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Mr R4nd0m
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:23:00 -
[1]
With all the 'best fits' and and the game driven by player choice ships.
There must be a ton load of ships and mods that just don't get used anymore, or very very little use.
Is there any point having them in the game anymore? or having a house clean?
Wonder if it would help server performance?
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GIGAR
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:28:00 -
[2]
I was wondering the same thing.
Just think of Faction Navy guns, lol (they suck, compared to T2)
The only people that would really use them would be new chars and e-peen flagships. New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
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"I've yet to meet one that can outsmart bullet." - Heavy Weapons Guy |
Bklyn 1
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:29:00 -
[3]
I doubt there are very many that are truly useless in all situations. Some things may be used until a player can afford a better one, or has the skills to use something else. Others may be used in unconventional setups or only in very specific circumstances. I'd hate to see variety removed unless it truly made a difference in server performance.
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Blnukem 192
Amarr
Shadows of the Empire
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:29:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: GIGAR
The only people that would really use them would be new chars and e-peen flagships. New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
Or people who can't use T2 yet. 
Originally by: CCP Navigator
This is really not worthy of a thread.
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Xtreem
Gallente
Fire Mandrill
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:31:00 -
[5]
Originally by: GIGAR
I was wondering the same thing.
Just think of Faction Navy guns, lol (they suck, compared to T2)
The only people that would really use them would be new chars and e-peen flagships. New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
I think my fed navy blasters look awesome on my flagship :P
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Lady Spank
Amarr
Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:33:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Blnukem 192
Originally by: GIGAR
The only people that would really use them would be new chars and e-peen flagships. New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
Or people who can't use T2 yet.
They have value in fits that are too tight for tech II. Modules might be considered more or less useless but removing them solves nothing while limiting options.
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Nix Gravity
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:39:00 -
[7]
How does removing options improve the game?
I could understand if we were being made an offer of "We are working on new ship model for every ship, but X,Y, and Z ships are causing problems, delaying the release of the project by a year, any chance we can just lose them, and release what we have?" from CCP, but outside of that, why not have them?
Worst case scenario they are adding a couple of extra lines to the markets, but even then somebody somewhere is selling most ships, even if they are a minority interest.
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GIGAR
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:42:00 -
[8]
Edited by: GIGAR on 27/05/2011 15:46:28
Edited by: GIGAR on 27/05/2011 15:42:49
Originally by: Blnukem 192
Originally by: GIGAR
The only people that would really use them would be new chars and e-peen flagships. New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
Or people who can't use T2 yet.
I thought it was kinda obvious that I meant new players that couldn't use T2. (and if you're a new player, you don't have
I'm not saying that ALL of the items are useless - some have a niche spot.
However, as a new player, you don't have +20 million for a faction mod right away. (prize may vary)
Yes, some mods fit in super special custom fits for just "THAT" thing. But it's rare that it happens.
[Edit/Update]
Originally by: Nix Gravity
How does removing options improve the game?
I could understand if we were being made an offer of "We are working on new ship model for every ship, but X,Y, and Z ships are causing problems, delaying the release of the project by a year, any chance we can just lose them, and release what we have?" from CCP, but outside of that, why not have them?
Worst case scenario they are adding a couple of extra lines to the markets, but even then somebody somewhere is selling most ships, even if they are a minority interest.
When something is better in 99,9% of all cases (and could even be replaced by something EVEN better), it just stops being a real choice.
You want cheap, you fit T1.
You want expensive, you fit officer/deadspace.
You want good allaround, you fit T2.
(this is an exaggeration, but you get the point)
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"I've yet to meet one that can outsmart bullet." - Heavy Weapons Guy |
Hermosa Diosas
Ministry Of Mining And Industry
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:52:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Nix Gravity
How does removing options improve the game?
Im sure it would help the market, not as many stuff, market works/loads quicker perhaps?
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Hans Crow
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Posted - 2011.05.27 15:56:00 -
[10]
Instead of simply decommissioning and removing them from game, why don't we change them to be better? This:
a.) Adds more variety to the game
b.) Enhances the strategy ("Oh, my Hyperion in THIS configuration actually benefits me on this strategy more than the Megathron and Dominix.")
c.) Keeps the faction ship options "balanced" (The Ferox is a rarely used Caldari tier-2 ship but outright removing it will simply make it look like Minmitar pwns in the battlecruiser category because ITS tier-2 Hurricane IS used a lot)
That being said, though, one should not confuse a "useless" ship with a "niche" ship. A ship you rarely see in PVP might be used a lot in PvE or visa versa, or might be a nice short-term stepping stone ship that gives you a classier ship after a week of service. The vast majority of ORE ships I see out there are Hulks but that doesn't mean one didn't need to mine in a lesser class like a Procurer or a Skiff in order to advance to a Hulk.
I saw a guy camping low-sec in a Hyperion and I was kinda curious as to what his strategy was, and found that he was simply smartbombing everyone who was warping into the area (he was aligned in such a way that was in-line with another stargate). His 8-hi slots of smartbombing pwning worked wonders at not only destroying any ship passing by (save for covert-ops), but the pod soon after. That strategy is horrible in pretty much every single other scenario (and granted makes you vulnerable to anyone who has a railgun or other turret that can shoot you out of smartbomb range), but it probably still paid off the ship within an hour.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.05.27 16:05:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Hermosa Diosas
Im sure it would help the market, not as many stuff, market works/loads quicker perhaps?
Not measurably.
Let's put it this way : you have a tank with ultra-heavy armor and a layer of dust on it.
How much better will the tank drive after you wash it ?
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Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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GIGAR
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.27 16:19:00 -
[12]
Edited by: GIGAR on 27/05/2011 16:19:56
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Hermosa Diosas
Im sure it would help the market, not as many stuff, market works/loads quicker perhaps?
Not measurably.
Let's put it this way : you have a tank with ultra-heavy armor and a layer of dust on it.
How much better will the tank drive after you wash it ?
Depends on whether it's a Russian tank or an American tank.
BADUM TISH! :P
Okay, not funny.
On topic:
It WOULD cut down on some unnecessary complexity, though.
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"I've yet to meet one that can outsmart bullet." - Heavy Weapons Guy |
mkint
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Posted - 2011.05.27 16:26:00 -
[13]
Leave the Fleet Scythe alone! Who cares if there are only 3 in the game (and are still cheap as hell)? Leave the multispec ECCM! If something is useless, new players should learn that in a fire ball!
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Aeronwen Carys
Empire of Dust
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Posted - 2011.05.27 16:30:00 -
[14]
Originally by: GIGAR
New chars can't afford them, and e-peen flagships... Well. Yeah.
First off, new char doesn't mean new player, there is a big difference. A new character may well be funded by an older, richer one and thus more than capable of affording said modules until such time as T2 is trained.
Also, even being a new player doesn't discount you from being able to afford expensive modules as there are an ever increasing number of people who buy GTC's, convert to PLEX and buy items that way.
As for "e-peen flagships" who are you to say that this isn't a valid playstyle? If I want to officer/deadspace/faction fit my Vargur, then I damn well have the right to do so.
Effectively this whole argument is null and void as soon as you realise that your point of view is NOT the only one that matters.
Jog on.
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Khallie Reese
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Posted - 2011.05.27 16:31:00 -
[15]
You are welcome to reprocess anything you feel is outdated that comes into your possession.
As for removing options from the game - keep your grubby little paws off mah ships!
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GIGAR
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.27 17:08:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Aeronwen Carys
First off, new char doesn't mean new player, there is a big difference. A new character may well be funded by an older, richer one and thus more than capable of affording said modules until such time as T2 is trained.
Also, even being a new player doesn't discount you from being able to afford expensive modules as there are an ever increasing number of people who buy GTC's, convert to PLEX and buy items that way.
OR you could just play with your older char and make more ISK.
I don't know many players that are new to a MMO that spends a few GTC's in the first week. Possible, yes, likely, somewhat doubtful.
Also this argument is pointless, and it loses relevance ONCE YOU CAN FIT T2 (which doesn't take THAT long, if you are an experienced PLAYER that knows how to make a skillplan - a few months should do for basics)
Originally by: Aeronwen Carys
As for "e-peen flagships" who are you to say that this isn't a valid playstyle? If I want to officer/deadspace/faction fit my Vargur, then I damn well have the right to do so.
This isn't an argument about Deadspace/Officer/Good fation items, though.
IT'S ABOUT THE USELESS TRASH MODULES.
For instance:
"Republic Fleet 425mm Autocannon"
Why would you use that over T2, once you have the skills?
Essentially, it's a VERY niche item.
I'm not saying billion ISK fits are useless - Go ahead and stuff some Estamel's on your ships. Those items are BETTER than T2.
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"I've yet to meet one that can outsmart bullet." - Heavy Weapons Guy |
Jack Tronic
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Posted - 2011.05.27 17:12:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Jack Tronic on 27/05/2011 17:12:25
Edited by: Jack Tronic on 27/05/2011 17:12:11
Originally by: GIGAR
This isn't an argument about Deadspace/Officer/Good fation items, though.
IT'S ABOUT THE USELESS TRASH MODULES.
For instance:
"Republic Fleet 425mm Autocannon"
Why would you use that over T2, once you have the skills?
Essentially, it's a VERY niche item.
So why not just boost the faction item like it should be?
Why not also remove all t2 ecm gear because the meta 4 gear is completely better and cheaper than it(only idiots use t2 jammers and signal amps)?
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Mister Smithington
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Posted - 2011.05.27 17:13:00 -
[18]
Just because a module or ship is underused doesn't mean it has no value. At least in theory. Fits that fell out of favor a year ago may be the counter to the next FotM. A mild example of this is armor vs shield tanking. Buffer shield tanking is currently favored because it gives you suitable EHP while maintaining your GTFO ability (at least, this is true for small gangs/low-sec roaming). That doesn't mean armor tanking doesn't work. It just doesn't fit as well with the current play style.
Having said that, there are categories of modules that just serve no purpose. Consider the Energized Regenerative Nano Plating. It increases armor HP by a % (I think 12% for t2). However, there is no situation where this adds more EHP than an Energized Adaptive Nano Plating, which has the same skill and fitting requirements. An EANM will also increase the effectiveness of reps, where a regenerative plate will not.
The solution in my opinion is to look at the ships and modules that are underused because something else fills their exact role better, and change them so they fill a different role. Removing them would just simplify a game that thrives on complexity.
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Zofran
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Posted - 2011.05.27 17:39:00 -
[19]
Rather decommission your ~game developers~ (excl: code monkeys, they are chill).
Build stakeholder value by destroying your only product, live on that pipe dream. Recruit Vuk Lau while you still have the cash, at least he has some good kool-aids. |
baltec1
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Posted - 2011.05.27 17:44:00 -
[20]
Just because the only sentinel I have seen in years are the two in my hanger doesnt mean people dont fly it
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EnslaverOfMinmatar
Amarr
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Posted - 2011.05.27 18:28:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Mr R4nd0m
With all the 'best fits' and and the game driven by player choice ships.
There must be a ton load of ships and mods that just don't get used anymore, or very very little use.
Is there any point having them in the game anymore? or having a house clean?
Wonder if it would help server performance?
NOOB.
Entity is using all of those ships and items.
uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ ƃuıpɐǝɹ ǝɹɐ noʎ |
Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.05.27 18:33:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Barakkus on 27/05/2011 18:34:16
Originally by: GIGAR
Yes, some mods fit in super special custom fits for just "THAT" thing. But it's rare that it happens.
Or "THAT" particular set of skills trained to a particular level. Some skills reduce cpu and pg usage the higher they are trained for certain mods. If you haven't trained the skill high enough, having a variation you can use with lower cpu/pg helps. I'll also settle for particular mods that are cheap if I don't want to blow a **** ton on a ship that's just going to blow up anyways.
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring |
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