| Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |

Simon Louvaki
Sengokuvaa Corporation
21
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 19:27:00 -
[31] - Quote
The Sengokuvaa Corporation would like to echo Mrs. Otsito offer as well. "Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu." |

Lyn Farel
Kitzless
395
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 20:29:00 -
[32] - Quote
Anabella Rella wrote:Lyn Farel wrote:I wonder why I even bothered to emancipate slaves and handle the willing ones to the Republic. This is a rather shallow joke. Better to let you all deal with Lord Crow instead.
Was that achievement sanctionned under the proxy war, by the way ? What? What do you mean? You're siding with extremists like Crow now, Farel?
Not really, why ?
Mensha Khael Crow wrote:This is the beginning of the same song dance again.
The heathens either understand what they have done and lie of it or are in need of a lesson. I believe the end result should be quite similar on Imperial policies.
Let us hope Ammatar mandate and Khanid Kingdom will now offcially join the militias conflict.
I would rather like to see the Mandate stay out of that nonsensical war and concentrate on more urgent issues. |

Mensha Khael Crow
House Murder
39
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 20:35:00 -
[33] - Quote
Mensha Khael Crow wrote:This is the beginning of the same song dance again.
The heathens either understand what they have done and lie of it or are in need of a lesson. I believe the end result should be quite similar on Imperial policies.
Let us hope Ammatar mandate and Khanid Kingdom will now offcially join the militias conflict.
I would rather like to see the Mandate stay out of that nonsensical war and concentrate on more urgent issues.[/quote]
Legal ability for the Mandate navy to fire upon any TLF vessels that cross the Mandate boundries. Or just declare it will be done regardless but since republic is using it's capsuleer militia to assist in breaching the Mandate sovereignity not taking steps against it would be irresponcible. |

Rodj Blake
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1199
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 20:38:00 -
[34] - Quote
Jinari Otsito wrote:Rodj Blake wrote:Well, this certainly puts EM's past claims that they don't illegally steal slaves from their owners into context. The news article says EM simply provided an escort out. The actual logistic operation was by a different corporation. However, this raises an interesting question. What laws governs such things? Amarrian laws? Republic laws? When the people are liberated, which law holds sway?
EM aided and abetted illegal activity according to the laws of the region in which they were operating.
Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |

Lyn Farel
Kitzless
395
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 20:45:00 -
[35] - Quote
Mensha Khael Crow wrote:Lyn Farel Mensha Khael Crow wrote:This is the beginning of the same song dance again.
The heathens either understand what they have done and lie of it or are in need of a lesson. I believe the end result should be quite similar on Imperial policies.
Let us hope Ammatar mandate and Khanid Kingdom will now offcially join the militias conflict.
I would rather like to see the Mandate stay out of that nonsensical war and concentrate on more urgent issues. [/quote wrote:
Legal ability for the Mandate navy to fire upon any TLF vessels that cross the Mandate boundries. Or just declare it will be done regardless but since republic is using it's capsuleer militia to assist in breaching the Mandate sovereignity not taking steps against it would be irresponcible.
TLF conventionnal vessels are not allowed to cross the Mandate boundaries. TLF capsuleers are, and they could be denied that access as well and hunted by the Ammatar Fleet, but the culprits here are not part of the TLF and can freely move in Mandate space, or Amarrian space as well.
However they are under CONCORD jurisdiction, and I would really like to know if that action was sanctionned under the terms of the proxy war. Which is rather unlikely since the parties involved are not part of any legal entity like the TLF.
Then, the logical question is, what is CONCORD doing ? This is rather disappointing. |

Lyn Farel
Kitzless
395
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 21:33:00 -
[36] - Quote
After complementary information, it appears that I did not take into consideration the possibility for Freedom Extension to only be the transport contractor and a capsuleer the actual owner of the slaves.
Could someone bring up a decent source of information to prevent further speculation ? |

von Khan
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
77
|
Posted - 2013.01.17 21:56:00 -
[37] - Quote
The first sign of corruption in a society is that the end justifies the means, and this is a fine example.
I wish to pledge my support to all the victims of this crime. From wherever refugee camp they get dumped into, I will offer safe passage to rejoin their loved ones back home.
von Khan Philosopher |

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
735
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 05:58:00 -
[38] - Quote
Lyrah Okkus wrote:I wasn't even a slave. There are plenty of people with Matar blood and features living free as Amarr citizens, thanks to the wisdom of the Reclamation, and terrorists on a smash and grab invasion aren't always careful.
Thank you, for this is something I also know all too well.
Lyrah Okkus wrote:Myself and my family was kidnapped in such a raid. The refugee camps are little better than a prison without bars and a re-education camp. Shows of religious faith in God was harshly punished as a sign of some "invasion", but it was the Matar who were the invaders. There was no shortage of the faithful there, though. The experience is a gift of burden and a test of faith, and a lot of my fellow prisoners just couldn't pass that test. That doesn't mean that they were happy and anxious to be kidnapped, it just means that they were human, and would rather praise whatever rude god is put in front of them in return for safety. I consider myself blessed to have found my way back to civilization from there.
Our stories almost alike, then. Be grateful you weren't forced into conscription for their "shadow" army.
Simon Louvaki wrote:What is to become of these million freed slaves? Are you providing job placement and integration service?
See above.
I can only wonder how many people like Lyrah and myself these fools have created in their latest raid. How surprised they will be when those guns that they're handing out get turned back upon them? They're think they're strengthening their little junta, but all they're really doing is setting themselves up for a revolution of the Faithful within their own borders. EvE Forum Bingo |

Simon Louvaki
Sengokuvaa Corporation
21
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 06:13:00 -
[39] - Quote
Mrs. Luftschreck,
To suit my own conscious, I felt the need to see if they would publicly rebuff what I already knew in heart. I spent a large portion of my young life in the Khanid Kingdom and the Ammatar Mandate; My father being a State diplomat to the Kingdom.
I've met many families who've lived perfectly happy lives as slaves, free of Vitoc and the virtual sink whole that is the Minmatar Republic. I've even seen first hand the tragedy of many of these 'freedom raids'. While I can't approve of slavery, I adhore the violence and destruction caused by many of these 'freedom fighters' who so callously destroy the lives of those they seek to rescue. "Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu." |

Joantir Sintar
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
3
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 09:23:00 -
[40] - Quote
Freedom Extension doing exactly what their name suggests, Our Alliance is ready to help them and EM in any future operations and support those already freed. |

Luna Mori
AmmuNacionale
43
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 11:15:00 -
[41] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote: I can only wonder how many people like Lyrah and myself these fools have created in their latest raid. How surprised they will be when those guns that they're handing out get turned back upon them? They're think they're strengthening their little junta, but all they're really doing is setting themselves up for a revolution of the Faithful within their own borders.
For every two who think they were wronged and would desperately want to return to the bosom of the Empire there must be hundreds of thousands who would embrace freedom and the new possibilities ahead. General Secretary, Ani Tribal Assembly |

Rodj Blake
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1201
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 11:26:00 -
[42] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:Katran Luftschreck wrote: I can only wonder how many people like Lyrah and myself these fools have created in their latest raid. How surprised they will be when those guns that they're handing out get turned back upon them? They're think they're strengthening their little junta, but all they're really doing is setting themselves up for a revolution of the Faithful within their own borders. For every two who think they were wronged and would desperately want to return to the bosom of the Empire there must be hundreds of thousands who would embrace freedom and the new possibilities ahead.
That's a big assumption.
Most of these slaves will have been born and raised in the Mandate or the Empire. Many will have no idea about conditions in the Republic. A lot probably aren't even Minmatar.
And yet the Shakorite government and their EM minions have decided that they know what's best for them. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |

Luna Mori
AmmuNacionale
43
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 13:09:00 -
[43] - Quote
I was being conservative with my estimate and had originally wanted to make an even bigger assumption. Maybe some details will emerge in the near future.
Freedom Extension, not the Republic government, along with EM are the parties involved, I think, and have the necessary power and resources to facilitate this. The welfare and eventual resettlement of these people must be very high on their agenda. An operation like this, along with the raid itself, for a small city-sized population must have taken a great deal of thought and planning. General Secretary, Ani Tribal Assembly |

Silas Vitalia
Nobilta Nera JIHADASQUAD
576
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 13:24:00 -
[44] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:
Freedom Extension, not the Republic government, along with EM are the parties involved, I think, and have the necessary power and resources to facilitate this. The welfare and eventual resettlement of these people must be very high on their agenda. An operation like this, along with the raid itself, for a small city-sized population must have taken a great deal of thought and planning.
A great deal of planning, not a great deal of thought. Sabik now, Sabik forever |

Joantir Sintar
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 13:29:00 -
[45] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:
And yet the Shakorite government and their EM minions have decided that they know what's best for them.
And that's no different to the Empire or Mandate knowing what's best for them?
|

Atlas Zao-tsu
University of Caille Gallente Federation
13
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 14:09:00 -
[46] - Quote
Joantir Sintar wrote:
And that's no different to the Empire or Mandate knowing what's best for them?
Would you be comfortable if the answer was no, it's the same? |

Rodj Blake
Praetorian Auxiliary Force Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1201
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 14:15:00 -
[47] - Quote
Joantir Sintar wrote:Rodj Blake wrote:
And yet the Shakorite government and their EM minions have decided that they know what's best for them.
And that's no different to the Empire or Mandate knowing what's best for them?
The difference is that the Empire (and by extension the Mandate) does know what's best for them. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori. |

Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
247
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 16:10:00 -
[48] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:I was being conservative with my estimate and had originally wanted to make an even bigger assumption. Maybe some details will emerge in the near future.
Freedom Extension, not the Republic government, along with EM are the parties involved, I think, and have the necessary power and resources to facilitate this. The welfare and eventual resettlement of these people must be very high on their agenda. An operation like this, along with the raid itself, for a small city-sized population must have taken a great deal of thought and planning.
Here we encounter the difference between deeds and tasks. The raid was a deed, no doubt it required anywhere close to a month of planning, preparation and practice for the prime instigator(s). It then took something like a day or two to set up and execute. And now the deed is done.
A deed, once done, is done. But the responsibilities inherent in feeding, housing, educating, paying and organising this many people is a task. Tasks, when done, return afresh the very next morning. Doing a deed and continuously completing a task require very different resources, mindsets, funding and preparations.
I would add that these freed slaves would not be the first to be gloriously and bravely seized and then abandoned on some run-down and unfunded rats nest to be left to their own devices. It is, in fact, virtually a stereotype of the Republic to do so. |

Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
1695
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 16:12:00 -
[49] - Quote
Rodj Blake wrote:The difference is that the Empire (and by extension the Mandate) does know what's best for them.
Which is still no less a matter of opinion than the Republic claiming the same. The difference is that if the slaves really want to leave the Republic, they can. Mane 614
|

Sepherim
Imperial Shipment Amarr Empire
150
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 16:14:00 -
[50] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:Freedom Extension, not the Republic government, along with EM are the parties involved, I think, and have the necessary power and resources to facilitate this. The welfare and eventual resettlement of these people must be very high on their agenda. An operation like this, along with the raid itself, for a small city-sized population must have taken a great deal of thought and planning.
Right, because they've been doing so well up to now in taking care of every need of their population and groups of freed slaves. Sepherim Catillah; Ex-Imperial Navy Officer |

Simon Louvaki
Sengokuvaa Corporation
22
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 16:50:00 -
[51] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:Katran Luftschreck wrote: I can only wonder how many people like Lyrah and myself these fools have created in their latest raid. How surprised they will be when those guns that they're handing out get turned back upon them? They're think they're strengthening their little junta, but all they're really doing is setting themselves up for a revolution of the Faithful within their own borders. For every two who think they were wronged and would desperately want to return to the bosom of the Empire there must be hundreds of thousands who would embrace freedom and the new possibilities ahead.
Mrs. Mori,
I don't want to presume to know you, but have you ever been a slave? Most of these people have spent their entire lives within the institution of slavery with every basic need of life fulfilled, and at that their entire family line has up to a point. A more correct estimate would more likely be 'for every two who desire freedom there are thousands who would rather just be left alone'. This is the most apolitical and logical approach given they generally have no notion of what 'freedom' is. How does one desire something they have no notion of? spend some time among the people on these worlds, rather than just looking down at them from your camera drones. There is certainly greatness that many have that is being squandered, and if they wish to be free then they have every right to be so, but as usual, these 'liberation' efforts aren't taking stock of who wish's to leave and who doesn't.
You yourself verified that thought by simply assuming everyone you 'free' should want it.
Shouldn't EM and Freedom Extension be focusing their efforts on providing for the Matari people and former slaves of the Ninth Generation at home the support they need rather than fueling the already poor situation by flooding even more people into the broken system?
Respectfully,
Simon Louvaki "Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu." |

Fey Ivory
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
47
|
Posted - 2013.01.18 20:49:00 -
[52] - Quote
I wont take sides in how this was done, and if it were the right or wrong way
But as iwe been studying human history... i think some underestimate the power of the human imagination and mind, it might been nine generations, but what is said in whispers, becomes a tale, and will linger on through generations, it might be in the end far from the truth and reality, but considering how this was done, it only feels logical that many of those freed were part in organicing this from their side, you cant just gather up that many people on such short time unless there is atleast some organising factor... |

No Mauk'Ob
Murientor Tribe Defiant Legacy
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 04:01:00 -
[53] - Quote
I commend Freedom Extension and EM on this operation.
A pity no Ammatar or their Ammar Handlers were killed in the process... but I suppose you take what you can get.
|

Simon Louvaki
Sengokuvaa Corporation
23
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 04:31:00 -
[54] - Quote
Fey Ivory wrote:I wont take sides in how this was done, and if it were the right or wrong way
But as iwe been studying human history... i think some underestimate the power of the human imagination and mind, it might been nine generations, but what is said in whispers, becomes a tale, and will linger on through generations, it might be in the end far from the truth and reality, but considering how this was done, it only feels logical that many of those freed were part in organicing this from their side, you cant just gather up that many people on such short time unless there is atleast some organising factor...
Of course, but then again, I believe the Elder Fleet struck with quite single handedly with the a few plants within the Ammatar government. If I recall correctly, the Mandate's Governor even had to reassure the people that the invaders were there to 'free' them and encouraged them not to fight invading fleet which suggests such operations are not always done with knowing consent of the population. My intention at heart, however, was only discovering what was to become of these people now that they have been taken from Ammatar space.
It takes more than just releasing someone from the physical bonds of slavery to make someone free. Without proper education and reintroduction into Matari society, these people may as well have remained within the Empire; she would have been a far kinder mistress than the cold and unforgiving 'freedom' of the market. "Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu." |

Flavius Arcturus
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
3
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 09:03:00 -
[55] - Quote
von Khan wrote:The first sign of corruption in a society is that the end justifies the means, and this is a fine example.
I wish to pledge my support to all the victims of this crime. From wherever refugee camp they get dumped into, I will offer safe passage to rejoin their loved ones back home.
I will surely second this. The rash actions have been carried out with no consideration to those being kidnapped *erhem* "liberated". These men and women you've freed will end up in a refugee camp, in squalid conditions, and with little to no resources. I will gladly assist in returning these kidnapped individuals to their homes to be reunited with their loved ones. "There will be neither compassion nor mercy; Nor peace, nor solace For those who bear witness to these Signs And still do not believe." - The Scriptures, Book of Reclaiming 25:10 |

Luna Mori
AmmuNacionale
46
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 11:14:00 -
[56] - Quote
Flavius Arcturus wrote:von Khan wrote:The first sign of corruption in a society is that the end justifies the means, and this is a fine example.
I wish to pledge my support to all the victims of this crime. From wherever refugee camp they get dumped into, I will offer safe passage to rejoin their loved ones back home. I will surely second this. The rash actions have been carried out with no consideration to those being kidnapped *erhem* "liberated". These men and women you've freed will end up in a refugee camp, in squalid conditions, and with little to no resources. I will gladly assist in returning these kidnapped individuals to their homes to be reunited with their loved ones.
There are at least three schemes which take rescued, freed, liberated, or stolen slaves and provide welfare, shelter, reintegration, repatriation, etc. I have seen one and it did not look like a refugee camp. It was not squalid and had plenty of resources. It used the very latest Smartfab technology to provide accommodation. There were herds of livestock; a well-stocked medical centre; food and water. All of which is provided by capsuleer donations. The people did not look lost, like children. Instead they looked intent, purposeful, and keen to be independent. They looked hopeful.
The idea that these people cannot cope without you is almost laughable. That is what must really scare slavers. Discovering that those children you love so much - who can't possibly survive without your grace and guidance, actually can. It must be crushing to realise that your love simply wasn't enough, or that it is unwanted. There's a hole, in your life. General Secretary, Ani Tribal Assembly |

Flavius Arcturus
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
5
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 12:19:00 -
[57] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:Flavius Arcturus wrote:von Khan wrote:The first sign of corruption in a society is that the end justifies the means, and this is a fine example.
I wish to pledge my support to all the victims of this crime. From wherever refugee camp they get dumped into, I will offer safe passage to rejoin their loved ones back home. I will surely second this. The rash actions have been carried out with no consideration to those being kidnapped *erhem* "liberated". These men and women you've freed will end up in a refugee camp, in squalid conditions, and with little to no resources. I will gladly assist in returning these kidnapped individuals to their homes to be reunited with their loved ones. There are at least three schemes which take rescued, freed, liberated, or stolen slaves and provide welfare, shelter, reintegration, repatriation, etc. I have seen one and it did not look like a refugee camp. It was not squalid and had plenty of resources. It used the very latest Smartfab technology to provide accommodation. There were herds of livestock; a well-stocked medical centre; food and water. All of which is provided by capsuleer donations. The people did not look lost, like children. Instead they looked intent, purposeful, and keen to be independent. They looked hopeful. The idea that these people cannot cope without you is almost laughable. That is what must really scare slavers. Discovering that those children you love so much - who can't possibly survive without your grace and guidance, actually can. It must be crushing to realise that your love simply wasn't enough, or that it is unwanted. There's a hole, in your life.
"There will be neither compassion nor mercy; Nor peace, nor solace For those who bear witness to these Signs And still do not believe." - The Scriptures, Book of Reclaiming 25:10 |

Lyn Farel
Kitzless
397
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 13:06:00 -
[58] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:
There are at least three schemes which take rescued, freed, liberated, or stolen slaves and provide welfare, shelter, reintegration, repatriation, etc. I have seen one and it did not look like a refugee camp. It was not squalid and had plenty of resources. It used the very latest Smartfab technology to provide accommodation. There were herds of livestock; a well-stocked medical centre; food and water. All of which is provided by capsuleer donations. The people did not look lost, like children. Instead they looked intent, purposeful, and keen to be independent. They looked hopeful.
It is good to know that you saw one. |

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
741
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 13:28:00 -
[59] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:There are at least three schemes which take rescued, freed, liberated, or stolen slaves and provide welfare, shelter, reintegration, repatriation, etc.
The first of which being to force them into military service for the Republic. The second is "re-education camps" where they get programmed into proper little patridiots. The third is the mass execution of those who refuse to bend or break.
Luna Mori wrote:I have seen one and it did not look like a refugee camp. It was not squalid and had plenty of resources.
No argument there. The training camps & staitons they dragged me around were never lacking for equipment, but then again the military is like, what, 90% of the Republic's budget or something?
Luna Mori wrote:It used the very latest Smartfab technology to provide accommodation.
Really? Who'd you steal it from?
Luna Mori wrote:There were herds of livestock;
No, those were your men. Oink oink grunt ohh Grok get big mirroshades! Grok look cool! Urg gah smash Amarr grunt ooof!
Luna Mori wrote:a well-stocked medical centre; food and water. All of which is provided by capsuleer donations.
Because God forbid the Republic government spend 0.10 ISK on keeping non-military personnel in good health. EvE Forum Bingo |

Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
741
|
Posted - 2013.01.19 13:29:00 -
[60] - Quote
Luna Mori wrote:The people did not look lost, like children. Instead they looked intent, purposeful, and keen to be independent. They looked hopeful.
Smile for the camera kiddies if you want to eat sometime this week!
Hmm, I wonder if they stuck all the footage they had of me during my forced conscription down the propaganda department's memory hole yet out of embarrassment or if it's still out there somewhere? Just because it would be funny to see the footage of "See this bright young Brutor girl, freed from a life of slavery and bondage as she trains to be a capsuleer pilot for the mighty Republic, to go forth and free her comrades in chains back in the evil Empire!" I'd get a real kick out of splicing that together with the gun-cam footage of the Republic ships I blew up crossing the border back home to the Mandate, and then, oh I dunno, turn it into a holo-display for the Jarizza memorial where my parents were buried.
Luna Mori wrote:The idea that these people cannot cope without you is almost laughable. That is what must really scare slavers. Discovering that those children you love so much - who can't possibly survive without your grace and guidance, actually can. It must be crushing to realise that your love simply wasn't enough, or that it is unwanted. There's a hole, in your life.
Funny, I was just going to say the same thing about you.
EvE Forum Bingo |
| |
|
| Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 6 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |