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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
Gempei
Siberian Khatru.
2
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Posted - 2011.10.10 21:15:00 -
[61] - Quote
Quark Valhala wrote:In a Drake load kinetick missels and win. load kinetic resist and you win
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Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1
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Posted - 2011.10.10 21:47:00 -
[62] - Quote
Quote:I think Drakes are possibly the most well balanced ship in the game
lol
*fits 85k ehp passive tank* *does 550 dps to 75km* *slowboats back to gates every time it encounters a gang of less than 10 people* *is a drake* |
Gempei
Siberian Khatru.
2
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Posted - 2011.10.10 22:05:00 -
[63] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:*fits 85k ehp passive tank* *does 550 dps to 75km* with signature radius 500m |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
23
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Posted - 2011.10.11 02:13:00 -
[64] - Quote
Gypsio III wrote:No, that's a worse idea. Tier 2 BCs already obsolete the Deimos, Sacrilege and all cruisers that aren't the Blackbird, and you want to make this situation worse? All that does is remove the "tier 2" from "tier 2 battlecruisers Online". Tier 2 battlecruisers are the problem, not the solution.
There is always going to be a sharp divide between people who want to PvP on the cheap but still an effective ship (mostly casuals) and those who want isk/SP to have a greater effect on performance.
Quote:*fits 85k ehp passive tank* *does 550 dps to 75km* *slowboats back to gates every time it encounters a gang of less than 10 people* *is a drake*
If a slowboating Drake makes it back to gate, so would a Hurricane with 5x the speed. IOW, you and your gang are terrible. |
Ganthrithor
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
6
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Posted - 2011.10.11 04:39:00 -
[65] - Quote
The point is that Drakes are clearly the most imbalanced BC in the game. In every other instance you're forced to choose between range, dps, and tank (pick any two) when you go to fit your BC. The Drake gets them all-- the range of a LR glass-cannon turret BC, the DPS of a closerange turret BC, and the tank of a battleship. Its a completely ridiculous ship, and anyone who argues otherwise is an illogical ******. Death2drakes. |
Quark Valhala
Empirius Enigmus Navy C0NVICTED
2
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Posted - 2011.10.11 05:16:00 -
[66] - Quote
I would like to here a dev explain about the ship (drake), and if they thinks its stats Are fair compared to the other races? ( thou the forum gods rarely answer thier minions ) |
Beckett Firesnake
Confrerie des ombres Confrerie de la Lumiere Alliance
0
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Posted - 2011.10.11 05:39:00 -
[67] - Quote
I made a lot of C3 sleepers with two Drakes. I made much ISK. I do not know if another T1 BC can make lvl4 mission as easily than a drake.
Because I did not understand the Resistance system, I did not see how a BattleShip could be better than a Drake for a while.
I think all races should have a Drake like ship.
Not enough firepower to overcome a BS but strong enough to tank a lvl4 mission.
So you could begin lvl4 missions while you up your BS skills .
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Elrianmk2
Dead Space Alpha Shadow of xXDEATHXx
0
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Posted - 2011.10.11 15:29:00 -
[68] - Quote
Funny i found that the Drake outperformed my Mega, then i remembered, Devs don't love Gallente. On topic though, Drakes are somewhat overpowered, i tend to run anoms in 0.0 in a pvp fit Drake, knowing if someone comes into system i can head over assist with tackle and take down without having to worry about switching out modules or ships, any other race, nah its not going happen unless you want the one way pod express. |
Shin Dari
The Vendunari Warped Aggression
3
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Posted - 2011.10.11 19:30:00 -
[69] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:The point is that Drakes are clearly the most imbalanced BC in the game. In every other instance you're forced to choose between range, dps, and tank (pick any two) when you go to fit your BC. The Drake gets them all-- the range of a LR glass-cannon turret BC, the DPS of a closerange turret BC, and the tank of a battleship. Its a completely ridiculous ship, and anyone who argues otherwise is an illogical ******. Death2drakes. With the Drake is Tank or DPS and most people just fit it with tank. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
32
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Posted - 2011.10.11 20:16:00 -
[70] - Quote
Shin Dari wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:The point is that Drakes are clearly the most imbalanced BC in the game. In every other instance you're forced to choose between range, dps, and tank (pick any two) when you go to fit your BC. The Drake gets them all-- the range of a LR glass-cannon turret BC, the DPS of a closerange turret BC, and the tank of a battleship. Its a completely ridiculous ship, and anyone who argues otherwise is an illogical ******. Death2drakes. With the Drake is Tank or DPS and most people just fit it with tank.
I don't fly a Drake myself but with an all T2 set up and some cheap implants - resistance tanking, I make a fit with two Ballistic Controls T2, 7x Heavy Launchers T2 64 541 eHP 225 sustained, 522 re-enforced defences per second 548 DPS (not over heated) 2845 per volley
Having no faction mods and being a T1 ship for that little ISK - is there any ship with that much tank and DPS? CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
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Quark Valhala
Empirius Enigmus Navy C0NVICTED
2
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Posted - 2011.10.11 20:40:00 -
[71] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Shin Dari wrote:Ganthrithor wrote:The point is that Drakes are clearly the most imbalanced BC in the game. In every other instance you're forced to choose between range, dps, and tank (pick any two) when you go to fit your BC. The Drake gets them all-- the range of a LR glass-cannon turret BC, the DPS of a closerange turret BC, and the tank of a battleship. Its a completely ridiculous ship, and anyone who argues otherwise is an illogical ******. Death2drakes. With the Drake is Tank or DPS and most people just fit it with tank. I don't fly a Drake myself but with an all T2 set up and some cheap implants - resistance tanking, I make a fit with two Ballistic Controls T2, 7x Heavy Launchers T2 64 541 eHP 225 sustained, 522 re-enforced defences per second 548 DPS (not over heated) 2845 per volley Having no faction mods and being a T1 ship for that little ISK - is there any ship with that much tank and DPS?
And range. Well tbh take a launcher slot off put in 2 turret hard points. Maybe remove a med or low slot.
Drake fixed . (i Think) |
Mfume Apocal
Origin. Black Legion.
24
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Posted - 2011.10.12 03:51:00 -
[72] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote: The Drake gets them all-- the range of a LR glass-cannon turret BC, the DPS of a closerange turret BC, and the tank of a battleship. Its a completely ridiculous ship, and anyone who argues otherwise is an illogical ******.
You're kidding, right?
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Dray
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
2
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Posted - 2011.10.12 10:34:00 -
[73] - Quote
Mfume Apocal wrote:cornholio508 wrote:A drake can do just as much dps as other races battleships and can also if fitted properly have way more ehp than them as well . Uh, no. Quote:A friend in my alliance has a drake that does 1000dps per volley and a passive tank that gives him 113,000 ehp . My faction fitted navy apoc with a omni tank of 85% resists and 1000 dps per volley and a 90,000 ehp on the other hand still doesnt come close to the drake. Because we know your Apoc doesn't shoot faster than a Drake, right? tl;dr you are bad at this. Stop.
Nah let him post, I'm enjoying them, admittedly for all the wrong reasons, but hey comedy comes in many forms.....
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Dray
Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED
2
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Posted - 2011.10.12 10:40:00 -
[74] - Quote
Ganthrithor wrote:Quote:I think Drakes are possibly the most well balanced ship in the game lol *fits 85k ehp passive tank* *does 550 dps to 75km* (missile dps and less if it's not scourge) *slowboats back to gates every time it encounters a gang of less than 10 people* (who can't web or bump) *is a drake* (laughing at the incompetent gang)
Fixed. |
Akara Ito
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
22
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Posted - 2011.10.12 15:03:00 -
[75] - Quote
How about just taking that kinetic bonus and replacing it with range ? Tank plus range would be a classic caldari setup and with reduced damage the ++ber ehp arent that much of a problem anymore.
Zagdul wrote: [...]and the Harbi could use a larger CPU grid.
YES! 30 CPU more would be great and bring it more in line with the Hurricane. |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
10
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Posted - 2011.10.12 16:11:00 -
[76] - Quote
Akara Ito wrote:How about just taking that kinetic bonus and replacing it with range ?
That makes it even more like a big Caracal. The game already has a fundamental problem with tier 2 battlecruisers obsoleting all T1 cruisers that aren't the Blackbird. Giving the Drake a missile velocity bonus puts it solidly into the Caracal's tiny remaining niche. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.12 18:50:00 -
[77] - Quote
I am more in the camp of boosting the other BCs than ever. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Heribeck Weathers
The Skunkworks
0
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Posted - 2011.10.12 20:01:00 -
[78] - Quote
make the raven worth taking into pvp and we can talk about nerfing the drake.
oh and give the ferox a diferant skill other than shield resists so its not so much of the drakes little brother |
Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.13 10:26:00 -
[79] - Quote
Sure! Coming right up!
P.S. I have found that they ship "bonus" of shield resistance or armour tends to only bring it up to average once it is fully trained. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
bongpacks
Mudbug Acquisition Of Empire
7
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Posted - 2011.10.14 04:31:00 -
[80] - Quote
So this guy posts a fail fit cyclone for running C2 anomalies on battleclinic and i get quoted on eve-o as saying a drake can do it better, because most anything is better than this monstrosity: http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/56446-Cyclone-C1-C2-WH.html
Gunboats suck for w-space PVE and really the reason boils down to the fact they have to pull optimal range on every target they engage. That's a lot of time consuming flying around while a drake can just sit still and blow stuff up. Not to mention they struggle with frigate sized rats without using drones, and we all know what sleepers do to drones. There's simply no reason to use anything other than a drake for w-space PVE in the lower level holes when the ship you're using does drake-ish DPS and on top of it has to fly around needlessly just to apply that low DPS.
Is the drake overpowered, heck no I wish it was. To get that fabled uber tank you guys keep talking about you'd have the DPS of a fail fit assault frigate. If you wanted to get 700+ DPS from a drake you'd have to gimp the tank with missile rigs so bad a fail fit assault frigate could kill it. OK yes of course the drake is superior for PVE compared to any of it's counterparts, but that can be said of most missile boats because of the minimum of skill required to simply press a button and watch stuff blow up instead of actually having to fly your ship to maintain optimal range ect. Should there be F.O.F type ammo for all types of weapon systems? I think so but really how often do you see anyone use F.O.F missiles? The drake as far as PVP is concerned is slow as hell, has crap capacitor and lackluster DPS not to mention the HUGE AS HELL sig radius is has without even cycling the MWD. I think it's pretty well balanced for the amount of tank vs. gank it has compared to it's counterparts. Maybe try using EM damage against the next drake you PVP against and you might not think the tank is so god-like. So to conclude this already long post, the drake is only superior at PVE, at everything else it's just mediocre. |
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Rek Seven
Zandathorn Industries
4
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Posted - 2011.10.14 11:26:00 -
[81] - Quote
I'd prefer if other ships got a boost instead of ccp nerfing the **** out of things that people have trained for. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.14 13:26:00 -
[82] - Quote
bongpacks wrote:Is the drake overpowered, heck no I wish it was. To get that fabled uber tank you guys keep talking about you'd have the DPS of a fail fit assault frigate.
Resists tank: 522 reinforced defence 64 541 eHP 548 DPS (not ever heated)
This is by a fail fitter.
CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.14 16:15:00 -
[83] - Quote
"Fail fit" Cyclone killed two C2 Sleeper battleships (one of them neuting) without having to warp out in just under nine minutes with T1 guns and drones. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Tyme Xandr
State Protectorate Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2011.10.14 17:01:00 -
[84] - Quote
After reading through this thread there are a few things that just dont make sense.
#1) Kinetic damage is an anti armor damage type. Shields have high kinetic resistance, armor doesnt. #2) A HAC is for use against other cruisers and under, not battlecruisers. Not saying HACs cant kill Battlecruisers, but that wasnt their intended use. #3) Tier 1 BC's are all broken. Prophecy is a tank with little other ability, Cyclone is a PVE ship that cant fit itself correctly. Ferox is a joke, Brutix is a glass cannon. #4) Tier 2 BC's are all specialized. Drake is high tank, low/mid DPS PVE or PVP support ship (depending on HAL, HL). Hurricane is high DPS, mid tank PVP boat (guns dont need cap, highest base speed), Harb is a high DPS, low tank, never reload PVP ship. And Myrm is a drone boat. #5) Caldari ships are the PVE ships of EVE. Drake, Raven, Golem, and Tengu are pretty much prefered over all other ships cept the Mach and sometimes the Nightmare depending on the situation/area. Guess what happens most the time in WHs? PVE.
Drake has many great points about it, but I've killed them with a Zealot. I've killed them with a Maelstrom. I've killed them with a Brutix. I've also had a lot of fun running around in drake fleets alpha launching enemies as well. My best suggestion to you is to fly a drake before you go crazy. Sure it may do well when your fighting NPCs, but try playing against some real ships sometime. Sure you wont be primaried ... but ... just stick around instead of running away when your main DPS is taken down. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.14 17:40:00 -
[85] - Quote
Tyme Xandr wrote: #3) Tier 1 BC's are all broken. Prophecy is a tank with little other ability, Cyclone is a PVE ship that cant fit itself correctly. Ferox is a joke, Brutix is a glass cannon. .
That is the main problem and reason for this thread I think.
I PvP in another Cyclone too. Love it when they shoot me, the only ship in the fleet with a good rep / boost and then they start going down while I tank them. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Tyme Xandr
State Protectorate Caldari State
3
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Posted - 2011.10.14 17:47:00 -
[86] - Quote
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:Tyme Xandr wrote: #3) Tier 1 BC's are all broken. Prophecy is a tank with little other ability, Cyclone is a PVE ship that cant fit itself correctly. Ferox is a joke, Brutix is a glass cannon. .
That is the main problem and reason for this thread I think. I PvP in another Cyclone too. Love it when they shoot me, the only ship in the fleet with a good rep / boost and then they start going down while I tank them.
And I can understand an outcry to 'fix' tier 1 BC's, but I don't think the drake should be changed (in accordance to the 'New Drake' title). The other battlecruisers should be tweaked in their own ways, but none of them should be similar at all.
The Harby and Myrm need tweaks, the cane and drake dont. The tier one BCs besides the brutix definitely need some looking into as well. But this applies to tier 1 and 2 frigates and some of the cruisers as well.
With CCPs new focus on 'fixing EVE' I hope they remember to take a hard look at the ships currently in game. I dont mind specializing and I think its great when ships do that, but it should be equal across the board in their different specialties. That might not make sense at first glance but lets all just think about that for a sec. Currently each race has a handful of ships that are usually always flown while the others are ignored ... shouldn't we at least make the ignored viable in some aspect?
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Jenshae Chiroptera
33
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Posted - 2011.10.14 21:12:00 -
[87] - Quote
Tyme Xandr wrote:... shouldn't we at least make the ignored viable in some aspect?
I totally agree but do feel this thread's thought process leading from nerfing a Drake to buffing the others is important when and particularly "why" they are being considered for improvements. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Jenshae Chiroptera
34
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Posted - 2011.10.16 13:38:00 -
[88] - Quote
Quote:Alli member > Woo! I can officially fly a Tengu! \o/ Jenshae Chiroptera > You were Draking it in a C4? o.O Alli member > I was Jenshae Chiroptera > Warp in - warp out? Alli member > With two repping-tengus? I haven't warped out more than twice in my carreer in here
Why would anyone want a Drake in a C4? This is a complete mystery to me. CSM - Do you think? You see if they ruin high sec and WHs, you are ripping the newbie uterus out of EVE and feeding it to the big alliances. When it is gone, they will starve and die. |
Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
11
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Posted - 2011.10.16 15:01:00 -
[89] - Quote
Rek Seven wrote:I'd prefer if other ships got a boost instead of ccp nerfing the **** out of things that people have trained for.
Since balance is relative, not absolute, boosting a competing ship is "nerfing the **** out of things that people have trained for". |
Fon Revedhort
Monks of War DarkSide.
9
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Posted - 2011.10.16 15:52:00 -
[90] - Quote
Gypsio III wrote:Rek Seven wrote:I'd prefer if other ships got a boost instead of ccp nerfing the **** out of things that people have trained for. Since balance is relative, not absolute, boosting a competing ship is "nerfing the **** out of things that people have trained for". How dare you use logic at EVE forums? 2008, CCP Zulu(park): "command ships are fine as is" 2011, CCP Greyscale: "is the Nighthawk actually underpowered?" Nice progress, guys. |
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