remember that low profit per item but selling large numbers of said items still means a lot of money. So trying to use ALL available production slots is generally a good idea. Then you need to transport your things to the best market.
Its usually a get reach quick thing, and there is a bit of trial and error when you first start out. But manufacturing can definitely turn a profit.
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Cozmik R5
Minmatar
Trust Doesn't Rust
Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2011.04.24 16:21:00 -
[33]
Can you craft me a potion of triple-fermented hops and barley plz?
____________________
Try not. Do. Or do not. There is no try. |
hired goon
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Posted - 2011.04.24 16:29:00 -
[34]
Thanks everyone for the replies, even the trolls. My use of the word "craft" was to refer to all industry, sorry if it caused anyone offense. After some of the points you have all raised, it points to the ISK 3.0 document as an incomplete guide to making money in Eve industry.
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Satchils
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Posted - 2011.04.24 16:37:00 -
[35]
Crafting is a completely legitimate term to use...
If you have ever played any other mmo, it would make sense
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Joe Phoenix
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Posted - 2011.04.24 16:40:00 -
[36]
Industry is a craft, lay off the guy for **** sake!
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Ubik Null
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.24 17:07:00 -
[37]
I think that perhaps you don't fully realize the import of maxed skills in industry. The difference between lvl 1 and lvl 5 in any applicable industrial skill easily covers the margins you refer to.
Keep in mind that a lot, perhaps most, of what is bought and sold never shows up on in any market stats. What any of us can determine from looking at the market stats is perhaps only a small portion. You'd need to go through all the contracts as well, and have access to station trading between players I would imagine. I admit, this may or may not be significant, but an assessment couldn't be made without access to these sources. There's a lot of Quid pro quo going on at the Alliance level.
Regarding accessibility by Rookies, you are correct in the sense that Rookies don't have access to a T2 BS and 30 million SP either. They have to work their way up.
My main "woke up" in EVE one day with a flimsy-ass Velator, a civilian miner, and some sort of broken slingshot that threw spitballs at the rats. Today He's a multi-billionaire and he did it through Industry. There's got to be a profit in there somewhere.
The term crafting is fine btw, I think there are just a lot of folks who don't want to be reminded that they do/did play WoW.
(Dziadzio, lvl 85 Hunter. My grandson lives 800 miles away and it's how we play together  He's still too young for EVE )
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Remlin
Caldari
XERCORE
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Posted - 2011.04.24 17:11:00 -
[38]
 Originally by: hired goon
- I assume ...
"Heroes don't die, they reload" |
Vardec Crom
Random Selection.
Tactical Narcotics Team
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Posted - 2011.04.24 17:17:00 -
[39]
Tech is the bottleneck for T2 production. It's only available in the north. Currently what is causing the reduced supply is the Geminate/Vale conflict.
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Laia Delo'var
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Posted - 2011.04.24 17:49:00 -
[40]
You got it, no profit to be made, keep blowing things up please.
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Skydell
Caldari
Morrigna Order
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Posted - 2011.04.24 20:31:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Skydell on 24/04/2011 20:33:50
It's another play style of EVE in itself. If you plan to simply buy all the parts and or minerals in Jita you will notice the margins spell loss. It's cheaper and easier to just buy the product, 100% of the time. It's also more effective to sell what parts you have because chances are you wont have all of what you need to make anything.
Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium
Profit margins go up when the manufacturing is done on a corporate level.
Add in this too. In it's own way it's a "blob" affair. Solo manufacturing works about as well as Solo PvP in EVE
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Mortania
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.04.24 20:46:00 -
[42]
An actual pro-tip:
Don't buy/sell in Jita.
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Trebor Locke
Gallente
Nexus Aerospace Corporation
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Posted - 2011.04.24 20:54:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Mortania
An actual pro-tip:
Don't buy/sell in Jita.
Agreed! Couldn't hand a better pro-tip myself.
Another pro-tip:
Go into trade. You'll make money faster and dont need to build the items :P
--------------
CEO of Round Table Enterprises
Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Methesda
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:33:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Methesda on 24/04/2011 21:35:28
I don't see the truth in this OP.
I have an ME5 Rupture BPO. I mine if I feel like a slow-paced change, but mostly I use buy orders to get my mineral supplies. Mining can be useful for getting the trit together since it's bulky, but if you have access to a freighter than this is less than a problem.
I keep logs of all my buy orders, and process these in a spread sheet, providing me with a cost for the minerals only, and then a small section for manufacturing costs. I don't figure in the BPO, but at this point I've probably paid for it.
Also, at this point, I should say that I only have PE level 4. I've been meaning to get it higher, but there you go - that's the reality.
I make around 7-10% profit currently.
This probably doesn't sound like a lot, but this is for barely lifting a finger. I really don't mine a lot, and the buy orders don't require a lot of baby-sitting. A little haulage once a week or so, and it all works.
The thing about this though, is that it's supplementary. The time taken for me to complete this is very little, and it provides an extra income over and above what i make doing missions, sneaking in to nulsec for a little ninja-ratting, exploration, etc.
Add all this together, and I have a fun game that I enjoy playing and has a lot of variety. I'm sure this is how it's supposed to be.
Stating that manufacturing is simply not profitable is just not true.
If you are expecting that all players should be able to double their money by processing what they mine/etc then you need to think about what the consequences of that would be on the rest of the universe - in fact, think about what this would mean in the real world. If you could double your money selling cars, everyone would sell cars and be undercutting eachother to the point that the market would fail. As every sensible investor knows, you never put all your eggs in one basket.
EDIT for some poor spelling.
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Hieronimus Rex
Minmatar
Infinitus Sapientia
New Eden Research.
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:36:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Zifrian
Eve has a market based economy. If you don't know how that works, then you probably aren't going to have much luck in manufacturing.
In fact, I think the economy is quite a beautiful thing to see in an MMO. It does pretty good at representing a perfect competition model.
There are profits to be made, but as an industrialist myself, there is no way I'm going to tell you what they are. 
Perfect competition is the most boring example - you just do the same thing everyone else does. Monopolies, Oligopolies, and other competition structures are much more interesting, since you actually have to think about what supply and demand curves are shaped like, but they don't seem to appear in EVE manufacturing.
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Kesshisan
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:39:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Kesshisan on 24/04/2011 21:39:02
Half of making money via industry is being good a trading. And I don't mean having a lot of skill points in trade, I mean having out-of-game trading skills.
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Methesda
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:40:00 -
[47]
PS:
There are always fools who sell for less than the mineral worth.
Part of the spreadsheet's purpose is to give me a quick reference to identifying these purchases. I'm sure there are many others that do the same. These items don't last long on the market. They get traded up (go the traders :-) ) or if they are that bad they can be reprocessed into minerals which are converted into something more in demand that the original items. Oh yes - this happens.
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Captain Brickwalle
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:55:00 -
[48]
ITT everyone misses that this is a whine about entry level being max level.
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baltec1
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:55:00 -
[49]
Originally by: OverlordY
Add to that ur competeing with people that will have 60 million SP in industry areas and have ME1000 BPOs its not easy to make any profit.
After ME30 there is not much point in further research.
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Captain Brickwalle
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Posted - 2011.04.24 21:58:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Captain Brickwalle on 24/04/2011 21:59:13
Double post
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Dark Muse
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Posted - 2011.04.24 22:14:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Dark Muse on 24/04/2011 22:16:11
Market fluctuations are very important.
For example I'm manufacturing these items using materials I bought/manufactured 6 months ago. Now I'm selling under price but what else can I do?
On the other hand, I earnt near 5b thanks to a positive fluctuation on other family of items. Life is good :)
In other words, manufacturers usually stockpile stuff for months/years and then just produce&sell, whatever the price goes up or down. This can mean billions of win or loss. Its like a lottery.
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Mortania
Minmatar
Sebiestor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.04.24 22:16:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Captain Brickwalle
ITT everyone misses that this is a whine about entry level being max level.
ITT thread, OP misses that skill training can't make you a better industrialist.
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Kesshisan
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.24 22:19:00 -
[53]
Originally by: baltec1
After ME30 there is not much point in further research.
Ammo BPOs can be worth it to train up to max, or 1/2 max, due to the volume you can/will make. But in general, I agree with you. ME over 30 is typically a waste of time.
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FeralShadow
RipStar.
United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2011.04.24 22:24:00 -
[54]
Isk 3.0 is an interesting read, but by no means should be taken as gospel. Purchasing and selling in Jita or other popular trade hubs will yield very little profit margin and you won't make money at all unless you trade in massive volumes. What it doesnt really touch upon is buying minerals (or mining) and then creating items and ships to sell in areas that arent major market hubs, so the price will be higher, and so will your profit margins.
_______________________________________________
"If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Uncle Alf
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Posted - 2011.04.24 23:17:00 -
[55]
Craft pyerite claymore swords and sell them to the orcs en masse .
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Adaris
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Posted - 2011.04.24 23:30:00 -
[56]
Crafting? Are we making wooden chairs or something?
*******
- ISK ME UP -
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Aquana Abyss
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Posted - 2011.04.25 01:01:00 -
[57]
Dear Hired Goon,
After over 5 years playing and dabbling in every type of manufacturing I now know some areas of manufacturing can definitely be profitable, but they take a lot of time and effort to find.
These areas often fluctuate from profit to non-profit and you need to adapt to the market changes if you're doing your "crafting" full time.
The worst parts about it are:
1. It is very boring and the interface is so rudimentary and terrible you will begin to resent CCP for your carpel-tunnel syndrome due to the click-fest.
2. Once you've gone through the ball-ache of building something you have the chore of selling it; often at this point you begin to realise you'd have made greater profit just reselling stuff in the first place since if you're selling somewhere "to get a quick return n your investment" then you have a 0.01 ISK war over most common products which consumes more time and energy.
3. Selling over a longer-term makes you very susceptible to market oversupply (very common) and often the price will continue to drop after your 90 day order to a point where you're making no profit if you ever want to sell the product just to clear your stock of it.
4. Competition is fierce and getting worse every day due to new players, stupid players (who like to build stuff just for the "fun" of it mindless of selling at a loss), and the growing manipulation of markets by unscrupulous players.
5. Everyone's an expert - Just look at the replies in this thread where people will tell you /paraphrasing "You fail at life if you can't make a profit from manufacturing in Eve because I make XXX Billion per day" - Charming people wasting their lives thinking they are 'getting ahead' in this game forgetting they are 'getting behind' in real life (See Carpel Tunnel, Spreadsheet nerding, forum trolling and loss of grace/dignity/hair as examples of this).
Other than that....You're wrong, "Crafting" in Eve is AWESOME!!! and not at all a waste of time.
Yours sincerely,
Retired bitter veteran
P.S. I converted all my "stuff" into PLEX a few months back and my playing of Eve consists of skill changing every month or so; Hence no, you cannot have my stuff. Toodles!
P.S.S. Entropy will always win in the end.
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Aprie
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Posted - 2011.04.25 02:42:00 -
[58]
Crafting can pay off very well. However, I think you need to have Exalted status with Stormwind or Ironforge to offset the costs.
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