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ma perke
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. |

Aducat Ragnarson
Cult of the Black Goat Dark Taboo
42
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:43:00 -
[2] - Quote
ma perke wrote: I am an angry person! I have no idea how wormholes work but I read somewhere that you can control the access to your homesystem. Also Goonswarm is the first that comes to mind when thinking about dangerous. Also I read that you can make more than 1bil isk per hour. NERF NAO!
... is what I would have posted, had i thought that this was not in fact a poor attempt to troll.
3/10 |

smokeAjoint
No Self Esteem Malefic Aspects
21
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:48:00 -
[3] - Quote
all i hear is this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xRrUVVKigk
-álegalize it |

Rroff
The Xenodus Initiative. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
78
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
ma perke wrote: - The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
Poor k-space if that ever happened... |

ma perke
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Aducat Ragnarson wrote:ma perke wrote: I am an angry person! I have no idea how wormholes work but I read somewhere that you can control the access to your homesystem. Also Goonswarm is the first that comes to mind when thinking about dangerous. Also I read that you can make more than 1bil isk per hour. NERF NAO!
... is what I would have posted, had i thought that this was not in fact a poor attempt to troll. 3/10
back on the topic:
do you do upgrades in WH? - NO can you close WH if you dont like it - NO do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
in WH you have less risk and win more ISK compared to 0.0, which should be nerfed!
P.S. CCP moderator please delete Aducat Ragnarson post as off topic and not constructive, but just emotional.
|

Omen Nihilo
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
37
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
Really? You're reposting that ignorant comment from themittani.com... 
TBH you sound like your knowledge of w-space is mostly hearsay... you obviously don't understand w-space.
Just a few things: 1) A sleeper BS only gets you around 20 million ISK. 2) If you're static leads to goon space you can't cycle it for a C5GÇöyou'll just get another nullsec. 3) Site-running takes a very large ISK investment. You can take precautions, but if you're running an escalation and a pvp entity opens into you you're pretty much forced to fight. And when something does go wrong, this sort of thing happens: http://www.eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=14859557 http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=15506705 http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_related&kll_id=13731319 http://kb.vergeofcollapse.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=4298
So while the risk might be lower in quantity (ganks happen less often), it is certainly higher in quality (when you do lose you lose big).
I'm not saying w-space ISK making is perfect, but you have to understand the subject before suggesting changes. |

Rroff
The Xenodus Initiative. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
78
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:57:00 -
[7] - Quote
I respectfully suggest you spend a few months living in a C5 then revisit this thread OP.
Check any large WH alliance killboard and you will see its quite possible to challenge someone living in a wormhole from both sides. |

Omen Nihilo
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
37
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 22:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
ma perke wrote: do you do upgrades in WH? - NO can you close WH if you dont like it - NO do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
Is there a facepalm emoticon I can use? |

Cheesy Feet
Reconfiguration Nation Transmission Lost
9
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 23:01:00 -
[9] - Quote
Oh noes! all my wormholes are going to be nerfed now and I made billions per hour in perfect safty too!! Oh noes.. Oh noes....
 |

Robert Harrison
Aperture Harmonics K162
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 23:06:00 -
[10] - Quote
Follow Rroff's very sound advice then come come back here. |

Godfrey Silvarna
Frozen Dawn Academy Arctic Light
57
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 23:07:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nullbears with their perfect Local chat safety intel trolling again. Nothing to see here. |

Alec Freeman
The Dark Space Initiative
152
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 23:31:00 -
[12] - Quote
ma perke wrote: back on the topic:
do you do upgrades in WH? - NO can you close WH if you dont like it - NO do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
in WH you have less risk and win more ISK compared to 0.0, which should be nerfed!
P.S. CCP moderator please delete Aducat Ragnarson post as off topic and not constructive, but just emotional.
Fixxed your list for you with reasoning:-
do you do upgrades in WH? - NO - Wernt you complaining we make so much isk? can you close WH if you dont like it - YES / KINDA - If there is nobody dangorous on the other side it is very easily rolled however it is also easy to catch and kill people rolling if you know what your doing. do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO - Why would we want to? can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - YES - Many farm corps get evicted from holes every week. |

Kurt Saken
State War Academy Caldari State
22
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 23:40:00 -
[13] - Quote
Go kiss the feet of your null master, slave. |

Cap James Tkirk
Magellan Corporation Jokers Wild.
50
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 00:20:00 -
[14] - Quote
isnt this one of thoes things where the post should be deleted and op gassed????? |

Hathrul
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD Exhale.
145
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 00:32:00 -
[15] - Quote
ill try to be serious here
do you do upgrades in WH? uhm. no...why would we do it?
can you close WH if you dont like it - Yes we can. unless someone comes into us. then we usually cant untill we kick them out
do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO, and ofcourse not. the wormhole itself is worthless. there are so many wormholes. why fight a war over it
can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - you said no? ever been into wh space?
Quote: in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
in WH you have less risk and win more ISK compared to 0.0, which should be nerfed!
in wh there is more risk then 0sec. we dont have local, and the incomming fleet doesnt show up untill it points you, nor can we see an enemy fleet comming 20 jumps out. you have no idea how wh space works, or what the risks are. youre posting under some assumptions that are all wrong or looked at from a perspective of someone who has only heard of wh space
and connecting to goons in wh space i undesirable? give me a break :p they suck at wormhole space
|

MisterAl tt1
Pretenders Inc W-Space
16
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 00:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
TS, what WH system do you live in? J number pls, show it to the public :) |

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
97
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 01:21:00 -
[17] - Quote
I still havent seen the new Batman movie!!!, Can you believe that? |

Cage Man
Evil Guinea Pigs
41
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 01:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
So stop whining and get in on the action...
|

bubble trout
Sky Fighters Talocan United
22
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 01:44:00 -
[19] - Quote
ma perke wrote: - The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
- WH should be more accessible.
These two are the best.
Every time we get some 0.0 people to make a fleet they never get a proper scout into the hole, nor do they ever jump fleets into it. It's like they are allergic to wormhole space. They can't for some reason gather intel without local, or understand how they work.
The number of connections to k space I find living in a wormhole is staggering. There are plenty of ways to get into wormholes as it is, increasing the number would be hilarious. |

CeNSeR
Jazz Associates Azgoths of Kria
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 01:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
Kalel Nimrott wrote:I still havent seen the new Batman movie!!!, Can you believe that?
Nope i cant tbh as its the best of the trilogy.
Oh and guys don't feed the troll ....oh wait.
|

Matuk Grymwal
Bite Me inc Bitten.
12
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 02:09:00 -
[21] - Quote
bubble trout wrote:ma perke wrote: - The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
- WH should be more accessible.
These two are the best. Every time we get some 0.0 people to make a fleet they never get a proper scout into the hole, nor do they ever jump fleets into it. It's like they are allergic to wormhole space. They can't for some reason gather intel without local, or understand how they work. The number of connections to k space I find living in a wormhole is staggering. There are plenty of ways to get into wormholes as it is, increasing the number would be hilarious. Yeah, most chains will have a number of null connections. Despite this I've seen nullseccers bring the fight to my WH corp once that I can recall (last weekend actually - and I've been in WH for 2 yrs). The lack of local and not being entirely familiar with the mass/time mechanics puts most of em off.
Props to FA btw, they leeroy'ed into our hole sending the BS in first and trapping half their fleet back in null when it collapsed, and then died in an entertaining and good natured manner. |

Senn Denroth
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
34
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 03:21:00 -
[22] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
Cry me a river carebear. Your NPC AI has just been brought in line with what we've been dealing with for years. Not to mention NPC timers have just been brought in to stop log offs and the likes. Go troll somewhere else please.
PS. Nobody listens to alts here. If you knew anything about WH space you would know this. |

Sorany
Hard Knocks Inc.
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 03:33:00 -
[23] - Quote
while we are at it can we also remove mass limits so that all of the super caps can jump in here and just steam roll all these pesky WH corps?! I mean why not right?!
also, I see what you did here.....
WHAT!?
MITTANI
you literally just seemed to think that if your idea wasn't well received on themittani.com, that the WORMHOLE forums would be a place to lodge your complaint, because that makes sense. |

Michael1995
Lead Farmers Kill It With Fire
43
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 04:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
Preparing for the 25 page threadnought where w-space people throw hard facts out while nullbears bleat randomly into the wind. One does not simply buy their way into Goonswarm. |

Sorany
Hard Knocks Inc.
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 04:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Matuk Grymwal wrote:[quote=bubble trout][quote=ma perke]Despite this I've seen nullseccers bring the fight to my WH corp once that I can recall (last weekend actually - and I've been in WH for 2 yrs).
not to mention when it does happen, suddenly nyxs...
then start the cries of how WHers never want to fight, and how we just retreat back into our hole and run away from all the leet nullbears pvpers.
but hey, it's really just our own fault for being so terrible and not building supercaps of our own.
we are bad, and we should feel bad. |

Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture
91
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 05:15:00 -
[26] - Quote
Quote:back on the topic:
do you do upgrades in WH? - NO can you close WH if you dont like it - NO do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
that's right. Because you don't live in a WH. you live in a WSpace.
but in regards to your questions:
1) Yes. They're called adding extra POSes/defenses. But you meant like the more rats (Escalations), Industry (Rorqual/Orcas), and the other one that I can't recall off the top of my head. 2) Yes. people crash WHs all the time 3) Yes, you do. It's the right to have your POS/ships/assets/etc in the system 4) Yes, if they find a Wormhole leading to yours, or if you open up yours and leave it open. or get a scanner alt in and scan down entrances to the Wspace. |

unimatrix0030
Viperfleet Inc. Transmission Lost
8
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 06:52:00 -
[27] - Quote
You clearly don't know what the risks are in w-space! After you run sites you need to transport the stuff you found to hs. If it gets ganked allong the way you have nothing... . Maybe we should change NPC-bountys in 0.0 to tags wich have to be cashed in in HS, lets see if that is not a risk. Everything you salvage, loot ,mine or produced needs to be transported again to somewhere else. Increasing the chance of getting ganked. And keeping in mind that large volumes can't be transported because the hole will collaps. It not like in 0.0 where you just jump a jempfreighter back and forth. After 3 capitals the largest holes will collaps, in lower class w-space you can't even get a freigther through most holes... . Closing holes is easy?,No one can come and challenge you? Have you at all been reading the latest battlereports in w-space? Check these out : http://themittani.com/news/autumns-attila-rnk-takes-transmission-lost http://themittani.com/media/c5-capital-carnage http://themittani.com/news/wormhole-massacre
Avoiding fights when carebearing was possible before retribution now, you can't. (logofski, everyone did it)
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. Why ? not that any nullbear would come in after that... . - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. It is a way to get to the game content, some holes are empty, how would you like to close down your 0.0 constellation so no one can get in or out, and only you are in there, ... - WH should be more accessible. They are just read the manual in this forum section , HTFU or GTFO. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. Lol, having a hard time killing a pos without a supercap? Then you are doing it wrong... . This is actualy a discussion point for a general pos revamp try there... . |

krinan Orlenard
TRUSTproof
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 08:02:00 -
[28] - Quote
So you think that there is no risk in w-space? then change that! but not by posting stuff on the forum! grab some friends, some some ships and add some risk to w-space! the sandbox gives you the lemons, make something with them! |

Himnos Altar
An Errant Venture Beyond The Dark
91
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 09:45:00 -
[29] - Quote
unimatrix0030 wrote: Maybe we should change NPC-bountys in 0.0 to tags wich have to be cashed in in HS
that actually sounds amazing, but would drive SO many people out of null sec. Too many, probably.
|

Paikis
Vapour Holdings
345
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 10:09:00 -
[30] - Quote
ma perke wrote:- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
Oh please, oh please, oh please. CCP, do it. Do it NAO!
As for the rest of your troll thread... LOLOL |

Sith1s Spectre
Sky Fighters Talocan United
47
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 10:27:00 -
[31] - Quote
It's threads like this that make me laugh.
ERRMAGHERD there's a neut in local in a buzzard, better safe up in a pos and log off May you be one with Bob |

Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
989
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 10:36:00 -
[32] - Quote
Alt posts never deserve any considerations. Especially ones copy and pasted off the mittani site where all of its points were already rebuked by people who have actually been in Whs before. |

Endo Scrote
the united Negative Ten.
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 11:09:00 -
[33] - Quote
Utter tool who knows nothing |

Irya Boone
Escadron leader
92
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 11:38:00 -
[34] - Quote
you all know the rule .. don't F.. feed the troll !!! Improve C2 class WH More anos more signs ...RENAME null sec system With the name Of REAL Universe Stellar Name like KOI-730 etc etc It xill be awesome-á |

unimatrix0030
Viperfleet Inc. Transmission Lost
8
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 11:51:00 -
[35] - Quote
Himnos Altar wrote:unimatrix0030 wrote: Maybe we should change NPC-bountys in 0.0 to tags wich have to be cashed in in HS that actually sounds amazing, but would drive SO many people out of null sec. Too many, probably. This makes me remember the i forgot to mention that there isn't any local, for all you know one solo dude might have 20 loged off corpmates... . I seem to remember that a few years ago some dudes found an bug/exploit to get into a system without being in local(something with cyno and disconnect). CCP couldn't patch that fast enough for those k-spacers... . |

Xtrah
NorCorp Enterprise No Holes Barred
6
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 12:06:00 -
[36] - Quote
Nerf WH! |

chris elliot
EG CORP Talocan United
60
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 12:16:00 -
[37] - Quote
*sniff sniff*
Is that a shtposting mittani.fail alt I smell? Why looky here! It is a shtposting mittani.fail alt!
Would you like some cheese to with your whine before the lock shtposting mittani.fail alt?
EDIT: I do love how whenever someone comes in here spewing stupidity like the OP's from their brown eye that we all immediately degenerate the thread into a pile of trolls and lolz such that it gets locked quite quickly.
Keep up the good work guys! |

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
97
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 12:54:00 -
[38] - Quote
I insist that NRA should be ban. |

Daniel Plain
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
513
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 16:12:00 -
[39] - Quote
this thread wins all the internets.
"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF |

Gnaw LF
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
265
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 16:52:00 -
[40] - Quote
I am sure that this post is either a poor troll or a very new player trying to figure out why w-space is different. However I will answer it in a serious manner.
As far as risk in w-space is concerned, it is by FAR the most risky venture in the game. Unlike null sec and some low sec, w-space alliances and corporations do not get their ISK from moons. Our members band together and earn ISK through Sleeper sites, ISK that goes to pay for Corp Towers, PvP ships and other expenses associated with maintaining alliances. Second, unlike lvl 4 missions, incursions and null sec anoms the w-space sleeper sites require the MOST skill point and ISK investment. If you do not have a Carrier (4.5bil fit + 1bil pod), 4 Dreads (5bil fit each), 3 Lokis (1.5bil each) on the field, you are not doing the sites right. That sum does not include the booster toon (1bil ship) and the second carrier (4.5bil + 1bil pod). So in the end you in order to do a sleeper site in an efficient manner you need to have at least 8 pilots of field with over 30bil worth of assets and probably around 800 million skill points combined.
Yes, you can do sleeper sites in other manner, but it will take hours will require quite a bit of ISK investment too and it wont be nowhere as efficient as the method above. Now lets talk about living in w-space, most importantly assets. Wspace unlike any other aspect of the game, carries with it the highest penalty on asset loss should you be locked out or evicted from your wormhole. Unlike high and low sec, where your assets are available at will. Null sec is a bit different, your enemies can and will revoke your docking rights, but with the current null sec coalitions renting out space to all sorts of renter corps and keeping pet alliances as buffer against roaming gangs, its very easy to create an alt and apply to one of those to get standings. Than you either evac your assets or sell them, in any case you have an option for loss mitigation. Not so with w-space, you lose everything you can't log off or scan out of the system.
If you think that wspace is populated by hotshot elitist pilots, then you bought into our trolling and propaganda way better than we though possible. In reality wspace is populated by players who are willing to put in extra time into learning additional mechanics. This knowledge comes at a cost, always, sometimes the cost is extra ships, sometimes its nerves and quite often its sleep. Wspace pilots aren't good because of some wspace magic, because we have it easy or because wspace is full of 24/7 non-stop shannigans, no the pilots are good because they invest time and effort into the game and if they pay even a little bit of attention they get rewarded for their time and effort. |

El Liptonez
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
22
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 16:53:00 -
[41] - Quote
OP is 100% right.
More k-space exits so we can gank more idiots like him (especially when they try to enter w-space). |

Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
81
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 16:57:00 -
[42] - Quote
Michael1995 wrote: nullbears bleat randomly into the wind.
Already got my favorite quote from the thread tbh.....
Ask me about Rengas-dar, HRDKX's Most recent, groundbreaking, game-changing, wormhole-collapsing research endeavour. |

Nicola Arman
Saiph Industries Talocan United
4
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 17:34:00 -
[43] - Quote
This thread succeeded in being perfect lunchtime entertainment. OP you a funny guy. |

Rhavas
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
97
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 17:44:00 -
[44] - Quote
Paikis wrote:ma perke wrote:- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. Oh please, oh please, oh please. CCP, do it. Do it NAO! As for the rest of your troll thread... LOLOL
QFT
|

Shazeen Zerubu
Master Bait and Tackle
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 18:24:00 -
[45] - Quote
OP you need to do one of two things.
1: Move to WH space and live there for awhile.
2: Read up on how WH space works and understand it.
I agree you can make alot of isk in WH space but you can also loose it all in an instant. You also have the issue of the logistics of the loot/gas that you hope to make isk off. No money is made until you get an safe exit to a hub. Alot of loot is lost in this manner.
You dont seem to grasp any of this..
2cents |

Svodola Darkfury
Heaven's End League of Infamy
102
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 19:05:00 -
[46] - Quote
3 pages on nobody cares but...
If you look at the PVP boards of the larger WH entities you'll see that, in fact, no, wormholes are not safe to run sites in always.
There is a great deal you can do to prevent yourself from being tackled in a site, but C5s and C6s especially are not in the favor of the defender.
Svo. |

Cage Man
Evil Guinea Pigs
42
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 19:08:00 -
[47] - Quote
Rhavas wrote:Paikis wrote:ma perke wrote:- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. Oh please, oh please, oh please. CCP, do it. Do it NAO! As for the rest of your troll thread... LOLOL QFT
Don't think he was trolling.. this will be a great improvement.... imagine not having to scan for hours every day to get from the wh to HS.. some kind high bear will open a nice easy path to Jita so wh people can more easily sell their risk free loot...
|

Archdaimon
NorCorp Enterprise No Holes Barred
141
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 20:32:00 -
[48] - Quote
I like the fact the OP believes we'd want less PVP. LOLZ. Wormholes has the best accoustics. It's known. - Sing it for me - |

Yabbiy
Freelance Wealth Redistribution Specialists Insurance Fraud.
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 20:40:00 -
[49] - Quote
-1
For being ignorant and not even suggesting a solution for your complaint / stupidity. Yes its a great idea , lets nerf the most dangerous and rightly profitable space in eve.
Yes we get to close wormholes but guess what! Other people can open them into our systems without us knowing it, Imagine that! But your right it, only, requires "capital" capabilities "roughly 2billion isk and 2-3months of training" and lvl 4 or 5 scanning skills and only an organized 20 people with at least 20+ million skill points a piece locked together in a confined space with complete access to each others assets.
If you had any idea what you are talking about you would have done it yourself already and you would not be complaining.  |

corbexx
Aperture Harmonics K162
29
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 21:21:00 -
[50] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
Or we could make null sec better. maybe just maybe we coudl take some of teh wh ideals and put them in nullsec.
sites would be worth more in nullsec the down side being you'd need properly fit carrier dreads and a small gang of people not just 1 ratting carrier, the bs in these new sites woudl also nuet loads point and do way more dps than what your used to at the moment, but they would be worth more isk.
we could get rid of officer spawns you'd have new sites called "officers hide aways" these woudl be like yoru new improved combat sites but would do even more damage you'd still need 8 or more people to do them either with multiple logi or triage carriers. once you have killed all the officers guards you could loot his hide away (needing a high skill in archeology) this still woudlnt give officer mods just plans to use these you'd probably need a dedicated 30 million science character to invent something out of it, You'd also need to find some random gas and crap and harvest this as well react said gas to polymers make some parts from teh salvage and then combine it all with yoru invented copy and walla you have yoru officer mod.
bounties woudl be gone i'm affraid but dont worry the sites woudl be worth more isk you'd just have to take your tags to concord in hisec (hope you guys dont have any wardecs) and turn them in for yoru lovely improved isk
we'd remove local this woudl be to make it safer for you while your in sites so others coming in dont know exactly how many there are of you
stations woudl get just 1 reinforce timer but you could alter this with stront up to a max of 41 hours. as people in null are not wanting to grind stations we'd improve this sov war mechanics and just say hey if your station is killed after the reinforce timer all your **** is gone everything. this would not only speed up sov wars but make future ones even quicker (assuming you havent rebuild the out posts.
we'd keep yoru gates but these wouldnt show up on overview and you woudl have to scan them down every day (they woudl change location after every down time) while on the gates talk they woudl only allow so much mass through them and if this is exceeded the gate woudl move to a new location and you would have to scan it again i'd say 3billion mas so about 30 bs's 1 way.
now you might say thats ok we have titan bridges but unfortunatly the distance between all systems woudl be 999 gazillion light years (a bit to far for titans) so they wouldnt be of much use same for super caps but they could be used to defend the single system they are built in i guess. to balance this change we'd allow you to move dreads and normal carriers through your gates, they would however count towards mass used (so max 3 per gate then you need to go scanning)
on top of this systems in null woudl get a different effects so you woudl have to tailor yoru fleet towards what every system your going in, since your gates are fixed to what system they go to we'd make this effect random and woudl change daily after down time so you would have to scout ahead of time to check what effect it was before sending a fleet in, and heaven forbid your armour fleet got jumped in a pulsar system on the way to your destination
ooh the gas and stuff that woudl be added to null sec to make officer mods woudl need to be scanned down and to compensate for this we'd remove all ice belts from null sec you would only be able to get ice in hisec and low sec, again hope you dont have war decs
i hope these new and improved changes would help make null a better place so you wouldnt have to worry about wh's being just so great, |

Wolvun
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
92
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 21:56:00 -
[51] - Quote
corbexx wrote:ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. Or we could make null sec better. maybe just maybe we coudl take some of teh wh ideals and put them in nullsec. sites would be worth more in nullsec the down side being you'd need properly fit carrier dreads and a small gang of people not just 1 ratting carrier, the bs in these new sites woudl also nuet loads point and do way more dps than what your used to at the moment, but they would be worth more isk. we could get rid of officer spawns you'd have new sites called "officers hide aways" these woudl be like yoru new improved combat sites but would do even more damage you'd still need 8 or more people to do them either with multiple logi or triage carriers. once you have killed all the officers guards you could loot his hide away (needing a high skill in archeology) this still woudlnt give officer mods just plans to use these you'd probably need a dedicated 30 million science character to invent something out of it, You'd also need to find some random gas and crap and harvest this as well react said gas to polymers make some parts from teh salvage and then combine it all with yoru invented copy and walla you have yoru officer mod. bounties woudl be gone i'm affraid but dont worry the sites woudl be worth more isk you'd just have to take your tags to concord in hisec (hope you guys dont have any wardecs) and turn them in for yoru lovely improved isk we'd remove local this woudl be to make it safer for you while your in sites so others coming in dont know exactly how many there are of you stations woudl get just 1 reinforce timer but you could alter this with stront up to a max of 41 hours. as people in null are not wanting to grind stations we'd improve this sov war mechanics and just say hey if your station is killed after the reinforce timer all your **** is gone everything. this would not only speed up sov wars but make future ones even quicker (assuming you havent rebuild the out posts. we'd keep yoru gates but these wouldnt show up on overview and you woudl have to scan them down every day (they woudl change location after every down time) while on the gates talk they woudl only allow so much mass through them and if this is exceeded the gate woudl move to a new location and you would have to scan it again i'd say 3billion mas so about 30 bs's 1 way. now you might say thats ok we have titan bridges but unfortunatly the distance between all systems woudl be 999 gazillion light years (a bit to far for titans) so they wouldnt be of much use same for super caps but they could be used to defend the single system they are built in i guess. to balance this change we'd allow you to move dreads and normal carriers through your gates, they would however count towards mass used (so max 3 per gate then you need to go scanning) on top of this systems in null woudl get a different effects so you woudl have to tailor yoru fleet towards what every system your going in, since your gates are fixed to what system they go to we'd make this effect random and woudl change daily after down time so you would have to scout ahead of time to check what effect it was before sending a fleet in, and heaven forbid your armour fleet got jumped in a pulsar system on the way to your destination ooh the gas and stuff that woudl be added to null sec to make officer mods woudl need to be scanned down and to compensate for this we'd remove all ice belts from null sec you would only be able to get ice in hisec and low sec, again hope you dont have war decs i hope these new and improved changes would help make null a better place so you wouldnt have to worry about wh's being just so great,
This should be reposted every time we get a null troll in here. |

Sorany
Hard Knocks Inc.
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 23:15:00 -
[52] - Quote
corbexx wrote:ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. Or we could make null sec better. maybe just maybe we coudl take some of teh wh ideals and put them in nullsec. sites would be worth more in nullsec the down side being you'd need properly fit carrier dreads and a small gang of people not just 1 ratting carrier, the bs in these new sites woudl also nuet loads point and do way more dps than what your used to at the moment, but they would be worth more isk. we could get rid of officer spawns you'd have new sites called "officers hide aways" these woudl be like yoru new improved combat sites but would do even more damage you'd still need 8 or more people to do them either with multiple logi or triage carriers. once you have killed all the officers guards you could loot his hide away (needing a high skill in archeology) this still woudlnt give officer mods just plans to use these you'd probably need a dedicated 30 million science character to invent something out of it, You'd also need to find some random gas and crap and harvest this as well react said gas to polymers make some parts from teh salvage and then combine it all with yoru invented copy and walla you have yoru officer mod. bounties woudl be gone i'm affraid but dont worry the sites woudl be worth more isk you'd just have to take your tags to concord in hisec (hope you guys dont have any wardecs) and turn them in for yoru lovely improved isk we'd remove local this woudl be to make it safer for you while your in sites so others coming in dont know exactly how many there are of you stations woudl get just 1 reinforce timer but you could alter this with stront up to a max of 41 hours. as people in null are not wanting to grind stations we'd improve this sov war mechanics and just say hey if your station is killed after the reinforce timer all your **** is gone everything. this would not only speed up sov wars but make future ones even quicker (assuming you havent rebuild the out posts. we'd keep yoru gates but these wouldnt show up on overview and you woudl have to scan them down every day (they woudl change location after every down time) while on the gates talk they woudl only allow so much mass through them and if this is exceeded the gate woudl move to a new location and you would have to scan it again i'd say 3billion mas so about 30 bs's 1 way. now you might say thats ok we have titan bridges but unfortunatly the distance between all systems woudl be 999 gazillion light years (a bit to far for titans) so they wouldnt be of much use same for super caps but they could be used to defend the single system they are built in i guess. to balance this change we'd allow you to move dreads and normal carriers through your gates, they would however count towards mass used (so max 3 per gate then you need to go scanning) on top of this systems in null woudl get a different effects so you woudl have to tailor yoru fleet towards what every system your going in, since your gates are fixed to what system they go to we'd make this effect random and woudl change daily after down time so you would have to scout ahead of time to check what effect it was before sending a fleet in, and heaven forbid your armour fleet got jumped in a pulsar system on the way to your destination ooh the gas and stuff that woudl be added to null sec to make officer mods woudl need to be scanned down and to compensate for this we'd remove all ice belts from null sec you would only be able to get ice in hisec and low sec, again hope you dont have war decs i hope these new and improved changes would help make null a better place so you wouldnt have to worry about wh's being just so great, qfe |

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
99
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 23:27:00 -
[53] - Quote
This guy use the same argument that a guy from hi sec incursions tried to use almost half ayear ago. Alt? |

Joran Jackson
The Red Circle Inc.
37
|
Posted - 2012.12.18 23:53:00 -
[54] - Quote
The only thing I've learned from this thread is that Gnaw is too good a person to be in Aquila |

Oxandrolone
Bite Me inc Bitten.
72
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 01:53:00 -
[55] - Quote
1/10 would not bang |

Matuk Grymwal
Bite Me inc Bitten.
13
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 03:46:00 -
[56] - Quote
Joran Jackson wrote:The only thing I've learned from this thread is that Gnaw is too good a person to be in Aquila The one thing I've taken away is Corb is a terrible speller and has a hard time spelling "would" properly. |

Rastin Crysknife
The Nommo Insurance Fraud.
10
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 05:00:00 -
[57] - Quote
Oxandrolone wrote:1/10 would not bang I'm gonna go with this. |

ma perke
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
7
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 09:34:00 -
[58] - Quote
lol so many elite WH-bears tears what can i say...
it reminds me about IT/WN/-A- etc. elite pvp-ers we noobs kicked out from every region we fight in, who instead of fixing their stuff and putting up a good fight like NC. did preffer to run. You are so good and skilled fighting Sleepers ?!? lol are they the CCP version of Deep Blue chess computer??
I think of level 4 missions - when they reached 100Misk/h in hi sec they were nerfed to nothing. I think of nul sec anomalies - when everybody started upgrading their system they were nerfed. I think of incursions - when so many elite hi sec bears started doing them they were nerfed.
Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... it is about time now.
Me being a noob cant remember any case when WH-bears have come to nul sec and we haven't kicked them in the nuts. Thanks for the loot btw, keep coming in faction fitted t3 cruisers, I love it. Unfortunately I can't return you the visit since the game mechanics dosen't allow it. Every single inhabited WH i find in null gets closed imediately by its elite sleeper-bears when they see Deklein on the other side.
btw I live in VFK and rat in sanctums - come say hallo. Where is your rat hole - Jxxxx??? |

Craggus
Lead Farmers Origin Kill It With Fire
81
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 09:39:00 -
[59] - Quote
This is one mad alt. |

QT McWhiskers
Hard Knocks Inc.
51
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 09:50:00 -
[60] - Quote
I have a solution for you sir. Why dont we have ccp randomly spawn sleepers in sites in null sec. We could call it sleeper incursions. You have your ratting carrier right? Its doing its thing killing off whatever pirate or drone scum that is causing havoc for the empires somehow in an isolated pocket of the galaxy over 50 jumps away... then suddenly sleepers. Thousands of them. (or maybe 15) Sleepers spawn inside your sanctum and start to shoot at you too. The amount spawned will be proportional to what you have brought on the field.
A BC will warrant 2 bs 2 cruisers and 4 frigates. Each additional BC adds 1 cruiser to the total that caps out at 5 BCs on field.
A BS will warrant 4 BS 4 Cruisers and 6 frigates. Each additional BS will add 2 BS and 2 Cruisers that caps out at 5 BS.
A carrier will add 10 BS and 7 Cruisers with no frigates. Each additional carrier will add in 8 BS that caps out at 5 Carriers.
A supercarrier will cause 70 BS to spawn. Each additional super carrier will cause 70 more BS to spawn that does not have a cap.
So there you go CCP you have your perfect solution to this guy. You have your ratters going about plying their merry anom trade when suddenly... the sanctum they warp to has sleepers in it. This way null ratters will have access to the sleeper loot and we will see many, and I mean many, carriers and super carriers die in a matter of days.
Also the sleepers spawned would be comparable to c6 sleepers.
On a serious note. I kind of would like to see the tears if this were ever implemented. Can you guys imagine it? All the ratting wyverns that will die in a matter of days? All the pimp as **** thannys going down in balls of fire. We would reduce null sec to people with actual skill in a matter of weeks. |

Hulasikali Walla
Never Mind the Bollocks
15
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 10:50:00 -
[61] - Quote
ma perke wrote: Where is your rat hole ???
DTC 
|

Gravitas Stolpe
Shiva Furnace
3
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 11:27:00 -
[62] - Quote
Alt in noobcorp, claiming to be goon, trying to antagonize w-community and inviting us to deklein to settle the score?. Sounds legit. |

Sandslinger
NorCorp Enterprise No Holes Barred
31
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 12:11:00 -
[63] - Quote
ma perke wrote:lol so many elite WH-bears tears what can i say...
it reminds me about IT/WN/-A- etc. elite pvp-ers we noobs kicked out from every region we fight in, who instead of fixing their stuff and putting up a good fight like NC. did preffer to run. You are so good and skilled fighting Sleepers ?!? lol are they the CCP version of Deep Blue chess computer??
I think of level 4 missions - when they reached 100Misk/h in hi sec they were nerfed to nothing. I think of nul sec anomalies - when everybody started upgrading their system they were nerfed. I think of incursions - when so many elite hi sec bears started doing them they were nerfed.
Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... it is about time now.
Me being a noob cant remember any case when WH-bears have come to nul sec and we haven't kicked them in the nuts. Thanks for the loot btw, keep coming in faction fitted t3 cruisers, I love it. Unfortunately I can't return you the visit since the game mechanics dosen't allow it. Every single inhabited WH i find in null gets closed imediately by its elite sleeper-bears when they see Deklein on the other side.
btw I live in VFK and rat in sanctums - come say hallo. Where is your rat hole - Jxxxx???
Hi
Hi I just met you and this is crazy but Post with your main... maybe ???
|

Axloth Okiah
Dark-Rising
6
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 13:08:00 -
[64] - Quote
ma perke wrote:Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... yes, sleepers were made significantly harder long time before any nerfing came to L4s, incursions or sanctums...
Criticising something you know absolutely nothing about makes you look very bad indeed (hence the npc noob alt I assume). So please stop this crying, try living in deep W-space for couple months and then come back and share you experiences with us. Because is it stands now, you have nothing to share and you'are rightly ignored/laughed at.
ps. I apologize for feeding the troll 
|

Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
520
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 13:45:00 -
[65] - Quote
ma perke wrote:lol so many elite WH-bears tears what can i say...
Sadly the only tears have been from your OP. Everyone else in the thread calling you out as a troll/idiot aren't tears, just stating facts.
0/10 |

Bronya Boga
Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
24
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 14:31:00 -
[66] - Quote
ma perke wrote: btw I live in VFK and rat in sanctums - come say hallo. Where is your rat hole - Jxxxx???
So your saying that you carrier rat deep in goon space, not only that,but in their headquarters. Where you have thousands of players at a moment notice,and that is more dangerous then WH's?
Thats precious. |

Gnaw LF
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
267
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 16:21:00 -
[67] - Quote
Joran Jackson wrote:The only thing I've learned from this thread is that Gnaw is too good a person to be in Aquila
....and my position of AAMR (Angry, Authoritarian, Megalomaniac Russian) of Verge of Collapse has been recently usurped. |

Gnaw LF
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
267
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 16:28:00 -
[68] - Quote
ma perke wrote:lol so many elite WH-bears tears what can i say...
it reminds me about IT/WN/-A- etc. elite pvp-ers we noobs kicked out from every region we fight in, who instead of fixing their stuff and putting up a good fight like NC. did preffer to run. You are so good and skilled fighting Sleepers ?!? lol are they the CCP version of Deep Blue chess computer??
I think of level 4 missions - when they reached 100Misk/h in hi sec they were nerfed to nothing. I think of nul sec anomalies - when everybody started upgrading their system they were nerfed. I think of incursions - when so many elite hi sec bears started doing them they were nerfed.
Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... it is about time now.
Me being a noob cant remember any case when WH-bears have come to nul sec and we haven't kicked them in the nuts. Thanks for the loot btw, keep coming in faction fitted t3 cruisers, I love it. Unfortunately I can't return you the visit since the game mechanics dosen't allow it. Every single inhabited WH i find in null gets closed imediately by its elite sleeper-bears when they see Deklein on the other side.
btw I live in VFK and rat in sanctums - come say hallo. Where is your rat hole - Jxxxx???
Oh my. The mighty CFC, purgers of RMTing Russian hordes. You have fought alliances that are 1/10th your size, and half filled with Bots and now you proudly thump your chest as if its some sort of accomplishment. Why don't you try the same thing with w-space, come to our turf and try to chest thump then see how long your mighty blob will handle warfare that requires skills and more than a few hours of staying online.
Also, your entire argument is a logical fallacy. You show us other aspects of the game that were nerfed due to over production of ISK, however you forget that those aspects of the game provided a very risk-free and pvp averse environment. People who make ISK in L4 or Incursions rarely went and spent all that ISK on ships and pew, in wspace most of us make ISK only to pew and we rarely if ever cause general inflation of the market. In fact the amount of ISK we earned depends entirely on how many Tech3 ships are lost.
P.S. Your coalition gets pwned by wspace alliance all the time. This is my personal favorite because I was there: http://kb.vergeofcollapse.com/?a=kill_related&kll_id=13657 http://themittani.com/news/eight-goonswarm-carriers-down-branch
I laugh at your inadequacy.  |

Pinaculus
Hole Busters
151
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 21:00:00 -
[69] - Quote
If W-Space is so safe why do I feel so paranoid all the time? I know sometimes it's difficult to realize just how much you spend on incidental things each month or year, but seriously, EVE is very cheap entertainment compared to most things... If you are a smoker, smoke one less pack a week and pay for EVE, with money left over to pick up a cheap bundle of flowers for the EVE widow upstairs. |

Ayeson
Hard Knocks Inc.
82
|
Posted - 2012.12.19 21:48:00 -
[70] - Quote
Pinaculus wrote:If W-Space is so safe why do I feel so paranoid all the time?
Rengas Ask me about Rengas-dar, HRDKX's Most recent, groundbreaking, game-changing, wormhole-collapsing research endeavour. |

Gibbo5771
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
71
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 00:52:00 -
[71] - Quote
Really hope the op gets baw cancer. |

Capt Starfox
Sebiestor Tribe Minmatar Republic
7
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 04:59:00 -
[72] - Quote
I'm a little disappointed, not enough OP tears. Page 2 he completely disappears. Page 3 one post about how leet he is and nothing on page 4. I was expecting more! And yeah w-space has virtually no risk at all, man good catch. No Concord, pfft who needs them? No local, pfft don't need to know how many pirates, murderers, war-targets, haters, killers, serial rapists (yeah idk, just go with it), slavers, scammers, politicians, lepers, Jita sales-people there are floating around out there! We got this, no worries about that pos you spent time setting up... oh wait. |

Bamsey Amraa
Unseen Nomads Exiled Ones
2
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 07:13:00 -
[73] - Quote
I rly love when null sec F1 pushers cry like child :D Cry more pls its fantastic  |

ash veratis
Hard Knocks Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 08:54:00 -
[74] - Quote
Axloth Okiah wrote:ma perke wrote:Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... yes, sleepers were made significantly harder long time before any nerfing came to L4s, incursions or sanctums...
For the record, w-space nerfs I can think of off the top of my head:
- NOS to Neut change.
- API-based jumps-per-hour counts were removed.
- high-end Ladar sleeper spawn count doubling (4bs's in instrumentals instead of 2, etc)
- Changes to wormhole jump mechanics reducing the number of people who can slip through a collapsing hole.
- Corporate hangar array max item count cap.
- Aggression-based reshipping counter applying even while inside a force-field. (silly, but it's applying everywhere, so it's marginal, I'll concede)
- Missile range reduction (since some sleepers love to hang out at 80k's, this is a problem, but fair enough, since it brings it closer to other races in terms of range)
- Signature resolution of dreadnaught guns being drastically increased. (this was balanced out by a tracking improvement, but since sleepers have a signature radius of 400m max, it can still cause problems, since it makes target painters less effective after stacking is applied)
I'm sure I missed some. |

corbexx
Aperture Harmonics K162
45
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 09:24:00 -
[75] - Quote
Quote:For the record, w-space nerfs I can think of off the top of my head:
NOS to Neut change. API-based jumps-per-hour counts were removed. high-end Ladar sleeper spawn count doubling (4bs's in instrumentals instead of 2, etc) Changes to wormhole jump mechanics reducing the number of people who can slip through a collapsing hole. Corporate hangar array max item count cap. Aggression-based reshipping counter applying even while inside a force-field. (silly, but it's applying everywhere, so it's marginal, I'll concede) Missile range reduction (since some sleepers love to hang out at 80k's, this is a problem, but fair enough, since it brings it closer to other races in terms of range) Signature resolution of dreadnaught guns being drastically increased. (this was balanced out by a tracking improvement, but since sleepers have a signature radius of 400m max, it can still cause problems, since it makes target painters less effective after stacking is applied)
I'm sure I missed some.
cap escaltions spawning when you land on grid not when you start yoru warp (god i feel old)
ecm removed from magnatar effects
pulsar effect working on pos shields (could be wrong with that one)
probably loads loads more |

Xtrah
NorCorp Enterprise No Holes Barred
6
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 10:02:00 -
[76] - Quote
Sleepers affected by wormhole effects !! |

Mother Ducks
OFF THE STATION
3
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 10:41:00 -
[77] - Quote
Oh poor goon, swimming in a sea of blue Tell me now, what did the WHs ever do to you? Are you jealous of our Cap escalation while you suffer from the blob retardation We want you to come join us, yes it true The vastness of W-space beckons you Come inside our home with your shiny toys as we wring our hands like greedy boys We want to take you on and you blob So we can make many sacrifices to our dear Bob What is that you say? WHs are for bads? You do not want to play with our Bhaals and their corresponding lads? You have no interest in taking on our Dreads Without the chance of Cynos lighting above you heads? You feel uncomfortable without your titan bridge It is as though you are standing on the ridge of the precipice of darkness, nothing is all you see Well that's because I have a cloaky with me Now you're tackled, and you scream and shout! But the last words you will here will be from me within my Proteus "****, or get the %@$ out"
Heh, ***** ****.
|

Chester Floyd
Balkan Xpress Talocan United
12
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 11:01:00 -
[78] - Quote
Irya Boone wrote:you all know the rule .. don't F.. feed the troll !!!
THIS |

AtomicConnor
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 11:58:00 -
[79] - Quote
ma perke wrote:lMe being a noob cant remember any case when WH-bears have come to nul sec and we haven't kicked them in the nuts.
lulwut? |

Rhavas
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
99
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 15:13:00 -
[80] - Quote
Mother Ducks wrote:Oh poor goon, swimming in a sea of blue Tell me now, what did the WHs ever do to you? Are you jealous of our Cap escalation while you suffer from the blob retardation We want you to come join us, yes it true The vastness of W-space beckons you Come inside our home with your shiny toys as we wring our hands like greedy boys We want to take you on and you blob So we can make many sacrifices to our dear Bob What is that you say? WHs are for bads? You do not want to play with our Bhaals and their corresponding lads? You have no interest in taking on our Dreads Without the chance of Cynos lighting above you heads? You feel uncomfortable without your titan bridge It is as though you are standing on the ridge of the precipice of darkness, nothing is all you see Well that's because I have a cloaky with me Now you're tackled, and you scream and shout! But the last words you will here will be from me within my Proteus "****, or get the %@$ out"
Heh, ***** ****.
This thread continues to deliver.
|

Zloco Crendraven
BALKAN EXPRESS
105
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 15:27:00 -
[81] - Quote
Yeah WH income should be nerfed by a lot. It is really shameful how much those guys are rich, especially compared to us lowsec dwellers. And i dont find WH that more dangerous than lowsec, on the contrary. C4 and above should be nerfed to the ground. |

Kirin Sky
Wormhole Hunters
3
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 15:33:00 -
[82] - Quote
I'd guess the basic laws of economics would apply here...
If it was so risk free and high reward, wouldn't everybody do it?
If most people aren't doing it, isn't the OP invalid?
Why are hemorrhoids called GÇ£hemorrhoidsGÇ¥ instead of GÇ£asteroidsGÇ¥? w-Space is best-Space! |

Paikis
Vapour Holdings
350
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 15:37:00 -
[83] - Quote
Kirin Sky wrote:Why are hemorrhoids called GÇ£hemorrhoidsGÇ¥ instead of GÇ£asteroidsGÇ¥?
Ooh! I know this one!
It's Hilter right? Right? Did I guess right? Do I win a prize? |

Matt Ellis
Infinity Engine
24
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 15:42:00 -
[84] - Quote
Zloco Crendraven wrote:Yeah WH income should be nerfed by a lot. It is really shameful how much those guys are rich, especially compared to us lowsec dwellers. And i dont find WH that more dangerous than lowsec, on the contrary. C4 and above should be nerfed to the ground.
Apart from the fac that you can dock up/POS up when you see someone enter system. We don't know when people enter, unless we catch a glimpse of scan. I once had a fight with 2 other corps when we attacked someone, and ended up having a 3rd party land at the same time. Tell me thats the same as low.
You also get your money from your sites straight away, with exceptions to faction drops. We have to move ALL of our loot out of our wormhole, through hostile systems to get them to highsec. If that gets blown up, not only do we have to replace the ship, but we dont get paid. Simple as!
Fueling our POSs is harder too, as we have to go thru many hostile systems. You low/null guys can just JF your stuff in. No chance here.
We have to constantly be on the lookout, actively. you just have to watch Local for when to perk up.
Still think WH's are on a level field with lowsec?
|

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
99
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 20:42:00 -
[85] - Quote
Station camping is dangerous now!!! |

Unholythrash Davaham
Bio Troll
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 21:20:00 -
[86] - Quote
ma perke wrote:lol so many elite WH-bears tears what can i say...
it reminds me about IT/WN/-A- etc. elite pvp-ers we noobs kicked out from every region we fight in, who instead of fixing their stuff and putting up a good fight like NC. did preffer to run. You are so good and skilled fighting Sleepers ?!? lol are they the CCP version of Deep Blue chess computer??
I think of level 4 missions - when they reached 100Misk/h in hi sec they were nerfed to nothing. I think of nul sec anomalies - when everybody started upgrading their system they were nerfed. I think of incursions - when so many elite hi sec bears started doing them they were nerfed.
Was there any change in the WH since they were introduced? NO... it is about time now.
Me being a noob cant remember any case when WH-bears have come to nul sec and we haven't kicked them in the nuts. Thanks for the loot btw, keep coming in faction fitted t3 cruisers, I love it. Unfortunately I can't return you the visit since the game mechanics dosen't allow it. Every single inhabited WH i find in null gets closed imediately by its elite sleeper-bears when they see Deklein on the other side.
btw I live in VFK and rat in sanctums - come say hallo. Where is your rat hole - Jxxxx???
Last time our WH opened up into Goonland we were in the ass end of Tenal. Whole area was dead we almost closed it to look for something else but instead we ran all the anoms in a 5 jump area, Few T3s, couple of logi and noctis in tow hoping for a fight but after 3 hours nobody came for us and we only saw 2-3 guys. We ended up running the DED's that popped and went home with some blue loot, was a rather boring night in Tenal. |

Diremage
Stability Critically Disrupted Seekers of the Unseen
8
|
Posted - 2012.12.20 23:01:00 -
[87] - Quote
Quote:Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
You know who else made too much isk for too small a profit? Godwin. You know what that means? ****** wanted WH's to be nerfed. You're taking the exact same position ****** did.
Don't be ******.
Edit: The profanity filter wins 0.375 internets. |

Dev Aldard
Wetwork Inc. Insurance Fraud.
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 06:24:00 -
[88] - Quote
There have been many replies to this so far but I want my two cents added in. Because I'm like that.
-Increase the number of WH connecting k-space to w-space. Sure thing. K-space is scared to death of us already, so why not induce more fear in the denizens of nullsec as they carebear away at their sure thing bountied rats as they gain sec status by the ton. -Player induced closing of a WH not possible? Well, that wouldn't be too awful, that just means we can jump whatever size fleet out of our wormholes and kill your k-space carebears more effectively. We show up in the middle of one of your ratting systems, and the Machariels, Archons, and Moros look mighty juicy. Don't get me started on the Rorquals... -WH should be more accessible. How are they not already quite accessible? Get a scanning ship and start scanning. You already scan for the big money sites out there in nullsec. Just because you cringe, followed by running back to station and hiding, when you see a wormhole doesn't mean it's not accessible. -POS mechanics changed just for w-space. So you can blob a dread into our wh and kill our POS's without waiting for a reinforce timer. How about this: If they change it for w-space, I think it should be changed for nullsec as well. OH WAIT! You have a super in there! You can't let that happen!!!
In conclusion: Give me a break. You don't want this stuff any more than w-spacers do. You're frustrated because when you see one of our exits in your carebear system, you head to your cushy station and sit there, all safe and cozy. We only bite when we see you after all. Do what we do. Don't be seen until you're ready to kill. Simple concept. My two cents. |

Matt Ellis
Infinity Engine
25
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 09:29:00 -
[89] - Quote
Dev Aldard wrote: Don't be seen until you're ready to kill.
Ah the fundamental of Wormhole PvP. And the other one of, "always assume we have a scout watching your fleet form up..". Follow those, and you'll be just fine..
|

bubble trout
Sky Fighters Talocan United
27
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 21:00:00 -
[90] - Quote
Matt Ellis wrote:Dev Aldard wrote: Don't be seen until you're ready to kill.
Ah the fundamental of Wormhole PvP. And the other one of, "always assume we have a scout watching your fleet form up..". Follow those, and you'll be just fine..
Missing one, "The drake is always bait". |

IIFraII
The Red Circle Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 21:41:00 -
[91] - Quote
ma perke wrote:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
Yes please.
MOAR nullsecs 
Seriously, dear troll, you dont have a clue about w-space.
|

Roime
Shiva Furnace
1439
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 21:43:00 -
[92] - Quote
yeah
So when do we get the animations back?
I tried to remove this sig. |

Peter Raptor
Galactic Hawks
302
|
Posted - 2012.12.21 23:37:00 -
[93] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
WH living is much more labour intensive than you think, living in a class 4 static WH, sometimes takes hours just to find 4 connecting WHs to k space, and then you're risking travelling from one WH to another, just to get to k space, your ideas are ridiculous overall,
-100/10 Evelopedia;-á
The Amarr Empire, is known for its omnipresent religion -áGÇá-á-á |

Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
212
|
Posted - 2012.12.22 01:08:00 -
[94] - Quote
ma perke wrote: back on the topic:
[point 1] do you do upgrades in WH? - NO [point 2] can you close WH if you dont like it - NO [point 3] do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO [point 4] can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
in WH you have less risk and win more ISK compared to 0.0, which should be nerfed!
[point 1] although your answer is technically correct. your intent is quite clearly illogically wrong. on every possible level. No , I can confirm there are are no upgrade opportunities inside a wormhole. To place upgrade structures i believe requires sovereignty (or at the very least ownership of the system) Wormholes CANNOT be claimed, and therefore they cannot be upgraded Outposts cannot be built, Only POS's can be erected at moons, but the moons cannot be mined for "Moon Goo"
[point 2] your wrong here. a wormhole can be closed very easily, it just requires time and the right ship with the appropriate mass
[point 3] the same reason for your [point 1] apply to this question As wormholes CANNOT be claimed your whole point here is ludicrous and actually pointless.
[point 4] your wrong here (yet again) you have absolutely no control over where connections to and from your wormhole go to. they can go to hisec, losec, nulsec and other wormholes people are free to travel through those connections to attack you they do NOT show up on local they do NOT travel through blue-space to get to you. (giving your intel channel ample time to warn you of thier arrival) in a wormhole it really is "and suddenly spaceships"
some final advice for you. before you make any futher posts on this subject i sugest you read "Everything Wormhole"
|

Celestra Doxaila
MinTek Heavy Industries
30
|
Posted - 2012.12.22 02:14:00 -
[95] - Quote
Nerf Billboards |

Kurt Saken
State War Academy Caldari State
27
|
Posted - 2012.12.22 03:08:00 -
[96] - Quote
So, where is the OP? Deep in Deklein, being stroked by his boss like i stroke my cat? Who knows. |

Zloco Crendraven
BALKAN EXPRESS
105
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 14:10:00 -
[97] - Quote
Matt Ellis wrote:Zloco Crendraven wrote:Yeah WH income should be nerfed by a lot. It is really shameful how much those guys are rich, especially compared to us lowsec dwellers. And i dont find WH that more dangerous than lowsec, on the contrary. C4 and above should be nerfed to the ground. Apart from the fac that you can dock up/POS up when you see someone enter system. We don't know when people enter, unless we catch a glimpse of scan. I once had a fight with 2 other corps when we attacked someone, and ended up having a 3rd party land at the same time. Tell me thats the same as low. You also get your money from your sites straight away, with exceptions to faction drops. We have to move ALL of our loot out of our wormhole, through hostile systems to get them to highsec. If that gets blown up, not only do we have to replace the ship, but we dont get paid. Simple as! Fueling our POSs is harder too, as we have to go thru many hostile systems. You low/null guys can just JF your stuff in. No chance here. We have to constantly be on the lookout, actively. you just have to watch Local for when to perk up. Still think WH's are on a level field with lowsec?
What PLEXES in lowsec? lol...Till i find one decent and do it and earn a buck, your already sitting on few billions, hauling included. And its a pain in the ass doing one cos lowsec one have much bigger traffic than your WH. In lowsec u get more than 3 parties really often. We in lowsec have POS logistics too, it is easier but dont tell me the story "omg because of harder hauling we sohuld get 100000% more profit".
|

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
100
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 14:38:00 -
[98] - Quote
The reason we make "so much isk" is the reason you have cheaps t3s. |

Rroff
The Xenodus Initiative. Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
96
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 14:52:00 -
[99] - Quote
Zloco Crendraven wrote:
What PLEXES in lowsec? lol...Till i find one decent and do it and earn a buck, your already sitting on few billions, hauling included. And its a pain in the ass doing one cos lowsec one have much bigger traffic than your WH. In lowsec u get more than 3 parties really often. We in lowsec have POS logistics too, it is easier but dont tell me the story "omg because of harder hauling we sohuld get 100000% more profit".
I'd say thats more of an indication that low sec is broken rather than WH space needing nerfing... |

ArmyOfMe
TEDDYBEARS.
125
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 18:23:00 -
[100] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. I agree, on the condition that we remove local chat from all space 
Suleiman Shouaa> And you still think you're taking risks? NightmareX> I do. I take risks every day. But i do whatever i can to make sure i'm not ending up in a loss.
|

Cage Man
Evil Guinea Pigs
45
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 19:07:00 -
[101] - Quote
Joining militia and orbiting buttons or running lvl4 missions is far easier and more profitable to make isk with than wh's.. the same applies for farming anoms in an upgraded null sec system which have anoms always present.. Its all about effort.. you put some in.. you make some isk.. |

Indo Nira
DEEP-SPACE CO-OP LTD Exhale.
27
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 19:29:00 -
[102] - Quote
ArmyOfMe wrote: agree, on the condition that we remove local chat from all space 
all space might be too much, i'm content with removing it from null alone
edit: it's not like they don't have intel channels in which they could say. i died in this system, now i'm in a NEW CLONE, 2 jumps away shipping up for pvp |

Wolvun
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
101
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 21:06:00 -
[103] - Quote
Indo Nira wrote:ArmyOfMe wrote: agree, on the condition that we remove local chat from all space  all space might be too much, i'm content with removing it from null alone edit: it's not like they don't have intel channels in which they could say. i died in this system, now i'm in a NEW CLONE, 2 jumps away shipping up for pvp
A 30sec delay on local is all i ask. |

Bronya Boga
Semper Ubi Sub Ubi
24
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 21:58:00 -
[104] - Quote
Wolvun wrote:Indo Nira wrote:ArmyOfMe wrote: agree, on the condition that we remove local chat from all space  all space might be too much, i'm content with removing it from null alone edit: it's not like they don't have intel channels in which they could say. i died in this system, now i'm in a NEW CLONE, 2 jumps away shipping up for pvp A 30sec delay on local is all i ask.
thats all you would need to kill a ratting tengu *drooling* |

Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
523
|
Posted - 2012.12.23 22:02:00 -
[105] - Quote
Not to continue taking this thread down a different path (but I will anyhow). Personally I think it would be cool for local to be some sort of SOV upgrade that can be used. A structure that can pick up people in a system. It could be cool in a few ways.
1. It could be a structure that could be destroyed. An attacking force could hit these first to knock out intel. Let's face it, messing up intel is a key component to any good war. 2. it would be an additional cost that alliances would have to consider. Do you want local in XYZ system? then you'd better make use of it, otherwise why would we go through the expense of paying for the local generator for unused systems.
Anyhow my brief thought. |

Jalabaster
Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking
13
|
Posted - 2012.12.24 14:17:00 -
[106] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Not to continue taking this thread down a different path (but I will anyhow). Personally I think it would be cool for local to be some sort of SOV upgrade that can be used. A structure that can pick up people in a system. It could be cool in a few ways.
1. It could be a structure that could be destroyed. An attacking force could hit these first to knock out intel. Let's face it, messing up intel is a key component to any good war. 2. it would be an additional cost that alliances would have to consider. Do you want local in XYZ system? then you'd better make use of it, otherwise why would we go through the expense of paying for the local generator for unused systems.
This! Please this! "when a ship is blown up, the pilot usually winds up replacing it. This drives the economy, steadies inflation, and gives industrialists a reason to manufacture. In contrast, creating isk while never losing any items has the unfortunate reverse effect on the market, plus it isn't really any fun." Jala |

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
100
|
Posted - 2012.12.24 18:41:00 -
[107] - Quote
Derath Ellecon wrote:Not to continue taking this thread down a different path (but I will anyhow). Personally I think it would be cool for local to be some sort of SOV upgrade that can be used. A structure that can pick up people in a system. It could be cool in a few ways.
1. It could be a structure that could be destroyed. An attacking force could hit these first to knock out intel. Let's face it, messing up intel is a key component to any good war. 2. it would be an additional cost that alliances would have to consider. Do you want local in XYZ system? then you'd better make use of it, otherwise why would we go through the expense of paying for the local generator for unused systems.
Anyhow my brief thought.
Whs is about Stealth and how good you are dealing with it. If you are good then there are little chances of getting caught. If you are good at it, you have more chanches of caught things. If you are bad..., my KB speak for itself. I`m bad, period.
So, my answer to your post is NO, please, no. |

Lloyd Roses
Blue-Fire
8
|
Posted - 2012.12.25 15:27:00 -
[108] - Quote
corbexx wrote:
Or we could make null sec better. maybe just maybe we coudl take some of teh wh ideals and put them in nullsec.
sites would be worth more in nullsec the down side being you'd need properly fit carrier dreads and a small gang of people not just 1 ratting carrier, the bs in these new sites woudl also nuet loads point and do way more dps than what your used to at the moment, but they would be worth more isk.
we could get rid of officer spawns you'd have new sites called "officers hide aways" these woudl be like yoru new improved combat sites but would do even more damage you'd still need 8 or more people to do them either with multiple logi or triage carriers. once you have killed all the officers guards you could loot his hide away (needing a high skill in archeology) this still woudlnt give officer mods just plans to use these you'd probably need a dedicated 30 million science character to invent something out of it, You'd also need to find some random gas and crap and harvest this as well react said gas to polymers make some parts from teh salvage and then combine it all with yoru invented copy and walla you have yoru officer mod.
bounties woudl be gone i'm affraid but dont worry the sites woudl be worth more isk you'd just have to take your tags to concord in hisec (hope you guys dont have any wardecs) and turn them in for yoru lovely improved isk
we'd remove local this woudl be to make it safer for you while your in sites so others coming in dont know exactly how many there are of you
stations woudl get just 1 reinforce timer but you could alter this with stront up to a max of 41 hours. as people in null are not wanting to grind stations we'd improve this sov war mechanics and just say hey if your station is killed after the reinforce timer all your **** is gone everything. this would not only speed up sov wars but make future ones even quicker (assuming you havent rebuild the out posts.
we'd keep yoru gates but these wouldnt show up on overview and you woudl have to scan them down every day (they woudl change location after every down time) while on the gates talk they woudl only allow so much mass through them and if this is exceeded the gate woudl move to a new location and you would have to scan it again i'd say 3billion mas so about 30 bs's 1 way.
now you might say thats ok we have titan bridges but unfortunatly the distance between all systems woudl be 999 gazillion light years (a bit to far for titans) so they wouldnt be of much use same for super caps but they could be used to defend the single system they are built in i guess. to balance this change we'd allow you to move dreads and normal carriers through your gates, they would however count towards mass used (so max 3 per gate then you need to go scanning)
on top of this systems in null woudl get a different effects so you woudl have to tailor yoru fleet towards what every system your going in, since your gates are fixed to what system they go to we'd make this effect random and woudl change daily after down time so you would have to scout ahead of time to check what effect it was before sending a fleet in, and heaven forbid your armour fleet got jumped in a pulsar system on the way to your destination
ooh the gas and stuff that woudl be added to null sec to make officer mods woudl need to be scanned down and to compensate for this we'd remove all ice belts from null sec you would only be able to get ice in hisec and low sec, again hope you dont have war decs
i hope these new and improved changes would help make null a better place so you wouldnt have to worry about wh's being just so great,
I'm unsure if +2 = +1 +1, or if it's not legit that way.
This gives a good comparison. It might be a bit harsh (need to scan gates -- do you even know how **** slow nullsec scanners are? Speaking from experience: While 'wormholeguy a' found a wormhole, I was delighted to see that he needs as long to scan the wormhole as I (or basically every other competent scanner) needs to find the hs 4 wormholes further. |

Fradle
Bite Me inc Bitten.
12
|
Posted - 2012.12.25 16:07:00 -
[109] - Quote
Merry Christmas wormholers! |

Dea della Morte
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
8
|
Posted - 2012.12.25 16:12:00 -
[110] - Quote
|

TYCONDEROGA
Bite Me inc Bitten.
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.29 10:47:00 -
[111] - Quote
Bears tears are the best tears.
Live, experience and then comment.
|

Omen Nihilo
AQUILA INC Verge of Collapse
75
|
Posted - 2012.12.29 15:41:00 -
[112] - Quote
Can this thread just die already? Oh wait... |

Kitty Bear
Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance
489
|
Posted - 2012.12.31 19:55:00 -
[113] - Quote
Fradle wrote:Merry Christmas wormholers!
Thank you.
I'm now off to get delirously drunk at a party !! Hope you have as much fun as i intend to . |

Komen
Capital Enrichment Services Transmission Lost
154
|
Posted - 2012.12.31 21:05:00 -
[114] - Quote
Not letting this thread die, because I am a heartless douchebag.
I join my voice to the many inviting the OP to come to wormholes and enjoy the low risk activity that is sleeper ratting.
Please to send eve-mail with system J-ident. |

FloppieTheBanjoClown
The Skunkworks
2486
|
Posted - 2012.12.31 23:57:00 -
[115] - Quote
Threads like this need to stand as monuments to the stupidity of those who hold such opinions. Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement. |

CaleAdaire
Research Industry Mining and Support Gatekeepers Universe
60
|
Posted - 2013.01.01 02:32:00 -
[116] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Lets say your corp lives in a class 5 wh, where only the loot from a rat BS is 50Misk. You do all the anomallies which are active and instead of waiting for another spawn next day you just scan for the wh in your own system. If it is again class 5 you go and do the anomalies there. If by some chance it leads to undesirable space - like goon space for instance - you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH. There is imediately another one spawning leading to some other place. There is no need for system upgrades, no need for soverenity warfare nothing. 20man corp can make tons of money and avoid all undesirable fights.
Hence WH should be nerfed - TOO MUCH ISK for too small risk involved!
Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
Can we upgrade a wormhole if we want to - no Do you in 0.0 have to deal with the extreme logistics of WH life - no Do you have to worry about a system going dead - no Do you have to worry about some unknown getting in your system covertly - no Do you have any realistic idea about how combat in a WH works? - obviously not.
Shut up and stay in your space. Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.
|

Piugattuk
Lima beans Corp
275
|
Posted - 2013.01.01 07:07:00 -
[117] - Quote
How 'bout no to OP. |

QT McWhiskers
Hard Knocks Inc.
71
|
Posted - 2013.01.01 14:05:00 -
[118] - Quote
I think this is all you need OP
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVuqVW4rq-o |

Kalel Nimrott
EG CORP Talocan United
171
|
Posted - 2013.01.02 15:48:00 -
[119] - Quote
Stop feeding the troll |

Bounty Haunter
Islam in Space
0
|
Posted - 2013.01.02 19:11:00 -
[120] - Quote
I too make ragey teary posts with alts-
On a less returd newb point
Nerf NPC AI its killing solo! |

silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
315
|
Posted - 2013.01.02 19:22:00 -
[121] - Quote
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in.
Come vist our WH. We'll sart the conversation with a bomb to your face, and then teach you all about 'low risk' from there.
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing. |

Lolmer
Yahoo Inc Caffeine Nicotine and Hate
88
|
Posted - 2013.01.25 02:21:00 -
[122] - Quote
As has been said many times in this thread, OP hasn't ever been in a wormhole enough to know any facts about them. Also, no risk? Has the OP seen WH Kills?
ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in. snip Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. So...he wants the following fixes?
- Add more wormhole systems (C1-C3,C5-C6) or increase the number of statics these wormholes have, adding to the number of opportunities for "riskless ISK".
- Remove mass restrictions from wormholes, allowing any number of ships to pass through making logistics (damn you, ice!), invasions, and retreats have no limit other than time.
- See #1 or make Sleepers easier to kill and do less damage so we can earn "riskless ISK" even faster.
- Which "WH" will be tied to the POS keeping it vulnerable? All statics and K162? Just the static? Both statics for a C2? Do wormhole players not have timezones to worry about? We are so populous that we cover all times all days and have no family or friends we might want to hang out with? Perhaps work thrown in now and then?
All of his suggestions make wormholes easier to make money or more onerous to live in than any other system. Oh wait, they already are more onerous, so their onerouser(?)(est?).
OP, please, get a clue before you post. "Good troll", if so. |

Sith1s Spectre
Sky Fighters Talocan United
74
|
Posted - 2013.01.25 02:50:00 -
[123] - Quote
Lolmer wrote:As has been said many times in this thread, OP hasn't ever been in a wormhole enough to know any facts about them. Also, no risk? Has the OP seen WH Kills? ma perke wrote:WH has too much advantage over k-space and too low risk to live in. snip Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp. - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible. - WH should be more accessible. - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts. So...he wants the following fixes?
- Add more wormhole systems (C1-C3,C5-C6) or increase the number of statics these wormholes have, adding to the number of opportunities for "riskless ISK".
- Remove mass restrictions from wormholes, allowing any number of ships to pass through making logistics (damn you, ice!), invasions, and retreats have no limit other than time.
- See #1 or make Sleepers easier to kill and do less damage so we can earn "riskless ISK" even faster.
- Which "WH" will be tied to the POS keeping it vulnerable? All statics and K162? Just the static? Both statics for a C2? Do wormhole players not have timezones to worry about? We are so populous that we cover all times all days and have no family or friends we might want to hang out with? Perhaps work thrown in now and then?
All of his suggestions make wormholes easier to make money or more onerous to live in than any other system. Oh wait, they already are more onerous, so their onerouser(?)(est?). OP, please, get a clue before you post. "Good troll", if so.
Really, you felt the need to dig this up and post in it. Can't it just be locked and let this thread die...
May you be one with Bob |

Utsen Dari
Adhocracy Incorporated Adhocracy
74
|
Posted - 2013.01.26 02:50:00 -
[124] - Quote
I agree OP, wormspace is much more amazing than other places in New Eden. In fact it's so good that lots of folks should move in right away, and take advantage of this fabulous opportunity. There's plenty of extra space to set up in! We are always looking for new neighbors who aren't tumbleweeds! |

Arronicus
Vintas Industries Mistakes Were Made.
140
|
Posted - 2013.01.26 10:10:00 -
[125] - Quote
ma perke wrote: you jump a carrier through in and out and close the WH.
Doesn't know that it takes more than a single carrier round trip to collapse any hole that a carrier can fit through.
ma perke wrote: Suggestes steps:
- The number of WH connecting K-space should be increased in order to increase pvp.
Allow me to rephrase his request: "We need constant instatravel routes all over non wormhole space to make eve smaller"
ma perke wrote: - Player induced closing of a WH should be not possible.
Allow me to rephrase again: "You should either not know if a wormhole is about to collapse, and them have random mass amounts that cannot be planned for"
Or "Wormholes should allow unlimited mass within x time frame"
ma perke wrote: - POS mechanics in WH should be changed, so that it can be killed in a single day as long as a WH lasts.
"You should be able to lose your home and all your stuff all at once, if you weren't the first person on the field, even though it isn't that way anywhere else in the game."
Haven't heard someone this mad in a while. Jimmies rustled so hard it was on the news. |

Harry Inskipp
Jupiter Roughriders We Suck At This Game
1
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 01:19:00 -
[126] - Quote
K-Space has local. Nullsec denizens can float around lazily and farm stuff, and Local protects them from any bad guys while they rat away in their faction battleships and 5Bil Tengus.
Wormholes do not have Local. Real men don't need Local. Wormholes require vigilance and a skill set. Nullsec would be cooler without Local, but CCP can't remove it because then Nullsec would require attention and people could not play Eve will surfing YouTube and playing other games at the same time. And it wouldn't be really, really, really easy to detect threats.
Nullsecers outgun wormholers 100:1 because it's 100 times easier to blob and farm Nullsec. Wormholers, by way of comparison, are like the brave pioneers of the Wild West. Nullsecers are like entitlement-minded inner-city gang-bangers.
Anyway, I hope that answers your questions about all the stuff you don't understand. Perhaps one day you can man-up and fly around a wormhole, without 300 of your friends and Local.
Best regards. |

Jack Miton
Aperture Harmonics K162
1348
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 03:55:00 -
[127] - Quote
Ok... what moron necroed THIS of all threads?? give yourself an uppercut... |

Maggeridon Thoraz
Reconfiguration Nation Transmission Lost
45
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 04:00:00 -
[128] - Quote
7 pages alredy , unebelievable. thread should have been closed righter after opening |

Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
406
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 11:49:00 -
[129] - Quote
Bumping this thread again to remind people that we should stop bumping it. |

Taz Edenrunner
The Dark Space Initiative
8
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 14:28:00 -
[130] - Quote
thought this had been locked a while ago...or was that one of the other 100 pointless !!!!NERF WH!!!! threads by nubs who dont live in WHs |

Derath Ellecon
Washburne Holdings Situation: Normal
1094
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 14:43:00 -
[131] - Quote
Jack Miton wrote:Ok... what moron necroed THIS of all threads?? give yourself an uppercut...
^^^^^
Whoever necro'd this thread should get a bounty from everyone, killed repeatedly, and their hole found and sieged. |

StonerPhReaK
Ashfell Celestial Equilibrium POD-SQUAD
102
|
Posted - 2013.01.30 15:01:00 -
[132] - Quote
ma perke wrote:
do you do upgrades in WH? - NO can you close WH if you dont like it - NO do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - NO can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - NO
in comparison in 0.0 answers to all above question are YES, YES, YES, YES
in WH you have less risk and win more ISK compared to 0.0, which should be nerfed!
do you do upgrades in WH? Yes, you start out in smaller ships and oyu build up your arsenal. can you close WH if you dont like it - Yes collapse it with mass do you fight soverenity wars for a WH - Yes Please google some of the more notable WH invasions. can anyone come chalenge you in a WH - Yes, See my above answer to the SOV question.
Do wh's constantly generate new sites to run like SOV making isk easy to acquire without the need of scouts and probing and collapsing wh after wh? - No Do wh's have local providing intel on the baddies in your system like sov - No Do wh's have gates that take you merrily to anywhere to sell your goods - No
Wh's are riskier than you think they are. Maybe you should hop in one for a few weeks and get some actual knowledge.
P.S. CCP moderator please delete ma perke topic as he lacks the actual knowledge to speak on this subject and is generally not constructive, but just emotional. Signature Removal in Progress, Estimated time of completion? Neva |

Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
281
|
Posted - 2013.02.02 01:32:00 -
[133] - Quote
I'd be inclined to give a decent responce if the OP had posted with his main.
As its an alt, i'll just settle for "completely disagree". Post with your main, like a BOSS! |

Arronicus
Vintas Industries Mistakes Were Made.
156
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 06:31:00 -
[134] - Quote
Harry Inskipp wrote:Wormholes do not have local.
Um, yes, yes they do. Every system in the game has local. The key difference is that the local chat window in wormhole space does not update the current present members list.
You're welcome. |
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