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Congratulations, Protestors. You've doomed your own cause.

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Tron Flux	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:11:00 - [1] If CCP has any sense at all--and I'm not sure if they do--the result of this meeting will be to accelerate the deployment of non-vanity items. The reason for this is that CCP can't allow the perception that the inmates can run the asylum. If the execs make a choice that can be in any way construed as a victory for the bedlam of the last several days, it sets a bad precedent that violating the ToS in large numbers is an effective negotiating method. People will go around wrecking trade hubs every time they feel like it, over any detail they decide they want. Given the insanity logic of many of the ragers, I really can't say they I want any of them in charge of the direction or future of the game. The obvious way for CCP to get out of this with some semblance of credibility is to have the meeting, tell the CSM what's up, and move forward--most likely at a faster pace to show that they really mean it. If non-vanity items really weren't planned, they should throw them in there to make the point loud and clear. CCP doesn't play ball with virtual terrorists. A secondary option would be to backtrack slightly, but invoke the banhammer mercilessly against everyone who has violated the ToS. That would be the equivalent of saying, "We hear you. But we don't accept the way you made your voice heard." Frankly, I'd like to see some combination of both options. Rules that don't get enforced, or are enforced intermittently, aren't really worth much of anything. Either enforce the rules or change them. In any case, there's not a good option for those of who decided to intentionally wreck the trade hubs. You've ruined your cause. As a side-note, I wouldn't listen to the CSM either. Their polling methodology is horribly messed up. You can't toss a vote thread right into the middle of a bunch of massively biased people and take that as some representation of the population. Vote threads here are like polling only republicans on election day and saying, "OMG! 95% of The People voted republican! How did any democrats get elected? OMG! CONSPIRACY!!! Sony bought the government!!!!" If either CSM or CCP is interested in finding out what the community really thinks, they should send out surveys to random subscribers and pay them ISK or SP to complete the study and look at that data. On the other hand, what I got from the leaked email is that they did a bit of real research with a good survey methodology and came to a conclusion. I hope CCP sticks to its guns on this because I don't want to play in a universe run by protestors that ruin certain parts of the game by breaking the ToS. If I'm wrong, and CCP never did that research, have someone contact me. My company will be happy to do some real, scientific research on the eve players. ~Tron Flux
kestrael nanahara Caldari Wrecking Shots Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:12:00 - [2] There not giving the impression that inmates are running the asylum.... becuase were all leaving.
Tobias Sjodin Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:15:00 - [3] Originally by: kestrael nanahara There not giving the impression that inmates are running the asylum.... becuase were all leaving. Good riddance. HABIT
RougeOperator	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:17:00 - [4] Its not like they have ignored or payed lip service to the CSM the last few years right? Oh wai......
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:17:00 - [5] Originally by: Tron Flux CCP doesn't play ball with virtual terrorists. Stopped reading there
Tron Flux	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:17:00 - [6] Originally by: kestrael nanahara There not giving the impression that inmates are running the asylum.... becuase were all leaving. If there is a major problem with NEX, it's that watching the train wreck of rage-quitters claim to quit without actually quitting on the forums is actually more entertaining than playing EVE at the moment.
Jacoba Stalker	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:18:00 - [7] Inmates running the asylum? Gotta clue for you; PAYING CUSTOMERS run this business, and if CCP wants to assert their authority (which is well within their power and right to do), then the customers that do not wish to follow along blindly to the showers, can and will assert THEIR authority and vote them out of business by taking their money (i.e. the fuel that runs CCP) and put it in another gas tank. All the while departing the scene with a single finger salute.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:18:00 - [8] regressive counterrevolutionary twaddle. Join the Revolution!
INLops	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:18:00 - [9] You know, both "CCP" and "CSM" start with C and have 3 letters,but they are not equal.That's it.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:19:00 - [10] TL;DR: OP is furiously mad. @OP:

Scerolikk Teromni Atrocious Order	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:22:00 - [11] Originally by: Tron Flux The reason for this is that CCP can't allow the perception that the inmates can run the asylum. Umm.............. what? EVE isn't a prison, it's a video game, and CCP isn't a government, it's a business. Businesses are ruled by their customers. If you make your customers unhappy, they leave, and if enough customers leave, well, you won't have much of a business. If CCP refuses to listen to the protests and accelerate their MT plans to prove that they "[don't] play ball with virtual terrorists" well then so long CCP, you had a good run. -- Quote: Are you moving beyond VANITY AUR items?
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation RvB - RED Federation	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:22:00 - [12] This isn't a prison and it isn't an asylum it's service they provide which we pay for. It's voluntary and we can and will take our money and go if they do not satisfy our needs/wants/desires. Being responsive to the concerns of your customers is just good business sense. They wanted to see if they could get away with MT for power items/services and we gave them a resounding no. If they chose to go forward with P2W when they can do so with out my money. What the protests and hell raising has done is make sure they can't sneak such changes through without us or the rest of the gaming community noticing.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:22:00 - [13] OP = FUD My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ We'll watch what you do not what you say.
edith prickley	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:23:00 - [14] Indeed, this inmate has tossed the sink through the wall, and is running away across the field. Those of you remaining, watch out for that lobotomy knife.
Desert Ice78 Gryphon River Industries R-I-P	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:24:00 - [15] Your an idiot. Go away. CCP: Consistency since 2003
Tron Flux	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:24:00 - [16] Originally by: Dimitri Fukoyama Originally by: Tron Flux CCP doesn't play ball with virtual terrorists. Stopped reading there Meh, fair enough. One person's protest is another person's terrorist. It's just a matter of perspective. The British called the Colonies terrorists back in that Revolution thing. Who ends up being called what by the history books is determined by who wins. If the Brits had won that war, the founding fathers would be remembered as the Osama bin Ladens of the late 18th century. And that's kind of my point. If the protestors win, you become heros of eve against the evil CCP empire. CCP can't let that happen, or the whole game goes to crap. The protestors have to go in any reasonable scenario.
Olvel	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:26:00 - [17] Any successful MMOG is a partnership - a two-way street. CCP needs us players around to pay their bills. We need CCP around to keep EVE up and running. Granted, there are other games out there. But there's a reason I'm playing EVE instead of FarmVille or WoW or whatever else... I like the game. And I'd prefer to keep playing it. If CCP is smart, they'll listen to the players. And if the players are smart, they'll be willing to come to a compromise. CCP going all strong-arm and trying to project an image that the "inmates aren't running the asylum" by accelerating non-vanity items in the NEX would be idiotic. Players insisting on a promise that non-vanity items will never, ever appear on the NEX would be equally idiotic.
Lykouleon Wildly Inappropriate Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:28:00 - [18] Originally by: Tron Flux If the Brits had won that war, the founding fathers would be remembered as the Osama bin Ladens of the late 18th century. Butt-hurt Brit nationalist and/or Iranian nationalist detected... Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO THAT I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD
Lonox	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:29:00 - [19] Originally by: kestrael nanahara There not giving the impression that inmates are running the asylum.... becuase were all leaving. You're stomping your little foot and threatening to leave if "teh ebil" CCP doesn't meet your childish and unrealistic demands. Even more hilarious? When you realised noone cares and started your emo rage asshat campaign. Funnier still? When you all come groveling back. It will be awesome! Originally by: Holly Cleland has red bruising and veins popping up where the monocle plugs in. No wonder you people are so angry, you're doing it wrong.
Hot Brunette	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:29:00 - [20] "inmates can run the asylum" Stopped reading there, OP is obv ******ed

Tron Flux	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:29:00 - [21] Originally by: Skex Relbore This isn't a prison and it isn't an asylum it's service they provide which we pay for. It's voluntary and we can and will take our money and go if they do not satisfy our needs/wants/desires. Being responsive to the concerns of your customers is just good business sense. They wanted to see if they could get away with MT for power items/services and we gave them a resounding no. If they chose to go forward with P2W when they can do so with out my money. What the protests and hell raising has done is make sure they can't sneak such changes through without us or the rest of the gaming community noticing. You're not much for analogy or literary reference, are you? How is this: the protests are a story told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
cecil b d'milf	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:29:00 - [22] Originally by: Tron Flux idiotic over dramatic metaphor ~Tron Flux tl;dr CCP don't negotiate with terrorists ??
the plague Anthraxus Defense Laboratories	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:31:00 - [23] Edited by: the plague on 26/06/2011 20:35:51 Originally by: Don Maddox I'm not sure why people are surprised by any of this or would even think of calling for protesters to be banned. This is EXACTLY the way CCP has encouraged players to deal with each other in the game for years. EVE not only encourages players to band together and grief other players using the most destructive, onerous, and frustrating tactics possible, it practically forces players to operate in that fashion because nothing else works! In many subtle (and some not-so-subtle) ways, the devs have created an environment where banding together and imposing your will by whatever means necessary is the intuitive and instinctive way to play this game. It should surprise absolutely no one that the EVE community has now evolved (or mutated) into a state where we treat the developers in exactly the same fashion as they encourage us to treat each other. You reap what you sow. And CCP has created a Frankenstein monster that will no longer blindly do as commanded. CCP talks a lot about bravery and creating new virtual worlds where players truly control their own destiny's. Well, CCP's response to this crisis is going to speak volumes about who they really are as a game company. And it will also reveal whether they really believe any of that fancy talk or whether it really is all just about the bucks. So far the signs are not encouraging. CCP has demonstrated a remarkable degree of incompetence in dealing with their own game and the player community over the past 24 months. There's very little reason to believe they're capable or willing to stop and actually listen. They often hear what we say, but they don't listen. http://forums.gamesquad.com/showthread.php?101089-Leaked-internal-CCP-documents-reveal-EVE-s-new-focus-on-f2p-and-microtransactions/page2 Pretty much.
WachinDaGame DrinkinABud	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:32:00 - [24] Since when do prisoners pay to stay in jail? If a prisoner does not get what he wants can he simply leave? What a terrible analogy. This can only be related to a business practice. What if a pizza joint started saying they are not putting cheese on pizza anymore. If some people asked to get cheese and the company said "go f_ck yourself", don't you think those customers would leave? Don't you think they would tell other potential customers to not bother going there? Even customers that are OK with no cheese might look poorly on how they treated all those other former customers and wonder will they be next? A pizza you spend a few minutes of time investment. With Eve most of us have spend YEARS investing time and effort. They said it themselves that it is OUR game, not theirs, and in my opinion that is what makes/made the game great for this long. This appears to be changing and that is why people are upset. We are talking about a paradigm shift here, not the fact that MT will exist. If it is vanity only, I just won't buy it. If it is pay to win, then I'm out.
i am jita	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:33:00 - [25] Edited by: i am jita on 26/06/2011 20:33:53 Originally by: Tron Flux CCP doesn't play ball with virtual terrorists. Obvious Fox News viewer. You sir are full weetard.
HostageTaker Gallente Band of Freelancers	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:34:00 - [26] @ OP Can you please summarize your sh!t topic into a 140 character tweet?! I'm not reading all of that ffs!!
Le Sabre Gallente Forced aggressions Lawful Insanity	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:37:00 - [27] Kinda putting every protester and everyone shooting the monuments into the same league there op. I joined in the protests for one reason, I didn't agree with the way CCP had presented itself to its playerbase, or some of its decisions in the latest patch. So, I went there to make sure if there was a CCP alt, media reporter or someone similar taking numbers, I wanted to make sure I was counted as one of the people who were unhappy. The protests had a good effect, both in CCP finally noticing that they were not getting the traction they wanted with the store/direction/attitude and also gaining the game a lot of publicity, if CCP can sort the mess out, the media no doubt will report on the resolution of the problems which as everyone knows, good publicity is good for our game and will help generate the revenue that they are seeking. Eve will then be 'business as normal' and everybody's happy. Proud participant in the great "Trade hub lock down" of 24th june 2011. We control OUR game CCP!!!
Tron Flux	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:37:00 - [28] Originally by: Jacoba Stalker Inmates running the asylum? Gotta clue for you; PAYING CUSTOMERS run this business, and if CCP wants to assert their authority (which is well within their power and right to do), then the customers that do not wish to follow along blindly to the showers, can and will assert THEIR authority and vote them out of business by taking their money (i.e. the fuel that runs CCP) and put it in another gas tank. All the while departing the scene with a single finger salute. Thank you for the clue. In my opinion, businesses are not run by customers. They are run by executives and possibly investors. If losing you and others were not planned into CCP's strategy, shame on them for not taking that possibility into account. That's bad business. But I think it was. Perhaps I'm wrong. In any case, breaking the rules you agreed to when you signed up to play shouldn't have any effect on anyone's business decisions. It should just get you banned.
Ghard Eleran	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:37:00 - [29] Originally by: Lonox Originally by: kestrael nanahara There not giving the impression that inmates are running the asylum.... becuase were all leaving. You're stomping your little foot and threatening to leave if "teh ebil" CCP doesn't meet your childish and unrealistic demands. Even more hilarious? When you realised noone cares and started your emo rage asshat campaign. Funnier still? When you all come groveling back. It will be awesome! are our demands so childish and unrealistic? what do you think our demands exactly are? please enlighten me what is it i am proteting againt?
Della Monk Broski Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.26 20:40:00 - [30] CCP needs our money. We don't need EVE. Simple.



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Are you moving beyond VANITY AUR items?