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Heavy Assault Cruiser versus Battleship Who is the MAC?

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Counsel	Posted - 2005.02.25 13:58:00 - [1] Edited by: Counsel on 25/02/2005 13:58:49 Looking for some info on the true effectiveness of the heavy assault, your input could save me 27 days!! please please share your experience. thank you :)
Zyanid	Posted - 2005.02.25 13:59:00 - [2] Edited by: Zyanid on 25/02/2005 14:14:10 ah, thank god you edited that post. =) Well i have seen lots of people managing to kill a bs with a HAC so it can be done. But it requires a good fit and some nice skillpoints at the right location. And it definately depends on what kind of HAC. I mean i wouldent be to worried if i see a eagle warping in on me at 70km with his 250mm's..
Counsel	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:24:00 - [3] damn really 'cause i was about to go caldari... so then what race are worth a shat?
magickangaroo	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:29:00 - [4] amar have great resists on there hac accross the board and good dmg out put. the demios is popular cos of the dmg the blasters do and cos if get close enought to a bs to hit with them his guns probably cant track you. thou as in all things it depends on setup and skills, im sure one day somone will strap some blasters on a eagle to see what happens :) so imo go for either of those two with the mind of killing bs, the eagle is more a killing ceptors at 50 km kinda ship and i dont know about the minnie one mgk
Dash Ripcock	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:41:00 - [5] Edited by: Dash Ripcock on 25/02/2005 14:41:47 2005.02.12 15:53:00 Victim: Dr Screamm Corporation: Reikoku Destroyed Type: Megathron Solar System: V-LEKM System Security Level: 0.0 Involved parties: Name: Dash Ripcock (laid the final blow) Security Status: 1.2 Corporation: Elite Storm Enterprises Ship Type: Deimos Weapon Type: Heavy Electron Blaster II Granted the target was utilising a med/long-range setup, but the fact that the Deimos could make it past his AM rounds (which hurt by the way - took me down to 50% armour), then have enough hitting power to demolish his shields/armour/structure before he got to the gate (webbed of course, but he only had about 7.5-10Km to go), I'd say makes it pretty clear that in the rights hands, and given the right set of circumstance, a HAC is a very dangerous weapon. Of course they have their down-sides, the major one being availability and price, but they are incredible fun to fly - and they are far more adept at dealing with Assault Frigates and Cruisers than BSs ever are, just make sure you pick and choose your targets. Battle Angels Inc - The Movie
X'Alor	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:46:00 - [6] blaster thorax = blasterax blaseter megatron = blastertron blaster eagle = beagle beware the mighty beagle.
Al Haquis	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:49:00 - [7] We seeing that i only fly Minnie ships. I have to say the HAC are great. I gave up on BS 3-4 months back but after i got my vagabond life is great. The ting with these ships is that u have to know what you are doing. The Muninn is a great gank ship being abile to break a Apocs tank solo. If you like shield tanking you can get all the resistances of the vagabond above 50% with only 2 harderners and still have speed. So yes the HAC¦s are great , you just have to pick a ship that goes good with your setup style. But at the end of the day it comes down to the pilot. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Council Member, Tahiri Warrior Masuat'aa Forums
Naal Morno	Posted - 2005.02.25 14:52:00 - [8] I peronally killed 3 gankageddons with my deimos (with help of covert) so I would say they're pretty effictive at what they can do granted you're not at disadvantage to begin with. Don't try any tricks with Ravens/Scorps though in any tank. These ships are way overpowered at this time. Your Heavy Neutron Blaster II perfectly strikes Serpentis Chief Sentinel, wrecking for 660.4 damage.
Eyeshadow	Posted - 2005.02.25 15:16:00 - [9] personally i think gallente rule the roost when it comes to HACs. Both of theirs are fantastic ships, the deimos being the powerhouse, the ishtar being possibly the most versatile ship in the game, and dont underestimate its hvy drones. I would say caldari are the worst (for once). Dont get me wrong, they are still great ships and both have a role to play. Amarr ships are pretty much like their BS cousins. One awsome dmg dealer that can tank well aswell as dish out some bbqpwnage if needy and a pretty poor dmg dealer but a great tank. Minnie HACs are pretty sharp too, the vagabond is a speed demon, thou i would say it lacks the punch to take on a BS solo, and the muninn which does do some good dmg but imo, needs another low slot to tank better. To solo a BS in a HAC is certainly doable, thou i wouldnt attempt it in anything but a deimos or a zealot, maybe a muninn but i dont really know these too well. It would rely on a lot of things thou. A deimos starting at 30km from a gankageddon is waiting to be smacked down. at 15km thou, i would put money on the deimos winning. It really depends if you can get under the guns of a BS Oh and dont go anywhere near a raven (a scorp aint so bad, its dmg output is tankable in a deimos) cos it will nuke u pretty damn sharpish. A deimos, once in range, can strip any ship quicker than u can blink, as long as it isnt pilotted by a monkey. I have tested v a corp mate in a mega with 2 large reps and 3 hardners and he woulda been dead in under 30 seconds if i had carried on. The sheer dmg output of deimos is frightening Forums: Sharks - MC
JaiMaster	Posted - 2005.02.25 15:17:00 - [10] Edited by: JaiMaster on 25/02/2005 15:17:32 hac vs bs = get in real close to mid/long range fitted bs then slaughter it with your own BS-like firepower at point blank... dont sit at range (eg, eagle, cerebus) and expect to do anything except die hard and fast. Missile boats? forget about it (scorp, raven, phoon). A heavily tanked domi could also give you a headache... ------- Skill points. ISK. Ships, rare equipment. Its all just a means to an end... Your end.

BlackHawk177	Posted - 2005.02.25 16:30:00 - [11] Originally by: X'Alor blaster thorax = blasterax blaseter megatron = blastertron blaster eagle = beagle beware the mighty beagle. LMAO that's great but seriously a HAC in the right hands is definatly very dangerous to everyone (\_/) (O.o) (> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination.
Idara	Posted - 2005.02.25 17:33:00 - [12] If you can get a Deimos in range and open up, the targets dead. If you get webbed, you're toast. That's why I'm going to get a Zealot, good range and still able to gank stuff Idara Section Leader - Security & Warfare Member of Metatron Incorporated
slothe	Posted - 2005.02.25 17:41:00 - [13] Edited by: slothe on 25/02/2005 17:42:38 personally i think that battleships SHOULD beat hac evertime. however in the right circumstances the hac could win. however those circumstances are rare. to be realistic a dominix is better that an ishtar for the same cost (or thereabouts)and is more versatile. a megathron is better than a deimos. people only really (lets be honest here) get hacs because they want to ...(a) look cool (and why not) (b) use something different or (c) use the ship for a niche purpose. You shouldnt buy a hac in the belief that it will pwn all bs, it wont. you will die. id only buy a hac in addition to a bs you already have. you wont lose much money on an insured bs, you will on an insured hac. Say hello on our forum @www.aserea.com or join our public channel ingame "MLM Public" http://www.khainestar.com/eve
Selim	Posted - 2005.02.25 18:02:00 - [14] Deimos and Ishtar are definitely the best. Ishtar actually does more damage than a Deimos and can tank better, (FFS it even has 10 mid+lows), AND its faster. Amarr are pretty good too. Vagabond is ok, pretty easy to fit, and good against laser ships but it cant tank for crap and its damage is subpar. Muninn is only slightly better of a tank than the Vagabond and has less mid/lows, and since its an armor tank with poor resists its uses are limited. Cerberus is absolutely crap except for raping intys. Eagle is a great tank and has superb range, but thats about it, don't know how one would boost it though.
Mallik Hendrake	Posted - 2005.02.25 21:16:00 - [15] The heavy nos is still the great equalizer, but versus some bs's you can pwn. I really just keep praying they remove nosferatus in general as they're freaking ridiculously stupid, but whatever :)
Wizard	Posted - 2005.02.25 22:13:00 - [16] hmm, ill have to get myself one of these HACS people keep mentioning.
redfield	Posted - 2005.02.25 22:53:00 - [17] i for one would train for minmatar hac they are brutal, Muninn is a beast waiting to be unleashed. All hac do their thing under right conditions ofc.. and to say deimos is THE hac is just pure ignorance.
Unleashed	Posted - 2005.02.26 00:34:00 - [18] I personally fly a Deimos, they are very effective in small scale combat situations. However alot of that is lost in fleet battles, so depending on what your planning to do, they may not suit your style. Of couse different hac's are better/worse at some situations than others, if you had said which one you were intending to use, you probably would have gotten more useful answers. ___ >currently training to level 5: sexual tyrannosaurus / Rank 8 /
Hanns	Posted - 2005.02.26 00:38:00 - [19] If you fly a HAC it is pretty easy to****a BS solo, depending on the circumstances, and the circumstances to avoid are A raven spamming you with torps, any ship jamming or dampnin, ohh and stay away from ***** heavy nosferatu, thos things kill HAC's raven is the BS you should be exremely cautious about attacking, as other ships you can just zoom in under its optimal, so its guns cant track(bar prehaps megathron), but torps still omfgbbq your ass no matter what u do! i personally fly a Zealot, its a dammed fine Hac it can tank like a crazy mofo, and it can gank as good as a dimos, maby slightly better due to better range. but you need to remeber just because you in a HAC dosent mean you omg uber, you can be kileld very easily, i fought a dom in pure blind that had havey nos and heavy drones, it drained my cap so bad my hardeners switched off, and my guns would only cycle once b4 switching off due to having like no cap, luckily he was slightly retarded and had no tank, so i managed to kill him, but if hed had a half decent tank i woulda probably gone pop.
Selim	Posted - 2005.02.26 00:43:00 - [20] Originally by: redfield i for one would train for minmatar hac they are brutal, Muninn is a beast waiting to be unleashed. All hac do their thing under right conditions ofc.. and to say deimos is THE hac is just pure ignorance. I'm starting to realize that the Ishtar is actually even more overpowered than the Deimos. It doesnt really need a mwd, can tank better, does same damage with drones alone, and its drones can go 70km. Not to mention its actually faster than a deimos... and cheaper. Craziness...

Bad'Boy	Posted - 2005.02.26 00:49:00 - [21] Originally by: Selim Originally by: redfield i for one would train for minmatar hac they are brutal, Muninn is a beast waiting to be unleashed. All hac do their thing under right conditions ofc.. and to say deimos is THE hac is just pure ignorance. I'm starting to realize that the Ishtar is actually even more overpowered than the Deimos. It doesnt really need a mwd, can tank better, does same damage with drones alone, and its drones can go 70km. Not to mention its actually faster than a deimos... and cheaper. Craziness... yep, and with NOS setup heavy NOS on BS arnt gonna be much help(unless tank on ishat is relay on NOS) B.A.D.B.O.Y.: Biomechanical Android Designed for Battle and Online Yelling "Bad Boys,Bad Boys, what you gonna do, what you gonna do when WE come for yoU"
Naal Morno	Posted - 2005.02.26 00:51:00 - [22] Zealot is definitely good ship too... BOth for PvP and NPCing due to its insane optimal for lasers and very good speed... Also, ganks pretty nicely too... This wasn't much of a fight... Victim: Nelson Vandermark Corporation: ClanKillers Destroyed Type: Caracal Solar System: Amarr System Security Level: 1.0 Name: Naal Morno (laid the final blow) Security Status: 1.2 Corporation: Psych0sis Ship Type: Zealot Weapon Type: Heavy Modal Laser I This was : Victim: WHOSYADADDY Corporation: ClanKillers Destroyed Type: Armageddon Solar System: Yulai System Security Level: 1.0 Involved parties: Name: Naal Morno (laid the final blow) Security Status: 1.1 Corporation: Psych0sis Ship Type: Deimos Weapon Type: Heavy Electron Blaster II As you can see, both ships are good, granted you know what you want to do with them... Zealot if good med-long range 'poker' where as deimos is pure PWNage up close. Your Heavy Neutron Blaster II perfectly strikes Serpentis Chief Sentinel, wrecking for 660.4 damage.
Nybbas	Posted - 2005.02.26 01:32:00 - [23] Edited by: Nybbas on 26/02/2005 01:33:17 NOTHING TO SEE HERE ISHTAR SUCKS!!! selim SHUT UP OH MY GOD... and also it doesnt have anywhere near the output of a deimos (even tho its damage output IS amazing) (and good up to 70km : D) but yeah ishtar sucks omg! dont buy them, replace their damage bonus to turrets with a bonus to thermal1!! i mean come on they ARE a drone ship! and 100 more pg and cpu too! oh yeah and when are we ganna get tech 2 drones ccp? and more drone skills? and mods to make drones better? i mean other ships do but ishtar doesnt? the poor forgotten useless ishtar... did i mention its useless and no one should buy these ships, if you find one contact me ill buy for a reasonable price, seeing how it is useless and all, and not good for anything cept dying...
Gel0	Posted - 2005.02.26 01:36:00 - [24] Originally by: Nybbas Edited by: Nybbas on 26/02/2005 01:33:17 NOTHING TO SEE HERE ISHTAR SUCKS!!! selim SHUT UP OH MY GOD... and also it doesnt have anywhere near the output of a deimos (even tho its damage output IS amazing) (and good up to 70km : D) but yeah ishtar sucks omg! dont buy them, replace their damage bonus to turrets with a bonus to thermal1!! i mean come on they ARE a drone ship! and 100 more pg and cpu too! oh yeah and when are we ganna get tech 2 drones ccp? and more drone skills? and mods to make drones better? i mean other ships do but ishtar doesnt? the poor forgotten useless ishtar... did i mention its useless and no one should buy these ships, if you find one contact me ill buy for a reasonable price, seeing how it is useless and all, and not good for anything cept dying... heh, yea, dont want whole eve to fly my ship
Selim	Posted - 2005.02.26 01:45:00 - [25] Edited by: Selim on 26/02/2005 01:47:38 Originally by: Gel0 Originally by: Nybbas Edited by: Nybbas on 26/02/2005 01:33:17 NOTHING TO SEE HERE ISHTAR SUCKS!!! selim SHUT UP OH MY GOD... and also it doesnt have anywhere near the output of a deimos (even tho its damage output IS amazing) (and good up to 70km : D) but yeah ishtar sucks omg! dont buy them, replace their damage bonus to turrets with a bonus to thermal1!! i mean come on they ARE a drone ship! and 100 more pg and cpu too! oh yeah and when are we ganna get tech 2 drones ccp? and more drone skills? and mods to make drones better? i mean other ships do but ishtar doesnt? the poor forgotten useless ishtar... did i mention its useless and no one should buy these ships, if you find one contact me ill buy for a reasonable price, seeing how it is useless and all, and not good for anything cept dying... heh, yea, dont want whole eve to fly my ship Sorry, the secrets out already. And since I dont want to have to compare my comparatively modest ship to such a super-powered one, I ask for it to be weakened. And god forbid the ishtar with tech 2 drones, the ishtar is already uber with tech 1. /me hopes nobody notices his uber breacher
Droidster	Posted - 2005.02.26 02:15:00 - [26] The Deimos incredible resists make it godlike against Serpentis and anyone else unlucky enough to be doing kinetic/thermal damage. With few hardeners you could have a 95% kinetic resist and 85% thermal resist. Basically you never die. _____________________________________________ I am motivated by various things, mostly ISK.
archangel sean	Posted - 2005.02.26 02:48:00 - [27] I have been thinking about this same thing for months..and have concludes that HACs are mearly useful for agent missions. One heavy NOS on a BS, which is quite standard for pvp these days, will ruin a HAC pilot's day. Anyhow, I'll see what the elite BSs are like, before I choose a race to train elite cruisers.
Nyxus	Posted - 2005.02.26 03:20:00 - [28] HACS can have really good damage output. But don't ever go up against something that can tank. From 60km out a zealot shot at my apoc and took my shields down. Then it just kinda kissed the armor on my Apoc till I jumped to the next system. When the Zealot jumped through after me and I had him at 16km, I took him from full shields to pod in just about 50 seconds. Nos + Torps/Cruise is plain evil. Too bad too because that Zealot just looked sweet! So they are situational killers, with good damage output. But be careful that you don't bite off more than you can chew. But I imagine that they are very effective verses any setups that lack a decent defense. Nyxus
Lorth	Posted - 2005.02.26 03:55:00 - [29] Killing a BS in a HAC is akin to killing a cruiser in an inty. It can be done, and consitantly by some pilots. But your not going to win them all, and esp not if the opponent has some sort of counter measures.
Hyey	Posted - 2005.02.26 05:00:00 - [30] HAC can take down BS rather consistantly actually. If the BS has heavy nos it can be quite a bit more difficult (and closer to impossible to deal with.). However a BS without is pretty fair game to anything that can avoid getting hit. Lorth is correct, you wont win em all when piloting either ship. ~~ Hyey I just payed 15 dollars this month just to be able to respond on the forums... stupid cancellation error.



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