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Zyella Stormborn
Alpha Strategy In Umbra Mortis
172
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:31:00 -
[31] - Quote
Arazel Chainfire wrote:
Its not just the bonus's from the ships, though admittedly the moros's are pretty nice. It is also that capital blasters have the highest tracking, which means that it is easier to hit for more damage. Add to that that it is doing more damage in the first place, and you start to see why the moros is preferred.
-Arazel
Ah. I see. Thx for the clarification |
Denuo Secus
64
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Posted - 2012.11.01 17:31:00 -
[32] - Quote
I'm no dread pilot yet...so this is all theory. Maybe I can learn from someone with experience
I understand that turret dreads are top notch as soon as more than one are on the field - positioned correctly. Tracking isn't an issue then. It's not possible to get under the guns of all of them.
But considering small gang...and just assuming it's wise to field a dread in small gang at all...if you only have one dread + some support I could imagine the Phoenix isn't that bad!
If a single turret dread is on the field only, all the opponent has to do is to get under it's guns. Which means what for a dread? 20km? Maybe 15km? Even a Moros shouldn't do any damage then. I cannot imagine that webbing or painting would change this. A dread cannot 'pull range' to reduce transversal.
A missile dread however, does damage in every case. Not much damage against sub caps ofc. But this damage can be increased with support. After all it should be possible to do BS-like damage against subcaps. Considering the strong local tank of a Phoenix (shield = full gank&tank), I get a super tanked BS against other BSs...with an option to do much more damage against stationary and/or big targets like triaged carriers, other sieged dreads and so on.
Wrong? If so, explain plz |
illirdor
The Grey Eagle Society
28
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Posted - 2012.11.01 20:06:00 -
[33] - Quote
Goldensaver wrote:illirdor wrote:Goldensaver wrote:(except the Chimera, that's... a different story entirely.) yea but thats because the chimera is a carrier My god, I really did say Chimera. What a fail on my part. Thanks for pointing that out. *Headdesk*
hehe happens to the best
Come to Amamake... The universal answer to everything... |
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
215
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Posted - 2012.11.01 21:18:00 -
[34] - Quote
Denuo Secus wrote:I'm no dread pilot yet...so this is all theory. Maybe I can learn from someone with experience I understand that turret dreads are top notch as soon as more than one are on the field - positioned correctly. Tracking isn't an issue then. It's not possible to get under the guns of all of them. But considering small gang...and just assuming it's wise to field a dread in small gang at all...if you only have one dread + some support I could imagine the Phoenix isn't that bad! If a single turret dread is on the field only, all the opponent has to do is to get under it's guns. Which means what for a dread? 20km? Maybe 15km? Even a Moros shouldn't do any damage then. I cannot imagine that webbing or painting would change this. A dread cannot 'pull range' to reduce transversal. A missile dread however, does damage in every case. Not much damage against sub caps ofc. But this damage can be increased with support. After all it should be possible to do BS-like damage against subcaps. Considering the strong local tank of a Phoenix (shield = full gank&tank), I get a super tanked BS against other BSs...with an option to do much more damage against stationary and/or big targets like triaged carriers, other sieged dreads and so on. Wrong? If so, explain plz
There's obviously the point about delayed damage, missiles that can be outrun and whatnot, but the main issue with the concept of a "tracking phoenix" is that damage is reduced based on signature radius and velocity of the target, whereas turret dreads only suffer from poor hit quality due to having their tracking beat. It's a lot easier to compensate for poor tracking by using painters and webs than to compensate for terrible explosion velocity (12m/s) and gigantic explosion radius (2000m2) due to stacking penalties.
An example of this can be seen in tracking titans: if they hit you poorly and they volley damage was reduced by 80%, you were still getting hit for 13k every few seconds. Now that their turret damage was made to also depend on the difference between their signature resolution and the target's signature radius, they behave a little more like the Phoenix's missiles would - and tracking titans are a rare sight since that change. CAUTION
SNIGGS |
SmilingVagrant
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
768
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Posted - 2012.11.02 03:12:00 -
[35] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote: Against sub-caps, they are LOL-useless. You can't track them, and even if they sit still you won't hit them.
This is some very nice outdated information you have here. You should google "Blap dreads" |
illirdor
The Grey Eagle Society
28
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Posted - 2012.11.02 09:03:00 -
[36] - Quote
De'Veldrin wrote:Dreads are designed to do two things:
Bash stationary structures Kill other capital ships
That said, they're really almost useless alone. Even in a high DPS dread, you're going to spend a while shooting at the tower to reinforce it, and even longer to kill it, and that's after you take out the guns, of course.
Against sub-caps, they are LOL-useless. You can't track them, and even if they sit still you won't hit them.
i keep seeing this and thinking how akward it must be for you to run around in the 70s... ohhh this new internet isnt gonna last more than 6 month i tell you....
Come to Amamake... The universal answer to everything... |
Gypsio III
Chemikals Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
410
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Posted - 2012.11.02 13:34:00 -
[37] - Quote
Denuo Secus wrote:A missile dread however, does damage in every case. Not much damage against sub caps ofc. But this damage can be increased with support. After all it should be possible to do BS-like damage against subcaps. Considering the strong local tank of a Phoenix (shield = full gank&tank), I get a super tanked BS against other BSs...with an option to do much more damage against stationary and/or big targets like triaged carriers, other sieged dreads and so on. Wrong? If so, explain plz
It's a LOT harder to apply capital missile damage to subcaps, relative to turret damage. Assuming citadel torps, then you basically need a 90% web to get your target down to the 12 m/s missile explosion velocity. Then you also need the target's signature to be inflated up to the 1600 m torp explosion radius with standard Crash running. For a typical 400 m sig radius BS, that requires a 4x sig inflator, which can be done, but requires something like 4x RF painters on a Rapier assisted by an unbonused, unmindlinked Electronic Superiority II gang link (multiplier of 4.2). With a dedicated mindlinked Proteus, a multiplier of 5 is achievable.
Just about the only real positive is that if you do manage to pull this off, you'll deliver volley damage that even the Moros will be impressed by - 140k of it. Oh, the sheer surprise of it may be vaguely useful too. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
5009
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Posted - 2012.11.02 13:37:00 -
[38] - Quote
The Renner wrote:confirming blap dreads are not a thing.
The Op said nothing about friends... MatrixSkye Mk2: "Remember: You consent to unconsensual PVP the moment you press the "Undock" button." |
FT Diomedes
The Graduates RAZOR Alliance
115
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Posted - 2012.11.02 14:07:00 -
[39] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:The Renner wrote:confirming blap dreads are not a thing. The Op said nothing about friends...
If the OP doesn't have friends, he shouldn't be in a dread. Unless, of course, he likes dying. |
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