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Frying Doom
Zat's Affiliated Traders
1725
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Posted - 2013.03.03 00:29:00 -
[61] - Quote
Ok standard reply
If afk cloakers bother you then just close local, then you can't see them and they cant bother you
EvE players have no voice. Just don't bother voting for the CSM, really its not worth the energy.
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
3446
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Posted - 2013.03.03 02:22:00 -
[62] - Quote
Luv2localllll!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Nerf local)
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
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ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
2023
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Posted - 2013.03.03 22:22:00 -
[63] - Quote
Moving this from General Discussion to Features and Ideas.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
Captain
Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Interstellar Services Department |
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Commander Ted
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
513
|
Posted - 2013.03.03 23:38:00 -
[64] - Quote
NO MOAR AFK CLOAKING THREADS FOR CHRIST SAKE.
INSERT OBLIGATORY "REMOVE LOCAL" JOKE HERE
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174097 Separate all 4 empires in eve with lowsec. |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
50
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Posted - 2013.03.04 01:22:00 -
[65] - Quote
Interesting correlation regarding AFK cloaking: CCP have resolutely ignored thousands of calls for changes to cloaking mechanics over many years (maybe they considered the benefits/drawbacks during the first few dozen calls), now EVE Online has grown to over half a million subscriptions.
I guess they must be doing something right. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
3457
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 02:05:00 -
[66] - Quote
Imigo Montoya wrote:Interesting correlation regarding AFK cloaking: CCP have resolutely ignored thousands of calls for changes to cloaking mechanics over many years (maybe they considered the benefits/drawbacks during the first few dozen calls), now EVE Online has grown to over half a million subscriptions. I guess they must be doing something right.
They should also continuing buffing highsec more.
Please, buff highsec more.
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Unclaimed.
1389
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 02:16:00 -
[67] - Quote
I am highly amused by the suggestion that cloaking has no counter.
Every bottleneck gate a cloaked ship passes through forces it to be in a known quantity of space. Blame yourself if you cannot manage to make the effort needed to stop them.
As to afk cloaking, no counter? It is an absurd blind spot to make that claim, because it IS the counter... the counter to the absolute intel provided freely to everyone by local's Amazing IntelGäó.
Cloaking is already exposed by local. As local is an absolute factor, so is cloaking's concealment.
Exchange local for a less absolute manner of exposing cloaking. Something that requires player effort, and has no guarantee of success.
CCP will balance cloaking to match that, then.
Remember, it takes an absolute to balance another absolute, and balance is needed for gameplay.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Xen Solarus
Inner 5phere
292
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 07:14:00 -
[68] - Quote
Iminent Penance wrote:Xen Solarus wrote:Posting in another poorly disguised "nerf AFK cloaking" thread. Next!  If you think cloaking needs nerfing, you're just a macro miner who doesnt know the many ways to target a cloak camper, and that's your fault not mine. Don't disgrace this legitimate thread with your pathetic attempts at demeaning the pros of fair cloaking
Wow you like to make assumptions! Not sure how you got any of that from my single sentence. Though i'm confused, i thought YOU wanted afk cloaking nerfed? I certainly don't. Never harmed anyone, apart from cowards.
And i live in a wormhole, where there isn't a local, like a BOSS!
Post with your main, like a BOSS! |
Caitlyn Tufy
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
200
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 08:58:00 -
[69] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Imigo Montoya wrote:Interesting correlation regarding AFK cloaking: CCP have resolutely ignored thousands of calls for changes to cloaking mechanics over many years (maybe they considered the benefits/drawbacks during the first few dozen calls), now EVE Online has grown to over half a million subscriptions. I guess they must be doing something right. They should also continuing buffing highsec more. Please, buff highsec more.
Even though this is a troll/ironic comment, I'll bite: I doubt any new subscribers join the game because they know they'll be safe in the confines of Concord. They do so to play Internet spaceships. I honestly believe that the fear of dying is instilled in them mostly by bittervets ("if you'll enter null, you'll instantly die") and high sec bears ("we make most money here").
However, unlike what goon voice or James 315 are suggesting, I also honestly believe that the answer is not in outright nerf of high sec "to the ground". Why? Because that only tackles the second half of the message, but not the "instant death" part. James would say: "let them leave, EVE will be better without them". I don't think so. I think what he's missing is that we don't need to tackle the people - we need to tackle their beliefs. We need to give them a carrot for trying to live in low/null/WH, a way to attract them rather than trying to push them into it. However, James, although taking a somewhat extreme stance on the matter, is also sort of right - a rebalancing of high sec must be done in order to make null/low/WH more attractive, while at the same time avoiding dangerous power creep. For instance, I really, really, REALLY loved this article about Low Sec as an example of what should have been done.
So on the one hand, I agree with James' basic message, but on the other, I'm also hearing what for instance Ripard Teg is saying. I'm honestly hoping that both sides will be represented in the next CSM, as this conflict can spark a ton of very interesting compromises that we can all benefit from.
Back to original topic: I'm not against afk cloaking, as long as it doesn't use out-of-game software support (read: cyno bot). Null is too safe as it is, afk-cloaking introduces some risk again. The only thing I have trouble with is the relative safety of the afk cloaker, but then that's the selling point of the covert cloaks in the first place. |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1030
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 10:00:00 -
[70] - Quote
The tears in the OP are delicious. |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1030
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 10:04:00 -
[71] - Quote
oh my god
hahahahaha |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2134
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 10:29:00 -
[72] - Quote
:DDDDDD
wtf
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
forestwho
Foonfleet Investment Banking
38
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 10:31:00 -
[73] - Quote
If you want to carebear in peace go to high sec
FFS who let all these crying carebears on the forums these days.... |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion
Mildly Sober
62
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 10:41:00 -
[74] - Quote
forestwho wrote:If you want to carebear in peace go to high sec
FFS who let all these crying carebears on the forums these days....
I have always wondered how stupid pvp players can be.
No carebears = no ships, it realy is just that simple. So what if a carebear cries on the forums cause something aint going their way, you pvp players do it ingame when your ships cost too much or that there isn't enough ships on the market or someone drop a cyno in the wrong place and other stupid and less meaningfull things that most carebears get a huge laughs about. |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
51
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 13:00:00 -
[75] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:forestwho wrote:If you want to carebear in peace go to high sec
FFS who let all these crying carebears on the forums these days.... I have always wondered how stupid pvp players can be. No carebears = no ships, it realy is just that simple. So what if a carebear cries on the forums cause something aint going their way, you pvp players do it ingame when your ships cost too much or that there isn't enough ships on the market or someone drop a cyno in the wrong place and other stupid and less meaningfull things that most carebears get a huge laughs about.
Carebear. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
A carebear is somebody who goes out of their way to avoid PvP interactions. Miners in nullsec aren't necessarily carebears, in fact I know plenty who are very active PvPers, particularly in capital warfare (funnily enough their playstyle enables them to PvP in the big ships).
I used to be in a heavily industrial corp (hi guys) and had a great time when our systems got camped by a couple of dudes in stealth bombers. We all just packed up our stuff and headed over to their systems and filled them up with cloaky ships (multiboxing miners have a lot of alts), ganking anybody who dared undock and making sure they knew why we were there. Apparently their CEO got angry at the guys who came to AFK in our systems so they left under orders.
Long story short, miner != carebear, so I don't give a damn if carebears don't build any more ships because there are plenty of players who appreciate that this is a PvP game who make their income building ships. |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
2136
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 13:20:00 -
[76] - Quote
I find it so cute when bears think they are actually useful in any way
-á- All I really wanted was to build a castle among the stars - |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion
Mildly Sober
62
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 13:21:00 -
[77] - Quote
Imigo Montoya wrote:Azrael Dinn wrote:forestwho wrote:If you want to carebear in peace go to high sec
FFS who let all these crying carebears on the forums these days.... I have always wondered how stupid pvp players can be. No carebears = no ships, it realy is just that simple. So what if a carebear cries on the forums cause something aint going their way, you pvp players do it ingame when your ships cost too much or that there isn't enough ships on the market or someone drop a cyno in the wrong place and other stupid and less meaningfull things that most carebears get a huge laughs about. Carebear. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. A carebear is somebody who goes out of their way to avoid PvP interactions. Miners in nullsec aren't necessarily carebears, in fact I know plenty who are very active PvPers, particularly in capital warfare (funnily enough their playstyle enables them to PvP in the big ships). I used to be in a heavily industrial corp (hi guys) and had a great time when our systems got camped by a couple of dudes in stealth bombers. We all just packed up our stuff and headed over to their systems and filled them up with cloaky ships (multiboxing miners have a lot of alts), ganking anybody who dared undock and making sure they knew why we were there. Apparently their CEO got angry at the guys who came to AFK in our systems so they left under orders. Long story short, miner != carebear, so I don't give a damn if carebears don't build any more ships because there are plenty of players who appreciate that this is a PvP game who make their income building ships.
Told you all
Roime wrote:I find it so cute when bears think they are actually useful in any way
It's the same as when pvp players think that they can actuly do something else than measure who has the biggest ship or most systems. |
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Unclaimed.
1391
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 15:00:00 -
[78] - Quote
Imigo Montoya wrote:Carebear. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
A carebear is somebody who goes out of their way to avoid PvP interactions. Miners in nullsec aren't necessarily carebears, in fact I know plenty who are very active PvPers, particularly in capital warfare (funnily enough their playstyle enables them to PvP in the big ships).
I used to be in a heavily industrial corp (hi guys) and had a great time when our systems got camped by a couple of dudes in stealth bombers. We all just packed up our stuff and headed over to their systems and filled them up with cloaky ships (multiboxing miners have a lot of alts), ganking anybody who dared undock and making sure they knew why we were there. Apparently their CEO got angry at the guys who came to AFK in our systems so they left under orders.
Long story short, miner != carebear, so I don't give a damn if carebears don't build any more ships because there are plenty of players who appreciate that this is a PvP game who make their income building ships.
This fellow has the right attitude.
I do not think anyone wants to stop players from mining, but we do want them in the areas that match their play-styles.
If they want to avoid all PvP at all costs, then they need to keep that in high sec, where it is respected. If they abuse local to import that style into other areas, they are only dumbing down those rewards to match high sec as well.
I mine, but it is hard to make a competitive effort when you are force fed intel on such an absolute level. Since noone needs to try to gather it, it dumbs down our efforts and rewards.
Would someone please take the stabilizers / training wheels off our PvE system in null? We are ready to get the better rewards by earning them.
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
53
|
Posted - 2013.03.04 23:29:00 -
[79] - Quote
If they want to avoid all PvP at all costs, then EVE may not be the game for them, even in highsec. If you undock your ship it can be targeted and shot by other players. The only difference is that if somebody does that in highsec, they're guaranteed to get their ship blown up. If your highsec mission running ship is a loot pinata, it's well worth people's time and effort to blow it up, not to mention that other, often forgotten, resource that people spend ISK on getting: fun and entertainment.
This concept that some people are PvPers and some aren't is somewhat silly in EVE, because it is fundamentally a PvP game. That may not always come in the form of PvP ship based combat, but pretty much anything you do involves dealing with other players in some way. |
Mikaila Penshar
Take it Deep
64
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Posted - 2013.03.05 00:08:00 -
[80] - Quote
-------------------{{{cloaked response}}}--------------------
|
Nikk Narrel
Infinite Improbability Inc
Unclaimed.
1395
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 01:09:00 -
[81] - Quote
Mikaila Penshar wrote:
-------------------{{{cloaked response}}}--------------------
Ahhhh... Oh noes.. an AFK Poster!!
She could link who knows how many other threads here... Hot Linker alert!!!
Cloaking being on a ten minute manual cycle timer? (Author: Bree Okanata)
Fine. As long as there is a ten minute timer for being docked in a station. Also, you can't stop moving in the game. Just add in a way so every ten minutes you are randomly warped to the nearest other player. Keeps people from going AFK. |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
54
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 01:46:00 -
[82] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:Mikaila Penshar wrote:
-------------------{{{cloaked response}}}--------------------
Ahhhh... Oh noes.. an AFK Poster!! She could link who knows how many other threads here... Hot Linker alert!!!
You have some options here - you could post in groups using PvP fitted words and carry on having fun with your friends, or just dock up, ***** in local, then run to the forums to propose a change to AFK posting. |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion
Mildly Sober
62
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 06:52:00 -
[83] - Quote
Nikk Narrel wrote:Imigo Montoya wrote:Carebear. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
A carebear is somebody who goes out of their way to avoid PvP interactions. Miners in nullsec aren't necessarily carebears, in fact I know plenty who are very active PvPers, particularly in capital warfare (funnily enough their playstyle enables them to PvP in the big ships).
I used to be in a heavily industrial corp (hi guys) and had a great time when our systems got camped by a couple of dudes in stealth bombers. We all just packed up our stuff and headed over to their systems and filled them up with cloaky ships (multiboxing miners have a lot of alts), ganking anybody who dared undock and making sure they knew why we were there. Apparently their CEO got angry at the guys who came to AFK in our systems so they left under orders.
Long story short, miner != carebear, so I don't give a damn if carebears don't build any more ships because there are plenty of players who appreciate that this is a PvP game who make their income building ships. This fellow has the right attitude. I do not think anyone wants to stop players from mining, but we do want them in the areas that match their play-styles. If they want to avoid all PvP at all costs, then they need to keep that in high sec, where it is respected. If they abuse local to import that style into other areas, they are only dumbing down those rewards to match high sec as well. I mine, but it is hard to make a competitive effort when you are force fed intel on such an absolute level. Since noone needs to try to gather it, it dumbs down our efforts and rewards. Would someone please take the stabilizers / training wheels off our PvE system in null? We are ready to get the better rewards by earning them.
So if I want to avoid loosing ships to nerds who get off from blowing up ships, build ships and caps, mine while im drunk and have fun with other players laughing to pvp players and ripping the market off and all that makes me a bad player and I should stay in empire or quit eve? |
TheGunslinger42
All Web Investigations
1031
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 07:20:00 -
[84] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:So if I want to avoid loosing ships *snipped* I should stay in empire or quit eve?
Yes. Lowsec, nullsec and wormhole space is not for people who can't handle losing ships
|
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion
Mildly Sober
62
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 08:57:00 -
[85] - Quote
TheGunslinger42 wrote:Azrael Dinn wrote:So if I want to avoid loosing ships *snipped* I should stay in empire or quit eve? Yes. Lowsec, nullsec and wormhole space is not for people who can't handle losing ships
You do realise how stupid you look like every single time you give that comment?
And it's funny that you want to reamove carebears from the game cause they are targets to you. And if they are better at avoiding you.... well that just tells everyone that quite bad at hunting carebears.
Plus if CCP would remove the carebear side of the game like you want... well it would not be EvE anymore after that would it?
oh so that we wont get so much off track. Give players more tools to find cloaked ships. Nerf cloaks more. Thank you |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
60
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 10:03:00 -
[86] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:oh so that we wont get so much off track. Give players more tools to find cloaked ships. Nerf cloaks more. Thank you
I believe the phrase is HTFU.
Cloaks are fine as they are. If somebody is cloaking, they can't hurt you. If they are AFK they can't hurt you. If they are AFK cloaking, they really can't hurt you. If they decloak and attack you, then they're not AFK or cloaking anymore. |
Imigo Montoya
Abraxsys
Get Off My Lawn
60
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 10:10:00 -
[87] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:TheGunslinger42 wrote:Azrael Dinn wrote:So if I want to avoid loosing ships *snipped* I should stay in empire or quit eve? Yes. Lowsec, nullsec and wormhole space is not for people who can't handle losing ships You do realise how stupid you look like every single time you give that comment?
The irony of this post is astounding. Lowsec, nullsec, and WH space are all places where CONCORD don't operate, and players are free to attack your ship with little or no game-enforced consequences. You therefore have to deal with losing a ship, because it's simply a matter of time before you do (provided you ever undock in these places).
This is a game that centres around the construction and destruction of ships. The above mentioned places are fantastic for carrying about the latter activity, therefore if you want to avoid losing ships you should stay out of these places. |
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Late Night Alliance
2042
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 11:04:00 -
[88] - Quote
Azrael Dinn wrote:And it's funny that you want to reamove carebears from the game cause they are targets to you. And if they are better at avoiding you.... well that just tells everyone that quite bad at hunting carebears.
No one is suggesting the "removal" of carebears. The majority of us just find it extremely difficult to figure out why someone who wishes to avoid conflict and ship on ship violence would choose to spend his/her time out in a part of the game that is intended to be one of the most dangerous.
And yet it is not. Because as soon as someone "non-blue" enter local, everyone in system docks up and denies any hostile group the chance to do any "real" damage.
Azrael Dinn wrote:Plus if CCP would remove the carebear side of the game like you want... well it would not be EvE anymore after that would it?
Interesting fact: many PvPers do industry and mining on the side (to make money and/or replace their own ships/equipment). No one ever talks about this though because such people know better than to reveal that they do those activities (the best way to defend yourself to keep your enemies ignorant).
There are also plenty of other [true] industrialists and miners who understand how to manage risk and work in tandem with their more bloodthirsty brethren.
Azrael Dinn wrote:oh so that we wont get so much off track. Give players more tools to find cloaked ships. Nerf cloaks more. Thank you
When local is nerfed, cloaks can be nerfed.
And yes... local is the problem. AFK cloaking is done in response to local's ability to report anyone and everyone in system without error or delay. It allows people to avoid conflict where there should be conflict.
And if cloaks are nerfed, something similar can be achieved using an interceptor, ECCM, and implants ("unprobable" setups still exist).
And your main complaint comes from the ability for one ship to call a "hotdrop"... that's NOT the fault of cloaking ships... that's an issue with cyno and jump bridging mechanics.
Change isn't bad, but it isn't always good. Sometimes, the oldest and most simple of things can be the most elegant and effective. |
Azrael Dinn
The 20th Legion
Mildly Sober
62
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 11:36:00 -
[89] - Quote
ShahFluffers wrote:
And your main complaint comes from the ability for one ship to call a "hotdrop"... that's NOT the fault of cloaking ships... that's an issue with cyno and jump bridging mechanics.
Oh not at all... I just want to find those cloaked bastards from the empitiness of space and shoot them nothing else  Thats the only reason I'm complaining about cloaked ships (includes every single module that allows ships to cloak).
And yes local remains as a big problem. |
Luc Chastot
Gentleman's Corp
251
|
Posted - 2013.03.05 11:46:00 -
[90] - Quote
1/10
Lock for trolling.
Make it idiot-proof and someone will make a better idiot. |
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