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CCP, please consider lowering the cost of Med Clones

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Dinsdale Pirannha Gallente	Posted - 2011.09.06 03:26:00 - [1] OK, up front, I am a carebear. Done my time in 0.0 as part of NC. Two tours of duty in wormholes. But still a carebear. Came back to high sec for a breather. I suck at PvP, too many clicks for someone as keyboard-challenged as I. I know the only way I am going to get better at PvP is jumping in and doing it a lot more than I have. No more running in logistics squads against the russians. I have friends in a couple corps encouraging me to hook up with them and pew pew. But given that I am going to lose a lot of clones since I suck so much at PvP, this is where I have an issue. Even though I plan on flying with an implantless clone, it is going to cost me more for a new med clone than it does to replace a ship. Does that seem reasonable? I recognize the concept of ISK sinks in the game, but does getting podded have to hurt the pocketbook so much? I don't know if many others feel that way, but there must be a ton of 2004, 2005, 2006 chars that must wince when they undock (I am 2008). It is one thing to say "don't fly what you can't afford to lose", but your clone is something that you have no choice over.
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 03:30:00 - [2] I 100% support the prices being reviewed. Does anyone have a list handy of the prices for say 75m and up clone prices? ______
daddys helper	Posted - 2011.09.06 03:35:00 - [3] dont get podded. yeah, it sounds like a troll, but seriously, don't get podded. the ONLY time you should ever die in a pod in space is if you are in a bubble. otherwise you screwed up. I go through a lot more ships than pods, if you are going to die in a ship that you can fly, you know full well when its too late, and thats usually a good bit before you pop. you should be setting up your escape before you pop. proper escape tactics won't save you every time, but they'll save you most of the time.
Dinsdale Pirannha Gallente	Posted - 2011.09.06 03:45:00 - [4] Originally by: daddys helper dont get podded. yeah, it sounds like a troll, but seriously, don't get podded. the ONLY time you should ever die in a pod in space is if you are in a bubble. otherwise you screwed up. I go through a lot more ships than pods, if you are going to die in a ship that you can fly, you know full well when its too late, and thats usually a good bit before you pop. you should be setting up your escape before you pop. proper escape tactics won't save you every time, but they'll save you most of the time. 2 things: 1. I do have the pod-saver overviews set up, have an excellent concept of when I am toast, and yet I still lose a ton of pods (hence the part about me sucking at PvP). 2. Like you mentioned right off, the bubble thing. In 0.0 and wh's I got nailed in a ton of bubbles. They are everywhere. They are completely expected and accepted, but that does not change the fact that when I lose a ship in null, I am VERY likely facing an expensive medclone loss.
Ghoest	Posted - 2011.09.06 05:25:00 - [5] The high end prices are absurd. Its no easier to make isk with 100 mill SP than it is with 25 mill SP. Wherever you went - Here you are.
Katrina Oniseki Caldari Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive	Posted - 2011.09.06 05:30:00 - [6] Does anyone know what type of mathemetic formula the game uses to assign a price to a clone grade? Or is it arbitrarily set by devs?
Mallak Azaria Three 6 MaFiA KRYSIS.	Posted - 2011.09.06 05:30:00 - [7] Originally by: Dinsdale Pirannha OK, up front, I am a carebear. Done my time in 0.0 as part of NC. Two tours of duty in wormholes. But still a carebear. Came back to high sec for a breather. I suck at PvP, too many clicks for someone as keyboard-challenged as I. I know the only way I am going to get better at PvP is jumping in and doing it a lot more than I have. No more running in logistics squads against the russians. I have friends in a couple corps encouraging me to hook up with them and pew pew. But given that I am going to lose a lot of clones since I suck so much at PvP, this is where I have an issue. Even though I plan on flying with an implantless clone, it is going to cost me more for a new med clone than it does to replace a ship. Does that seem reasonable? I recognize the concept of ISK sinks in the game, but does getting podded have to hurt the pocketbook so much? I don't know if many others feel that way, but there must be a ton of 2004, 2005, 2006 chars that must wince when they undock (I am 2008). It is one thing to say "don't fly what you can't afford to lose", but your clone is something that you have no choice over. "Please lower the cost of medical clones, because making isk is really hard in this game" That's all I saw. ================================================== I love and hate 0.0 these days and feel CCP is taking a big **** on my chest every time i see super carriers. ~Tipsy McStagger
Tau Cabalander	Posted - 2011.09.06 05:49:00 - [8] Originally by: AnzacPaul Does anyone have a list handy of the prices for say 75m and up clone prices? Clone Grade Omega - Skill Points Kept 450m - 150m ISK Clone Grade Psi - Skill Points Kept 343.5m - 120m ISK Clone Grade Chi - Skill Points Kept 264m - 90m ISK Clone Grade Phi - Skill Points Kept 203m - 65m ISK Clone Grade Upsilon - Skill Points Kept 156m - 45m ISK Clone Grade Tau - Skill Points Kept 120m - 30m ISK Clone Grade Sigma - Skill Points Kept 92.5m - 20m ISK Clone Grade Rho - Skill Points Kept 71m - 13m ISK Clone Grade Pi - Skill Points Kept 54.6m - 7.8m ISK Clone Grade Omicron - Skill Points Kept 42.2m - 4.7m ISK Clone Grade Xi - Skill Points Kept 32.8m - 2.99m ISK Clone Grade Nu - Skill Points Kept 25.6m - 1.98m ISK Clone Grade Lambda - Skill Points Kept 15.7m - 0.93m ISK Clone Grade Kappa - Skill Points Kept 12.4m - 0.65m ISK Clone Grade Iota - Skill Points Kept 9.8m - 0.47m ISK Clone Grade Theta - Skill Points Kept 7.75m - 0.335m ISK Clone Grade Eta - Skill Points Kept 6.1m - 0.25m ISK Clone Grade Zeta - Skill Points Kept 4.8m - 0.18m ISK Clone Grade Epsilon - Skill Points Kept 3.75m - 0.13m ISK Clone Grade Delta - Skill Points Kept 2.8m - 0.095m ISK Clone Grade Gamma - Skill Points Kept 2.05m - 0.065m ISK Clone Grade Beta - Skill Points Kept 1.38m - 0.040m ISK Clone Grade Alpha - Skill Points Kept 0.9m - FREE
Ciar Meara Amarr Virtus Vindice	Posted - 2011.09.06 07:44:00 - [9] Edited by: Ciar Meara on 06/09/2011 07:44:04 That's the price of a high end frigate, If anything they should raise prices. Get more rich. - English only please. Zymurgist
Jagga Spikes Minmatar Spikes Chop Shop	Posted - 2011.09.06 07:44:00 - [10] Originally by: Dinsdale Pirannha ... I recognize the concept of ISK sinks in the game, but does getting podded have to hurt the pocketbook so much? I don't know if many others feel that way, but there must be a ton of 2004, 2005, 2006 chars that must wince when they undock (I am 2008). It is one thing to say "don't fly what you can't afford to lose", but your clone is something that you have no choice over. it has to hurt at some level. and if it's raised, then it would eventually start to hurt again. and you do have a choice for your clone. simply stop training, and cost of your loss will stop increasing. ________________________________ : Forum Bore 'Em : Foamy The Squirrel - [jedi handwave] "There is no spoon."
El'Niaga Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2011.09.06 07:47:00 - [11] Many of us use combat alts that have fewer skill points than our mains :) If you've not used all your character slots you can make an alt on one halt main training and have a decent combat toon with about a month of time invested.
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 07:49:00 - [12] Originally by: Jagga Spikes simply stop training, and cost of your loss will stop increasing. Nice trolling. Perhaps a better idea would be to have an insurance period on the clone, ie lose it within 2 weeks and it's only half price. You shouldn't be repeatedly punished for actively participating in PVP. ______
Estephania Independent Political Analysts	Posted - 2011.09.06 07:55:00 - [13] Originally by: Ciar Meara Edited by: Ciar Meara on 06/09/2011 07:44:04 That's the price of a high end frigate, If anything they should raise prices. Get more rich. Grind moar, right?
enterprisePSI Unimatrix 0.1	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:00:00 - [14] Originally by: Ciar Meara Edited by: Ciar Meara on 06/09/2011 07:44:04 That's the price of a high end frigate, If anything they should raise prices. Get more rich. The Pod Log. \|\|\| I MADE TWEET Y U NO FOLLOW!?
Aineko Macx	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:04:00 - [15] Seriusly, I don't think clone prices are too high. Also, the game needs isk sinks. ________________________ CCP: Where fixing bugs is a luxury, not an obligation.
RaTTuS BIG Gentlemen's Agreement	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:04:00 - [16] Practice with 900k Alts - it's fine for a lot of stuff Join BIG
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:28:00 - [17] Can anyone that pvp's actively in 0.0 say how often they would replace their clone? I think the issue is now, alot of people are reaching the higher clones, and the prices have never changed. It's fine to have 30m isk clones when the only people using them were the Skill training online bunch, but now more and more general pvpers are getting up above 75m sp, and if your losing 3 clones a week in active pvp (this might be way over, i'm not sure?), having to dedicate the cost of a BC each time just to protect your sp that you've earnt over time is a bit rich, in my opinion only). Perhaps the fact that not a large amount of noise is being made about it says that it isn't a large issue for the people with say >90m sp, but I think it might be in the future as more and more reach the higher caps. ______
Si Omega	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:32:00 - [18] Quote: You shouldn't be repeatedly punished for actively participating in PVP. Isn't it you that keeps saying "Eve has consequences" when a Carebear says he loses a Hulk or an Indy? Isn't it you that says "if you can't afford to lose it, don't fly it"? Aww shucks.
Si Omega	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:34:00 - [19] Quote: Can anyone that pvp's actively in 0.0 say how often they would replace their clone? Death cloning is a common and std practise. Used to lose 1 or 2 a day sometimes - even on small roams. Besides, 75m+ SP pilots don't "normally" get podded. If they do, they shoulda stayed outta character bazaar.
baltec1	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:38:00 - [20] Originally by: AnzacPaul Can anyone that pvp's actively in 0.0 say how often they would replace their clone? Once a week if I am unlucky. Most of the time I lose one or two a month. It takes me 15 minutes to make the isk to cover my 7.8 mil clone cost. I don't see the problem here...
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 08:51:00 - [21] Originally by: Si Omega Quote: Can anyone that pvp's actively in 0.0 say how often they would replace their clone? Death cloning is a common and std practise. Used to lose 1 or 2 a day sometimes - even on small roams. Besides, 75m+ SP pilots don't "normally" get podded. If they do, they shoulda stayed outta character bazaar. ______
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.09.06 09:34:00 - [22] Yes, it's true. Beyond 150M SP, the clone costs go a bit bonkers. From what I understand, those grades didn't even exist in the beginning and when they were added as people started to push the boundaries, they didn't think that hard about the pricing. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡ you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Malcanis Caldari Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.09.06 10:01:00 - [23] Originally by: AnzacPaul You shouldn't be repeatedly punished for actively participating in PVP. You aren't. You're only punished for losing. Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.
Jagga Spikes Minmatar Spikes Chop Shop	Posted - 2011.09.06 10:12:00 - [24] Originally by: Tippia Yes, it's true. Beyond 150M SP, the clone costs go a bit bonkers. From what I understand, those grades didn't even exist in the beginning and when they were added as people started to push the boundaries, they didn't think that hard about the pricing. actually, from table presented, past 150 mil SP cost is linear. up to that point, on average, each 33% increase of SP has 50% increase in ISK cost. ________________________________ : Forum Bore 'Em : Foamy The Squirrel - [jedi handwave] "There is no spoon."
Holy One SniggWaffe	Posted - 2011.09.06 10:17:00 - [25] Peasants. BBQ makes me hungry for more...
Amsterdam Conversations	Posted - 2011.09.06 13:05:00 - [26] If you get podded everytime you PVP, you shouldn't be flying a 70m SP char. Not even a 20m SP char to be perfectly honest.
Bane Necran Minmatar	Posted - 2011.09.06 13:21:00 - [27] Originally by: daddys helper dont get podded. yeah, it sounds like a troll, but seriously, don't get podded. the ONLY time you should ever die in a pod in space is if you are in a bubble. There's a ****load of bubbles out there. Maybe a better idea is to limit the amount of bubbles which can be used.
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 13:24:00 - [28] Originally by: Amsterdam Conversations If you get podded everytime you PVP, you shouldn't be flying a 70m SP char. Not even a 20m SP char to be perfectly honest. Nobody is saying every single time, but it obviously does happen. Bubbles get dropped, I heard there was a bug recently of pods not warping off properly. Lag in big fights (sometimes your dead and don't even know you've been shot at). If you have anything over 92m SP your looking at 30m for each med clone. Even twice a week is still 60mill you have to pay just for clones. As I said, in my opinion maybe some kind of frequent "dier" deal could be set up :P, so the cost is reduced if you lose your clone over a week or fortnight period. But it seems like alot of people are happy for the price to be high, so no dramas. ______
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.09.06 13:52:00 - [29] I have 150M SP, and I don't have a problem with the cost of clones. Dying is meant to hurt. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
daddys helper	Posted - 2011.09.06 14:13:00 - [30] Originally by: Bane Necran Originally by: daddys helper dont get podded. yeah, it sounds like a troll, but seriously, don't get podded. the ONLY time you should ever die in a pod in space is if you are in a bubble. There's a ****load of bubbles out there. Maybe a better idea is to limit the amount of bubbles which can be used. or don't warp to zero like a moron When I said bubbles, I should have added the qualifier of "bubbles on entry gates." of course many gates are bubbled in null (many are not), but honestly you are doing it wrong if you manage to fly into each and every one. ffs, if you are going to spend time in dangerous places, set up perches and safes then the only bubble you need to worry about is the one on the other side of the gate
Soi Mala Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen	Posted - 2011.09.06 14:14:00 - [31] Clone cost stops me doing silly t1 suicide roams, since my clone costs roughly 30 times more than the ships. As a result, I stick to lowsec, where I find nothing but... well, mainly nothing. Clone costs should be minimal, the real loss in pods should be down to implants, meaning if you want some no strings attached cheap fun, you can go get it, and all you harm is your precious k:d ratio. Since its obvious everyone is so damn risk averse in this game that goodfights NEVER happen anymore, something needs to be done to bring back some FUN pewpew, instead of the seriousbusiness that has infected everyone.
AnzacPaul Perkone	Posted - 2011.09.06 14:18:00 - [32] Originally by: daddys helper or don't warp to zero like a moron When I said bubbles, I should have added the qualifier of "bubbles on entry gates." of course many gates are bubbled in null (many are not), but honestly you are doing it wrong if you manage to fly into each and every one. ffs, if you are going to spend time in dangerous places, set up perches and safes then the only bubble you need to worry about is the one on the other side of the gate There are more ways to die then on a gate. You've never had a bubble dropped on you during a fight?
daddys helper	Posted - 2011.09.06 15:03:00 - [33] Originally by: AnzacPaul Originally by: daddys helper or don't warp to zero like a moron When I said bubbles, I should have added the qualifier of "bubbles on entry gates." of course many gates are bubbled in null (many are not), but honestly you are doing it wrong if you manage to fly into each and every one. ffs, if you are going to spend time in dangerous places, set up perches and safes then the only bubble you need to worry about is the one on the other side of the gate There are more ways to die then on a gate. You've never had a bubble dropped on you during a fight? plenty of times, and again its one of the instances where you have to suck it up and die like a good little chappie. but the mere fact that it can and does happen does not dictate how I play. and those who want to take the short cut and not have a dedicated PVP alt will pay the price of an expensive clone, that's life in the big city. BUT EVEN THEN you still should not get podded so often it becomes a burdensome expense. so someone drops a bubble on you if its a hictor you can outrun it before you get popped if its a dictor you can fly out of the bubble before you get popped getting stuck in a ship-based bubble puts agro and GCC on the interdictor and that limits his options and makes his life a lot more intense when you are in a gang. soooo many variables to go through before it even comes to where you need to start thinking about saving your pod. Bottom line is you guys have "the fear" that dark closet called null is full of all sorts of nasty monsters out to deprive you of your expensive toys and thats all you can see. not the logic, not the reality, just "the fear" in the last 6 months this board has been dipped and the tears of null dwellers lamenting the lack of population in null, and breaded in the coarse breading of the endless moaning about supercap blobs locking down 3/4 of the map. and you people seem to think that every gate is r8pe caged with 20 bubbles and every ship you see is a 120mill hictor spearheading a 300 man fleet. /shakes head
Nirnias Stirrum	Posted - 2011.09.06 15:06:00 - [34] Im a 2005 character and i can safely say that anyone playing for as long and longer than me, we know how to make isk so even the maximum 150misk for the clone isnt that much... granted you keep dieing in your pod thats not really anyones fault but your own! AS stated earlier only reason to die in pod is if ur inside a bubble!
Ed Sullivan	Posted - 2011.09.06 16:29:00 - [35] Normally I would tend to agree with you op, but considering the direction the game is heading, I must come out against anything that makes it less harsh.
Drakhar M'zan Amarr	Posted - 2011.09.06 18:33:00 - [36] Easy, make pods interdiction nullified, the only way to loose one is by smartbombs, superfast lockers, or stupidity.
E man Industries	Posted - 2011.09.06 19:55:00 - [37] in a 5mil clone ATM.... 5mil clone is worth more than a t2 fitted rifter..makes short expendable pvp not an option never mind higher SP toons. That said what are you flying with 75m SP that is not t2 or a battleship? Your ships costs a lot more that that when it explodes. ______ Hello WoW players. Look at your toon, now back to me. Sadly it isn't me, but if it wasn't simplistic pre scripted linear mono dimensional game you could look like me. I'm in a Paladin
Linium Super Batungwaa Ninja Warriors 0ccupational Hazzard	Posted - 2011.09.06 22:11:00 - [38] I would get rid of clone updating altogether it adds nothing to the game.
Si Omega	Posted - 2011.09.06 22:30:00 - [39] Quote: I would get rid of clone updating altogether it adds nothing to the game. This. I've seen (and done it) ppl lose 1000's of SP's by overlooking the clone update. It's purpose is what, to see if you can mess up yet another (but obscure) way?
Praia	Posted - 2011.09.07 01:05:00 - [40] Originally by: Linium I would get rid of clone updating altogether it adds nothing to the game. This!
Lelob	Posted - 2011.09.07 07:59:00 - [41] Edited by: Lelob on 07/09/2011 07:59:56 Originally by: Si Omega Quote: I would get rid of clone updating altogether it adds nothing to the game. This. I've seen (and done it) ppl lose 1000's of SP's by overlooking the clone update. It's purpose is what, to see if you can mess up yet another (but obscure) way? Agreed. The few times I've lost my clone it was because I was having so much fun that I completely forgot about doing such a silly thing as clone updating. That, or depending on if it's a big enough isk sink, just make the clones cost dependent on the type of implants the char wants to plug in. That way, super pilots (for example) who want an edge and want hg slaves will have to pay for an expensive type of clone in order to insert the slaves. Someone who is out just looking for fun in a rifter without implants on the other hand pays nothing. If you don't pay for the clone, you don't get to put in the implants.
Dirty Addict	Posted - 2011.09.08 06:35:00 - [42] Originally by: Rodj Blake Dying is meant to hurt. +10 Anyone not remember what Eve it? Its a game where everything you have owned and worked for ingame gets put on the line, dont dumb it down with cheaper clones!!!
Skinae Hello Kitty Hug Patrol	Posted - 2011.09.08 08:05:00 - [43] Ya lets make Titan pilots lifes easier. Increase them imo.

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