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Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
9
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Posted - 2013.02.02 10:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
This is a joke, right? |
Tsobai Hashimoto
FATAL Warfare Hopeless Addiction
111
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Posted - 2013.02.02 10:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Scorpyn wrote:This is a joke, right?
its free2play stuff, how it works
honestly im not sure why people dont just use vent or TS3 anyways, can that run on the PS3? if not, there are ways around that too |
Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
9
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Posted - 2013.02.02 22:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
Tsobai Hashimoto wrote:Scorpyn wrote:This is a joke, right? its free2play stuff, how it works honestly im not sure why people dont just use vent or TS3 anyways, can that run on the PS3? if not, there are ways around that too Afaik you can't use TeamSpeak, Ventrilo and similar on the PS3.
Those with laptops (or another computer) close enough to the PS3 should be able to use TS3 or similar.
The problem I have with this is that I consider voice to be a core game mechanic in this type of game.
I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
If you want to charge for pay to win features you should at least TRY to make it subtle, like you do with the main game where you can buy isk with plex (which I also hate, if I hadn't started playing before that was allowed there is no way I'd have kept playing). |
El Cymech
Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation
4
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Posted - 2013.02.02 23:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Scorpyn wrote:
I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
So you want 100% completely free everything.
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Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
9
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Posted - 2013.02.03 01:01:00 -
[5] - Quote
El Cymech wrote:Scorpyn wrote: I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
So you want 100% completely free everything. I'm not going to lie and say that I wouldn't appreciate that, but while it would be nice, I'm sure most of us understand that it's not realistic for this type of game.
If you want to charge for stuff, go ahead. If you want to pretend that the game is free and then charge for core game mechanics and make it a pay to win game, go ahead without me. |
Funless Saisima
Strange Energy Gentlemen's Agreement
18
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Posted - 2013.02.03 01:58:00 -
[6] - Quote
In game battle voice (Squad/Team) chat is free. UTV is only for corp chat and private rooms. My corp uses jabber primarily for chat and rarely use our private mumble channel. No biggie.
FWIW, the out of battle voice coms are not done by CCP. They use a 3rd party. They get charged, so you get charged. |
Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
9
|
Posted - 2013.02.03 21:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Funless Saisima wrote:In game battle voice (Squad/Team) chat is free. UTV is only for corp chat and private rooms. My corp uses jabber primarily for chat and rarely use our private mumble channel. No biggie. Ok. Not as bad as it may have seemed at first in that case.
Funless Saisima wrote:FWIW, the out of battle voice coms are not done by CCP. They use a 3rd party. They get charged, so you get charged. This may be a valid reason from the book keeping point of view, but imo it's not a valid reason from the game mechanics point of view.
If you charge for this typ of stuff, fewer people will use it than if you don't charge for it, which will make it less useful for those who do pay for it. This is why I don't think you should make a separate optional charge for core game mechanics. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4296
|
Posted - 2013.02.04 01:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
For those of you who are a bit uniformed,
You pay for eve voice via subscription, this is a very expensive service but thankfully all of our subscriptions help pay for it.
This is the same service being used for dust 514. However since dust 514 does not have subscribers they're allowing players to choose if they like to pay for the voice support or not.
You can still talk in squad out of battle and team and squad in battle without the UVT. With uvt you can talk in any channel except local, and npc corp channels.
Currently there is quite a few changes being done for the UVT services such as a corp wide UVT. As well as selling aurum bought items UVT would be nearly the equivalents to plexes just about and another possible price point change, CCP is current in negotiations to get it more flexible but its a three way chat between psn ccp and vivox. So who knows... best outcome of these negoations is 'no seen' cost to the consumer and vivox just gets paid out of the general profits of dust 514 instead.
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ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers R O G U E
194
|
Posted - 2013.02.04 13:35:00 -
[9] - Quote
i have to agree, charging for voice comms with your own corp is a very bad decission, communication with your own corp IS essential and will be more so when DUST becomes part of sov warfare, i dont mind the whole Micro transaction stuff in DUSt but this is over the line if you ask me. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4296
|
Posted - 2013.02.04 15:38:00 -
[10] - Quote
ITTigerClawIK wrote:i have to agree, charging for voice comms with your own corp is a very bad decission, communication with your own corp IS essential and will be more so when DUST becomes part of sov warfare, i dont mind the whole Micro transaction stuff in DUSt but this is over the line if you ask me.
I would hate for eve online players to pay for voice for another game though.
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Henry Haphorn
Kid's Logistics Inc
410
|
Posted - 2013.02.05 02:35:00 -
[11] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:ITTigerClawIK wrote:i have to agree, charging for voice comms with your own corp is a very bad decission, communication with your own corp IS essential and will be more so when DUST becomes part of sov warfare, i dont mind the whole Micro transaction stuff in DUSt but this is over the line if you ask me. I would hate for eve online players to pay for voice for another game though.
This.
My subscription already pays for the development and iteration of DUST. Are you willing to foot the extra bill to cover the voice service of console players? Adapt or Die |
Henry Haphorn
Kid's Logistics Inc
410
|
Posted - 2013.02.05 02:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Here is a thought.
If the market in DUST does open up, then CCP should allow UVT to be resellable on the player-run secondary market for ISK just like PLEX currently is for Eve Online. They are both expendable commodities and allow ISK hoarders to be able to afford the voice service. Adapt or Die |
Hienz Doofenshmirtz
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
30
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Posted - 2013.02.05 08:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
You do realise that When eve voice was introduced, we paid for it right, but that has been rolled into our subscription.
EVE uses Vivox for the Voice system for New eden, they pay for it, why wouldn't they pass on the cost of it to the consumer. |
Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
11
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Posted - 2013.02.05 20:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
Hienz Doofenshmirtz wrote:You do realise that When eve voice was introduced, we paid for it right, but that has been rolled into our subscription.
EVE uses Vivox for the Voice system for New eden, they pay for it, why wouldn't they pass on the cost of it to the consumer. I still don't understand why it has to be a separate cost.
What makes you think CCP:s servers don't cost anything? |
Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
11
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Posted - 2013.02.05 20:35:00 -
[15] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:ITTigerClawIK wrote:i have to agree, charging for voice comms with your own corp is a very bad decission, communication with your own corp IS essential and will be more so when DUST becomes part of sov warfare, i dont mind the whole Micro transaction stuff in DUSt but this is over the line if you ask me. I would hate for eve online players to pay for voice for another game though. I'm not saying that it should be paid for by EVE Online.
I'm saying that it should be paid for by a part of the income from other (nonvital) items. |
Pyre leFay
The Scope Gallente Federation
447
|
Posted - 2013.02.05 21:39:00 -
[16] - Quote
It is paid for by for non vital items as Corp and custom channel chat is a luxury. It is more than likely UTVs will be sold on market for isk by people who have paid Aur for them in the future. Then with both avenues available, there is no way to complain about their availability. Only complaints about what the players deem their worth is in isk. |
Rikki Sals
State War Academy Caldari State
44
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Posted - 2013.02.05 21:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
Henry Haphorn wrote:Here is a thought.
If the market in DUST does open up, then CCP should allow UVT to be resellable on the player-run secondary market for ISK just like PLEX currently is for Eve Online. They are both expendable commodities and allow ISK hoarders to be able to afford the voice service.
Second this. Further, I hope all AUR items become tradeable between Dust players on the ISK market, as is the case in EVE with clothes and PLEX. CCP gets the same real cash per item/service, but it frees up players' options and provides neat market mechanics. |
Scorpyn
The Providers Rebel Alliance of New Eden
11
|
Posted - 2013.02.05 22:22:00 -
[18] - Quote
Pyre leFay wrote:It is paid for by for non vital items as Corp and custom channel chat is a luxury. It is more than likely UTVs will be sold on market for isk by people who have paid Aur for them in the future. Then with both avenues available, there is no way to complain about their availability. Only complaints about what the players deem their worth is in isk. Selling them for isk doesn't fix the problem. It may move it around a bit but it doesn't fix it since the real issue isn't about the money. The real issue is about availability. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4298
|
Posted - 2013.02.06 00:14:00 -
[19] - Quote
Well until dust 514 can 'proove' it can have a stable income to shuffle off the costs of vivox onto normal aur purchases I don't see this changing anytime soon, price adjustments are wanted the most though as well as the corp uvt.
I would like to thank the OP for being at least reasonable and reading. Dust 514 bunnies where rather furious over this, had to chop a quite a few of them down by the ankles.
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Agustice Arterius
Couch Athletics
14
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Posted - 2013.02.06 04:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
El Cymech wrote:
So you want 100% completely free everything.
I think he wants something like TF2. Where it's free to play, and what you can buy has absolutely no outcome or advantage over other people. Yet still makes more money than EVE.
But as people were saying, sounds like this wouldn't work for Dust at all. |
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IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome Caldari State Capturing
195
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Posted - 2013.02.06 04:56:00 -
[21] - Quote
El Cymech wrote:Scorpyn wrote:
I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
So you want 100% completely free everything.
No one wants free - they just don't want pay to win.
Remove the Aur items and many people will happily pay $50 for a full functioning standalone game without pay to win items. I would pay $50 for it. At the moment and in the future CCP will earn $0 from me via the dust store.
AUR pricing is really bad. If it was $5 for 500,000 AUR then maybe some would consider it. But atm it is a very bad deal. I'd rather just buy a full standalone game like Colonial Marines and have money left over. So people can choose between spending $149.00 on an AUR package or buy between 3 and up to 30 full standalone games without pay to win items on Steam with the same $149. Hmmmm - not a tough choice. Steam - here's $149. CCP - here's $0.
SP requirements are way to high and that is to encourage the stupid to purchase 'implants' (14x multipliers on the jumpsuit skills ???? why??? oh greed....)
+ The mistake many make is playing dust to win. That is a waste of time in a pay to win game so start playing with a different motive and Dust is better:
For me - I don't cap many points. I steal tanks(that some idiots could have paid real $$$ for) and park them in front of blaster turrents for destruction. Quite often I just run around with the nova knife doing nothing to help my team. I have a lot of fun - but do not at any point try to win.
Then the hilarity of PS3 only at the end of the console generation. PS4 announcement which seems to be likely on Feb20 will be the end of Dust. Even if they have the PS4 version ready to roll upon release.
Who's gonna pay $800+ for a new console to play one game that then expects them to pay even more money if they want to win????? How many people just purchased a PS3 in the last few months for dust and are on Feb 20 going to lose their **** at CCP???
Free to play should mean free to play like DOTA2 is - where items are only cosmetic and have no extra abilities. Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4298
|
Posted - 2013.02.06 18:17:00 -
[22] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:El Cymech wrote:Scorpyn wrote:
I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
So you want 100% completely free everything. No one wants free - they just don't want pay to win. Remove the Aur items and many people will happily pay $50 for a full functioning standalone game without pay to win items. I would pay $50 for it. At the moment and in the future CCP will earn $0 from me via the dust store. AUR pricing is really bad. If it was $5 for 500,000 AUR then maybe some would consider it. But atm it is a very bad deal. I'd rather just buy a full standalone game like Colonial Marines and have money left over. So people can choose between spending $149.00 on an AUR package or buy between 3 and up to 30 full standalone games without pay to win items on Steam with the same $149. Hmmmm - not a tough choice. Steam - here's $149. CCP - here's $0. SP requirements are way to high and that is to encourage the stupid to purchase 'implants' (14x multipliers on the jumpsuit skills ???? why??? oh greed....) + The mistake many make is playing dust to win. That is a waste of time in a pay to win game so start playing with a different motive and Dust is better: For me - I don't cap many points. I steal tanks(that some idiots could have paid real $$$ for) and park them in front of blaster turrents for destruction. Quite often I just run around with the nova knife doing nothing to help my team. I have a lot of fun - but do not at any point try to win. Then the hilarity of PS3 only at the end of the console generation. PS4 announcement which seems to be likely on Feb20 will be the end of Dust. Even if they have the PS4 version ready to roll upon release. Who's gonna pay $800+ for a new console to play one game that then expects them to pay even more money if they want to win????? How many people just purchased a PS3 in the last few months for dust and are on Feb 20 going to lose their **** at CCP??? Free to play should mean free to play like DOTA2 is - where items are only cosmetic and have no extra abilities.
I don't think you play the game to be honest or at least not recently.
Suits are not 14x only the Murader, advanced vehicles (tech 2 form our perspectve) and some of the advanced weapon skills are.
Pay to Win doesn't really exist, hell most aurum weapons stuck against the level of early access they are for. I kill full aur kitted players with militia gear just fine. Its going to be bad when I progress into advanced level gear.
Unless the tanks are a really weird color they didn't pay aurum for them. also they where all removed. There are no early access tanks or vehicles for htat matter.
Also keep up with the times Dust 514 is a PS4 Launch Title and the two clients are going to be like mac and windows versions of eve.
Also you haven't played dota 2 recently either have you?
That stupid sword that people can loot off of you if you fail hard is one of the items that is non cosmetic.
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Eliniale
co-operative resource extraction
70
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Posted - 2013.02.07 00:52:00 -
[23] - Quote
I still don't get why you aren't able to subscribe to DUST 514. I mean those want FTP with microtransactions should have that chance. But those who just want to fund the game monthly should too. System ideas: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=191928&find=unread |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4298
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 01:50:00 -
[24] - Quote
Eliniale wrote:I still don't get why you aren't able to subscribe to DUST 514. I mean those want FTP with microtransactions should have that chance. But those who just want to fund the game monthly should too.
Its on the planner as well but not at the moment.
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IbanezLaney
The Church of Awesome Caldari State Capturing
196
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Posted - 2013.02.07 03:00:00 -
[25] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:
...... someone bagged out the pay to win game I pay to win at and I must defend it.......
Also you haven't played dota 2 recently either have you?
That stupid sword that people can loot off of you if you fail hard is one of the items that is non cosmetic.
The item that drops in Dota2 is not purchased with $$$. + there is more than one item that does this if you die. It's a normal in game item that everyone can get if they save enough gold during a normal game. All dota items are cosmetic.
The pay to win tanks may have been removed from Dust for now ( I had noticed less tanks being used but don't waste my time reading the dust forums) - but when they return (which they will), the pay to win aspect of dust will also be back to the same level. So your point about that was...pointless.
My steam and PS3 names are both Ibanez Laney. So add me just so you can see the stats and how I've never played Dust or Dota2.
Name one other game where voice comms cost anything.
All other games have free voice comms. I have never had counter strike, bf3, supcom, bfme2, or the 200+ other games on my steam or ps3 lists ask me to buy a Voice Transmitter with money to talk in game. They all have voice chat (if multiplayer) and not one has ever said - 'Oh we pay another company for that and need $$$ for you to talk.' - CCP is scamming you with these pay to win items.
Fix this **** See Sea Pea. |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4299
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 04:23:00 -
[26] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote: The item that drops in Dota2 is not purchased with $$$. + there is more than one item that does this if you die. It's a normal in game item that everyone can get if they save enough gold during a normal game. All dota items are cosmetic.
The pay to win tanks may have been removed from Dust for now ( I had noticed less tanks being used but don't waste my time reading the dust forums) - but when they return (which they will), the pay to win aspect of dust will also be back to the same level. So your point about that was...pointless.
My steam and PS3 names are both Ibanez Laney. So add me just so you can see the stats and how I've never played Dust or Dota2.
Name one other game where voice comms cost anything.
All other games have free voice comms. I have never had counter strike, bf3, supcom, bfme2, or the 200+ other games on my steam or ps3 lists ask me to buy a Voice Transmitter with money to talk in game. They all have voice chat (if multiplayer) and not one has ever said - 'Oh we pay another company for that and need $$$ for you to talk.' - CCP is scamming you with these pay to win items.
Further evidence you don't play Dust 514. First off the tank you where talking about was cosmetic painted in Guristas camo colors, there never was early access vehicles or side grade vehicles. You must be confusing that tank with the far superior Prototype Level Murader (Tech 2 Tank) SAGARIS tank which was the massive bane of everyone's existence back in the bad days and luckily nobody has trained one up yet since the reset but its getting there.
Also http://www.dota2wiki.com/wiki/Divine_Rapier P2W DOTA2 evidence here. Its nearly 100% more pay to win than Dust 514 is.
Dust 514 has free voice comms in battle and with the squad at all times similar to most other games.
However most mmos built in voice isn't used that much even if it was free some people go out and still rent servers for 15 dollars a month to have voice services.
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eddie valvetino
Snuff Box
151
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 15:47:00 -
[27] - Quote
Scorpyn wrote:This is a joke, right?
no it's for real
but has no real impact as you can still hear what is being said and squad and team coms work without it
so it's just like eve, which really has no voice and you pay for your TS3 servers. Just cos someone in your corp or allaince is paying, |
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
4300
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 16:20:00 -
[28] - Quote
eddie valvetino wrote:Scorpyn wrote:This is a joke, right? no it's for real but has no real impact as you can still hear what is being said and squad and team coms work without it so it's just like eve, which really has no voice and you pay for your TS3 servers. Just cos someone in your corp or allaince is paying,
Basically, uvt only lets you chat out of battle mostly. Stuff accomplished just as easily with text channels eve side (though dust side it is a bit... inconvient.)
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Henry Haphorn
Kid's Logistics Inc
411
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 16:47:00 -
[29] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:The pay to win tanks may have been removed from Dust for now ( I had noticed less tanks being used but don't waste my time reading the dust forums) - but when they return (which they will), the pay to win aspect of dust will also be back to the same level. So your point about that was...pointless.
What evidence do you have that CCP will return those tanks in the same condition in which they were removed? Just like any broken weapons, suit, vehicle, and map, they removed those tanks because people found a big problem with them. When they come back, they will definitely not be the same. That we all know in the Dust 514 community. What we don't know is how different they will be when they come back. Adapt or Die |
eddie valvetino
Snuff Box
151
|
Posted - 2013.02.07 17:06:00 -
[30] - Quote
IbanezLaney wrote:El Cymech wrote:Scorpyn wrote:
I can understand wanting to charge for stuff, but then don't pretend that the game is free.
Also, since there are also implants that are only available for aur, I'll be uninstalling the game.
So you want 100% completely free everything. No one wants free - they just don't want pay to win. Remove the Aur items and many people will happily pay $50 for a full functioning standalone game without pay to win items. I would pay $50 for it. At the moment and in the future CCP will earn $0 from me via the dust store. AUR pricing is really bad. If it was $5 for 500,000 AUR then maybe some would consider it. But atm it is a very bad deal. I'd rather just buy a full standalone game like Colonial Marines and have money left over. So people can choose between spending $149.00 on an AUR package or buy between 3 and up to 30 full standalone games without pay to win items on Steam with the same $149. Hmmmm - not a tough choice. Steam - here's $149. CCP - here's $0. SP requirements are way to high and that is to encourage the stupid to purchase 'implants' (14x multipliers on the jumpsuit skills ???? why??? oh greed....) + The mistake many make is playing dust to win. That is a waste of time in a pay to win game so start playing with a different motive and Dust is better: For me - I don't cap many points. I steal tanks(that some idiots could have paid real $$$ for) and park them in front of blaster turrents for destruction. Quite often I just run around with the nova knife doing nothing to help my team. I have a lot of fun - but do not at any point try to win. Then the hilarity of PS3 only at the end of the console generation. PS4 announcement which seems to be likely on Feb20 will be the end of Dust. Even if they have the PS4 version ready to roll upon release. Who's gonna pay $800+ for a new console to play one game that then expects them to pay even more money if they want to win????? How many people just purchased a PS3 in the last few months for dust and are on Feb 20 going to lose their **** at CCP??? Free to play should mean free to play like DOTA2 is - where items are only cosmetic and have no extra abilities.
You sir are a moron
If you don't like playing a pay to win format, might suggest you uninstall Eve as well? as Eve also is a pay to win model. Ever since the sale of PLEX has been with us, it's has been pay to win.
I don't think Dust will be any worse for not havin you play it. |
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