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Cecil Tanner
Lightning Squad
1
   |
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money. |
Amun Doshu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:07:00 -
[2] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
it will might bring the shooter guys to have interest in space and many will sub to eve to support their teams from the sky... simple? |
James Amril-Kesh
RAZOR Alliance
3156
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:09:00 -
[3] - Quote
Because DUST has microtransactions.
Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
Cecil Tanner
Lightning Squad
1
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Amun Doshu wrote:Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit? it will might bring the shooter guys to have interest in space and many will sub to eve to support their teams from the sky... simple?
Pretty risky given how much it must of cost to make dust 514 for that chance few people. |
Syn Fatelyng
Redanni
63
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
Quote:Citation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dust_514Unlike Eve Online, Dust 514 will not require a monthly subscription. It will instead use a micro-transaction model, making the game free to play. |
Randolph Rothstein
whatever corp.
311
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
its a conspiracy to get dust players pay for microtransactions to make ccp more money to make better eve ...huehue |
King Rothgar
CONTRATTO
IMPERIAL LEGI0N
343
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:11:00 -
[7] - Quote
Same business model as world of tanks and planet side 2. WoT seems to be doing fairly well, not sure on PS2. Money is made off of premium accounts (XP/resource boosts), cosmetic items and simply purchasing items instead of having to grind for 500 hours to get them.
The Troll is trolling. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
12584
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
F2P Gëá Non-profit. It's only the GÇ£to playGÇ¥ bit that is free, after allGǪ
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan. |
Randolph Rothstein
whatever corp.
311
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:22:00 -
[9] - Quote
people overpay when they see shiny stuff,sub might cost 15 bucks a month but give me some cute pet and stupid xmas costume and ill just say shut up and take my money
its actually a miracle that eve isnt f2p micro yet |
Rain6639
Team Evil
67
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:25:00 -
[10] - Quote
the current package is 20 USD for a permanent gun and suit.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
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silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
330
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:26:00 -
[11] - Quote
Dust == Pay to Win
Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing. |
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
349
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:28:00 -
[12] - Quote
Facebook shares are worth billions and Facebook has never made a dime.
Get it?
R.I.P. Vile Rat |
Rain6639
Team Evil
67
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:32:00 -
[13] - Quote
In terms of gameplay magnitude, I'm filing Dust next to FW.
I don't FW.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Stitcher
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
583
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
Free-to-play is actually the most profitable payment model the games industry has ever produced. I'd be very surprised if DUST didn't turn out to be extremely profitable.
An in-character blog and a video:
http://verinsjournal.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tu1mbsgo738
|
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
6905
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:38:00 -
[15] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money.
Dust has a cash shop where you can buy vanity stuff, skillpoint boosters, and so on. That's the revenue source.
Also it's a good advertising hook for EVE itself - anecdotally, quite a few Dust players have tried EVE.
MatrixSkye Mk2: "Remember: You consent to unconsensual PVP the moment you press the "Undock" button." |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
6905
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Dust == Pay to Win
What advantage can you get in Dust by paying for it that you can't get for free?
MatrixSkye Mk2: "Remember: You consent to unconsensual PVP the moment you press the "Undock" button." |
Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
349
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:40:00 -
[17] - Quote
Ioci wrote:Facebook shares are worth billions and Facebook has never made a dime.
Get it?
You are all wrong.
They are doing it so they can inflate their subscription numbers, crank up their share value and borrow more money.
R.I.P. Vile Rat |
Rain6639
Team Evil
67
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:41:00 -
[18] - Quote
equipment
would be like constantly undocking in noob ships in EVE, just so you don't have to pony up IRL money
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Lexmana
880
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
[quote=Stitcher]Free-to-play is actually the most profitable payment model the games industry has ever produced. I/quote]
Are you sure about that or is it just a 'feeling' that you have: http://www.businessinsider.com/here-are-the-top-10-highest-grossing-video-games-of-all-time-2012-6?op=1 |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
12584
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:46:00 -
[20] - Quote
Rain6639 wrote:equipment
would be like constantly undocking in noob ships in EVE, just so you don't have to pony up IRL money
Not quite. You can still earn your ISK for the equipment by just shooting stuff, and as the Dust-EVE integration moves on, it should be possible to earn it by getting paid by pod pilots.
Ponying up cash is mainly there to avoid the grind: either the XP grind by buying training boosters or the ISK grind by purchasing your equipment with AUR instead.
That's the genious of the F2P model: the grinders provide a dedicated base population that gives life to the servers; the drop-ins want in on the action and plunk down the cash to get the same stuff the grinders have without having to do the actual grinding. You don't need P2W to earn money from F2P because convenience is a much more compelling product.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan. |
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Rain6639
Team Evil
67
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Posted - 2013.01.10 14:47:00 -
[21] - Quote
permanent equipment
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
1047
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 14:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
Rain6639 wrote:permanent equipment
Not as useful as you might think.
It's only barely above the free stuff.
The good stuff you have to keep buying with ISK or Aurum.
FuzzWork Enterprises
http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/
Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
JamesCLK
251
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:03:00 -
[23] - Quote
The permanent Dragonfly dropsuit and Toxin SMG are essentially painted versions of militia gear. If you had done your research, you'd know this. |
Rain6639
Team Evil
67
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:03:00 -
[24] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:Rain6639 wrote:permanent equipment Not as useful as you might think. It's only barely above the free stuff. The good stuff you have to keep buying with ISK or Aurum.
JamesCLK wrote:The permanent Dragonfly dropsuit and Toxin SMG are essentially painted versions of militia gear. If you had done your research, you'd know this.
I never said it would be uber
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Thomas Hurt
Poteque Industries
76
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:04:00 -
[25] - Quote
Ioci wrote:Facebook shares are worth billions and Facebook has never made a dime.
Get it?
Facebook makes a ton of money on ad revenue, and frequently oscillates between net profit and net loss. thats not a very good comparison |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3318
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:08:00 -
[26] - Quote
Rain6639 wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:Rain6639 wrote:permanent equipment Not as useful as you might think. It's only barely above the free stuff. The good stuff you have to keep buying with ISK or Aurum. JamesCLK wrote:The permanent Dragonfly dropsuit and Toxin SMG are essentially painted versions of militia gear. If you had done your research, you'd know this. I never said it would be uber
So it gains you no advantage, and in fact is mostly cosmetic and convenient.
I'm pretty much okay with that.
I'll be even more okay with that when DUST (and EvE) players can resell them on the in game market.
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Rain6639
Team Evil
68
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:12:00 -
[27] - Quote
in terms of gameplay [sandbox], I think Dust = F2P is fair.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Toku Jiang
Jiang Laboratories and Discovery
108
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:18:00 -
[28] - Quote
It's FTP, but these games have been thriving. |
Rain6639
Team Evil
69
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:18:00 -
[29] - Quote
wut
http://www.dust514.com/game/free-to-play/
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
815
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:19:00 -
[30] - Quote
But, is it Fun2Play as well as Free2Play?
GÇ£You go into combat, and itGÇÖs NOT going to be WagnerGǪindustrial techno or really hard drum and bassGÇ¥
Reynir Hardarson, founding member of CCP Games, 2002. |
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Ioci
Bad Girl Posse
350
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:25:00 -
[31] - Quote
Thomas Hurt wrote:Ioci wrote:Facebook shares are worth billions and Facebook has never made a dime.
Get it? Facebook makes a ton of money on ad revenue, and frequently oscillates between net profit and net loss. thats not a very good comparison
They have no profit. They are in the hole. It's a fashion stock. Public knowledge, don't even go there.
R.I.P. Vile Rat |
Rain6639
Team Evil
69
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 15:26:00 -
[32] - Quote
vanity fair?
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2090
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 16:16:00 -
[33] - Quote
I spend more each month on my 'free' games than I do on my subbed ones. Sometimes a lot more.
It's a solid and proven business model.
Mr Epeen 
-ávOv |
Ginger Barbarella
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
1094
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 16:30:00 -
[34] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money.
The same way other F2P games bring in money: think NeX store for DUSTbunnies... Cash for shinies.
"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." -á --- Sorlac |
TheBlueMonkey
Don't Be a Menace
That Red Alliance
335
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 16:31:00 -
[35] - Quote
If you view it solely for what it is then yeah, it looks bad I guess (assuming no micro-transactions\hats)
If it is totally free to play then I imagine it'll be a lot like the recent story of Lego sending free stuff to some kid who lost some characters from a box set.
Sure they're giving away free stuff, but they're also generating good PR and free advertising (look at me talking about it)
In CCP's case, it'll make a much more accessible avenue to the eve universe, once people are in there's the curiosity element to things that may turn some players into eve players.
There's also the FP test bed part to it. You lot want walking in station, what better way to test then engine than starting up a FPS game to get all your models sorted prior to full release etc.
Personally I want stabbings in station, so, I'm hoping that's part of it.
Although more likely is that it's part of the whole wod thingy (although I've not read about that in a while so I'm probably off target).
anyway, basically, free isn't necessarily free and there are times when free can be free but the returns that it generates are more than worth the initial loss. |
TheBlueMonkey
Don't Be a Menace
That Red Alliance
335
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 16:32:00 -
[36] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:
It's a solid and proven business model.
It's a ****** business model and I hates it -¼_-¼
I like me a good old fashion subscription any day |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2091
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 16:49:00 -
[37] - Quote
TheBlueMonkey wrote:Mr Epeen wrote:
It's a solid and proven business model.
It's a ****** business model and I hates it -¼_-¼ I like me a good old fashion subscription any day
I can't disagree with you.
I didn't say it was a good business model, just solid and proven.
Mr Epeen
-ávOv |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
287
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:04:00 -
[38] - Quote
I imagine it will be about as "pay to win" as Eve is, which is not at all.
When a game relies enough on actual player skill and coordination between players, being able to buy your ingame currency is far from game-breaking and barely affects the overall game at all. It's a clever and so far successful business model for games. |
Rain6639
Team Evil
71
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:15:00 -
[39] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:I imagine it will be about as "pay to win" as Eve is, which is not at all.
When a game relies enough on actual player skill and coordination between players, being able to buy your ingame currency is far from game-breaking and barely affects the overall game at all. It's a clever and so far successful business model for games.
if that's true, what incentive does a newcomer have to stay among other players who have a head start 
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
287
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:20:00 -
[40] - Quote
Rain6639 wrote:if that's true, what incentive does a newcomer have to stay among other players who have a head start
Wanna try rephrasing that in a way that actually makes it responsive to what you quoted?
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Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
1048
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:36:00 -
[41] - Quote
What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start?
FuzzWork Enterprises
http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/
Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract. |
Rain6639
Team Evil
71
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:37:00 -
[42] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:I imagine it will be about as "pay to win" as Eve is, which is not at all.
When a game relies enough on actual player skill and coordination between players, being able to buy your ingame currency is far from game-breaking and barely affects the overall game at all. It's a clever and so far successful business model for games.
fair enough. it sounded a little convoluted to me, too tbh. you're saying Dust will not be pay-to-win, but based on skill as much as EVE. looking at this claim again, I see three things wrong with that statement which implies:
Purchased items will not significantly augment the player's ability to win <- a meritocracy
Success is mostly determined by player skill <- a gerontocracy
this would alienate newcomers. and the correct answer is... although ^ is a nice thought, Dust is a more appropriate environment than EVE to throw money at success.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
3202
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:43:00 -
[43] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start?
You can blob !
All the skillless noobs can blob up, then magic happens 
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Rain6639
Team Evil
71
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:43:00 -
[44] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start? You can blob ! All the skillless noobs can blob up, then magic happens
that too, and there is more to EVE than putting someone on the other side of a crosshair
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Varius Xeral
Galactic Trade Syndicate
287
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:43:00 -
[45] - Quote
Because player skill and cooperation aren't simple grind formulas like currency and items generally are.
Why compete in any game where everyone does start perfectly equal every time? Because it can still be fun. Now, if that inequality is simply a matter of real-life wealth, that does not generally make for a very entertaining game to play (maybe to watch though). However, in Eve, and hopefully Dust, real-life wealth really doesn't mean that much in most cases, and inequality based on player skill and inter-player coordination is far more palatable.
That said, this whole line of conversations is pointless of off-topic in my mind. Asking if a persistent skill-to-win game can work is ridiculous, as obviously it does.
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Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1414
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:48:00 -
[46] - Quote
Free to play is the future, and CCP knows this. Allowing free access and only charging people for convenience or vanity items can often make more income than a subscription model.
I guarantee CCP already have plans to make EVE itself free to play if subs drop enough.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Thomas Hurt
Poteque Industries
76
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:48:00 -
[47] - Quote
Ioci wrote:Thomas Hurt wrote:Ioci wrote:Facebook shares are worth billions and Facebook has never made a dime.
Get it? Facebook makes a ton of money on ad revenue, and frequently oscillates between net profit and net loss. thats not a very good comparison They have no profit. They are in the hole. It's a fashion stock. Public knowledge, don't even go there. Disclaimer: CCP aren't the broken aspect of this, I'm not saying they are being shady. They are one of the few companies making MMO's that have the revenue to support their investment needs. They have the unfortunate problem of low subs and any time they try and get support, the rhetorical reaction would be, "get more subs" because popularity takes president over profitable for some inexplicable reason.
Facebook is a company on the verge of profitability with a potentially massive upside if they can find a way to further monetize their huge customer base. I hope some day you are capable of factoring in the risk/reward of probabilities along with the magnitude of said probabilities, but it looks like youve got some growing up to do... |
Rain6639
Team Evil
72
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:52:00 -
[48] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:Because player skill and cooperation aren't simple grind formulas like currency and items generally are.
Why compete in any game where everyone does start perfectly equal every time? Because it can still be fun. Now, if that inequality is simply a matter of real-life wealth, that does not generally make for a very entertaining game to play (maybe to watch though). However, in Eve, and hopefully Dust, real-life wealth really doesn't mean that much in most cases, and inequality based on player skill and inter-player coordination is far more palatable.
That said, this whole line of conversations is pointless of off-topic in my mind. Asking if a persistent skill-to-win game can work is ridiculous, as obviously it does.
to remain on-topic, while Dust is Free-to-play, it benefits CCP because unlike EVE, Dust is a fast-twitch combat system that generates 1v1 pvp around every corner and Dust's pace of gameplay is 'drop in, start shooting.' improved weapon damage and defense available through microtransactions has a greater, immediate impact on pvp success than EVE.
I can't see why or how else it would be free-to-play.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Bagrat Skalski
Poseidaon
122
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:54:00 -
[49] - Quote
Quote:its actually a miracle that eve isnt f2p micro yet
They have no clue how to do it, and not make "Burn Jita" a permanent feature.
Inside mining barge, true story |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
3202
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:55:00 -
[50] - Quote
Varius Xeral wrote:That said, this whole line of conversations is pointless and off-topic in my mind. Asking if a persistent skill-to-win game can work is ridiculous, as obviously it does.
EVE is dying, though.
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
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Rain6639
Team Evil
72
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Posted - 2013.01.10 17:56:00 -
[51] - Quote
I think EVE, in contrast to Dust, should return to completely irl money subscription based.
also, I'm pretty sure I'm buying a 500GB Assassin's Creed III PS3 bundle today. all this talk has me... wound-up.
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Hedion's oracle
Shark Enterprises
35
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Posted - 2013.01.10 17:57:00 -
[52] - Quote
Another small benefit is Crossover Marketing, ..........some Dustplayers will cross over to EvEonline itself.
Error: Working As intended |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1414
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:58:00 -
[53] - Quote
Thomas Hurt wrote:Facebook makes a ton of money on ad revenue
Facebook didn't make 100 billion with a banner ad. 
Their business is selling your info, and business is good.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Rain6639
Team Evil
72
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 17:59:00 -
[54] - Quote
Hedion's oracle wrote: Another small benefit is Crossover Marketing, ..........some Dustplayers will cross over to EvEonline itself.
yah, that might be a benefit, and I thought of that, too. but it's not enough to have launched... Dust...
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Lexmana
882
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:01:00 -
[55] - Quote
Bane Necran wrote:Free to play is the future, and CCP knows this. Allowing free access and only charging people for convenience or vanity items can often make more income than a subscription model.
I guarantee CCP already have plans to make EVE itself free to play if subs drop enough.
Free to play needs about 10 to 100 times more players than a subscription game to generate the same level of income. It might be the future for many games but not for games like EVE. |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1414
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:06:00 -
[56] - Quote
Lexmana wrote:Free to play needs about 10 to 100 times more players than a subscription game to generate the same level of income. It might be the future for many games but not for games like EVE.
The number of current subscribers is tiny compared to how many would play if it were free. I don't think CCPs servers could handle it.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Rain6639
Team Evil
72
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:06:00 -
[57] - Quote
Lexmana wrote:Bane Necran wrote:Free to play is the future, and CCP knows this. Allowing free access and only charging people for convenience or vanity items can often make more income than a subscription model.
I guarantee CCP already have plans to make EVE itself free to play if subs drop enough. Free to play needs about 10 to 100 times more players than a subscription game to generate the same level of income. It might be the future for many games but not for games like EVE.
well it would be nice if they would stop double-dipping, and make up their mind 
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Shamus O'Reilly
Gungnirs' Point
I Know Right
50
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:15:00 -
[58] - Quote
Honestly profitability and popularity come hand in hand when it comes to gross income.
Whether F2P is more profitable than subscription based or like most console/computer games store bought comes down to the game's popularity also. The more who play the game, the more you make. Youre also comparing the top 10 highest grossing games of all time to F2P models which, so far, have lacked in TV advertisements and/or video advertisements. All of the games listed in that top 10 were well known by the general public, well made, and properly launched. Put it this way, ask a guy on the street if he's heard of CoD MW and if he's heard of WoT or Dust514 or even EVE Online, the guy will most likely say yes to the former and no to all 3 latters... |
Amun Doshu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:23:00 -
[59] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Steve Ronuken wrote:What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start? You can blob ! All the skillless noobs can blob up, then magic happens
yep, thats called gooneffect |
Muad 'dib
The Imperial Fedaykin
737
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:55:00 -
[60] - Quote
its really F2PBBIUPYDB
Free to play badly but if you pay you do better
http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg |
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Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2091
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 18:57:00 -
[61] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start?
PLEX and the Character Bazaar are all the incentive needed.
Mr Epeen
-ávOv |
Henry Haphorn
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
388
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:06:00 -
[62] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
According to Zion Shad as he was talking live a few days ago on Podside Podcast, he (or someone else) mentioned that he spoke to some of the Dust players and discovered that those who never heard about Eve Online are finally starting to hear about it and even wanting to try it out. With the Buddy invite system for Eve in place, newcomers were able to try out Eve for 21 days free. The many who began to like it even mentioned plans to subscribe because of the nature of Eve. Buddies who offered the invite then get rewarded as usual while CCP earns cash through new subscriptions while Dust players learn the ropes on how to later milk the system like a true capsuleer. Everyone wins.
That and micro-transactions. But unlike other MT models out there, Dust has absolutely no pay-to-win items. Not anymore at least as some of those items that did were merely bugs that got corrected later on. As of this point, those items are nothing more than a fashion statement just like the $70 monocle in the NeX store.
Adapt or Die |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1414
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:18:00 -
[63] - Quote
Henry Haphorn wrote:That and micro-transactions. But unlike other MT models out there, Dust has absolutely no pay-to-win items.
Every free to play game is now very aware that pay to win is a game killer.
I originally heard DUST players could spawn more tanks and things with MT, but according to the DUST FAQ it's now just been limited to 'customization' items, which is a wise move.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
12589
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:35:00 -
[64] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:What incentive does a player in Eve have to stay among other players who have a head start? The same incentive as those who have the head start: because it's a fun game to play and because having a head start isn't particularly important.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: newbie skill plan. |
Hannah Flex
Elite Market PvP Consortium
81
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:42:00 -
[65] - Quote
One thing I've noticed about many F2P games is that they will offer the basics for free. But in order for min/maxers to advance their character properly, then microtransactions are necessary to 'unlock' features. Some games call it VIP. But in order to be 'elite' L33t or the best of the best; the microtransaction is purchased without hesitation.
I would imagine fps duders are all about being pro, I mean lookit this guy
https://gate.eveonline.com/Profile/fpshacker
Just look at it |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2091
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:50:00 -
[66] - Quote
He'll fit into the EVE universe just fine.
Mr Epeen
-ávOv |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1414
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:50:00 -
[67] - Quote
I like knifing those guys repeatedly in BF3 until they have an aneurysm. Fragile little egos.
Seems hacks only work for the direction you're facing.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
Mathrin
Synthetic Solution
Synthetic Systems
54
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 19:58:00 -
[68] - Quote
Disclaimer: tinfoil hat time.
What if they are just slowing exposing us to f2p. If it works well on dust many good things will be said. Then later they wil say, "yea know this is working great for dust, it's not as bad as you think. Let's give it a try..." |
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
3325
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:03:00 -
[69] - Quote
Mathrin wrote:Disclaimer: tinfoil hat time.
What if they are just slowing exposing us to f2p. If it works well on dust many good things will be said. Then later they wil say, "yea know this is working great for dust, it's not as bad as you think. Let's give it a try..."
I don't think anyone who knows the difference between "Free to Play" and "Pay to Win" would care that much if EvE became "Free to Play".
To carve a successful niche for yourself in EVE you need to be able to out sell, out produce, out fight,-á out run, or out wit your competitors.
If you can do none of the above, your only option is to complain on the forums that somehow you are at a disadvantage using the exact same tool set-áas the rest of the player base. |
Tarvos Telesto
Blood Fanatics
713
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:08:00 -
[70] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money.
"how does dust 514 benifit CCP if its F2P"
In my opinion very good, espetialy here large ps3 community.
After spending three days in f2p mmo caled star trek online i notice a lot people use stuf - items that they can buy for real money using micro transactions, like ships, crew members, items.
You can buy even Eye Patch is some kind of monocle hehe ;)
EvE isn't game, its style of living. |
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Grimpak
Midnight Elites
Echelon Rising
696
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:13:00 -
[71] - Quote
Stitcher wrote:Free-to-play is actually the most profitable payment model the games industry has ever produced. I'd be very surprised if DUST didn't turn out to be extremely profitable.
not quite.
F2P is good on the short term. many games that were sub-based and went F2P had limited success at first and are now just a bit more than ghost towns.
[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote]
ain't that right |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
2091
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:25:00 -
[72] - Quote
Grimpak wrote:Stitcher wrote:Free-to-play is actually the most profitable payment model the games industry has ever produced. I'd be very surprised if DUST didn't turn out to be extremely profitable. not quite. F2P is good on the short term. many games that were sub-based and went F2P had limited success at first and are now just a bit more than ghost towns.
The caveat, of course, is that games designed from scratch to be F2P are pulling in cash hand over fist.
It would be a mistake, in my opinion, for EVE to go F2P, but for Dust...
Mr Epeen
-ávOv |
Cat Troll
Systems Federation
Coalition of Galactic Unity
184
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:32:00 -
[73] - Quote
silens vesica wrote:Dust == Pay to Win
As a Dust player I can tell you that the only thing that was better than normal gear you buy with ISK was a single gun, which was nerfed to the level of other ISK guns.
Plus you can get them off the EVE market in the same way like PLEX.
Lolwut:
"Yes, you kids don't know how lucky you have it. These days noobs get given free tackle ships for PvP but back in the old days the only tackle ships we were given were our pods. We had to use them to bump their rookie ships out of alignment to stop them warping off." |
Grimpak
Midnight Elites
Echelon Rising
696
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 20:58:00 -
[74] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:Grimpak wrote:Stitcher wrote:Free-to-play is actually the most profitable payment model the games industry has ever produced. I'd be very surprised if DUST didn't turn out to be extremely profitable. not quite. F2P is good on the short term. many games that were sub-based and went F2P had limited success at first and are now just a bit more than ghost towns. The caveat, of course, is that games designed from scratch to be F2P are pulling in cash hand over fist. It would be a mistake, in my opinion, for EVE to go F2P, but for Dust... Mr Epeen
still stops a bit too soon.
then again, I'm comparing them all to EVE, which, considering it's approaching it's 10th and growing, seems to be the exception to the rule.
[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]
[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote]
ain't that right |
Jan'tor
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
32
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 21:06:00 -
[75] - Quote
I'd love it if eve went f2p. Every single miner would start 80-boxing retrievers and the cost of my scythes would drop to nothing.
I'd even continue to pay for plex because as a premium subscriber my training speed would be doubled, **** yeah |
Callic Veratar
Power of the Phoenix
313
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 21:25:00 -
[76] - Quote
Grimpak wrote:still stops a bit too soon.
then again, I'm comparing them all to EVE, which, considering it's approaching it's 10th and growing, seems to be the exception to the rule.
You should check out what's happening with LOTRO. It's been growing pretty well.
DirectX 11, it's not rocket appliance! |
Bane Necran
Appono Astos
1416
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 21:31:00 -
[77] - Quote
Jan'tor wrote:Every single miner would start 80-boxing retrievers and the cost of my scythes would drop to nothing.
Good point. But the side effect of that is when everything is dirt cheap you'll have lots more PvP.
"The nice thing about quotes is that they give us a nodding acquaintance with the originator which is often socially impressive." ~Kenneth Williams |
KIller Wabbit
The Scope
Gallente Federation
311
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 21:42:00 -
[78] - Quote
PLEX sold to pay Dusty contracts?
CCP Punkturis-á "I want to get in on the goodposter circle jerk!"
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Rain6639
Team Evil
73
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 23:05:00 -
[79] - Quote
I just got back home, and i'm waiting out the 5pm traffic to pick up mah 500GB ps3 assassin's creed III bundle... the HD bundle is a bonus, but this is for Dust
you can include that in your pillowtalk with Sony tonight, CCP
"are you not entertained?"
-Maximus Decimus Meridius,
commander of the Armies of the North,
General of the Felix Legions
loyal servant to the true emperor: EVE
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
317
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 23:32:00 -
[80] - Quote
Simply put, other "Space" games have failed with pay to play, miserable fail, they switched over to micro transactions FTP and are now making money, end of story. |
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Rain6639
Team Evil
73
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 23:34:00 -
[81] - Quote
Kara Books wrote:Simply put, other "Space" games have failed with pay to play, miserable fail, they switched over to micro transactions FTP and are now making money, end of story.
yah, and farmville! wanna be my space neighbor?
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
385
|
Posted - 2013.01.10 23:47:00 -
[82] - Quote
Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money.
It's up to you to support them, buy a couple more accounts.
Besides I think the plan is to use Dust as a huge isk sink anyway.......
Petition for a Minimum bounty of 10 mil. Prevent useless bounties!
|
Rain6639
Team Evil
74
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 00:01:00 -
[83] - Quote
Beekeeper Bob wrote:Cecil Tanner wrote:So if dust 514 is F2P like i've heard why would CCP put in this much effort and R&D and money for no profit?
Not saying that they are greedy or anything but i've never heard of any company that wants to loose money. It's up to you to support them, buy a couple more accounts. Besides I think the plan is to use Dust as a huge isk sink anyway.......
qft. also, something about sudden clarity clarence and 'was isk sink this whole time'
IT WILL NEVER LEAVE CLOSED BETA
it was about PLEX this whole tiem!
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Lipbite
Express Hauler
584
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 01:25:00 -
[84] - Quote
If you are not paying - you are content which is being sold to actual customers.
P.S. Check Planetside 2 to see how F2P shooter game makes money. Like every other player is wearing multiple $5 camo suits, $2.5-7.5 decorative helmets, switching between $7 guns. |
Wacktopia
Noir.
Black Legion.
408
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 02:00:00 -
[85] - Quote
Randolph Rothstein wrote:people overpay when they see shiny stuff,sub might cost 15 bucks a month but give me some cute pet and stupid xmas costume and ill just say shut up and take my money
its actually a miracle that eve isnt f2p micro yet
EVE already has MT in the form of PLEX.
Sure, it's sub-based still but if you want a Titan you can just buy one with RL cash....
The bottom line is that now I have one of those annoying signatures. |
James Amril-Kesh
RAZOR Alliance
3185
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 02:18:00 -
[86] - Quote
Wacktopia wrote:Randolph Rothstein wrote:people overpay when they see shiny stuff,sub might cost 15 bucks a month but give me some cute pet and stupid xmas costume and ill just say shut up and take my money
its actually a miracle that eve isnt f2p micro yet EVE already has MT in the form of PLEX. Sure, it's sub-based still but if you want a Titan you can just buy one with RL cash....
Which pretty much nobody does.
Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
Rain6639
Team Evil
74
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 02:59:00 -
[87] - Quote
that's right if you want a titan you'd better MINE for it
if you need me, I'll be on youtube watching russian car accident videos |
Mars Theran
Red Rogue Squadron
1595
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 07:05:00 -
[88] - Quote
Tippia wrote:F2P Gëá Non-profit. It's only the GÇ£to playGÇ¥ bit that is free, after allGǪ
..which roughly includes creating an account and logging in the first time for many games, as beyond that it's a money grab. Thankfully, it appears Dust 514 is a much more player friendly model that actually lets you play the game effectively without requiring MTs to continue play.
Most of these games, you cannot access content without them, and attempting to play without buying "super" gear is utterly pointless. Personally, I think the model used in that way is just a means for wealthy players or rich kids with low self esteem to make themselves feel superior to others by having the ability to leverage their effectiveness and power with money.
Personally, I think if a Micro-transaction model can be expected to bring in 10-20$ a month from each player on average, then it is as good as a subscription model, or possibly better, for it`s ability to offer gameplay without cost indefinitely to new or very casual players, and for that it is capable of bringing in as much, or more than a subscription model from active and interested players, and without forcing anyone to do anything.
I`ve seen Devs `brag`about there companies focus on leveraging the game content and design, through changes to game mechanics often enough, to not only encourage, but enforce a climate of regular spending on MT based on their being advantageous and often required to continue playing or even succeed in achieving goals within the game.
Such that they actually target regular and consistent MTs by active, dedicated players on not only a daily basis, but an hourly one, with no less than $2-10 per transaction expected within each MT. The continuous requirement for players to spend money, based on game mechanics and design that force them to do so by leveraging content against their ability to gain resources and items to effectively challenge it.
That sort of thing pisses me off more than the models which simply require MT to access content, which those often do as well. I don't think I should have to explain why; but at the very least, it`s worth noting that the game becomes available to only a very limited selection of players.
Worth noting, but not what actually makes me angry, just to clarify. Obviously, I and others like me simply cannot afford to play these games. Wouldn't want to if I could, from my perspective.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub |
Thomas Gore
Black Dawn Rising
201
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 07:31:00 -
[89] - Quote
Randolph Rothstein wrote:its a conspiracy to get dust players pay for microtransactions to make ccp more money to make better eve ...huehue
You don't believe that yourself. We've already seen that CCP likes to use even their EVE-generated money rather on non-EVE things.
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James Amril-Kesh
RAZOR Alliance
3195
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 08:37:00 -
[90] - Quote
Thomas Gore wrote:Randolph Rothstein wrote:its a conspiracy to get dust players pay for microtransactions to make ccp more money to make better eve ...huehue You don't believe that yourself. We've already seen that CCP likes to use even their EVE-generated money rather on non-EVE things.
We have?
Phrases like "you can't nerf / buff X EVE is a Sandbox" have the same amount of meaning as "If this is a sack of potatoes then you can not carrot." - Alara IonStorm |
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Zol Interbottom
Nanotrasen Inc
66
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 09:18:00 -
[91] - Quote
I'm so glad CCP don't subscribe to the MindArk style of F2P, as in, marketing it as F2P but then making all but the most basic activity cost you money
When can I buy stuff with my EVE character and drop it to myself in DUST is what I want to know, I have a laptop for a reason
Nivin Sajjad > we fly perpetually networked, neural interfaced spaceships yet can't communicate coordinates to each other without physically passing back and forth little pieces of paper. it's weird |
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
625
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 09:25:00 -
[92] - Quote
Randolph Rothstein wrote:people overpay when they see shiny stuff,sub might cost 15 bucks a month but give me some cute pet and stupid xmas costume and ill just say shut up and take my money
its actually a miracle that eve isnt f2p micro yet
Eve is not f2p micro in that I do not pay to play it, and it has had microtransactions since before I started playing. Exactly.
From: Tommas De'Wins
To: Cipher Jones
Dude :) I got massives Basi hahahahahahaha |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
6943
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 09:33:00 -
[93] - Quote
Thomas Gore wrote:Randolph Rothstein wrote:its a conspiracy to get dust players pay for microtransactions to make ccp more money to make better eve ...huehue You don't believe that yourself. We've already seen that CCP likes to use even their EVE-generated money rather on non-EVE things.
It's a pretty good idea for a company not to rely on a single product lasting forever. Diversifying the product range and expanding the customer base is a very good idea indeed.
MatrixSkye Mk2: "Remember: You consent to unconsensual PVP the moment you press the "Undock" button." |
Karim alRashid
Red Federation
RvB - RED Federation
204
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 09:35:00 -
[94] - Quote
Rain6639 wrote:that's right if you want a titan you'd better MINE for it ... if you know what I mean
FYP
Sure ... "mine" ...
Pain is weakness leaving the body
http://www.youtube.com/user/AlRashidKarim/videos |
TheBlueMonkey
Don't Be a Menace
That Red Alliance
338
|
Posted - 2013.01.11 09:52:00 -
[95] - Quote
Mr Epeen wrote:TheBlueMonkey wrote:Mr Epeen wrote:
It's a solid and proven business model.
It's a ****** business model and I hates it -¼_-¼ I like me a good old fashion subscription any day I can't disagree with you. I didn't say it was a good business model, just solid and proven. Mr Epeen
Yeah, I avoid the whole thing as much as I can but there are people out there validating it.
In some cases, yes, microtransaction based mode can be good, if the game has been written with that in mind from the start.
more often than not it just comes across as a "how can we get the most amount of money out of people?" |
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