| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
mahhy
   |
Posted - 2005.03.22 12:08:00 -
[1]
Just curious what people really want to see from Dreads?
I'm hoping CCP don't introduce them as the next step "after battleships". Personally I'd like to see them much more specialized, so heres my thoughts:
1.) Cost a lot. Least a billion.
2.) Can really hurt a BS, but can't hit the ship if its moving at all. Awful tracking.
3.) Can slug it out with POS.
4.) Extremely vulnerable to smaller ship classes (with enuf numbers obviously).
5.) No insurance for them.
That would give 'em a niche to fill. Real economic impact against corps and alliances who wish to use them. The impact can either be the POS owner or the Dread owner, depending on who gets shot down. They don't become "insta-bs-death" (point 2). And the no insurance is simply so it becomes an isk sink and makes people really think hard about flying one. Since they're meant to attack POS, and a POS has no insurance, I see no reason why the attacker should have the ISK advantage.
Of course, some things regarding POS would have to change as well, namely the POS turrets effectiveness against mis-matched targets. XL turrets only hit Dreads etc, etc, etc.
Just my 0.02 ISK.
|
Saerid
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 12:13:00 -
[2]
Something to consider:
Skill specialization. Think logistics cruisers. If you turn the ship into a heavy niche specialist but with 15 times the cost of a battleship, the chances of anyone bothering to train for one drops rather a lot. Particularly if it's going to be basically a station buster and nothing else. Some degree of anti-BS ability is a must.
|
Del Narveux
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 12:24:00 -
[3]
I think that would be a good compromise. CCP really needs to move away from making bigger ships and tech2 stuff just more uber versions of tech1, but more specialized with its strengths and weaknesses more pronounced.
_________________
[SAK] And Proud Of It!
aka Cpt Bogus
Is that my torped sig cloaking your base? |
Glarion Garnier
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 13:41:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Glarion Garnier on 22/03/2005 15:48:56
1. Cost 500-750mil -> Titan 1-3 bil
2. Long locking time even to a BS. Can hit BS in relation to a BS hitting a cruiser
3. Group of Dreadnoughts and support ships can take down a POS
4. yeah takes too long to lock even a BC. For proper BS ofence you need tracking computer's
5. Can be insured offcourse. could be with -10 -20% effiency ratio vs BS insurance
6. They should be bit bigger than BS. CCP should make a desing effort while modelling them.
7. 2 versions per race. not just one ! ! And I wan't to see those huge guns
|
Grimpak
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 14:03:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Grimpak on 22/03/2005 14:03:27
omg! 1st double post evah!
-------------------
 Quote:
Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
|
Grimpak
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 14:03:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Glarion Garnier
7. 2 versions per race. not just one ! ! And I wan't to see those huge guns
...prolly a specialized tier1 dread and a heavy weapon tier2?
-------------------
Quote:
Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
|
Rexthor Hammerfists
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 14:06:00 -
[7]
make dreads, good agaisnt bs, but not undieable against many - let em cost about 1-2billion.
1-2billion lies in many ppls wallet.
let titans cost bout 6 billions
|
mahhy
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 14:13:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Glarion Garnier
5. Can be insured offcourse. copuld be with -10 -20% effiency ratio vs BS insurance
This is the one thing I really don't agree with, until POS can be insured anyhow.
The POS owner (person/corp/alliance) is shelling out what, 500mill or more? Plus consumables?
Now we have Dreads which are apparently supposed to take out a POS, yet the Dread owner can get insurance and the POS owner can't?
Its not like POS are hugely profitable, from what I understand 
|
Reatu Krentor
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 14:23:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Reatu Krentor on 22/03/2005 14:25:34
Originally by: Rexthor Hammerfists
make dreads, good agaisnt bs, but not undieable against many - let em cost about 1-2billion.
1-2billion lies in many ppls wallet.
let titans cost bout 6 billions
From what i understand, dreadnought and titan are about the same size, just 1 is a combat oriented ship and the other is a mobile station(if it is this it prolly can be flown and then deployed or so to start to function like a station), a POSy ship  .
*edit: addendum*
Oh and yeah i'd say they both be expensive and no insurance(or very limited), whats the point if fleet battles will just change from bs to dread?
------------------------------------------
The ammatar are not the enemy, they are the smoke and mirrors of the amarr. |
Hung Odonkey
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 15:35:00 -
[10]
Time for a starwars analogy(cause thats all I can think of!)
Battleships->Star Destroyer
Dreadnaughts->Super Star Destroyers
When it gets right down to it I think the same rules should apply to this ship as it would to any other ship. They are big and according to the current trend on ship power and abilities here is what I think basic specs should be. SLOW! Maximum unadjusted speed of 50-75 km/s. 10 or more high slots with appropriate med and low slots. The terror of the skies!! Just as it takes 3 or more standard cruisers to take on a battleship effectivly, it should take 3 or more battleships to effectivly take on one of these behomoths. I would say price wise, 750 mill to 1 bill would be about right. Now as for how they are distributed... Well this is a tech 1 ship. Why well its in a catagory all its own. Its not related to any other ship. With that in mind lets set some realistic ground rules: (1) BPOs should cost about 10 billion. (2) When they are introduced the empires and concord should get some as well. That way players can't go on a hunting spree with several of these through high sec systems. (3) Named dreadnaughts added to the lp list for agent runners. So you wanted to know what you could get when you earned 10 million lp: Named Empire Dreadnaught!! Anywit just some thoughts about this.
|
Gierling
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 16:09:00 -
[11]
It would be great if Cruisers became the ship of choice for destroying dreadnoughts.
As far as titants, I've heard 1 trillion as a figure, not 1 billion.
Bastards we are lest Bastards we become. |
Glarion Garnier
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 16:24:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Glarion Garnier on 22/03/2005 16:26:10
Originally by: Gierling
It would be great if Cruisers became the ship of choice for destroying dreadnoughts.
As far as titants, I've heard 1 trillion as a figure, not 1 billion.
LOL well for One trillion you should get LAB's Factory's Refinery, 20 high , med & low slot's , BS carrying capability. Cutomizable paint job. Sertificate of Gaming exelence posted to you via RL mail From CCP Office with some nice small gift. oh yeah POS hitpoints. Did I forgot something ?
|
Aryth
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 16:27:00 -
[13]
Originally by: mahhy
Its not like POS are hugely profitable, from what I understand
Are you being sarcasctic?
Anyways if dreads are supposed to be able to really help take out a pos. They better be able to do absolutely INSANE amounts of damage. I was in a fleet trying to take out a pos, and we sat there for 6-7 hrs with 20-30 bs's and we got it to about 26-27% shields, and the guys broke the gate camp and warped into their pos at the last minute (they know who they are. and good job on that by the way. I was impressed). Point of the story is that POS's are damn near impossible to take out if you factor in firepower losses and the ebil force known as LAG (I was getting about 2fps through most of the fight). If a dread, or group of dreads is supposed to be the deciding force in taking out a pos it better be doing 5000-10000 damage per hit IMO. It will also have to withstand the sizeable defenses that a well equipped pos can mount (turrets launchers ew batterys AND ships inside the bubble). [/ramble]
___________________________________________
No... I must have my oven... My hot cakey treasures piping hot from their 40 watt. |
Grut
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 17:14:00 -
[14]
no insurance and costing a few bill should do the job
Mostly harmless |
Alowishus
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 17:22:00 -
[15]
Will Dreads be Tech 1 ships in their own class or will they be Tech 2 BS? If they are T1, will there be more than one Tier or will they be structured like BCs and Destroyers? What about Tier 3 Tech 1 BS? Why didn't CCP ever make these? What about skill? Will there be Ammar Dread skill, Caldari Dread skill etc. or will there just be a Dread skill?
I think, first off, we need some Tech2 BS. Something along the lines of an Assult version of the current BS. Then they can make Dreads as T1 ships. I think Dreads should be about 750 mil and T2 BS should be about 500 mil. Dreads should use XL weapons.
Raven 4TW! Rank(1) SP: 243745/256000 |
Meridius
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 17:48:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Meridius on 22/03/2005 17:48:47
Originally by: Alowishus
Will Dreads be Tech 1 ships in their own class or will they be Tech 2 BS? If they are T1, will there be more than one Tier or will they be structured like BCs and Destroyers? What about Tier 3 Tech 1 BS? Why didn't CCP ever make these? What about skill? Will there be Ammar Dread skill, Caldari Dread skill etc. or will there just be a Dread skill?
I think, first off, we need some Tech2 BS. Something along the lines of an Assult version of the current BS. Then they can make Dreads as T1 ships. I think Dreads should be about 750 mil and T2 BS should be about 500 mil. Dreads should use XL weapons.
I hope to god they are nothing like destroyers/battlecruisers in terms of how they were designed and the skills they require.
There should be a proper 'race' dreadnought skill layout.
________________________________________________________
|
Jim Steele
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 17:56:00 -
[17]
I think they need a high skill set in my opinion, racial BS 5 perhaps? and darn good engineering skills otherwise everyone will have one in a few weeks.
Death to the Galante |
Face Lifter
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 18:56:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Face Lifter on 22/03/2005 19:13:17
I don't think that dreads should cost over 1 billion
I don't think they should have insane skills
They should have a niche role, they should be designed in such a way that even tho many people could get one, many people will choose not to get one because it doesn't do what they want.
I don't want to see another uber ship that everyone tries to get.
|
mahhy
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 19:13:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Face Lifter
I don't want to see another uber ship that everyone tries to get.
Exactly what I don't want to see either, hence my first points. If dreads become just the next big thing after BS, then they become the next must have ship in any sort of sizeable engagement.
Then a year from now or two when Tech 3 is being introduced, something bigger has to come along. Boring. They need to be specialized...
|
Arimas Talasko
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 19:27:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Glarion Garnier
Edited by: Glarion Garnier on 22/03/2005 16:26:10
Originally by: Gierling
It would be great if Cruisers became the ship of choice for destroying dreadnoughts.
As far as titants, I've heard 1 trillion as a figure, not 1 billion.
LOL well for One trillion you should get LAB's Factory's Refinery, 20 high , med & low slot's , BS carrying capability. Cutomizable paint job. Sertificate of Gaming exelence posted to you via RL mail From CCP Office with some nice small gift. oh yeah POS hitpoints. Did I forgot something ?
Well, considering the NPC Empires aren't exactly packing fleets of Titans, I don't think a trillion or so for them is too crazy. After all, don't you want it to be cool to see one flying around? Plenty of people could afford a couple billion for a big ship. Not cool.
Anyway. In my opinion. Dreads should
1. Have scan resolution of .5 or something.
2. Be insurable for maybe 50% max on platinum, and cost 1.5-2 billion to manufacture.
3. Be able to lock maybe two or so targets at once, max. Hopefully something to make them woefully inefficient NPC hunters and agent mission runners.
Supremacy Keepin it Real |
Nanus Parkite
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 19:27:00 -
[21]
The difference between BS and dreads will be that only a fraction of the playerbase will be able to afford them. Skill-wise I would expect it to requier BS level 4 in the same way BS requires cruiser 4 and cruiser requires frigate 4. I seem to be the only person that read the eve chronicle about titans which actually tells us quite a lot. They are supposedly so amazingly expensive that only the empires have the resources to build and run a few at a time. One required an entire planet to be stripped off resources to build. Secondly they are big enough to affect the orbit of moons and even planets to the point that they are restricted to certain movements to avoid disrupting civilised systems. These things are not going to be your next thing up. These are going to be for the people that treat a POS like a weekend laugh and have a wallet large enough to stretch between regions.
|
Aegis Osiris
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 20:20:00 -
[22]
How about a much slower warp speed? Combined with a (likely) slow cruising speed, they'd be terrible for fast raids. Maybe 1/2 or 2/3 the warp speed of a BS.
|
Face Lifter
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 20:24:00 -
[23]
Dreads with extra-large guns would be mostly used for total gate pwnage
You'll see 1-2 dreads sitting at 150 km from gate. They will have a friend in BB range boosting them and tracking boosting
Doubt they would have much trouble tracking at that range with remote helper. And there would be no way to defend. With extra slow speed, they could easily keep going full speed in direction of their safe spot, while maintaining optimal range for the gate
|
Darkwolf
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 20:49:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Nanus Parkite
I seem to be the only person that read the eve chronicle about titans which actually tells us quite a lot.
You read about Titans, not Dreadnoughts. There is essentially no hard information about Dreadnoughts, except hearsay, and a few comments from Developers.
|
Fierce Deity
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 21:11:00 -
[25]
the dread is a t1 ship just above bs, so following by the already set examples why would you need lvl 5 bs to fly one?..
Do you need lvl 5 cruiser to fly a bs?, or lvl 5 frig to fly a cruiser for that matter? hell no so why, in gods name, would you possibly need lvl 5 bs?
Logic and half a brain dictates that follwing the example of current ship skill needs, you'll need bs 4 and spaceship 5 for dreadnaught skill, along with the jump drive skill as a secondary need to use it's propultion type.
Lvl 5 spaceship command skills are for t2 ships, and t2 ships alone.
------FD------
|
Lygos
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 21:20:00 -
[26]
Limited deployability.
Needs to carry warp charges in order to warp. Maybe it should have to crawl through systems by warping from planet to planet or to a more mobile gang member until it comes within 2 AU of a gate.
Or something. I want to see player build empires much much more than a I desire to see the means to easilly destroy them roaming around in packs (and then logging off for the night  ).
Every dreadnaught should have to need a home to continue to exist outside of empire. Frankly every ship should need this, but none moreso than dreadnaughts.
|
Myko
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 21:21:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Face Lifter
Dreads with extra-large guns would be mostly used for total gate pwnage
You'll see 1-2 dreads sitting at 150 km from gate. They will have a friend in BB range boosting them and tracking boosting
Doubt they would have much trouble tracking at that range with remote helper. And there would be no way to defend. With extra slow speed, they could easily keep going full speed in direction of their safe spot, while maintaining optimal range for the gate
give them jump drives, and dont let them enter space near a gate. TBH the aim should surely be to move combat away from gates to POS (less stress on server etc.).
12 or so high slots, enough grid to fit 9 extra large guns/launchers or 12 large weapons easily. Limited drone bay (i'd go as far as to say no drone bay on any ship but the gallente ones). Same resists as tech1 ships. Limited med and low slots (these ships shouldnt be just bigger battleships).
|
anBurka
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 21:42:00 -
[28]
Why does everyone think they should have in escess of the current maximum of eight slots?
Why not give them less slots than a battleship. Make them less flexible, but the dreanought-sized modules are extra big and extra powerful.
|
Nero Scuro
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 22:04:00 -
[29]
According to a dev blob, Dreads will be anti-POS AND anti-BS. I don't see how this will work. POS can fry a BS in seconds. Which means a Dread will have to tank a POS, at least for a limited time. But if they can tank a POS, a fleet of BS hasn't got a chance of breaking it's tank. Which means it'll pwnzor BS so badly it isn't even funny.
I'm hoping that they'll be very very uber, but very very expensive. Like, they pwn EVERYTHING (no, literally everything) but cost like a trillion with NO insurance. Then they would truly give everyone in the game something to aim for (and fail at getting =P).
----------------
Haha, stupid monkey! Now I'VE got the Oscar! Enjoy your worthless gun! |
Meridius
|
Posted - 2005.03.22 22:13:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Nero Scuro
According to a dev blob, Dreads will be anti-POS AND anti-BS. I don't see how this will work. POS can fry a BS in seconds. Which means a Dread will have to tank a POS, at least for a limited time. But if they can tank a POS, a fleet of BS hasn't got a chance of breaking it's tank. Which means it'll pwnzor BS so badly it isn't even funny.
I'm hoping that they'll be very very uber, but very very expensive. Like, they pwn EVERYTHING (no, literally everything) but cost like a trillion with NO insurance. Then they would truly give everyone in the game something to aim for (and fail at getting =P).
A trillion for a Dreadnought? Sorry, not everyone can run lvl 4 missions 24/7/365 or mine
________________________________________________________
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |